F-series Successor: What do you NOT need?

[Ulysses]

We've covered the bases thoroughly as to what we'd like to see in a successor to the F707. But this time, I'd like you to reverse the process?

What about the F707 do you NOT need? What would you take out in its successor?

Enjoy!

--

Ulysses

 

[HockeyDave]

• the directional pad "enter" option .. they could make that into a button or some easier way to select your menu choice.. you have to be perfect when pressing in or it doesn't register... its very annoying
• the negative art option ..kinda useless (my opinion)
• the HUGE sony strap ... i prefer something a little smaller

We've covered the bases thoroughly as to what we'd like to see in a
successor to the F707. But this time, I'd like you to reverse the
process?

What about the F707 do you NOT need? What would you take out in its
successor?

Enjoy!

--

Ulysses

--
HockeyDave
http://www.pbase.com/igotjump

 

[Ulysses]

• the HUGE sony strap ... i prefer something a little smaller

The button would make the camera kind of like the S602Z with its confirmation-like SET button. There's nothing wrong with that.

But DON'T take my neckstrap away!! I look so professional with it on!! What I would like is if they took away this version and substituted with some sort of Quick-Release version of the neck strap eyelets.

 

[Tom F707 (nl)]

What about the F707 do you NOT need? What would you take out in its
successor?

BFS, DLS... ;-)

 

[David (r00t)]

I would take away the "effects" in the menu. I would rather use photo editing software to do it.

Take away the swivels for the straps. OK, so I am being anal here. At least add ones that do not get twisted. I spend a lot of time untwisting my neck strap and lens cover.



--
David

My galleries
http://www.imagestation.com/album/?id=4292111925
http://www.imagestation.com/album/?id=4292056545

'Those things that live only at night do not need to talk, for their victims are asleep, waiting.' -- Nosferatu

 

[JohnK]

What about the F707 do you NOT need? What would you take out in its
successor?

I sure like this camera, but since you ask, Picture Effects comes to mind, and Manual Focus (theoretically I'd like to have manual focus but as it exists on the 707 it's hard for me to tell where the image is sharpest, so I don't use it much) Moving Images and Nightframing... does anyone use Nightframing? I'm curious.

Some other thoughts

Make "Nightshot" valid in Manual Mode enabling full control of daylight infrared shooting (we're beggin' ya.)
Move emitters so lens barrel diameter can be reduced (could they pop up?)
I'm always untwisting the strap... (could the attachments swivel less?)

I've messed up shots because because I forget that I'm in macro mode, could I have control over whether that setting is saved or not saved when the camera is shut off?

AE lock: could that remain in effect until I shut it off, instead of the camera shutting it off?

Recording images for e-mail: for my purposes these are a bit too low-res, but I would use it if the files were a little bigger, say 6" x 4.5" x 72DPI, that would be very handy to me.

I'd like to have contrast adjustment, and saturation adjustment, although I'm rarely unhappy with what the 707 does on its own without these settings, still I think a camera in this class ought to offer these adjustments



--
JohnK

 

[David (r00t)]

Yes, I use it quite often with the kids when they are sleeping. Or when I creep on them playing in the other room. I also use it in restaraunts with low lighting.

I mainly adjust the heck out of the camera depending on my situation, but for quick photos of friends and kids in low-light..Nightframing is my friend. If Sony could only activate nightframing instead of turning the LCD black.....I wish nightframing would work in manual mode...

Nightframing... does anyone use Nightframing? I'm curious.
--

David

My galleries
http://www.imagestation.com/album/?id=4292111925
http://www.imagestation.com/album/?id=4292056545

'Those things that live only at night do not need to talk, for their victims are asleep, waiting.' -- Nosferatu

 

[Yves P.]

• A shoe that doesn't sync with a real flash
• A badly designed Manual Focus
• BFS
• DLS
• Negative art and solarisation special effect
• Uncontrolable self-timer (only 10 sec)
• Only one Focus mode available
• A very limited WB
• Just one setting for color saturation
• A weirdly placed zoom button (although I can live with it)

We've covered the bases thoroughly as to what we'd like to see in a
successor to the F707. But this time, I'd like you to reverse the
process?

