a7r4 compared to 24mp aps-c, base iso100, final.

[Advent1sam]

Final comparison, you'll be glad to here, of the 24mp aps-c sensor in the a6500 using LR ED and Gigapixel to ai the output to 74mp, ie 1.75% increase in height and width. I then applied LR ED to the latest profile release of a7r4 and used Gigapixel to ai the output to 74mp, the same processing essentially. The increase is much less on the a7r4 beyond this the difference does move in favour of the a7r4, as was suspected, but my objective was to see how far you can push the 24mp aps-c with the latest ai model.

The point to this, others asked for a point, was not show how great the a6500, it is very impressive from raw at base, or that it is better than the a7r4, it isn't technically, but that ai now provides a very interesting proposition for those wanting to print large or make enlargements of cropped areas to provide more to print with. In my opinion 50mp is ample anyway, 60mp incredible and 74mp, unbelievable when the results are this good.

Here's what I found at 74mp from both

Note, the new pink cast to the a7r4, both below std adobe profile and default and ed applied, export just jpg and resized in gigapixel.

 

[drip01]

At 100% zoom, the left side images blow away the right side, not even close.

For example, I can clearly make out what the fine prints say in the second row on the left but not on the right.

JMHO, you may see things differently.

 

[Advent1sam]

At 100% zoom, the left side images blow away the right side, not even close.

For example, I can clearly make out what the fine prints say in the second row on the left but not on the right.

JMHO, you may see things differently.

I just see differences, good/bad are you on a 2k or 4k and viewing in the browser.

If you are referring to the text swatch I can clearly read on both, faces seem similar for me, remember these are colossal size now, you can print to a billboard with these size images.

--
Brian

 

[drip01]

At 100% zoom, the left side images blow away the right side, not even close.

For example, I can clearly make out what the fine prints say in the second row on the left but not on the right.

JMHO, you may see things differently.

I just see differences, good/bad are you on a 2k or 4k and viewing in the browser.

I don't think my monitor or browser would selective blur out the right side images and keep the left side clear. Big differences to me as a bird shooter. Feather details are important.

If you are referring to the text swatch I can clearly read on both, faces seem similar for me, remember these are colossal size now, you can print to a billboard with these size images.

Last few rows of text in the second image. Not close to me. As I said, you may see things differently because you love your a6500 so much.

Do this comparison again with phone images, I bet you'd come up with the same conclusions that they are close (when reduced in size).

 

[yuzukiii]

Last few rows of text in the second image. Not close to me. As I said, you may see things differently because you love your a6500 so much.

You are indeed correct. On the left side, I can read the whole text up till the last row.

As for the image on the right side, the words starts to become smudgy for the last 7 rows.

 

[Advent1sam]

At 100% zoom, the left side images blow away the right side, not even close.

For example, I can clearly make out what the fine prints say in the second row on the left but not on the right.

JMHO, you may see things differently.

I just see differences, good/bad are you on a 2k or 4k and viewing in the browser.

I don't think my monitor or browser would selective blur out the right side images and keep the left side clear. Big differences to me as a bird shooter. Feather details are important.

Well, birds and wildlife are a different topic all together, which lens are you looking at as for birds unless you can stretch to incredibly large glass the chances are you will be using crop anyway, this is not that type of comparison really!

If you are referring to the text swatch I can clearly read on both, faces seem similar for me, remember these are colossal size now, you can print to a billboard with these size images.

Last few rows of text in the second image. Not close to me. As I said, you may see things differently because you love your a6500 so much.

probably no more than others like their camera

Do this comparison again with phone images, I bet you'd come up with the same conclusions that they are close (when reduced in size).

Not really, the lenses, raw output isn’t really up to it under this extreme pixel peeping

--
Brian

 

[drip01]

Last few rows of text in the second image. Not close to me. As I said, you may see things differently because you love your a6500 so much.

You are indeed correct. On the left side, I can read the whole text up till the last row.

As for the image on the right side, the words starts to become smudgy for the last 7 rows.

How could some people miss that? That's my question.

