Astrophotraphy and travel tripod

[clarnibass]

Hi

I've decided to buy a tracker like the Sky Guider or something similar. I have a few tripods, none of which I think are great for that. One is a very lightweight aluminium Slik. One is for an 8" catadioptric telescope and would probably require some huge adapter (doesn't have a tripod head mount). The most reasonable is the Manfrotto 055 aluminium version which might be worth trying.

Would a carbon fiber tripod be significantly better for tracking? Obviously it depends on the specific one and it's possible to make a very stable (and heavy) aluminium tripod...

Feisol has pretty good reviews and they have this one which is VERY light. It has double the payload of my Manfrotto tripod, but maybe being so light isn't such a good idea for astrophotography tracking, regardless of payload?

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www.bhphotovideo.com

Am I imagining the significance of not having a center column?
It would be nice to have a better and lighter tripod to replace my Slik regardless of astro, but not having a column might make it less usefull for that.

Would a heavier aluminium tripod actually be better in this case?

I also don't really plan to hike with it or anything like that. It's just really nice that it's so light. I sometimes take my Slik and not the Manfrotto if I have to walk a bit and know I'll have to be a little more careful (e.g. wait longer between touching the camera and taking the photo).

Thanks

 

[tradesmith45]

Like you I own several tripods of different sizes & still occasionally backpack w/ cam gear & a Nanotracker. Here's some basic things for you to consider.

• Nearly any CF tripod can work w/ care for up to short tele lenses on a tracker.
• Two main things-wind resistance & focal length. The more of either the more pod needed.
• A too weak pod can allow the tracker alignment to move the the camera/lens is moved.

I own CF pods with led diameters of 22, 28 & 42mm. The latter 2 are Feisols. Both the smallest pods have been used successfully with UWA to 135mm FL lenses. The big one worked fine @ 600mm w/ mild winds. There will be more wind movement caused by loosness in the Sky Guider than from any of these pods.

The Feisol your considering is not tall enough for me but will do the astro job for you unless you plan long or heavy lenses. I do not own any 4 leg section pods - the more sections, the more flex. My 28mm is the tall CT-3342. For astro, I only extend 2 of its leg sections because I get on my knees to look through the polar scope to align. No center column. This height also puts the camera near eye level.

I own a center column for the 3342 which I use for birds which may be high in trees.

My smallest pod is the Slik 634CF. Amazingly sturdy but winds can cause vibrations. Even the bigger Feisols will vibrate if there's enough wind but size does matter. Always use some weight like a stone bag regardless of pod.

Not sure if the 055 you own has the tiltable column but that could be a problem area. I've never used an 055 but owned a classic Tiltall AL that's weighs about the same. AL pods can certainly work for astro. CF is definitely stiffer.

Can't be more specific w/o knowing the FL you hope to use.

 

[Andy01]

Hi

I've decided to buy a tracker like the Sky Guider or something similar. I have a few tripods, none of which I think are great for that. One is a very lightweight aluminium Slik. One is for an 8" catadioptric telescope and would probably require some huge adapter (doesn't have a tripod head mount). The most reasonable is the Manfrotto 055 aluminium version which might be worth trying.

I am not sure that the Manfrotto 055 would be ideal for travelling ? Isn't it a beefy 3 section tripod that weighs about 2.5kg plus head ? I used to have a Manfrotto 055 (bought in the early 1990s and when I bought my Sirui I realised what a big heavy brute the Manfrotto was.

Would a carbon fiber tripod be significantly better for tracking?

Not sure as I don't have a tracker, but from a travelling point of view, a decent CF tripod that folds back on itself is vastly better.

Obviously it depends on the specific one and it's possible to make a very stable (and heavy) aluminium tripod...

Feisol has pretty good reviews and they have this one which is VERY light. It has double the payload of my Manfrotto tripod, but maybe being so light isn't such a good idea for astrophotography tracking, regardless of payload?

Be very careful about believing anything a tripod manufacturer says about payload - there doesn't appear to be any standard test method, and IMO most of them are waaaay over-cooked.

https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/prod...ID_CARBON_TRIPOD_CLASSIC_4_SECTION.html/specs

It looks OK, but I would be astounded if it could handle a rig weighing 18kg. That might be the weight that something starts buckling at, but it would almost never be stable with a 18kg rig hanging off it.

Am I imagining the significance of not having a center column?

I rarely use mine.

It would be nice to have a better and lighter tripod to replace my Slik regardless of astro, but not having a column might make it less usefull for that.

