Cancelled 1ds Because of Sigma

[John Mason]

Sigma/Foveon may need to tweak their silicon depth curve

The amount of resolution for the money definately makes one pause on any new purchase though. The next F3 release will probably not have the teething issues.

Hey - how about not cancelling your 1Ds order and letting me have it?

 

[John Mason]

according to the review the color of the skys is cartoonish blue not actual blue and greens are supressed

1st generation teething

in many other ways very impressive chip

The foveon looks promising, but like every new technology it needs
perfection. Why would you opt to let go of the d1s and go for the
sigma? I mean really. Why would you want to limit yourself to a
camera that essentially only works in daylight? Shooting sports?
Forget about it..that would require you to bump the iso and then
you know what happens there. Seems that the Fav. chip does well
under ideal situations...but lets be real...how often do your shots
happen to be in the "Ideal" situation.

The way I see it, it is a 1700 dollar landscape slr since it can't
handle the higher iso's required for other types of photography
(except studio).

In a year from now lets see how that chip has progressed. I imagine
it will do fine things. Then again a year from now the next
greatest cameras will be out both from Nikon and Canon. State of
the Art is State of the Past too quickly. Enjoy whats out there now
and not what might come about. I would still pick the D60 over the
sigma. The lens choices alone would make me say that. Really, sigma
lens over an L series??? You have to be smokin some crack!!!
--
Photo Noob
D60
50mm 1.8, 75-300mm 4-5.6 III, 22-55 F4-5.6 USM
1 Gig Microdrive

--
John Mason - Lafayette, IN

 

[Rob Martin]

Apart from trolls and spide men, I doubt for a minute that the purchaser was contemplating a 1Ds. There are lots of pretenders saying they will get one. Then they say the price is too high or I'll buy a Sigma or something .

It's like shopping for a car and saying "I'm not going for the porsche this time because they don't have the lime green colour I like, I'll take the corolla instead"

Chasing the technology is a hobby in itself, albeit an expensive one. Those that can afford will, those that can't are in two camps:-

1. don't care, they can still take great shots any way and
b. moaners and complainers.

It's always wise never to look at Ferraris to buy when you can make do with something else.

Life is short, you're here for a good time, not a long time....

 

[FUCK DPREVIEW!!]

a 1ds shipped at the end of the week and I just cancelled it.
There is NO way as a hobbist that im spending 8k on a camera

That's a lot of money for a lot of people, you're right. One cannot "justify" a 1Ds as a hobbyist as this is clearly a camera designed for "pro" use.

when there are improvements like the foveon chip right now.

I just had a look at the SD9 review here on dpreview. My conclusion is a bit different: Foveon does not really give you an advantage over Canon's CMOS cameras - and the SD9 is not even compared to the 1Ds, but D30/D60 "only"! Don't forget to compare all features of the bodies, not just the chip used!!

sorry for myself. I will now go and order my 1d and wait till I
see what next year brings..... rest in peace 1ds : (

The body is only one component in a whole system: It would take a LOT to drive me awayfom Canon glass, for example. As a hobbyist, I think you're better off with a D30/D60 and if you've got the cashready, a set of really, really nice lenses (=L glass and some primes). The 1d is designed for "pro use" too, but can be justified on the basis that the focsuing system of the D30/D60 is seriously flawed compared to film bodies.

I will stick to my D30 and only upgrade when something with features like the EOS 3 to 30 is available that delivers photo quality up to print sizes of A3+. As a hobbyist (compared to a pro), I enjoy having the luxury of being able to wait.