 

[brilly]

now you have finally made a more sensible comparison and processed both cameras with the same software we are back to the beginning - clearly a7iv does much better as expected

 

[Advent1sam]

now you have finally made a more sensible comparison and processed both cameras with the same software we are back to the beginning - clearly a7iv does much better as expected

Sure, but the law of ever diminishing improvements are close and on a individual basis you can easily print very very large with 24mp using ai. I certainly will not be buying any FF camera, let alone the a7r4, to gain a stop of dof or iso or any more mp, but I accept others may feel differently for those that are wanting to print large do check out Lr ed tool and the Topaz Gigapixel, the jewel in the Topaz ai suite

 

[brilly]

now you have finally made a more sensible comparison and processed both cameras with the same software we are back to the beginning - clearly a7iv does much better as expected

Sure, but the law of ever diminishing improvements are close and on a individual basis you can easily print very very large with 24mp using ai. I certainly will not be buying any FF camera, let alone the a7r4, to gain a stop of dof or iso or any more mp, but I accept others may feel differently for those that are wanting to print large do check out Lr ed tool and the Topaz Gigapixel, the jewel in the Topaz ai suite

ok then lets use m43 and do the same, lets use 1 inch and do the same etc

seems all you do is try and justify your own choices whilst criticising others

24MP is fine for 300dpi 11x14inch

generally viewing distances are larger for bigger than that do lower dpi can be used perfectly well

you decide that a6500 with gigapixel is 'enough' but what if its not - what about those that want to print big big? only a7riv gigapixel will do...

 

[Advent1sam]

now you have finally made a more sensible comparison and processed both cameras with the same software we are back to the beginning - clearly a7iv does much better as expected

Sure, but the law of ever diminishing improvements are close and on a individual basis you can easily print very very large with 24mp using ai. I certainly will not be buying any FF camera, let alone the a7r4, to gain a stop of dof or iso or any more mp, but I accept others may feel differently for those that are wanting to print large do check out Lr ed tool and the Topaz Gigapixel, the jewel in the Topaz ai suite

ok then lets use m43 and do the same, lets use 1 inch and do the same etc

Been there, done that, 12 bit raw and in m43 case actually 2 stops now and 1 inch 3, m43 is also less than 18mp in 3:2 ratio, overall they are just a step too far away to FF, imo, but sure try it yourself

seems all you do is try and justify your own choices whilst criticising others

No, I am fully sold on aps-c, have been since digital DSLR, FF is unnecessary for the majority of people imo and for wildlife aps-c it is the sweet spot. If Fuji made a high performance bayer body and one more high performance tele lens II would of stayed Fuji, but they have gone even more extreme/elitist with Gfx and now some crazy 50mm f1 development is replacing the equally crazy 35 f1 development, they appear clueless. Sony did good with a6600 in theory, let’s see what it’s really like with the 16-55 equally looking good!

24MP is fine for 300dpi 11x14inch

Nonesense

generally viewing distances are larger for bigger than that do lower dpi can be used perfectly well

you decide that a6500 with gigapixel is 'enough' but what if its not - what about those that want to print big big? only a7riv gigapixel will do...

If you say so

 

[brilly]

now you have finally made a more sensible comparison and processed both cameras with the same software we are back to the beginning - clearly a7iv does much better as expected

Sure, but the law of ever diminishing improvements are close and on a individual basis you can easily print very very large with 24mp using ai. I certainly will not be buying any FF camera, let alone the a7r4, to gain a stop of dof or iso or any more mp, but I accept others may feel differently for those that are wanting to print large do check out Lr ed tool and the Topaz Gigapixel, the jewel in the Topaz ai suite

ok then lets use m43 and do the same, lets use 1 inch and do the same etc

Been there, done that, 12 bit raw and in m43 case actually 2 stops now and 1 inch 3, m43 is also less than 18mp in 3:2 ratio, overall they are just a step too far away to FF, imo, but sure try it yourself

seems all you do is try and justify your own choices whilst criticising others

No, I am fully sold on aps-c, have been since digital DSLR, FF is unnecessary for the majority of people imo and for wildlife aps-c it is the sweet spot. If Fuji made a high performance bayer body and one more high performance tele lens II would of stayed Fuji, but they have gone even more extreme/elitist with Gfx and now some crazy 50mm f1 development is replacing the equally crazy 35 f1 development, they appear clueless. Sony did good with a6600 in theory, let’s see what it’s really like with the 16-55 equally looking good!

24MP is fine for 300dpi 11x14inch

Nonesense

generally viewing distances are larger for bigger than that do lower dpi can be used perfectly well

you decide that a6500 with gigapixel is 'enough' but what if its not - what about those that want to print big big? only a7riv gigapixel will do...

