Pulse effect banding in electronic shutter X-T3/LEDs

[Michael Todd]

I used my new X-T3 yesterday and was experimenting with it. I noticed that when using the electronic shutter under LED lighting (from a dining room chandelier), I was getting horizontal stripes that moved up and down my image --shooting BKT, so you could see it move through the 3 images. It was the kind of pulsing that I'd usually see from fluorescent lights at high shutter speeds.

When I switched back to mechanical shutter, I didn't see the stripes anymore.

Settings were: f/2.0 1/250th ISO 3200

I thought it was the lights at first, but then I wasn't sure when they went away with mech. shutter.

Does the pulsing of fluorescents/LEDs get exxagerated when using electronic shutter? I'd expect this would be a drawback for people wanting to use the ES for silent wedding shooting.

https://scontent-ort2-2.xx.fbcdn.ne...=10060c48ef2deffe6b0db4e194ffbd68&oe=5CA28265

--
-Todd Muskopf
www.classicbeautyproject.com
FB/IG #classicbeautyproject

 

[Michael Todd]

n/t

 

[Michael Todd]

Trying a different way to embed.

Loading…

4.bp.blogspot.com

 

[Michael Todd]

--
-Todd Muskopf
www.classicbeautyproject.com
FB/IG #classicbeautyproject

 

[Michael Todd]

I was just testing ways to post an image. Back when I used to be a regular on DPR, I believe we used to host the photo somewhere else, then put a link to it in the post. I guess now, we just click the insert photo button. Things are different than they were in 2005.

 

[tdwesbo]

ES doesn’t grab the whole frame at once. It scans its way down the sensor. With LED lighting (and some fluorescent fixtures) the scene’s brightness changes during the scanning process, resulting in images like the one you posted.

Yes, it can be a problem...

 

[rokphish]

I use ES mostly on my X cameras. When that banding with lights happens, I could make it go away simply by changing the ss, maybe not first or second next lower/higher ss, but eventually it will get to where the banding disappears. If by then the ss is not what I’m satisfied with, I just switch to MS with one/two presses with my thumb. This rarely happens, and when it does, very simple and quick remedy so it’s not a matter at all for me.

 

[Jerry-astro]

Mike, suggest you get familiar with the Edit function here so you can simply revise posts rather than posting a string of them as you did here. PM me if you have any further questions.

 

[Chris Dodkin]

ES has a slow readout, so any change in lighting, camera position, or subject movement, will lead to issues with the final image

As a rule of thumb, only use ES if there is absolutely no other option available to you

 

[jakelindsay]

Yes. It's kind of been a known deal that e shutters suffer from. The only exception would be the A9, which is an engineering marvel. The xt3 does a decent job with it but as you now know it's kinda useless under artificial light. Also no good for fast action either. Really good for time lapse intervals however.

 

[Michael Todd]

I use ES mostly on my X cameras. When that banding with lights happens, I could make it go away simply by changing the ss, maybe not first or second next lower/higher ss, but eventually it will get to where the banding disappears. If by then the ss is not what I’m satisfied with, I just switch to MS with one/two presses with my thumb. This rarely happens, and when it does, very simple and quick remedy so it’s not a matter at all for me.

When shooting under fluorescents with my dslrs, I'd generally try to put the shutter at about 1/60th s. to alleviate the banding/fluctutation. I'm guessing this is a similar situation, but it's different because the capture is alternating (due to rolling shutter) as well as the lights pulsing (imperceptible to the eye).

Interesting situation.

 

[koweb]

Yes. It's kind of been a known deal that e shutters suffer from. The only exception would be the A9, which is an engineering marvel. The xt3 does a decent job with it but as you now know it's kinda useless under artificial light. Also no good for fast action either. Really good for time lapse intervals however.

What's up this week? Maybe I'm just grumpy (I know I shouldn't be), but there seems to be a lot of trolling; really seems like another seagull here... you don't seem to own an X-T3, or any Fuji gear, but you want to fly in, crap on this forum, then fly away.