Andi

--
http://www.andreassteiner.net/photography

 

[William C]

you know , that Sigma review really made me sad.....I was getting
a 1ds shipped at the end of the week and I just cancelled it.
There is NO way as a hobbist that im spending 8k on a camera when
there are improvements like the foveon chip right now. It wasnt
that the resolution was equal but the color was dead on as
well.....just look at the silver in the quater comparison! Anyway
I know you have to jump in somewhere and that there are more
qualities as far as a professional camere (lenses, body, auto
focus) but maybe its at the point that you can save more money by
going with yesterdays technology (not last years...lol) save some
money and still get a good camera. God just think what a foveon
would be at 10mp!!! Anyway sorry for the rant but i need to feel
sorry for myself. I will now go and order my 1d and wait till I
see what next year brings.....
rest in peace 1ds : (

 

[dave veneri]

I could only aford one due to the fact that it is a company write off that I could also used for my own pleasure. I was also looking into a P&S for my wife as well (got some flack as far as postings about both P&S and dslr...lol)

All I said AGAIN was that the chip tech. made me sad that there "seems to be" a better tech for sensors right on the horizon. And that recent post regarding Canons patent proves this. Yes there will ALWAYS be better when dealing with tech. BUT 8k seems like a lot of cash when you know something better(chip only) is right around the patent corner. To use your car example.....That would be like getting ready to buy a beautiful BMW 740, having the contract out ready to sign, and the manager comming over and telling you and the salesman that the new 750 body style was just released and they improved apon the design. NOW that does not mean you are buying a bad car, but it has to effect you to a certain degree to lay out that kind of cash for a older bodied BMW.....

Can you see my point here?? ( now please, im not saying that the Foveon is without flaws because its not, but those 100% res. shots were remarkable. and its a first gen . product.... PS, life is short Bob, too bad your first name was'nt Ricky or you could buy us all disposable 1ds's : )))
peace, D

Apart from trolls and spide men, I doubt for a minute that the
purchaser was contemplating a 1Ds. There are lots of pretenders
saying they will get one. Then they say the price is too high or
I'll buy a Sigma or something .

It's like shopping for a car and saying "I'm not going for the
porsche this time because they don't have the lime green colour I
like, I'll take the corolla instead"

Chasing the technology is a hobby in itself, albeit an expensive
one. Those that can afford will, those that can't are in two camps:-

1. don't care, they can still take great shots any way and
b. moaners and complainers.

It's always wise never to look at Ferraris to buy when you can make
do with something else.

Life is short, you're here for a good time, not a long time....

 

[dave veneri]

The only crack here my esteemed collegue, is the one you are talking out of....John, when I reflect back to second grade about my class learning how to pronounce sylables and read letters I had no idea how important those lessons were until I read posts like yours. When reading, we must read ALL of the words and then do something that is a miracle of nature...COMPREHEND! Yes crackman, you must understand what is written before making a mucus filled awnser. So here it goes for Little John and I will type nice and slow....I (meaning me) Did NOT (meaning NO)

say anything about wanting a sigma (camera whos lenses you seem to think I prefer) I was talking about chip design.....Yes johnny, as in potato chip, golf chip, chip off the old block.......you get it??? chip, chip, chip!

PS, as far as the sigma glass goes, (and im NOT touting sigma glass here flamebags!) Phil did take those super clear 100% pics with the sigma lens right?? Anyway, please johnny, write an opinion and dont use words like me bieng on crack.....it only leads me to write things mentioned above.
kisses, D

1st generation teething

in many other ways very impressive chip

The foveon looks promising, but like every new technology it needs
perfection. Why would you opt to let go of the d1s and go for the
sigma? I mean really. Why would you want to limit yourself to a
camera that essentially only works in daylight? Shooting sports?
Forget about it..that would require you to bump the iso and then
you know what happens there. Seems that the Fav. chip does well
under ideal situations...but lets be real...how often do your shots
happen to be in the "Ideal" situation.

The way I see it, it is a 1700 dollar landscape slr since it can't
handle the higher iso's required for other types of photography
(except studio).