If you say so

nonsense? so you cant print that size with 24mp?

actually i just checked at its 13*20 inches at 300dpi

now which part is nonsense now? that 300dpi isn't enough or that 13*20 inch is achievable perfectly at 300dpi?

so you need more thann 300dpi at larger sizes than that? well ok - fake some data with gigapixel and make multiple threads about it!

so few facts from you and just fudged statements supporting random claims

 

[Advent1sam]

now you have finally made a more sensible comparison and processed both cameras with the same software we are back to the beginning - clearly a7iv does much better as expected

Sure, but the law of ever diminishing improvements are close and on a individual basis you can easily print very very large with 24mp using ai. I certainly will not be buying any FF camera, let alone the a7r4, to gain a stop of dof or iso or any more mp, but I accept others may feel differently for those that are wanting to print large do check out Lr ed tool and the Topaz Gigapixel, the jewel in the Topaz ai suite

ok then lets use m43 and do the same, lets use 1 inch and do the same etc

Been there, done that, 12 bit raw and in m43 case actually 2 stops now and 1 inch 3, m43 is also less than 18mp in 3:2 ratio, overall they are just a step too far away to FF, imo, but sure try it yourself

seems all you do is try and justify your own choices whilst criticising others

No, I am fully sold on aps-c, have been since digital DSLR, FF is unnecessary for the majority of people imo and for wildlife aps-c it is the sweet spot. If Fuji made a high performance bayer body and one more high performance tele lens II would of stayed Fuji, but they have gone even more extreme/elitist with Gfx and now some crazy 50mm f1 development is replacing the equally crazy 35 f1 development, they appear clueless. Sony did good with a6600 in theory, let’s see what it’s really like with the 16-55 equally looking good!

24MP is fine for 300dpi 11x14inch

Nonesense

generally viewing distances are larger for bigger than that do lower dpi can be used perfectly well

you decide that a6500 with gigapixel is 'enough' but what if its not - what about those that want to print big big? only a7riv gigapixel will do...

If you say so

nonsense? so you cant print that size with 24mp?

actually i just checked at its 13*20 inches at 300dpi

now which part is nonsense now? that 300dpi isn't enough or that 13*20 inch is achievable perfectly at 300dpi?

so you need more thann 300dpi at larger sizes than that? well ok - fake some data with gigapixel and make multiple threads about it!

so few facts from you and just fudged statements supporting random claims

24mp well taken quality images with ai resizing will easily provide a 50mp image that side by side with a camera of native 50mp resolution will if taken together at the same time equally will provide enormous prints of identical quality, even if you push your nose up to it, but how many have the reason or inclination to print so many expensive huge prints anyway? Mp race is done, focus on glass and sensor iq is the way forward.

https://www.imaging-resource.com/articles/why-the-hell-do-we-need-400mp-we-dont-even-need-100mp-and-ill-prove-it

 

[brilly]

now you have finally made a more sensible comparison and processed both cameras with the same software we are back to the beginning - clearly a7iv does much better as expected

Sure, but the law of ever diminishing improvements are close and on a individual basis you can easily print very very large with 24mp using ai. I certainly will not be buying any FF camera, let alone the a7r4, to gain a stop of dof or iso or any more mp, but I accept others may feel differently for those that are wanting to print large do check out Lr ed tool and the Topaz Gigapixel, the jewel in the Topaz ai suite

ok then lets use m43 and do the same, lets use 1 inch and do the same etc

Been there, done that, 12 bit raw and in m43 case actually 2 stops now and 1 inch 3, m43 is also less than 18mp in 3:2 ratio, overall they are just a step too far away to FF, imo, but sure try it yourself

seems all you do is try and justify your own choices whilst criticising others

No, I am fully sold on aps-c, have been since digital DSLR, FF is unnecessary for the majority of people imo and for wildlife aps-c it is the sweet spot. If Fuji made a high performance bayer body and one more high performance tele lens II would of stayed Fuji, but they have gone even more extreme/elitist with Gfx and now some crazy 50mm f1 development is replacing the equally crazy 35 f1 development, they appear clueless. Sony did good with a6600 in theory, let’s see what it’s really like with the 16-55 equally looking good!

24MP is fine for 300dpi 11x14inch

Nonesense

generally viewing distances are larger for bigger than that do lower dpi can be used perfectly well

you decide that a6500 with gigapixel is 'enough' but what if its not - what about those that want to print big big? only a7riv gigapixel will do...

