When are we going to get a new "1 point & shoot camera from Panasonic?

[mkygod]

Canon and Sony has already revealed and released their high-end point and shoots (G7x and RX100 VII), but i haven't heard a peep from Panasonic.

Have you guys heard or read anything about an upcoming successor to the ZS100/200?

Seems like its been a long time since they put out a new high-end point and shoot compact camera. The ZS200 is basically just a small upgrade to the ZS100 that came out over 4 years ago.

I'm doing ok with my ZS100 but it i could use a sharper lens when zooming, better autofocus, mic input, and true 4K video. But at the same time, i dont want to spend a grand on a RX100 VII.

I shoot mostly at concerts where the lighting, distance, and moving subjects often make it difficult to get many good shots. It could be made a lot easier with a bigger sensor camera, but most venues will only allow you to bring in compact point and shoots w/o removable lenses which is why I have a ZS100.

 

[saudidave]

The ZS200 is basically just a small upgrade to the ZS100 that came out over 4 years ago.

Class leading 1" zoom for a pocketable compact upgraded from 10x to 15x

Massively improved viewfinder

Ergonomic grip instead of virtually none

Small upgrade? F.M., what would a big upgrade be?

 

[mkygod]

10-15x but at the expense of a slower lens. I don't consider that an upgrade, but a side-grade. In my usage, having a slower lens would be a downgrade because i shoot mostly in low light situations.

Yes it has a nicer viewfinder and grip, but those are relatively small things and do not directly impact the quality of photos/video. I have a grip added to my ZS100 and I rarely ever use the viewfinder, so these are non-selling points for me.

 

[saudidave]

10-15x but at the expense of a slower lens. I don't consider that an upgrade, but a side-grade. In my usage, having a slower lens would be a downgrade because i shoot mostly in low light situations.

Yes it has a nicer viewfinder and grip, but those are relatively small things and do not directly impact the quality of photos/video. I have a grip added to my ZS100 and I rarely ever use the viewfinder, so these are non-selling points for me.

Slower lens is BS. It is very,very minor, over a very small part of the cameras range and it has absolutely no impact on usability or IQ, the latter of which is identical. Do some proper research as quite frankly you aren't talking with the benefit of a full understanding of the facts about the "slow lens myth"

The viewfinder issue is huge. The one on the TZ100 is garbage, like looking down a tunnel and only useful in emergencies. The one on the TZ200 is an absolute joy to use.

I do know what I am talking about as I have had both cameras and I used the 100 for two years and the 200 for one year. I took tens of thousands of photographs with each and posted extensively on this forum until the 200 failed.

I would buy the 200 again in a heartbeat if Panasonic would sort out their Q.C. but I'm afraid the 100 wouldn't get a look in.

Have a look at this:





The TZ100 has less than half a stop advantage at the wide end that falls off very rapidly so the slower lens claim is three parts of diddly squat. Couple that with the improved I.S. of the 200 and your "slow lens I'm not buying it" view goes right down the tubes!

Dave

 

[Gerry Siegel]

I can not speak about the Zs 200 & defer to Saudidave on that model which is the latest one.. I consider the former ZS 100 with different specs and one I have used a lot to be a desirable small compact camera which has no serious flaws for- for the price- since you justifiably mentioned price consideration. If I were doing your kind of shooting I would consider, or try out, the LX 100, which is a series jump to a larger sensor and brighter lens.

I think this business of absolute embargo to ILC cameras at events that allow cameras at all to be goofy.

Times are changing thus when a phone can do so many tricks. I do not visualize a frisk at the door to check for proscribed camera. Watch for a Terminator at the door checking your gear

Panasonic has many tiers of choices methinks. Audio input is something else and beyond a small camera . (Take along a Zoom recorder. Better for sound if sound is of real value.

 

[saudidave]

I can not speak about the Zs 200 & defer to Saudidave on that model which is the latest one.. I consider the former ZS 100 with different specs and one I have used a lot to be a desirable small compact camera which has no serious flaws for- for the price- since you justifiably mentioned price consideration. If I were doing your kind of shooting I would consider, or try out, the LX 100, which is a series jump to a larger sensor and brighter lens.

I think this business of absolute embargo to ILC cameras at events that allow cameras at all to be goofy.

Times are changing thus when a phone can do so many tricks. I do not visualize a frisk at the door to check for proscribed camera. Watch for a Terminator at the door checking your gear

Panasonic has many tiers of choices methinks. Audio input is something else and beyond a small camera . (Take along a Zoom recorder. Better for sound if sound is of real value.

In terms of IQ & lIght gathering I totally agree, but the LX100 has only 75mm at the long end and it just won't cut the mustard at an event unless you are ringside!

