Dumb question - What is an "organic sensor"?

Birddogman

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I keep reading about the development of an organic sensor and have no clue what that means. If I had such a sensor, would it need to be fed and walked every day?

Just joking.... but I would like to understand the concept. Thanks in advance.
 
I keep reading about the development of an organic sensor and have no clue what that means. If I had such a sensor, would it need to be fed and walked every day?

Just joking.... but I would like to understand the concept. Thanks in advance.
"Organic" equals "carbon-based". Oil is organic in that sense, as is plastic. Plants and animals are likewise carbon-based.

Current sensors are silicon-based rather than carbon-based.
 
what about end of life....?

carbon based material very often are aging......deteriorating over time..

Peter
 
I keep reading about the development of an organic sensor and have no clue what that means. If I had such a sensor, would it need to be fed and walked every day?

Just joking.... but I would like to understand the concept. Thanks in advance.
Its not really an organic sensor exactly, its a thin photoelectric film placed on the chip surface which acts as the photo-electric conversion layer instead of the chip surface itself (which is normally in a well surrounded by the circuitry mounted on the silicon surface and thus not as receptive to incoming light, especially at an angle).

This "film" happens to be based on an organic (carbon based) compound rather than a silicon one. Its only job is to convert light into electrical charge which is then stored on the silicon itself.

But because it sits on the surface of the chip, it is not obstructed by the chip circuitry so can be receptive to all the incident light from a wide range of angles.

However, apart from this organic layer, the chip is otherwise a normal silicon device.
 
what about end of life....?

carbon based material very often are aging......deteriorating over time..

Peter
The carbon-based material in question will not be alive and hence will not die. Diamonds are carbon-based. They don't deteriorate over time.
 
what about end of life....?

carbon based material very often are aging......deteriorating over time..

Peter
There are well over 10 million organic compounds out there. Photo-degradation is normally associated only with long chain polymers, but only matters in the case of continuous exposure to UVB radiation.

UVB is filtered out by glass and the colour filter in sensors.
 
I keep reading about the development of an organic sensor and have no clue what that means. If I had such a sensor, would it need to be fed and walked every day?

Just joking.... but I would like to understand the concept. Thanks in advance.
Certainly not a dumb question. I had the same question a couple weeks ago when I read a posting by someone that mentioned the organic sensor. I spent several hours plowing through articles to figure out what it was. Others in your thread have provided the answer. There are some very technical explanations out there if you enjoy reading physics books, not me, I just wanted a simple explanation.
 
Thanks for asking this question as I've no doubt it has puzzled many of us here for some time ! The nomenclature is confusing , why don't they just say 'Carbon based sensor' ?

I know that you were joking but many will have assumed that organic based materials may well be subject to deterioration over time. The only other area where 'Organic' is used commonly is in supermarkets where it is synonymous with higher prices !
 
I keep reading about the development of an organic sensor and have no clue what that means. If I had such a sensor, would it need to be fed and walked every day?

Just joking.... but I would like to understand the concept. Thanks in advance.
That one linked in the thread could even be the solution for the wide open lens problem:


BTW there is an older project (2005 time frame), where Fujifilm stacked 3 layers of organic photosensitive material for the different color components. So this would be like a Foveon sensor with better color differentiation and higher conversion efficiency than standard CCD/CMOS sensors. But it doesn't look like it's ready for production soon.

This in a X-T2 would let buyers of other system cameras look like they weren't interested in image quality at all but in pop art filters and touch screens. ;)
 
Thanks for asking this question as I've no doubt it has puzzled many of us here for some time ! The nomenclature is confusing , why don't they just say 'Carbon based sensor' ?

I know that you were joking but many will have assumed that organic based materials may well be subject to deterioration over time. The only other area where 'Organic' is used commonly is in supermarkets where it is synonymous with higher prices !
Organic in technical terms simply means based on covalent molecular carbon compounds. That definition existed long before marketing campaigns got hold of the idea that "organic" meant "natural" or "healthy".

But its not a carbon based sensor. Its a silicon sensor with a carbon based photo-electric layer.
 
Thanks for asking this question as I've no doubt it has puzzled many of us here for some time ! The nomenclature is confusing , why don't they just say 'Carbon based sensor' ?

I know that you were joking but many will have assumed that organic based materials may well be subject to deterioration over time. The only other area where 'Organic' is used commonly is in supermarkets where it is synonymous with higher prices !
Organic in technical terms simply means based on covalent molecular carbon compounds. That definition existed long before marketing campaigns got hold of the idea that "organic" meant "natural" or "healthy".

But its not a carbon based sensor. Its a silicon sensor with a carbon based photo-electric layer.
That is why I referred to common usage of the word not too many people are into 'covalent molecular carbon compounds' ;-)

'Silicon sensor with a carbon based photo-electric layer' may trip lightly off your tongue but you are the exception . ' Carbon based' ( or Carbon surfaced Silicon ) would be more acceptable IMHO.
 
what about end of life....?

carbon based material very often are aging......deteriorating over time..

Peter
It comes with a free Lomo mode… you just have to wait a couple of years to receive it.
 
I keep reading about the development of an organic sensor and have no clue what that means. If I had such a sensor, would it need to be fed and walked every day?