If you say so

nonsense? so you cant print that size with 24mp?

actually i just checked at its 13*20 inches at 300dpi

now which part is nonsense now? that 300dpi isn't enough or that 13*20 inch is achievable perfectly at 300dpi?

so you need more thann 300dpi at larger sizes than that? well ok - fake some data with gigapixel and make multiple threads about it!

so few facts from you and just fudged statements supporting random claims

24mp well taken quality images with ai resizing will easily provide a 50mp image that side by side with a camera of native 50mp resolution will if taken together at the same time equally will provide enormous prints of identical quality, even if you push your nose up to it, but how many have the reason or inclination to print so many expensive huge prints anyway? Mp race is done, focus on glass and sensor iq is the way forward.

https://www.imaging-resource.com/ar...00mp-we-dont-even-need-100mp-and-ill-prove-it

wait a sec - you didnt answer which part was nonsense

obviously they are only identical if you dont have the brains to process them the same as you have shown

you are the one seemingly obsessed with the large prints not me

 

[Advent1sam]

now you have finally made a more sensible comparison and processed both cameras with the same software we are back to the beginning - clearly a7iv does much better as expected

Sure, but the law of ever diminishing improvements are close and on a individual basis you can easily print very very large with 24mp using ai. I certainly will not be buying any FF camera, let alone the a7r4, to gain a stop of dof or iso or any more mp, but I accept others may feel differently for those that are wanting to print large do check out Lr ed tool and the Topaz Gigapixel, the jewel in the Topaz ai suite

ok then lets use m43 and do the same, lets use 1 inch and do the same etc

Been there, done that, 12 bit raw and in m43 case actually 2 stops now and 1 inch 3, m43 is also less than 18mp in 3:2 ratio, overall they are just a step too far away to FF, imo, but sure try it yourself

seems all you do is try and justify your own choices whilst criticising others

No, I am fully sold on aps-c, have been since digital DSLR, FF is unnecessary for the majority of people imo and for wildlife aps-c it is the sweet spot. If Fuji made a high performance bayer body and one more high performance tele lens II would of stayed Fuji, but they have gone even more extreme/elitist with Gfx and now some crazy 50mm f1 development is replacing the equally crazy 35 f1 development, they appear clueless. Sony did good with a6600 in theory, let’s see what it’s really like with the 16-55 equally looking good!

24MP is fine for 300dpi 11x14inch

Nonesense

generally viewing distances are larger for bigger than that do lower dpi can be used perfectly well

you decide that a6500 with gigapixel is 'enough' but what if its not - what about those that want to print big big? only a7riv gigapixel will do...

If you say so

nonsense? so you cant print that size with 24mp?

actually i just checked at its 13*20 inches at 300dpi

now which part is nonsense now? that 300dpi isn't enough or that 13*20 inch is achievable perfectly at 300dpi?

so you need more thann 300dpi at larger sizes than that? well ok - fake some data with gigapixel and make multiple threads about it!

so few facts from you and just fudged statements supporting random claims

24mp well taken quality images with ai resizing will easily provide a 50mp image that side by side with a camera of native 50mp resolution will if taken together at the same time equally will provide enormous prints of identical quality, even if you push your nose up to it, but how many have the reason or inclination to print so many expensive huge prints anyway? Mp race is done, focus on glass and sensor iq is the way forward.

https://www.imaging-resource.com/ar...00mp-we-dont-even-need-100mp-and-ill-prove-it

wait a sec - you didnt answer which part was nonsense

obviously they are only identical if you dont have the brains to process them the same as you have shown

you are the one seemingly obsessed with the large prints not me

What other reasons are there for lots of mp?