Dave

 

[Gerry Siegel]

I can not speak about the Zs 200 & defer to Saudidave on that model which is the latest one.. I consider the former ZS 100 with different specs and one I have used a lot to be a desirable small compact camera which has no serious flaws for- for the price- since you justifiably mentioned price consideration. If I were doing your kind of shooting I would consider, or try out, the LX 100, which is a series jump to a larger sensor and brighter lens.

I think this business of absolute embargo to ILC cameras at events that allow cameras at all to be goofy.

Times are changing thus when a phone can do so many tricks. I do not visualize a frisk at the door to check for proscribed camera. Watch for a Terminator at the door checking your gear

Panasonic has many tiers of choices methinks. Audio input is something else and beyond a small camera . (Take along a Zoom recorder. Better for sound if sound is of real value.

In terms of IQ & lIght gathering I totally agree, but the LX100 has only 75mm at the long end and it just won't cut the mustard at an event unless you are ringside!

Dave

Is the long end 75mm EFL on my ZS100 Dave or is it 250..? . Do I misread the specs. Still affordable item in production -?

 

[123dy]

As indicated by its European 'TZ' designation, the ZS200 or TZ200 is primarily a Travel Zoom.

For that purpose, travel camera, it's just about perfect. (And unique!)

The main weakness I've found is autofocus speed on subjects that are all of the following: badly lit, at the long end of the zoom, in motion.

This probably describes the performers at the shows you go to, so perhaps the best thing would be to forget autofocus and use manual focus instead. If the stage is distant enough you could probably just set the focus point to the right edge of the red zone on the MF scale, otherwise identify a point on the stage that the performers are moving into and get that in focus.

 

[saudidave]

I can not speak about the Zs 200 & defer to Saudidave on that model which is the latest one.. I consider the former ZS 100 with different specs and one I have used a lot to be a desirable small compact camera which has no serious flaws for- for the price- since you justifiably mentioned price consideration. If I were doing your kind of shooting I would consider, or try out, the LX 100, which is a series jump to a larger sensor and brighter lens.

I think this business of absolute embargo to ILC cameras at events that allow cameras at all to be goofy.

Times are changing thus when a phone can do so many tricks. I do not visualize a frisk at the door to check for proscribed camera. Watch for a Terminator at the door checking your gear

Panasonic has many tiers of choices methinks. Audio input is something else and beyond a small camera . (Take along a Zoom recorder. Better for sound if sound is of real value.

In terms of IQ & lIght gathering I totally agree, but the LX100 has only 75mm at the long end and it just won't cut the mustard at an event unless you are ringside!

Dave

Is the long end 75mm EFL on my ZS100 Dave or is it 250..? . Do I misread the specs. Still affordable item in production -?

Gerry, read again!

You advised the OP to try an LX100 and he wants to photograph concerts, hence my response to that. It's about as much use at a concert as a chocolate fireguard.

I obviously know that the TZ100 has an a range of 25 - 250mm. I had one for two years.

Dave

 

[Gerry Siegel]

I got you, Dave...you were right first time and I was misreading-- as happens lately. ( Anecdote= Was reading line " Constitution created by the framers.." and I thought I saw " Constitution was written by the farmers. " Though they were farmers too..the dry eye syndrome gets us all )

I forget and can you refresh on your pro/con experience w LX 100 which I am considering in its Mark ii version right now. Thanks. I shoot in mostly well lit surrounds and if I need tele I bring along my GX 8 and 35-100 btw) LX 100 seems like a worthy model but has a lot of bad press as well despite a high rating by DPR. Aloha, GS

 

[saudidave]

I got you, Dave...you were right first time and I was misreading-- as happens lately. ( Anecdote= Was reading line " Constitution created by the framers.." and I thought I saw " Constitution was written by the farmers. " Though they were farmers too..the dry eye syndrome gets us all )

I forget and can you refresh on your pro/con experience w LX 100 which I am considering in its Mark ii version right now. Thanks. I shoot in mostly well lit surrounds and if I need tele I bring along my GX 8 and 35-100 btw) LX 100 seems like a worthy model but has a lot of bad press as well despite a high rating by DPR. Aloha, GS

No worries Gerry. I'd gladly tell you about my experience with the LX100 if I'd ever owned one but sadly I haven't!

Dave

 

[Jon_T]

10-15x but at the expense of a slower lens. I don't consider that an upgrade, but a side-grade. In my usage, having a slower lens would be a downgrade because i shoot mostly in low light situations. ...

Of course the ZS200 360mm EFL max aperture going to be smaller (slower) than the ZS100 250mm EFL to keep the ZS200 small lens size.

To have larger (faster) max aperture the lens would have to be larger; e.g., the FZ1000 f/2.8-4.0 25-400mm EFL.