I don't own an A9, but you won't see me on the Sony forum telling you how it's no good. So, please don't come here and tell Fuji owners about something you have no experience with. If you want to know what some gear is like that you don't own, go read some reviews --hint, they don't agree with you about the X-T3... at all...

 

[ikaika777]

Turn on “flicker reduction”.

”FLICKER REDUCTION

Select ON to reduce flicker in pictures and the display when shooting under fluorescent lighting and other similar light sources.

OptionsONOFF

Enabling flicker reduction disables the electronic shutter and increases the time needed to record pictures.

Flicker reduction is not available during movie recording.”

Loading…

fujifilm-dsc.com

 

[baobob]

Read

Silent Shutter Banding | Enthusiast Photography Blog

silent shutter on mirrorless cameras, how to avoid banding with silent shutter, Sony A7riii, Sony A9, Sony A7iii, Nikon Z, Canon R, banding

enthusiastphotoblog.com

that should help about e shutter use pros and cons

 

[Michael Todd]

Is there one? Looking in more options, I don't see it.







--
-Todd Muskopf
www.classicbeautyproject.com
FB/IG #classicbeautyproject

 

[Michael Todd]

Turn on “flicker reduction”.

”FLICKER REDUCTION

Select ON to reduce flicker in pictures and the display when shooting under fluorescent lighting and other similar light sources.

OptionsONOFF

Enabling flicker reduction disables the electronic shutter and increases the time needed to record pictures.

Flicker reduction is not available during movie recording.”

http://fujifilm-dsc.com/en/manual/x-t3/menu_shooting/shooting_setting/index.html

Greybeard2017 just said this in another thread:

For the X-T3 the following are disabled (possibly others) when using ES:

- Long Exposure Noise Reduction

- Sports Finder Mode

- Flicker Reduction

I'm guessing he's right. I've been meandering through the manual, but haven't read everything yet.

 

[dual12]

I use it all the time with subject movement outdoors. Not a problem for me at all.

 

[koweb]

Yes. It's kind of been a known deal that e shutters suffer from. The only exception would be the A9, which is an engineering marvel. The xt3 does a decent job with it but as you now know it's kinda useless under artificial light. Also no good for fast action either. Really good for time lapse intervals however.

Ok, I believe I totally misread your post, and wish that I could delete my earlier reply... guess I was right when I thought I was grumpy... my apologies.

When I re-read your post, I realize that you were not saying that, in general, the X-T3 was "useless under artificial light" and "no good for fast action", but that the E-shutter was not good for those situations. I agree, and would recommend MS for those times as well.

I have had some success slowing the E shutter down in low artificial light, to about 1/60, but it doesn't completely remove banding. Fluorescent lights seem particularly bad.

We need the new "organic, global shutter" that has been rumoured for awhile that apparently Fuji and Panasonic have been working on. Maybe in the X-T5 ;-)

 

[Jerry-astro]

Is there one? Looking in more options, I don't see it.

Mike, I may be off base here, but I believe that your option to edit may go away if your post has been responded to. I can't double check this, because Mods have additional editing capabilities (those "magical Mod powers" I mention once in a while) that other Forum members do not. However, if you create a post and see an error before it's responded to, the "Edit" function should be available to you. The key is to catch the problem right away.

Try it next time around, and see if it works for you. If not, PM me, and we'll work on a solution together.

--
Jerry-Astro
Fujifilm X Forum Co-Mod

 

[Michael Todd]

Is there one? Looking in more options, I don't see it.

Mike, I may be off base here, but I believe that your option to edit may go away if your post has been responded to. I can't double check this, because Mods have additional editing capabilities (those "magical Mod powers" I mention once in a while) that other Forum members do not. However, if you create a post and see an error before it's responded to, the "Edit" function should be available to you. The key is to catch the problem right away.

Try it next time around, and see if it works for you. If not, PM me, and we'll work on a solution together.

I did notice that I wasn't able to remove anything after it had been replied to. Perhaps the edit disappears as well.