What about the F707 do you NOT need? What would you take out in its
successor?

Enjoy!

--

Ulysses

--
If you don't snap it, nobody will snap it for you ...
Kafrifelle (Yves P.) Owner of DSC-F707,
No BFS, No hassle but strong vignetting on left
VCL-MHG07A, HVL-F1000 and some close up lenses ...
http://www.pbase.com/kafrifelle

 

[KennyZ]

I don't use the movie recording function at all - if one's serious about DV, why not go get a camcorder...

We've covered the bases thoroughly as to what we'd like to see in a
successor to the F707. But this time, I'd like you to reverse the
process?

What about the F707 do you NOT need? What would you take out in its
successor?

Enjoy!

--

Ulysses

 

[Mike_D]

Things I don't need in an F series successor, hmmm how about an F series successor. I think they should do a minor update kind of like the 505 to the 505V, and resurrect the D series. I don't know if sony can ever truly compete with the true DSLR's, but it would be nice to have a TTL viewfinder. The EVF in manual focus mode just doesn't cut it. So my vote is for no major 707 upgrade in favor of major flagship camera line.

Mike D

We've covered the bases thoroughly as to what we'd like to see in a
successor to the F707. But this time, I'd like you to reverse the
process?

What about the F707 do you NOT need? What would you take out in its
successor?

Enjoy!

--

Ulysses

 

[Ulysses]

Heheheh... Yves, you gave a list of what you think is wrong.

But that's not the question. I'm asking what FEATURES present in the camera right now (not what we see as design flaws) could you do without? And further, would you replace them with something else?

• A shoe that doesn't sync with a real flash
• A badly designed Manual Focus
• BFS
• DLS
• Negative art and solarisation special effect
• Uncontrolable self-timer (only 10 sec)
• Only one Focus mode available
• A very limited WB
• Just one setting for color saturation
• A weirdly placed zoom button (although I can live with it)

 

[Ulysses]

Things I don't need in an F series successor, hmmm how about an F
series successor.

OK, now you're asking for it... ;-)

I think they should do a minor update kind of
like the 505 to the 505V, and resurrect the D series.

The D-series never sold all that many units for some odd reason. It just never took off. But its few users are a rabid following. --gg--

I don't know if sony can ever truly compete with the true DSLR's

Did they ever intend to do so?

but it would be nice to have a TTL viewfinder.

Already have that in both the LCD and the EVF, which see exactly what the sensor/lens sees. Do you mean that you'd like an optical SLR-type viewfinder?

The EVF in manual focus mode just doesn't cut it.

I have to strongly disagree with ALL of yous guys who have said this. ;-)

I LOVE the manual focus of this thing. Sometimes certain lighting conditions might make it difficult, but I can always switch from LCD to EVF or back the other way depending upon my needs. Never had much of a real problem focusing, however. I dunno....

So my vote is for no major 707 upgrade in favor of
major flagship camera line.

Well, I might agree with you there.

I'm all for new tech and new cameras rather than rehashes of the same thing.

But I likes me the swivel action. Don't take that away.

Odd... this thread is turning into a wish list, which is what I was trying to avoid. It's like folks can't think of the other direction in which I was trying to go with this one.

--

Ulysses

 

[Yves P.]

hehehehehe, You caught me Ulysses, ...

but in general, a flaw is something i do not want on my camera.

But that's not the question. I'm asking what FEATURES present in
the camera right now (not what we see as design flaws) could you do
without? And further, would you replace them with something else?

• A shoe that doesn't sync with a real flash
• A badly designed Manual Focus
• BFS
• DLS
• Negative art and solarisation special effect
• Uncontrolable self-timer (only 10 sec)
• Only one Focus mode available
• A very limited WB
• Just one setting for color saturation
• A weirdly placed zoom button (although I can live with it)

--
If you don't snap it, nobody will snap it for you ...
Kafrifelle (Yves P.) Owner of DSC-F707,
No BFS, No hassle but strong vignetting on left
VCL-MHG07A, HVL-F1000 and some close up lenses ...
http://www.pbase.com/kafrifelle

 

[Mike_D]

Things I don't need in an F series successor, hmmm how about an F
series successor.