Another example is comparing the sizes of the Canon G3 X f/2.8-5.6 24-600mm vs the Sony RX10 IV f/2.4-4.0 24-600mm EFL — both cameras using 1"-Type sensor, and both have the same 24-600mm EFL range; difference in lens size is G3 X f/5.6 600mm EFL vs. the RX10 IV f/4.0 600mm EFL

Cheers,
Jon

 

[123dy]

My only problems with the LX100 are the controls and the zoom speed. However some people like the controls and don't seem to mind the slow zoom, so it's something you can only check for yourself.

The viewfinder is good and IQ is fine.

What's feels slightly strange is that the LX100-2 is the most expensive compact in Panasonic's line up. That puts it ahead of the FZ2000/2500, which is surely a far more versatile and satisfying proposition.

 

[saudidave]

10-15x but at the expense of a slower lens. I don't consider that an upgrade, but a side-grade. In my usage, having a slower lens would be a downgrade because i shoot mostly in low light situations. ...

Of course the ZS200 360mm EFL max aperture going to be smaller (slower) than the ZS100 250mm EFL to keep the ZS200 small lens size.

To have larger (faster) max aperture the lens would have to be larger; e.g., the FZ1000 f/2.8-4.0 25-400mm EFL.

Another example is comparing the sizes of the Canon G3 X f/2.8-5.6 24-600mm vs the Sony RX10 IV f/2.4-4.0 24-600mm EFL — both cameras using 1"-Type sensor, and both have the same 24-600mm EFL range; difference in lens size is G3 X f/5.6 600mm EFL vs. the RX10 IV f/4.0 600mm EFL

Cheers,
Jon

Jon

As I said in my response to the OP, The difference, as the grasph shows is neither Sh*t nor Sh*te.

Please get real and stop fuelling the fire, there is no need for it

Dave

 

[Ed B]

I got you, Dave...you were right first time and I was misreading-- as happens lately. ( Anecdote= Was reading line " Constitution created by the framers.." and I thought I saw " Constitution was written by the farmers. " Though they were farmers too..the dry eye syndrome gets us all )

I forget and can you refresh on your pro/con experience w LX 100 which I am considering in its Mark ii version right now. Thanks. I shoot in mostly well lit surrounds and if I need tele I bring along my GX 8 and 35-100 btw) LX 100 seems like a worthy model but has a lot of bad press as well despite a high rating by DPR. Aloha, GS

Gerry, I have the Leica equivalent of the LX100 and like it quite a bit.

I suppose it all goes back to the old adage that every camera is a compromise but even though the LX100 only has a zoom range up to 75mm, that's not such a bad thing and with its fast lens and larger sensor the LX100 is the best of the smaller zoom type cameras, in lower light.

The only negative I know about with the LX100 is that several people have problems with sensor dust but I'm not 100% sure the LX100 is any worse than other fixed, zoom lens cameras because all of them can suck in dust in the right (or maybe wrong) circumstances.

Other complaints about the LX100 cameras are minor and could be attributed to user errors or to people who would like to see different features other than those the camera actually has.

I'm not saying the LX100 is perfect but provided a person doesn't expect the camera to be excellent for every situation I tend to agree with DPR that it's a great camera.

Anyway, if you end up getting the MK II or even the older version, I think you'll like it.

Good luck.

 

[Jon_T]

10-15x but at the expense of a slower lens. I don't consider that an upgrade, but a side-grade. In my usage, having a slower lens would be a downgrade because i shoot mostly in low light situations. ...

Of course the ZS200 360mm EFL max aperture going to be smaller (slower) than the ZS100 250mm EFL to keep the ZS200 small lens size.

To have larger (faster) max aperture the lens would have to be larger; e.g., the FZ1000 f/2.8-4.0 25-400mm EFL.

Another example is comparing the sizes of the Canon G3 X f/2.8-5.6 24-600mm vs the Sony RX10 IV f/2.4-4.0 24-600mm EFL — both cameras using 1"-Type sensor, and both have the same 24-600mm EFL range; difference in lens size is G3 X f/5.6 600mm EFL vs. the RX10 IV f/4.0 600mm EFL

Cheers,
Jon

Jon

As I said in my response to the OP, The difference, as the grasph shows is neither Sh*t nor Sh*te.

REALLY?

Only stated that the FACT that a larger aperture going to require the lens to have a larger diameter.

In order for the ZS200 (or any 'other' pocketable camera) to 'have' a larger max aperture would require the lens diameter to be larger; e.g., the size of the f/2.8 - f/4 25-400mm FZ1000 lens.

Just as Sony was smart to limit the RX100 VI to 200mm EFL to keep lens size small and have the max f/4.5 max aperture.

NOTHING as to "fueling" ZS100 vs. ZS200.