Would a heavier aluminium tripod actually be better in this case?

I don't see why, especially for a travel tripod ? You can always hang a bag off the centre column if you want more stability.

I also don't really plan to hike with it or anything like that. It's just really nice that it's so light. I sometimes take my Slik and not the Manfrotto if I have to walk a bit and know I'll have to be a little more careful (e.g. wait longer between touching the camera and taking the photo).

I have a Sirui N-2204X + Sirui K-20X ballhead and it is quite stable with my Canon 6D ii and Canon 100-400L ii fully zoomed (not for astro).

I think the newer version of mine is this - I have traveled a fair bit with it (packed in case on planes);

https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/prod...204sk_n_2204sk_carbon_fiber_tripod.html/specs - note that this is legs only.

It is a bit heavier than the Feisol you linked, slightly longer folded length - worth noting that the Sirui load rating is less than the Feisol's, in spite of being bigger and heavier. I seldom use the 4th (and thinnest) leg sections as I am short, so it is quite stable. What tends to "kill" many of the travel tripods (especially the 5 section models) is the super skinny legs. Mine has 16mm CF as the thinnest which is still quite stiff, but when you get down to 10-12mm it is never going to be too stable with those out, so it is a good idea to find this information before choosing - often hard to find what the leg section diameters is.

Thanks

Colin

 

[82Virago]

Hi

I've decided to buy a tracker like the Sky Guider or something similar. I have a few tripods, none of which I think are great for that. One is a very lightweight aluminium Slik. One is for an 8" catadioptric telescope and would probably require some huge adapter (doesn't have a tripod head mount). The most reasonable is the Manfrotto 055 aluminium version which might be worth trying.

Would a carbon fiber tripod be significantly better for tracking? Obviously it depends on the specific one and it's possible to make a very stable (and heavy) aluminium tripod...

Feisol has pretty good reviews and they have this one which is VERY light. It has double the payload of my Manfrotto tripod, but maybe being so light isn't such a good idea for astrophotography tracking, regardless of payload?

https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/prod...ID_CARBON_TRIPOD_CLASSIC_4_SECTION.html/specs

Am I imagining the significance of not having a center column?
It would be nice to have a better and lighter tripod to replace my Slik regardless of astro, but not having a column might make it less usefull for that.

Would a heavier aluminium tripod actually be better in this case?

I also don't really plan to hike with it or anything like that. It's just really nice that it's so light. I sometimes take my Slik and not the Manfrotto if I have to walk a bit and know I'll have to be a little more careful (e.g. wait longer between touching the camera and taking the photo).

Thanks

Define travel tripod. I just bought a used 055 to run my second Star Adventurer from.

I could definitely hike all day with it, if I have a strap etc. I am thinking it stable enough for wide field astro, not sure yet if it is up to shooting with my 300mm. I haven't had time or clear skies to test.

I have a much lighter tripod that is more airline friendly size and weight wise. It is stable if I don't extend the legs. Would no use it for longer focal length astro.

Defining weight and size parameter for the type of travelling you want to do is the start.

Then test with gear you want to bring. There are also ways to get more stability with additional weight or as I used to do with a telescope, tying to a peg driven into the ground.

Everything has trade offs figuring what you can live with is the trick.

Cheers

 

[clarnibass]

I am not sure that the Manfrotto 055 would be ideal for travelling ? Isn't it a beefy 3 section tripod that weighs about 2.5kg plus head ?

I guess, yes. It is a bit heavy and I'd like something lighter and more rigid (without the column). I does feel flimsy compared with my telescope tripod (obviously) or the much heavier Manfrotto tripod I've used in a studio last year... I mean it's still relatively light and I do take it with me often.

Be very careful about believing anything a tripod manufacturer says about payload - there doesn't appear to be any standard test method, and IMO most of them are waaaay over-cooked.

Maybe Manfrotto are closer to realistic actual weight of the whole setup and others use the actual weight that could damage it...? Who knows.

ripods (especially the 5 section models) is the super skinny legs. Mine has 16mm CF as the thinnest which is still quite stiff, but when you get down to 10-12mm it is never going to be too stable with those out, so it is a good idea to find this information before choosing - often hard to find what the leg section diameters is.

If I don't need it to be tall enough to use the last section, maybe another section doesn't make any difference (or possibly could be even more rigid, but that really depends on the exact specs).

Thanks

 

[clarnibass]

The Feisol your considering is not tall enough for me but will do the astro job for you unless you plan long or heavy lenses. I do not own any 4 leg section pods - the more sections, the more flex.

