OT - Which MP3 Player...

[Badge767]

...do you use?

I'm in the market for an MP3 player, around the 60GB size.

Since everyone on this forum is pretty technically savvy, I'd thought I'd post the question here.

I've looked at the iPod (obviously), and also the Creative Zen Vision seems pretty cool. They're probably the two top choices (so far), and both are around the same price range (from Newegg at least).

Understanding that reviews are subjective, both these units seem to score pretty high marks, and the Creative unit may even score a bit higher in most reviews I've seen.

But, I want to look beyond just the player, and also consider what aftermarket accessories are available. From what I've seen so far, the iPod wins here hands-down.

On the other hand, the Creative sounds like it'd be easier to use (also) as a portable file transport device, as the operating systems (Win and Linux, I'm not sure about Apple) simply see it as a removable drive. The LCD on the Creative also has higher resolution than the iPod. (Although I'd lilky not use it for photo or video review very often...if at all.)

Before I leap, I'd like to factor in some real-world feedback from you folks that (it almost seems like) I know, and more importantly, trust.

Thanks in advance!

--
Living in a Fisheye Lens,
Caught in the Camera Eye,
I Have No Heart to Lie;
I Can't Pretend a Stranger
Is a Long-Awaited Friend.

-- 'Limelight'
-- Lyrics by Neil Peart

http://www.gtcraigphoto.com

 

[JohnMcL7]

Probably too big for you but I use an Archos 504 160GB as it's a great all round device and perfect partner for the camera. With so much capacity I can carry around all my photos, browse them on the large, vibrant screen and with its usb host capability (by clipping on a small dock) you can copy photos direct from the camera.

Main grumble with it for photos is that it only seems to recognise 1100 photos per folder and the main photo browser doesn't understand subfolders and just collapses the lot into one massive folder for viewing...not very practical.

John

 

[Chris_in_Osaka]

I got the second Zen (zen vision m)after I dropped and damaged my first( zen touch)after a good year and a half of use.

I was tempted to jump on the Ipod badwagon but there are a couple of things about it that bothered me. I could be wrong about these, but this is what my Ipod usung friends told me.

First off, Ipods don't play windows WMA files.

Second, once you've loaded a track onto your ipod, you can't transfer it back to a computer. I guess apples trying to insure profits from their I tunes download service by making it more difficult to exchange files. The Zen allows you to bounce files back and forth like a hard drive.

Not that you would exchange any copyrighted files, now would you Mr.Officer? ;-)
--
Lumix DMC-L1, Olympus E-1

30mm Sigma, ZD 50mm, ZD 11-22mm, Leica 14-50mm, ZD 14-54mm, ZD 50-200mm, ZD 8mm fisheye. FL-36 Flash.SHLD-2.
Ricoh GR-D
Sony DSC-V3
Fujifilm f810

 

[Olyinaz]

60GB model because it offered not only great storage, but good video capability and (this was key) the ability to act as a USB host. In other words you can jack in a USB card reader or a thumb drive and the Gigabeat will recognize it and suck the photos off if that's what you want. I thought that this was outstanding and would fill two holes at once and make a great addition to my kit.

HOWEVER!! It's been a real piece of junk. Not the build quality - it looks wonderful and is really well made - but the usability. It has no provided user interface so you have to either drag and drop files to it, or use Windows Media player. YUCK. And the killer, the absolute KILLER for me, is that the device completely screws up the ID tags (EXIF info on the song files in other words) and mis-catalogs half of almost every album. This garbage is just completely UNSAT as far as I'm concerned and I wont live with it. When it gets back from warranty repair (where it is today because IT DIED on me) it'll go up on eBay for whatever I can get for it. What a disappointment. The Microsoft Zune is based on the Gigabeat so I suspect that it blows a foul wind as well.

My other MP3 player is a 20GB Rio Karma and it's the finest sounding MP3 player ever made (not just my opinion there - many agree). Problem is Rio is pushing up daisies now so it's an orphan and getting long in the tooth to boot. I still LOVE IT however and will listen to it until it croaks.

Best,
Oly

 

[Charles Laigo]

If its strictly an MP3 player you're looking for then you might want to consider an iPod.

I didn't know what all the fuss was about until I owned a 4Gig iPod 1st Gen Nano. Using the player is just half the fun, iTunes is also such a pleasure to use. It has nothing to do with being hip and all that, it's about a system that works (at least for me anyway).

BTW, contrary to popular belief you CAN download music from your iPod back to your PC. I do it all the time: upload office -> download home and vice versa.

However If you're thinking of using an iPod as a portable storage device for your pics, then you might want to consider something else. It'll work, sure (except for the Nano) but from what I've heard they're pretty slow and next to useless in the field.