In a year from now lets see how that chip has progressed. I imagine
it will do fine things. Then again a year from now the next
greatest cameras will be out both from Nikon and Canon. State of
the Art is State of the Past too quickly. Enjoy whats out there now
and not what might come about. I would still pick the D60 over the
sigma. The lens choices alone would make me say that. Really, sigma
lens over an L series??? You have to be smokin some crack!!!
--
Photo Noob
D60
50mm 1.8, 75-300mm 4-5.6 III, 22-55 F4-5.6 USM
1 Gig Microdrive

--
John Mason - Lafayette, IN

 

[dave veneri]

William Wallace.....please take a deep breath and READ my reply!

http://www.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1019&message=3853193

you know , that Sigma review really made me sad.....I was getting
a 1ds shipped at the end of the week and I just cancelled it.
There is NO way as a hobbist that im spending 8k on a camera when
there are improvements like the foveon chip right now. It wasnt
that the resolution was equal but the color was dead on as
well.....just look at the silver in the quater comparison! Anyway
I know you have to jump in somewhere and that there are more
qualities as far as a professional camere (lenses, body, auto
focus) but maybe its at the point that you can save more money by
going with yesterdays technology (not last years...lol) save some
money and still get a good camera. God just think what a foveon
would be at 10mp!!! Anyway sorry for the rant but i need to feel
sorry for myself. I will now go and order my 1d and wait till I
see what next year brings.....
rest in peace 1ds : (

 

[Rob Martin]

http://www.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1019&message=3853193

you know , that Sigma review really made me sad.....I was getting
a 1ds shipped at the end of the week and I just cancelled it.
There is NO way as a hobbist that im spending 8k on a camera when
there are improvements like the foveon chip right now. It wasnt
that the resolution was equal but the color was dead on as
well.....just look at the silver in the quater comparison! Anyway
I know you have to jump in somewhere and that there are more
qualities as far as a professional camere (lenses, body, auto
focus) but maybe its at the point that you can save more money by
going with yesterdays technology (not last years...lol) save some
money and still get a good camera. God just think what a foveon
would be at 10mp!!! Anyway sorry for the rant but i need to feel
sorry for myself. I will now go and order my 1d and wait till I
see what next year brings.....
rest in peace 1ds : (

 

[Mishkin]

Daven, I agree with you. It seems people don't read your posts. Somehow they read "Sigma is better than Canon!" in your posts... well they better learn reading.

I think buying Bayer chips now that Foveon showed its incredible resolution is a waste of money. Bayer is going to die soon (1-2-3 years max). Why invest in old technology?

Waiting for Canon's Foveon...

Apart from trolls and spide men, I doubt for a minute that the
purchaser was contemplating a 1Ds. There are lots of pretenders
saying they will get one. Then they say the price is too high or
I'll buy a Sigma or something .

It's like shopping for a car and saying "I'm not going for the
porsche this time because they don't have the lime green colour I
like, I'll take the corolla instead"

Chasing the technology is a hobby in itself, albeit an expensive
one. Those that can afford will, those that can't are in two camps:-

1. don't care, they can still take great shots any way and
b. moaners and complainers.

It's always wise never to look at Ferraris to buy when you can make
do with something else.

Life is short, you're here for a good time, not a long time....

 

[dave veneri]

It was photo Boob who wrote that not you....I will deal with him soon enough...Again Please accept my sincerest appoligies....You seem like a nice guy!
: )

1st generation teething

in many other ways very impressive chip

The foveon looks promising, but like every new technology it needs
perfection. Why would you opt to let go of the d1s and go for the
sigma? I mean really. Why would you want to limit yourself to a
camera that essentially only works in daylight? Shooting sports?
Forget about it..that would require you to bump the iso and then
you know what happens there. Seems that the Fav. chip does well
under ideal situations...but lets be real...how often do your shots
happen to be in the "Ideal" situation.

The way I see it, it is a 1700 dollar landscape slr since it can't
handle the higher iso's required for other types of photography
(except studio).

In a year from now lets see how that chip has progressed. I imagine
it will do fine things. Then again a year from now the next
greatest cameras will be out both from Nikon and Canon. State of
the Art is State of the Past too quickly. Enjoy whats out there now
and not what might come about. I would still pick the D60 over the
sigma. The lens choices alone would make me say that. Really, sigma
lens over an L series??? You have to be smokin some crack!!!
--
Photo Noob
D60
50mm 1.8, 75-300mm 4-5.6 III, 22-55 F4-5.6 USM
1 Gig Microdrive

--
John Mason - Lafayette, IN

 

[Adam-T]

sorry for myself. I will now go and order my 1d and wait till I
see what next year brings.....
rest in peace 1ds : (

Have fun with your New 1D -- I'll be keeping my D60 that's for sure, it really IS all I need for work and although I would have bought a 1DS had I got the money (it's extras would benefit my leisure photography more than my pro stuff however) , likewise, seeing the Foveon perform in a budget camera has made me think what canon could do with a larger version of the chip - a 9Mp EOS3D ? - not a bad thought for the future..