 

[brilly]

now you have finally made a more sensible comparison and processed both cameras with the same software we are back to the beginning - clearly a7iv does much better as expected

Sure, but the law of ever diminishing improvements are close and on a individual basis you can easily print very very large with 24mp using ai. I certainly will not be buying any FF camera, let alone the a7r4, to gain a stop of dof or iso or any more mp, but I accept others may feel differently for those that are wanting to print large do check out Lr ed tool and the Topaz Gigapixel, the jewel in the Topaz ai suite

ok then lets use m43 and do the same, lets use 1 inch and do the same etc

Been there, done that, 12 bit raw and in m43 case actually 2 stops now and 1 inch 3, m43 is also less than 18mp in 3:2 ratio, overall they are just a step too far away to FF, imo, but sure try it yourself

seems all you do is try and justify your own choices whilst criticising others

No, I am fully sold on aps-c, have been since digital DSLR, FF is unnecessary for the majority of people imo and for wildlife aps-c it is the sweet spot. If Fuji made a high performance bayer body and one more high performance tele lens II would of stayed Fuji, but they have gone even more extreme/elitist with Gfx and now some crazy 50mm f1 development is replacing the equally crazy 35 f1 development, they appear clueless. Sony did good with a6600 in theory, let’s see what it’s really like with the 16-55 equally looking good!

24MP is fine for 300dpi 11x14inch

Nonesense

generally viewing distances are larger for bigger than that do lower dpi can be used perfectly well

you decide that a6500 with gigapixel is 'enough' but what if its not - what about those that want to print big big? only a7riv gigapixel will do...

If you say so

nonsense? so you cant print that size with 24mp?

actually i just checked at its 13*20 inches at 300dpi

now which part is nonsense now? that 300dpi isn't enough or that 13*20 inch is achievable perfectly at 300dpi?

so you need more thann 300dpi at larger sizes than that? well ok - fake some data with gigapixel and make multiple threads about it!

so few facts from you and just fudged statements supporting random claims

24mp well taken quality images with ai resizing will easily provide a 50mp image that side by side with a camera of native 50mp resolution will if taken together at the same time equally will provide enormous prints of identical quality, even if you push your nose up to it, but how many have the reason or inclination to print so many expensive huge prints anyway? Mp race is done, focus on glass and sensor iq is the way forward.

https://www.imaging-resource.com/ar...00mp-we-dont-even-need-100mp-and-ill-prove-it

wait a sec - you didnt answer which part was nonsense

obviously they are only identical if you dont have the brains to process them the same as you have shown

you are the one seemingly obsessed with the large prints not me

What other reasons are there for lots of mp?

"wait a sec - you didnt answer which part was nonsense"

 

[Advent1sam]

now you have finally made a more sensible comparison and processed both cameras with the same software we are back to the beginning - clearly a7iv does much better as expected

Sure, but the law of ever diminishing improvements are close and on a individual basis you can easily print very very large with 24mp using ai. I certainly will not be buying any FF camera, let alone the a7r4, to gain a stop of dof or iso or any more mp, but I accept others may feel differently for those that are wanting to print large do check out Lr ed tool and the Topaz Gigapixel, the jewel in the Topaz ai suite

ok then lets use m43 and do the same, lets use 1 inch and do the same etc

Been there, done that, 12 bit raw and in m43 case actually 2 stops now and 1 inch 3, m43 is also less than 18mp in 3:2 ratio, overall they are just a step too far away to FF, imo, but sure try it yourself

seems all you do is try and justify your own choices whilst criticising others

No, I am fully sold on aps-c, have been since digital DSLR, FF is unnecessary for the majority of people imo and for wildlife aps-c it is the sweet spot. If Fuji made a high performance bayer body and one more high performance tele lens II would of stayed Fuji, but they have gone even more extreme/elitist with Gfx and now some crazy 50mm f1 development is replacing the equally crazy 35 f1 development, they appear clueless. Sony did good with a6600 in theory, let’s see what it’s really like with the 16-55 equally looking good!

24MP is fine for 300dpi 11x14inch

Nonesense

generally viewing distances are larger for bigger than that do lower dpi can be used perfectly well

you decide that a6500 with gigapixel is 'enough' but what if its not - what about those that want to print big big? only a7riv gigapixel will do...

If you say so

nonsense? so you cant print that size with 24mp?

actually i just checked at its 13*20 inches at 300dpi

now which part is nonsense now? that 300dpi isn't enough or that 13*20 inch is achievable perfectly at 300dpi?

so you need more thann 300dpi at larger sizes than that? well ok - fake some data with gigapixel and make multiple threads about it!

so few facts from you and just fudged statements supporting random claims

24mp well taken quality images with ai resizing will easily provide a 50mp image that side by side with a camera of native 50mp resolution will if taken together at the same time equally will provide enormous prints of identical quality, even if you push your nose up to it, but how many have the reason or inclination to print so many expensive huge prints anyway? Mp race is done, focus on glass and sensor iq is the way forward.

https://www.imaging-resource.com/ar...00mp-we-dont-even-need-100mp-and-ill-prove-it

wait a sec - you didnt answer which part was nonsense

obviously they are only identical if you dont have the brains to process them the same as you have shown

you are the one seemingly obsessed with the large prints not me

What other reasons are there for lots of mp?