-Charlie

 

[Actrurus]

The iPod can appear to your computer as a removable drive on a PC or Mac with no problem (but not both - which can be anoying at times).

It's only a bit slow if you try and connect the iPod directly to your camera to transfer photos with a special adapter.

The real advantage of the iPod is the way iTunes works with the player - something the rivals don't appear yet to have an answer to. You don't have to buy any tunes from the on-line store, you can happily import your exisitng CD collection into iTunes for transefer to the iPod. As iTunes is a 'free' donwload you can start this lengthy process before the purchase of the actual iPod.

--
http://www.fachwen.org
http://www.flickr.com/photos/fachwen/sets

 

[Badge767]

Not that you would exchange any copyrighted files, now would you
Mr.Officer? ;-)

I can categorically deny ever doing anything like that.

Remember, it's just "backing up" what is legally yours! ;-)

--
Living in a Fisheye Lens,
Caught in the Camera Eye,
I Have No Heart to Lie;
I Can't Pretend a Stranger
Is a Long-Awaited Friend.

-- 'Limelight'
-- Lyrics by Neil Peart

http://www.gtcraigphoto.com

 

[illy]

i recently got an Ipod and i am impressed with it, I just love the way the player itself works, i hated Itunes and never use it now, so i switched to Anapod which gives the features and controls i like

 

[ljclark]

I have an Creative Zen Vision M 30GB so I really can't talk to the direct USB file transfer issues that the 60GB features. I like that I can show pictures and vids.

There is a difference in the "social" behavior of the two systems.

If you are very active in the latest contemporary music and like to do a lot of downloading, the support structure for the iPod is pretty hard to beat. That's why kids like them so much. Also, some PodCasts with really long file names (thank you BBC) can be difficult to manage on the Creative.

On the other hand, if you like the music you own, and want to make legal copies of the music you own, then the Creative works very well. I have a lot of CDs and what I want to take with me is music I already know I like. (This may be an "old fart" behavior.)

There ARE a lot more accessories for the iPod system. Frankly the most important thing I picked up for use with portable players is a good set of phones - Shure E2C. These are sound isolating rather than noise reduction so the sound is very clean. I also picked up an accessory 2 amp, 5 volt international charger/converter that has two output cords which, through adapters, charges or powers a lot of different devices (cell phone, GPS module, PDA, small Creative portable speakers, USB hub, etc.).

My first Creative player was a 20 GB Creative Zen Nomad Zen NX. The reason I bought it was because it was less expensive than the current iPods for the same storage capacity, and it had a replaceable battery -- so I could travel with a charged spare. It's been all over the country and to Europe a few times -- one battery would last me across the pond. The Vision M players do not have interchangeable batteries, but based on the data (and doing the automatic "remove 1/3 of the published battery life" thing) it should be fine.

One thing...When you start ripping CDs you'll encounter the wonderful world of cataloging. You'll need to figure out your own system of identifying artists and tracks...the downloadable data is not always consistent. If you like classical, that composer / orchestra / conductor / artist thing adds a wrinkle.
--
If you don't talk to your cat about catnip, who will?

 

[PerL]

...do you use?

I'm in the market for an MP3 player, around the 60GB size.

Since everyone on this forum is pretty technically savvy, I'd
thought I'd post the question here.

I've looked at the iPod (obviously), and also the Creative Zen
Vision seems pretty cool. They're probably the two top choices (so
far), and both are around the same price range (from Newegg at
least).

Understanding that reviews are subjective, both these units seem to
score pretty high marks, and the Creative unit may even score a bit
higher in most reviews I've seen.

But, I want to look beyond just the player, and also consider what
aftermarket accessories are available. From what I've seen so far,
the iPod wins here hands-down.

On the other hand, the Creative sounds like it'd be easier to use
(also) as a portable file transport device, as the operating
systems (Win and Linux, I'm not sure about Apple) simply see it as
a removable drive. The LCD on the Creative also has higher
resolution than the iPod. (Although I'd lilky not use it for photo
or video review very often...if at all.)

Before I leap, I'd like to factor in some real-world feedback from
you folks that (it almost seems like) I know, and more importantly,
trust.

Thanks in advance!

An iPod in combination with iTunes software is a very slick and elegant solution.

If you want to download huge amounts of RAW files a dedicated photo storage solution like an Epson 4000 is better than the mp3 players because of transfer speed and battery life.

--
Living in a Fisheye Lens,
Caught in the Camera Eye,
I Have No Heart to Lie;
I Can't Pretend a Stranger
Is a Long-Awaited Friend.