I was looking for a 2-section one but missed it. They actually have a similar one with 2 section legs. It also has a higher max height (I don't mind the longer folded size) and weighs essentially the same https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/prod...ID_CARBON_TRIPOD_CLASSIC_3_SECTION.html/specs

Of course I'd try to have the tripod as low as possible as long as it doesn't interfere with the frame, so maybe a 3-section one could actually be more rigid (because it would be lower, with all legs closed... depends how comfortable that is).

They also have this one https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/prod...42_Tournament_CT_3342_Rapid_Tripod.html/specs
A little taller, weighs a fraction less (same as the one in the OP), slightly smaller when folded, but costs a lot more for some reason.

I own a center column for the 3342 which I use for birds which may be high in trees.

You mean it is possible to get one of those without a center column and add a center column? That could be a good option

Not sure if the 055 you own has the tiltable column but that could be a problem area. I've never used an 055 but owned a classic Tiltall AL that's weighs about the same. AL pods can certainly work for astro. CF is definitely stiffer.

Yes it's that one. I'm hoping to get something lighter and without a center column (so it's more sturdy). Those 1.1KG-1.2KG Feisols weigh about the same as myc super flimsy aluminium Slik.

Can't be more specific w/o knowing the FL you hope to use.

FL likely up to 400mm, but it's not one of those huge 400mm lenses. I guess total of camera+lens might be about 2kg. With some accessories that I might add in the future (such as guiding telescope, etc.) maybe 2.5kg-3kg maximum (can't really see it getting to 3kg but who knows).

If I found the correct weight for everything then the heaviest setup of the camera and tracking mount combined seems like it might be about 5kg total. Maybe a little more if I add some accessories later.

Thanks

 

[nighthiker]

Hi!

As already mentioned: The weight classifications of the manufacturers are useless. Some are realistic (e.g. Gitzo and RRS) and others are just fiction. The only(?) and best tripod comparison I know: https://thecentercolumn.com/rankings/all-purpose-tripod-rankings/

Also read the additional info in the links to get a better understanding about tripod stability.

As I mostly hike to my locations my focus is on stability and low weight. I have several tripods, but my workhorse is now a serie 2 from RRS and I use additional serie 1 RRS tripods for additional cameras (e.g. startrails, meteors). If you want to have it more budget-friendly I would look for a tripod w/o center column, e.g. Leofoto, FLM, Feisol.

Add weight to a tripod in the correct way! Never let it 'swing' under your tripod but make sure that it cannot move (e.g. let it touch - a little bit - the ground).

If weight is not a factor go for wood (e.g. Berlebach)! Aluminium is damping less well than CF - but it's cheaper - and aluminium is more robust if you have really hard travel condition (e.g. climbing) as CF can break.

I used the Feisol Tournament 3342 a lot in the past due to the low weight, but - despite the large tube diameters - it was always a little bit unstable in critical (150-200mm and some wind) situations. Testing is easy: Use a longer focal length - let's say around 200mm - and put it on the tripod. The weakest point is around the eigenfrequency which is around 5-15 Hz, so use 1/5 to 1/15 and check the results for sharpness.

 

[tradesmith45]

FL likely up to 400mm, but it's not one of those huge 400mm lenses. I guess total of camera+lens might be about 2kg. With some accessories that I might add in the future (such as guiding telescope, etc.) maybe 2.5kg-3kg maximum (can't really see it getting to 3kg but who knows).

If I found the correct weight for everything then the heaviest setup of the camera and tracking mount combined seems like it might be about 5kg total. Maybe a little more if I add some accessories later.

Thanks

There are many challenges if you really hope to use 400mm regardless of tripod. Just trying to focus by hand will be a problem due to vibration. You'll need really good PA. Getting on targets will be frustrating.

For 400mm, you'll need remote focusing, guiding, plate solving. More gear on the mount and a laptop will be required. Though some are successful at 300mm w/o all this, its rare. For a tripod based iOptron SG, consider 135mm maybe 200mm as an upper limit. A bigger tripod will not fix any of these challenges.

I'm currently working w/ a club member w/ a SWSA who has succeeded with the NA Nebula @ 200mm w/ a slight miss. After adding plate solving & guiding he's @at 400mm.

From my experience with an SWSA, a travel tripod is a good match for these generally loose mounts.

FWIW, I could mount my Fuji 100-400mm on my Polarie w/ it load kit but haven't. May try one day. The Poalrie has less backlash in the mount than the SWSA I owned before. It still vibrates when trying to MF a 90mm.