Just joking.... but I would like to understand the concept. Thanks in advance.
Its not really an organic sensor exactly, its a thin photoelectric film placed on the chip surface which acts as the photo-electric conversion layer instead of the chip surface itself (which is normally in a well surrounded by the circuitry mounted on the silicon surface and thus not as receptive to incoming light, especially at an angle).

This "film" happens to be based on an organic (carbon based) compound rather than a silicon one. Its only job is to convert light into electrical charge which is then stored on the silicon itself.

But because it sits on the surface of the chip, it is not obstructed by the chip circuitry so can be receptive to all the incident light from a wide range of angles.

However, apart from this organic layer, the chip is otherwise a normal silicon device.
That's interesting. But doesn't receptiveness to wide angles mean the sensor would give its best benefit on a larger sensor. Something re Fuji that has been discussed ad nauseum and they have denied.

Are there also clear, step-change levels of benefit for such a sensor at APSC size?

K
 
I keep reading about the development of an organic sensor and have no clue what that means. If I had such a sensor, would it need to be fed and walked every day?

Just joking.... but I would like to understand the concept. Thanks in advance.
Its not really an organic sensor exactly, its a thin photoelectric film placed on the chip surface which acts as the photo-electric conversion layer instead of the chip surface itself (which is normally in a well surrounded by the circuitry mounted on the silicon surface and thus not as receptive to incoming light, especially at an angle).

This "film" happens to be based on an organic (carbon based) compound rather than a silicon one. Its only job is to convert light into electrical charge which is then stored on the silicon itself.

But because it sits on the surface of the chip, it is not obstructed by the chip circuitry so can be receptive to all the incident light from a wide range of angles.

However, apart from this organic layer, the chip is otherwise a normal silicon device.
That's interesting. But doesn't receptiveness to wide angles mean the sensor would give its best benefit on a larger sensor. Something re Fuji that has been discussed ad nauseum and they have denied.
Not really. The component circuitry uses up a smaller proportion of sensor area with larger pixels. It has more benefit for smaller photosites. It will help, but not as much as it would for phone cameras.
Are there also clear, step-change levels of benefit for such a sensor at APSC size?
It would have less benefit as sensor size increased. I suspect the primary purpose of the research was phone cameras and medical imaging, which use very small sensors with lots of pixels.
 
Thanks for asking this question as I've no doubt it has puzzled many of us here for some time ! The nomenclature is confusing , why don't they just say 'Carbon based sensor' ?

I know that you were joking but many will have assumed that organic based materials may well be subject to deterioration over time. The only other area where 'Organic' is used commonly is in supermarkets where it is synonymous with higher prices !
Organic in technical terms simply means based on covalent molecular carbon compounds. That definition existed long before marketing campaigns got hold of the idea that "organic" meant "natural" or "healthy".

But its not a carbon based sensor. Its a silicon sensor with a carbon based photo-electric layer.
That is why I referred to common usage of the word not too many people are into 'covalent molecular carbon compounds' ;-)

'Silicon sensor with a carbon based photo-electric layer' may trip lightly off your tongue but you are the exception . ' Carbon based' ( or Carbon surfaced Silicon ) would be more acceptable IMHO.
If the correct term has been usurped by marketing trolls, why should the whole scientific community change it's terminology?
 
Thanks for asking this question as I've no doubt it has puzzled many of us here for some time ! The nomenclature is confusing , why don't they just say 'Carbon based sensor' ?

I know that you were joking but many will have assumed that organic based materials may well be subject to deterioration over time. The only other area where 'Organic' is used commonly is in supermarkets where it is synonymous with higher prices !
Organic in technical terms simply means based on covalent molecular carbon compounds. That definition existed long before marketing campaigns got hold of the idea that "organic" meant "natural" or "healthy".

But its not a carbon based sensor. Its a silicon sensor with a carbon based photo-electric layer.
That is why I referred to common usage of the word not too many people are into 'covalent molecular carbon compounds' ;-)

'Silicon sensor with a carbon based photo-electric layer' may trip lightly off your tongue but you are the exception . ' Carbon based' ( or Carbon surfaced Silicon ) would be more acceptable IMHO.
If the correct term has been usurped by marketing trolls, why should the whole scientific community change it's terminology?
With respect we are not talking about the preferences of the 'whole scientific community' , we are talking about effective communication with ordinary consumers. The Scientific community are well known for poor communication skills, instead they tend to boost their own egos with a heavy use of obscure scientific terms & jargon. :-)
 
With respect we are not talking about the preferences of the 'whole scientific community' , we are talking about effective communication with ordinary consumers. The Scientific community are well known for poor communication skills, instead they tend to boost their own egos with a heavy use of obscure scientific terms & jargon. :-)
With respect, you just mortally offended me ;-)

The way it usually works is this: the marketing guys get together with the scientists and engineers and ask them to toss out every scientific/technical term they can think of in the context of a given product. The marketing team then takes these terms and checks them for buzz-worthyness, how they sound pronounced in different languages, if anyone else has used them already, etc., etc., and then distorts the hell out of them, hoping that the 'dumb' consumer will stop long enough to read the rest of the ad or register the company's name.

Please do not blame the scientists. :-P
 
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