Please get real and stop fuelling the fire, there is no need for it

PLEASE fully read/ understand post prior to replying. :-|

You seem to bee ignoring that the OP wants a camera for ".. mostly at concerts where the lighting, distance, ...", from my own experiences would understand that the ZS200 f/6.4 would be too slow.

I do a LOT of lower lighting condition events (NO flash); for myself want a f/4.0 or faster lens to avoid having to use 1600+ ISO's.

I like my ZS100, but would not be 'my' camera choice for lower lighting condition events; i.e., concerts, stage performances, etc.

For low light exhibit conditions with 'static' subjects where you can use slower shutter speeds the ZS100 can do well.


ZS100; f/3.2; 1600 ISO; 1/20th

Titanic Exhibit

Jon

 

[saudidave]

10-15x but at the expense of a slower lens. I don't consider that an upgrade, but a side-grade. In my usage, having a slower lens would be a downgrade because i shoot mostly in low light situations. ...

Of course the ZS200 360mm EFL max aperture going to be smaller (slower) than the ZS100 250mm EFL to keep the ZS200 small lens size.

To have larger (faster) max aperture the lens would have to be larger; e.g., the FZ1000 f/2.8-4.0 25-400mm EFL.

Another example is comparing the sizes of the Canon G3 X f/2.8-5.6 24-600mm vs the Sony RX10 IV f/2.4-4.0 24-600mm EFL — both cameras using 1"-Type sensor, and both have the same 24-600mm EFL range; difference in lens size is G3 X f/5.6 600mm EFL vs. the RX10 IV f/4.0 600mm EFL

Cheers,
Jon

Jon

As I said in my response to the OP, The difference, as the grasph shows is neither Sh*t nor Sh*te.

REALLY?

Only stated that the FACT that a larger aperture going to require the lens to have a larger diameter.

In order for the ZS200 (or any 'other' pocketable camera) to 'have' a larger max aperture would require the lens diameter to be larger; e.g., the size of the f/2.8 - f/4 25-400mm FZ1000 lens.

Just as Sony was smart to limit the RX100 VI to 200mm EFL to keep lens size small and have the max f/4.5 max aperture.

NOTHING as to "fueling" ZS100 vs. ZS200.

Please get real and stop fuelling the fire, there is no need for it

PLEASE fully read/ understand post prior to replying. :-|

You seem to bee ignoring that the OP wants a camera for ".. mostly at concerts where the lighting, distance, ...", from my own experiences would understand that the ZS200 f/6.4 would be too slow.

I do a LOT of lower lighting condition events (NO flash); for myself want a f/4.0 or faster lens to avoid having to use 1600+ ISO's.

I like my ZS100, but would not be 'my' camera choice for lower lighting condition events; i.e., concerts, stage performances, etc.

For low light exhibit conditions with 'static' subjects where you can use slower shutter speeds the ZS100 can do well.


ZS100; f/3.2; 1600 ISO; 1/20th

Titanic Exhibit

Jon

Jon

Thanks for the comprehensive response and you are of course technically correct. However in your, zealous enthusiasm to prove your point you have completely misunderstood mine!

The purpose behind my posting the graph was to demonstrate that the light gathering ability of the ZS200 isn't much different than that of the ZS100 and in practical terms so little that it is of no real consequence. The OP was under the misapprehension that the lens on the 200 was massively slower than that on the 100 when it isn't and I was just trying to educate him that his misguided conclusion was wrong.

As I said, you have fuelled the fire; made worse his appreciation of the real situation by providing misleading raw facts.

Dave

 

[Chris 222]

The only thing we may get next year is some "incrementalware" model since Panasonic Engineers are no longer allowed to do anything but use low-cost components from the ol' parts bin. Sadly, don't hold your breath for anything after that.

 

[123dy]

Panny's consumer cameras don't even rate a mention as a "business category", along with the other low-profit dregs their future is cost reductions and rationalisation.


etc

 

[ANAYV]

Panny's consumer cameras don't even rate a mention as a "business category"

Should it be??

Perhaps..or perhaps not, since it's such a small part of what Panasonic makes.

For the record, they are an old company...been around over 100 years!!

These days they make camera's but have been making electronic stuff for a long time.

Some items Panasonic makes:

air conditioners, refrigerators, washing machines, compressors, lighting, televisions, personal computers, mobile phones, audio equipment, cameras, broadcasting equipment, projectors, automotive electronics, aircraft in-flight entertainment systems..and well known for their batteries

they have also made cordless drills, stereo systems, Plasma TV's...and yes, still make batteries. Still make them (Tesla uses their batteries in their cars)

, along with the other low-profit dregs their future is cost reductions and rationalisation.

After 100 years and the changing times, I'd guess some changes will always be made to survive.



ANAYV