-- 'Limelight'
-- Lyrics by Neil Peart

http://www.gtcraigphoto.com

--

http://www.pbase.com/interactive
http://tri-xstories.blogspot.com

 

[dodger421]

The first part is true. The second not so much. You can still access the files if you set the ipod to storage mode (or something similar). But the tracks are in hidden folders and do not have titles or any recognisable ID3 data. Bit rubbish really.
--
Cheers, Neil
http://dodger.photoblog.com/

 

[PerL]

I have an Creative Zen Vision M 30GB so I really can't talk to the
direct USB file transfer issues that the 60GB features. I like
that I can show pictures and vids.

There is a difference in the "social" behavior of the two systems.

If you are very active in the latest contemporary music and like to
do a lot of downloading, the support structure for the iPod is
pretty hard to beat. That's why kids like them so much. Also,
some PodCasts with really long file names (thank you BBC) can be
difficult to manage on the Creative.

On the other hand, if you like the music you own, and want to make
legal copies of the music you own, then the Creative works very
well. I have a lot of CDs and what I want to take with me is music
I already know I like. (This may be an "old fart" behavior.)

You can do that with iPod/iTunes too. Thats what I do with mine. I often buy CDs in webbshops (cheaply, beacuse I am so old (49) that I mostly buy rock music from the 70s...) and then rip them to my iTunes collection, syncronized with my iPod.

There ARE a lot more accessories for the iPod system. Frankly the
most important thing I picked up for use with portable players is a
good set of phones - Shure E2C. These are sound isolating rather
than noise reduction so the sound is very clean. I also picked up
an accessory 2 amp, 5 volt international charger/converter that has
two output cords which, through adapters, charges or powers a lot
of different devices (cell phone, GPS module, PDA, small Creative
portable speakers, USB hub, etc.).

My first Creative player was a 20 GB Creative Zen Nomad Zen NX.
The reason I bought it was because it was less expensive than the
current iPods for the same storage capacity, and it had a
replaceable battery -- so I could travel with a charged spare.
It's been all over the country and to Europe a few times -- one
battery would last me across the pond. The Vision M players do not
have interchangeable batteries, but based on the data (and doing
the automatic "remove 1/3 of the published battery life" thing) it
should be fine.

One thing...When you start ripping CDs you'll encounter the
wonderful world of cataloging. You'll need to figure out your own
system of identifying artists and tracks...the downloadable data is
not always consistent. If you like classical, that composer /
orchestra / conductor / artist thing adds a wrinkle.
--
If you don't talk to your cat about catnip, who will?

--

http://www.pbase.com/interactive
http://tri-xstories.blogspot.com

 

[PerL]

I got the second Zen (zen vision m)after I dropped and damaged my
first( zen touch)after a good year and a half of use.

I was tempted to jump on the Ipod badwagon but there are a couple
of things about it that bothered me. I could be wrong about these,
but this is what my Ipod usung friends told me.

First off, Ipods don't play windows WMA files.

Well, thats good IMO. Microsoft wants to kill the MP3 format for business reasons. I prefer MP3 files before WMA files or Apples protected format. So I set my iTunes to have MP3 as default for all the CD:s that I rip.

Second, once you've loaded a track onto your ipod, you can't
transfer it back to a computer.

You can with special software. But since you already got the files on your computer it is only if you want to transfer them to another computer.

I guess apples trying to insure

profits from their I tunes download service by making it more
difficult to exchange files. The Zen allows you to bounce files
back and forth like a hard drive.

But not with protected files like WMA or Apples format I guess? (I may be wrong)

Not that you would exchange any copyrighted files, now would you
Mr.Officer? ;-)
--
Lumix DMC-L1, Olympus E-1
30mm Sigma, ZD 50mm, ZD 11-22mm, Leica 14-50mm, ZD 14-54mm, ZD
50-200mm, ZD 8mm fisheye. FL-36 Flash.SHLD-2.
Ricoh GR-D
Sony DSC-V3
Fujifilm f810

--

http://www.pbase.com/interactive
http://tri-xstories.blogspot.com

 

[Badge767]

...so far!!

Thanks to everyone who has responded, this is helping!

Keep it coming!

--
Living in a Fisheye Lens,
Caught in the Camera Eye,
I Have No Heart to Lie;
I Can't Pretend a Stranger
Is a Long-Awaited Friend.

-- 'Limelight'
-- Lyrics by Neil Peart

http://www.gtcraigphoto.com

 

[ljclark]

You can do that with iPod/iTunes too. Thats what I do with mine. I
often buy CDs in webbshops (cheaply, beacuse I am so old (49) that
I mostly buy rock music from the 70s...) and then rip them to my
iTunes collection, syncronized with my iPod.

I know you can rip CDs and other sources to the iPod.

My point is that if you JUST rip CDs, there is no inherent advantage to the iPod -- unless there are some accessories you just gotta have. On the other hand, I think that the iPod is a better system for those who make fairly heavy use of online services.

--
If you don't talk to your cat about catnip, who will?