OK, now you're asking for it... ;-)

Ain't I a stinker

I think they should do a minor update kind of
like the 505 to the 505V, and resurrect the D series.

The D-series never sold all that many units for some odd reason. It
just never took off. But its few users are a rabid following.
--gg--

I've thought about this, I even mentioned it in another post, but the reason I suspect they weren't successful is possibly that the state of the electronics just wasn't up to the quality of the surrounding hardware.

I don't know if sony can ever truly compete with the true DSLR's

Did they ever intend to do so?

To elaborate on this I don't see sony ever coming out with interchangeable lenses. But who knows, stranger things have happened.

but it would be nice to have a TTL viewfinder.

Already have that in both the LCD and the EVF, which see exactly
what the sensor/lens sees. Do you mean that you'd like an optical
SLR-type viewfinder?

I think you're stretching the definition of TTL. For me TTL means photons are are entering through the lens and exiting through the viewfinder. I do however consider an EVF to be the next best thing.

The EVF in manual focus mode just doesn't cut it.

I have to strongly disagree with ALL of yous guys who have said
this. ;-)

I LOVE the manual focus of this thing. Sometimes certain lighting
conditions might make it difficult, but I can always switch from
LCD to EVF or back the other way depending upon my needs. Never had
much of a real problem focusing, however. I dunno....

On this we'll simply have to disagree, I'm not pleased with it, but it's better than no manual focus.

So my vote is for no major 707 upgrade in favor of
major flagship camera line.

Well, I might agree with you there.

I'm all for new tech and new cameras rather than rehashes of the
same thing.

But I likes me the swivel action. Don't take that away.

not likely with an SLR like camera, but I will not underestimate the resourcefulness of Sony Engineers

Odd... this thread is turning into a wish list, which is what I was
trying to avoid. It's like folks can't think of the other direction
in which I was trying to go with this one.

I thought I did a good of stating what I didn't want in a 707 replacement. By the way, I love my 707, and there is little I would alter on a next generation camera, that's why I think a V-like minor upgrade would be appropriate.

Mike D

--

Ulysses

 

[kudbegud]

the special effects....does anybody use reverse or solarize? replace them with b/w and saturation control
--
kudbegud
you pay for what you get, but you don't always get what you paid for.
F707,TCON-14B,MCON-35,ETX-90 http://www.pbase.com/kudbegud/galleries
http://www.photosig.com/userphotos.php?id=2471

 

[Ulysses]

Ain't I a stinker

Yes. You're a very mean man.

To elaborate on this I don't see sony ever coming out with
interchangeable lenses. But who knows, stranger things have
happened.

Nothing that strange, though. ;-)

About the only thing stranger would be seeing them release user-updatable firmware.

I think you're stretching the definition of TTL. For me TTL means
photons are are entering through the lens and exiting through the
viewfinder. I do however consider an EVF to be the next best thing.

Well... OK.

So you are asking for a mirror or prism that can transmit the image directly through an optical viewfinder. You're asking for a D-SLR type of viewfinder. The purpose is to help with focusing and easy visualization of DOF.

What I'm saying is that you can do all of that with the TTL (what the viewer shows is what the sensor and lens sees) LCD and EVF. In fact, it can be even better than optical, if tweaked properly.

On this we'll simply have to disagree, I'm not pleased with it,
but it's better than no manual focus.

OK. I can handle that. It'll just make our thread more interesting, that's all. Besides, it's clear that you're the "Bad Man" in the black hat here, and I'm shining in glory as I ride with my white hat.

Hahahahahahahahahah!!

not likely with an SLR like camera, but I will not underestimate
the resourcefulness of Sony Engineers

No, they are rather incredible. But if I were them, I would definitely test things a bit more.