"wait a sec - you didnt answer which part was nonsense"

Apologies, but I thought I'd answered it many times now, I will say it one last time,

24mp is good for very large prints, bigger than 60x50 inches, certainly bigger than I need to print, that's for sure!

 

[brilly]

now you have finally made a more sensible comparison and processed both cameras with the same software we are back to the beginning - clearly a7iv does much better as expected

Sure, but the law of ever diminishing improvements are close and on a individual basis you can easily print very very large with 24mp using ai. I certainly will not be buying any FF camera, let alone the a7r4, to gain a stop of dof or iso or any more mp, but I accept others may feel differently for those that are wanting to print large do check out Lr ed tool and the Topaz Gigapixel, the jewel in the Topaz ai suite

ok then lets use m43 and do the same, lets use 1 inch and do the same etc

Been there, done that, 12 bit raw and in m43 case actually 2 stops now and 1 inch 3, m43 is also less than 18mp in 3:2 ratio, overall they are just a step too far away to FF, imo, but sure try it yourself

seems all you do is try and justify your own choices whilst criticising others

No, I am fully sold on aps-c, have been since digital DSLR, FF is unnecessary for the majority of people imo and for wildlife aps-c it is the sweet spot. If Fuji made a high performance bayer body and one more high performance tele lens II would of stayed Fuji, but they have gone even more extreme/elitist with Gfx and now some crazy 50mm f1 development is replacing the equally crazy 35 f1 development, they appear clueless. Sony did good with a6600 in theory, let’s see what it’s really like with the 16-55 equally looking good!

24MP is fine for 300dpi 11x14inch

Nonesense

generally viewing distances are larger for bigger than that do lower dpi can be used perfectly well

you decide that a6500 with gigapixel is 'enough' but what if its not - what about those that want to print big big? only a7riv gigapixel will do...

If you say so

nonsense? so you cant print that size with 24mp?

actually i just checked at its 13*20 inches at 300dpi

now which part is nonsense now? that 300dpi isn't enough or that 13*20 inch is achievable perfectly at 300dpi?

so you need more thann 300dpi at larger sizes than that? well ok - fake some data with gigapixel and make multiple threads about it!

so few facts from you and just fudged statements supporting random claims

24mp well taken quality images with ai resizing will easily provide a 50mp image that side by side with a camera of native 50mp resolution will if taken together at the same time equally will provide enormous prints of identical quality, even if you push your nose up to it, but how many have the reason or inclination to print so many expensive huge prints anyway? Mp race is done, focus on glass and sensor iq is the way forward.

https://www.imaging-resource.com/ar...00mp-we-dont-even-need-100mp-and-ill-prove-it

wait a sec - you didnt answer which part was nonsense

obviously they are only identical if you dont have the brains to process them the same as you have shown

you are the one seemingly obsessed with the large prints not me

What other reasons are there for lots of mp?

"wait a sec - you didnt answer which part was nonsense"

Apologies, but I thought I'd answered it many times now, I will say it one last time,

24mp is good for very large prints, bigger than 60x50 inches, certainly bigger than I need to print, that's for sure!

as you make random statements as fact i thought you might try and back it up

24mp at 300dpi is 13.3*20 inches at 300dpi which is the generally accepted 'perfect' res

if you use a different criteria then better to say so rather than just say 'nonsense'

sorry that 60*50 inch isnt enough for you or that you seem to have chosen such an odd aspect ratio randomly

 

[Advent1sam]

now you have finally made a more sensible comparison and processed both cameras with the same software we are back to the beginning - clearly a7iv does much better as expected