 

[EricTheAstroJunkie]

Absolutely forego a tripod with a center column, they do not add anything and in a lot of cases they compromise tripod quality. I highly suggest you read through this website on tripod testing, it's the most comprehensive independent tripod testing/reviewing website online and will help you make a price-conscious decision on which tripod is best for you:

https://thecentercolumn.com/

 

[outlierrn]

I have a burly CF Really Right Stuff tripod that's way too much for travel, I only use for astro, and, to be honest, I never would have bought if they didn't used to have their shop in my town where I could go in and handle (play with) their stuff. I also have a SkyGuider pro and a Redcat 51. On paper, I'm underloading the tripod, but I still have found that hanging a weight is essential to getting good results. One thing I do love about it is the leveling base, which really simplifies getting the leveling spot on.

If I was looking for a new photo tripod for astro, a leveling base and ease of hanging a wt would be pretty much must haves.

 

[clarnibass]

Thanks. Of course that's all true, however, it's why I wrote "likely up to 400mm".
I've seen someone use this successfully with a 2kg 600mm lens (though usually with an auto guider, which I will probably add at some point).

I'll start with much wider FLs, from about 20mm. I will try many, like 50mm, 85mm, 100mm, 200mm. I just have a 400mm lens too and will try it eventually. So I don't expect to just use 400mm with great results immediately. I gave the 400mm example because it's my heaviest lens, and it's not heavy at all for a 400mm (about 1.2kg).

I don't want the tripod to be an issue even if I try the 400mm lens, and certainly not with the shorter FLs. That's why I mentioned it. I don't want the tripod to cause problems if I do try it.

If I like this enough I might buy a better telescope, mount and tripod in the future, which would be much better than my 400mm lens anyway.

 

[nighthiker]

Hi!

Well, if RRS isn't good/stable enough for you (series 2 or higher) and travel/transportation/weight is not a critical point for you AND you want to use up to 400mm or above ... Well, in this case you should go for a dedicated astro tripod which is not my area of expertise.

 

[bmike]

I have 2 RRS:









I’ve lugged the giant one (TVC 24L) around Switzerland and Italy and recently bought one of the smaller ones (TQC 14). They are both solid. If you aren’t hiking up mountains their large diameter tube ones are awesome (and I’ve hiked with mine...).

 

[nighthiker]

Hi!

It seems that RRS is popular in this group, despite of the poor availability in Europe (I only know 2 online shops) and the price tag. I even cannot order from RRS directly any more as USPS is recently unable to deliver to my home address (the last parcel took 1 month and several phone calls).

I use the RRS tripods w/o center column and I hate this wrist strap under the platform as it prevents the tripod legs from closing properly. Instead I'm recently testing different methods to attach an easily adjustable string under the platform so that I can attach my back-pack easily for additional stability.

 

[bmike]

Hi!

It seems that RRS is popular in this group, despite of the poor availability in Europe (I only know 2 online shops) and the price tag. I even cannot order from RRS directly any more as USPS is recently unable to deliver to my home address (the last parcel took 1 month and several phone calls).

I use the RRS tripods w/o center column and I hate this wrist strap under the platform as it prevents the tripod legs from closing properly. Instead I'm recently testing different methods to attach an easily adjustable string under the platform so that I can attach my back-pack easily for additional stability.

I ordered direct from them about 2 months ago. Shipped via UPS to Switzerland. Took ~1 week.

 

[nighthiker]

Jipp, that's how it was in the past. But in recent times (Covid ?) UPS has had massive problems to deliver the parcel to my home address in a big city in Norway. But the big US camera stores have no problem with the delivery and their shipping can also be cheaper.

 

[bmike]

Jipp, that's how it was in the past. But in recent times (Covid ?) UPS has had massive problems to deliver the parcel to my home address in a big city in Norway. But the big US camera stores have no problem with the delivery and their shipping can also be cheaper.

I’ve had stuff come from family in the US take 8-10 weeks via USPS. Heard it was covid related. Lack of flights means also lack of quick ish mail. Was really surprised at the speed I got the tripod.



Had a friend send me $6 of small parts for my bike that I couldn’t get here. Took 3 months from the time he sent it. I filed numerous missing mail reports. One day they just showed up. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯.

 

[nighthiker]

My slowest parcel was 6 month from Honduras. Something like 2 kg of handcrafts for 1 or 2 $, 30 years ago ....