I thought I did a good of stating what I didn't want in a 707
replacement. By the way, I love my 707, and there is little I would
alter on a next generation camera, that's why I think a V-like
minor upgrade would be appropriate.

I'm just teasing. Don't mind me.

But I'm looking for relatively "useless" features and functions, things that could be tossed so as to lighten the load of the camera and make room for the other things that we do want to see. The camera only has so much processing power, so much speed, and so much room to place a button or a knob or an input port.. So it's nice to know where it can be made more efficient.

--

Ulysses

 

[Sparky_ca]

I can do with out email mode. I can just take one photo and resize it to what I need.
I could do with out the sony colors KIDDING I AM KIDDING.
I love those colors.

Even though the "909" will most likly be an improvement I am afriad I will have to stick with the 707 email mode and all sigh.

We've covered the bases thoroughly as to what we'd like to see in a
successor to the F707. But this time, I'd like you to reverse the
process?

What about the F707 do you NOT need? What would you take out in its
successor?

Enjoy!

--

Ulysses

--
Sparky_ca
I have a photographic memory, but I always seem to have the lens cap on.

 

[Steve Cavigliano]

1. movie mode
2. clip motion
3. special effects
4. email function

5. red-eye flash function (it may work for some, but it usually gives my pics "closed-eyes"

Sony should feel free to ADD as many new features as possible while still keeping the DA around the same price point. If they add significant features like the 2 indoor wb's we're missing and add a bigger buffer for a longer burst and faster shot processing, I'd even pay $1200. (like the 5700 is said to be priced). Sorry about this last part, but I missed out on the 909 thread yesterday....lol

Steve

--
http://www.pbase.com/slo2k

 

[Ulysses]

1. movie mode

WHAT?!?!?!?

What is with everyone trying to kill our Movie mode? I use it. Shay uses it. Numerous other folks use it. . . Well, at least two people use it.

2. clip motion

OK, I could easily kill this one.

3. special effects

Lose 'em. I do better ones myself in PSE anyway.

4. email function

Drop it. Like a bad habit. I can get better quality reductions on my own. Keep the voice mode, however.

5. red-eye flash function (it may work for some, but it usually
gives my pics "closed-eyes"

Hmm... it only does it with certain people I find. There is one girl I shoot, who in just about 80% of her pics has closed eyes. Too bad as she has such a pleasant face, too.

Sony should feel free to ADD as many new features as possible while
still keeping the DA around the same price point.

Well, within reason. Too many features, and they won't test adequately.

significant features like the 2 indoor wb's we're missing and add a

You gotta figure that the new w.b. is here to stay since even the new P-series cameras include them.

--

Ulysses

 

[Steven Painter]

I LOVE the manual focus of this thing. Sometimes certain lighting
conditions might make it difficult, but I can always switch from
LCD to EVF or back the other way depending upon my needs. Never had
much of a real problem focusing, however. I dunno....

Odd... this thread is turning into a wish list, which is what I was
trying to avoid. It's like folks can't think of the other direction
in which I was trying to go with this one.

At the risk of contributing to this latter problem, I have to disagree with you on manual focus. I had no trouble focusing my friend's G2 manually because it magnifies the center of the image much more than the 707. The 707's manual focus magnifies by a factor of 2 (not enough), magnifies the whole image instead of just the center (I lose my position) and doesn't show me the distance till I start fiddling with the focus ring (and I never remember which way is which). Don't get me wrong, I love the manual focus RING (as opposed to a button or something), but I'm not so great at using it.

Back to being on topic.

Things I don't need in a successor model:
-Negative/Solarization modes
-Digital zoom
-Red Eye Reduction "feature" (does this ever work?)

-Movie mode (clip art is cool, but I don't think the mpegs are so great - incidentally, I LIKE photo annotation - which is technically mpeg before anyone shouts)
-The "mark photos for printing" function
-Manual mode lock-out on Nightshot

-Measly 16MB memory stick (take it out and cut the price - even if it's only 5 bucks LOL!)

Steve