Sure, but the law of ever diminishing improvements are close and on a individual basis you can easily print very very large with 24mp using ai. I certainly will not be buying any FF camera, let alone the a7r4, to gain a stop of dof or iso or any more mp, but I accept others may feel differently for those that are wanting to print large do check out Lr ed tool and the Topaz Gigapixel, the jewel in the Topaz ai suite

ok then lets use m43 and do the same, lets use 1 inch and do the same etc

Been there, done that, 12 bit raw and in m43 case actually 2 stops now and 1 inch 3, m43 is also less than 18mp in 3:2 ratio, overall they are just a step too far away to FF, imo, but sure try it yourself

seems all you do is try and justify your own choices whilst criticising others

No, I am fully sold on aps-c, have been since digital DSLR, FF is unnecessary for the majority of people imo and for wildlife aps-c it is the sweet spot. If Fuji made a high performance bayer body and one more high performance tele lens II would of stayed Fuji, but they have gone even more extreme/elitist with Gfx and now some crazy 50mm f1 development is replacing the equally crazy 35 f1 development, they appear clueless. Sony did good with a6600 in theory, let’s see what it’s really like with the 16-55 equally looking good!

24MP is fine for 300dpi 11x14inch

Nonesense

generally viewing distances are larger for bigger than that do lower dpi can be used perfectly well

you decide that a6500 with gigapixel is 'enough' but what if its not - what about those that want to print big big? only a7riv gigapixel will do...

If you say so

nonsense? so you cant print that size with 24mp?

actually i just checked at its 13*20 inches at 300dpi

now which part is nonsense now? that 300dpi isn't enough or that 13*20 inch is achievable perfectly at 300dpi?

so you need more thann 300dpi at larger sizes than that? well ok - fake some data with gigapixel and make multiple threads about it!

so few facts from you and just fudged statements supporting random claims

24mp well taken quality images with ai resizing will easily provide a 50mp image that side by side with a camera of native 50mp resolution will if taken together at the same time equally will provide enormous prints of identical quality, even if you push your nose up to it, but how many have the reason or inclination to print so many expensive huge prints anyway? Mp race is done, focus on glass and sensor iq is the way forward.

https://www.imaging-resource.com/ar...00mp-we-dont-even-need-100mp-and-ill-prove-it

wait a sec - you didnt answer which part was nonsense

obviously they are only identical if you dont have the brains to process them the same as you have shown

you are the one seemingly obsessed with the large prints not me

What other reasons are there for lots of mp?

"wait a sec - you didnt answer which part was nonsense"

Apologies, but I thought I'd answered it many times now, I will say it one last time,

24mp is good for very large prints, bigger than 60x50 inches, certainly bigger than I need to print, that's for sure!

as you make random statements as fact i thought you might try and back it up

24mp at 300dpi is 13.3*20 inches at 300dpi which is the generally accepted 'perfect' res

if you use a different criteria then better to say so rather than just say 'nonsense'

sorry that 60*50 inch isnt enough for you or that you seem to have chosen such an odd aspect ratio randomly

Whitewall as referenced in the IR editorial will accept a 10mp image for a 60x50inch print, on the basis I can provide 54mp with ease, repeatedly now with GigaPIX from a 24mp sensor with no degradation with decent glass, there is no issue being able to make billboard size images, the story is over there.

For info, the only person ever able to make the effort and provide a real meaningful equivalence image, provided these raws, which were processed the same except the x-pro2 24mp image was resized to the GFX50 size in height, one is 4:3 and one is 3:2 so you will end up with even larger image in mp than GFX50, 54mp is a very nice resizing ratio, 9x6 for 24mp sensors, ie 60x40 images with ease.

Anyway here are the links to the GFX50 and xpro2 for your own comparison.

https://3.img-dpreview.com/files/p/E~forums/62719834/fae41535a8f4449685155ac75c7e3a77

https://1.img-dpreview.com/files/p/E~forums/62719834/e2e9c3c23c2747e1b3c780a59e8eb47d

There is no way I will respond further to you brilly, if you want to approach things in a different way it is your prerogative, no issue with that, good luck.

 

[terryreid]

At 100% zoom, the left side images blow away the right side, not even close.

For example, I can clearly make out what the fine prints say in the second row on the left but not on the right.

JMHO, you may see things differently.

It is not even close I own a a6500 and have a a6600 coming but I do not use them for image quality or critical things just for convenience.

I did preorder the two new lenses 16-55 G & 70-350 G because they appear to be good but only as a small rig when I go somewhere for the weekend.

The idea of walking around and having everything from 24mm to 525mm FF equivalent with one of these lenses in my cargo shorts is pretty appealing.

It is hard to back away from my a7rIV and GM's but for what I intend to use them for they should be fine. Not a critical intense what is the best I can get but hopefully good enough and convenient.