--
Olympus C2100UZI +B300 +A28, Canon D60.

My Ugly mug and submitted Photos at -------->
http://www.photosig.com/viewuser.php?id=27855

 

[dave veneri]

Thanks! Im glad to see someone else understood what I said. Its also getting hard to track what was written by whom....I insulted poor John who did not deserve that. I really dont mind disagreement but some people make things personal thus the need to respond in a less than desirable manner......

I agree with what you said and again we are NOT talking about camera features just chips....and to think that this is the first generation. bet that new canon chip will hit the market sooner than we think : )
Peace, D

I think buying Bayer chips now that Foveon showed its incredible
resolution is a waste of money. Bayer is going to die soon (1-2-3
years max). Why invest in old technology?

Waiting for Canon's Foveon...

Apart from trolls and spide men, I doubt for a minute that the
purchaser was contemplating a 1Ds. There are lots of pretenders
saying they will get one. Then they say the price is too high or
I'll buy a Sigma or something .

It's like shopping for a car and saying "I'm not going for the
porsche this time because they don't have the lime green colour I
like, I'll take the corolla instead"

Chasing the technology is a hobby in itself, albeit an expensive
one. Those that can afford will, those that can't are in two camps:-

1. don't care, they can still take great shots any way and
b. moaners and complainers.

It's always wise never to look at Ferraris to buy when you can make
do with something else.

Life is short, you're here for a good time, not a long time....

 

[dave veneri]

if and when there is a newer chip design, you would have to think that one would have to take a smaller hit if you stick with a 2k camera right now. Unless you really need that extra res. ASAP for portrait or hi quality landscape stuff.....I fall in niether catagory. Its not so much the money issue but the fact that we might be seeing the last of the bayer products. That new design, if I interpreted the specs right, will make a giant leap forward in cycle times and dynamic range : )))

sorry for myself. I will now go and order my 1d and wait till I
see what next year brings.....
rest in peace 1ds : (

Have fun with your New 1D -- I'll be keeping my D60 that's for
sure, it really IS all I need for work and although I would have
bought a 1DS had I got the money (it's extras would benefit my
leisure photography more than my pro stuff however) , likewise,
seeing the Foveon perform in a budget camera has made me think what
canon could do with a larger version of the chip - a 9Mp EOS3D ? -
not a bad thought for the future..

--
Olympus C2100UZI +B300 +A28, Canon D60.

My Ugly mug and submitted Photos at -------->
http://www.photosig.com/viewuser.php?id=27855

 

[Jeffrey Behr]

...insinuating that those of us who choose to buy a 1Ds are making the wrong choices with our disposable income.

--
http://community.webshots.com/user/jeffreybehr

 

[jblann]

I could only aford one due to the fact that it is a company write
off that I could also used for my own pleasure.

I just checked his profile and he is a BEE KEEPER!

Maybe if I were a BEE KEEPER, I could work for a company that would buy me a fancy dSLR as a write-off! Maybe if I were a "Chief Bee Keeper", they would let me use is for my personal pleasure on company paid for trips to the Bahamas in the Company Jet! Sure, the jet's yellow & black and has a sign on it that says "I Brake for Pollen", but who cares? And to think, I wouldn't even have to have a college degree, just a degree in BS!

Can we please have an answer as to why you even have/want a dSLR in the first place? Why this one over that one? It doesn't seem like you have really used the equipment before, and the majority of the comments on this forum, predominantly on the Canon Forum, not this one, are about P&S digital. State your real reason for buying the camera, and what you are going to use it for, and maybe you won't get so hammered!