 

[Badge767]

which includes the 80GB iPod:

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?O=4259&A=details&Q=&sku=471800&is=REG&addedTroughType=categoryNavigation

The "B&H Kit" saves about $22 (USD) over purchasing the items seperately.

The two best things in this kit (IMO) is the noise-isolating earbuds, and the Mack 3-yr. extended warranty.

And, B&H is actually beating Newegg on their iPod prices! (Plus, having purchased a BUNCH of stuff from B&H, I feel good about dealing with them.)

--
Living in a Fisheye Lens,
Caught in the Camera Eye,
I Have No Heart to Lie;
I Can't Pretend a Stranger
Is a Long-Awaited Friend.

-- 'Limelight'
-- Lyrics by Neil Peart

http://www.gtcraigphoto.com

 

[Badge767]

You can do that with iPod/iTunes too. Thats what I do with mine. I
often buy CDs in webbshops (cheaply, beacuse I am so old (49) that
I mostly buy rock music from the 70s...) and then rip them to my
iTunes collection, syncronized with my iPod.

I know you can rip CDs and other sources to the iPod.

My point is that if you JUST rip CDs, there is no inherent
advantage to the iPod -- unless there are some accessories you just
gotta have. On the other hand, I think that the iPod is a better
system for those who make fairly heavy use of online services.

I'd have to include myself in the "old fart" category (thanks, BTW!) insofar that the VAST majority of the music I listen to is on the 500+ CDs that I already own from the late 60's through the mid-90's. So, the online services features isn't very high up on my list.

But, I'm thinking the availability of the accessories is swaying me toward the iPod system. Mainly the Bose dock/speakers. My father-in-law has a set for his iPod, and it sounds absolutely stunning!

I want to be able to dock the player in my office while at work.

--
Living in a Fisheye Lens,
Caught in the Camera Eye,
I Have No Heart to Lie;
I Can't Pretend a Stranger
Is a Long-Awaited Friend.

-- 'Limelight'
-- Lyrics by Neil Peart

http://www.gtcraigphoto.com

 

[jxl]

Take a look at Archos. I've had the Gmini 400 (20GB) for a couple of years now and it's taken a lot of abuse. The Gmini 400 had a CF connector on it so that you could upload images onto it. Saved me once when I ran out of space on my CF card, and had forgot to pack my spares. The newer models have USB host functionality, so you would just plug the camera into the device.

I'm not a big fan of the overarching "control" programs like itunes, and the MS eq, so I like that I can just drop a folder of mp3s on it and it will just sort them out using ID3.

The firmware is in no way as nice as that of the iPod, and the device itself isn't high on the "cool" meter, but it get's the job done.

Their website is horrible, but here it is anyway:
http://www.shoparchos.com/

 

[Skip Williams]

I've had an iPod for 3 years now and it's been one of the best products that I've ever owned. I've got almost 6,000 songs on mine, including classical, jazz, big-band, swing, standards, pop, bluegrass, rock, blues, r&b, folk, irish/celtic, comedy, and 40 ongoing podcasts. I use the player about 6 hours/day, mainly in the office. My family has 5: 40Gig 3G, 2x4Gig Mini, 2Gig Nano, and a new 1Gig Shuffle, all managed from the same library

The almost seamless integration of the Itunes/Ipod pair is really great. You don't have to worry about any transferring mechanics or other hassles. It's not perfect, but it's very, very good. No techie stuff, even my techno-phobic wife can use iTunes.

You can copy music from the iPod back to your PC, but you'll need to use a third party solution....I use CopyPod to rip songs off my friends' iPod when they want to share songs that they've ripped.

The iPod's aftermarket and accessory availability is many times greater than any other player. I use iLounge.com for reviews and recommendations. We've got a Bose Soundock and a Logitech MM50 at home and they're both great products for sound integration. Also, 70% of new, US-sold cars in 2007 will have some sort of iPod integration.

Disadvantages? The big one for me is that I can't buy one of the aftermarket home-audio solutions that will read my ITunes directory for home-wide playback. The Apple Fairplay DRM remains a closed system, only available to ITunes or the Ipod. Make sure you realize that if you buy songs in iTunes that you can ONLY play them on a computer or iPod that is authorized with the same Apple account that purchased the songs. The only other alternative is to burn them to a CD and re-import to another iTunes/Ipod. I don't have any WMA music, so that isn't an issue for me.

Highly recommended.

Skip

 

[England Kev]

I am a Zen man myself although mine is the micro, two years and still going fine on the original battery, and used every day, also I am not tied in to the way too expensive apple music download system. when I bought mine, the retailer said that the biggest single product with most complaints that they sold was the I-pod.

I have been hearing very good things about the new Microsoft Zune, and I think this will blow away all competition this year...

http://www.zune.net/en-US/