--
'In cyberspace, you can't hear the screams...'
'Price is only an issue in the absence of value.'
'Being 6'8' means not having to say you're sorry...'

Equipment list in profile.

 

[Rune Moberg]

I agree with what you said and again we are NOT talking about
camera features just chips....and to think that this is the first
generation. bet that new canon chip will hit the market sooner
than we think : )

But there's nothing revolutionary with the Foveon chip. It squeezes more info out of each pixel by using three layers (possibly with weaker output in one of the colour channels covering the bottom layer). Big whoop.

The 1Ds OTOH contains a full frame chip at an (relatively) affordable price. Now THAT's innovation and much more useful.

What's interesting is that you put yourself on a list to get the 1Ds. Then when a camera that can't even match the D60 comes along, you suddenly decide to switch. You could've purchased a D60 a long time ago and saved yourself both time and money.

Oh well.

--
Rune, http://runesbike.com/

 

[jblann]

Hello Rune -

But there's nothing revolutionary with the Foveon chip. It squeezes
more info out of each pixel by using three layers (possibly with
weaker output in one of the colour channels covering the bottom
layer). Big whoop.

True, but I think it hails a different type of chip making that could become something great. It could take years (5+) and I guess i don't have the luxury of waiting that long for it. 3 years before that, We'll have a really fast EOS pro-grade to drool over, hopefully...

The 1Ds OTOH contains a full frame chip at an (relatively)
affordable price. Now THAT's innovation and much more useful.

True, too many forget how expensice the 6MP cameras were just a couple years ago. I have seen anything yet that would make me sell all the Canon equip I have for that 14MP Kodak, either!

What's interesting is that you put yourself on a list to get the
1Ds. Then when a camera that can't even match the D60 comes along,
you suddenly decide to switch. You could've purchased a D60 a long
time ago and saved yourself both time and money.

BINGO! This guy is full of it, but he is spending his bee-keeping company's money, so he probably doesn't care! Yeah, right...

--
'In cyberspace, you can't hear the screams...'
'Price is only an issue in the absence of value.'
'Being 6'8' means not having to say you're sorry...'

Equipment list in profile.

 

[PhotoNoob120916]

HAHAHA Daven. You flame about " When reading, we must read ALL of the words and then do something that is a miracle of nature...COMPREHEND! " Then you go and address it to the wrong person. Silly little man.

And why are you so nasty? Nobody was telling you that you talked out of your A* . Go crawl back in to your hole. If you can't take someone’s ideas without puffing out your chest and beating it with your fists like some caged up gorilla, then you need to seek counseling.

Go ahead and flame on....nobody cares.....unless it is constructive..which yours wasn't.

--
Photo Noob
D60
50mm 1.8, 75-300mm 4-5.6 III
1 Gig Microdrive

 

[dave veneri]

I did comprehend ,just posted the correct message to the wrong person.

Now as to you.........You silly disturbed goat rectum, YOU started this nonsense by asking if someone was on crack, did you not??? That was not constructive now was it?? I only respond this way to slanderous personal remarks (your: what are you on crack) Anyway, im really into the wslam posts on the new 1ds along with the new 24-70 zoom so I cant give you a verbal spanking right now. I will however retreat back to my "hole" and keep reading those constructive posts from wslam. This is exciting stuff!! Almost as exciting as the day you found out that your finger fit nicely in your nose......
This concludes my response to Photo Boob..........No go to your room!
xo, D

HAHAHA Daven. You flame about " When reading, we must read ALL of
the words and then do something that is a miracle of
nature...COMPREHEND! " Then you go and address it to the wrong
person. Silly little man.

And why are you so nasty? Nobody was telling you that you talked
out of your A* . Go crawl back in to your hole. If you can't take
someone’s ideas without puffing out your chest and beating it
with your fists like some caged up gorilla, then you need to seek
counseling.

Go ahead and flame on....nobody cares.....unless it is
constructive..which yours wasn't.

--
Photo Noob
D60
50mm 1.8, 75-300mm 4-5.6 III
1 Gig Microdrive