ANS: Hmmmm. Seems like you’re wanting to change the wager.
MIKE: OK, let me see if I can make this simple enough for you. You tell me the date that you're willing to bet $50 that available SM media capacity will exceed CF-I.
ANS: I’m not quite that simple. The wager was over whether or not MS is limited to 64MB as you stated, not whether available MS exceeds CF-1. Now, if you’re stating that CF-1 will exceed the 1.3MB that Sony is going to put on MS by 2002, I’ll take that bet even though it is not the original wager.
MIKE: You can buy 160Mb CF Type I TODAY from a variety of manufacturers, including some that you can see without even typing. Just click on either of the two links below.
http://www.lexarmedia.com/products/usb_cf2_main.html
http://www.bc-express.com/sandisk/product.asp?sku=SD%2DSDCFB%2D160455&mscssid=JH0T0P4P00SR2N2N001PQPPD4CBA91A3
You can also visit the following link to order a 192Mb TYPE I card for delivery next week.
http://www.bc-express.com/sandisk/product.asp?sku=SD%2DSDCFB%2D192455&mscssid=JH0T0P4P00SR2N2N001PQPPD4CBA91A3
Now try to act like a mature adult and simply admit that you've made a mistake.
ANS: And your point is? I made no statement as to what CF cards you could buy where or when. I did point out that the lowest price you quoted was still 52% higher than 64MB of MS.
ANS: Huh? You’re saying bigger is better? Something of a
revolutionary idea in the electronics world. Don’t hold your
breath until it catches on.
MIKE: As a matter of fact, Rodger, in this case bigger is better -- even by your own standard. The additional 2mm in depth allows the production of a 340Mb storage device (let's see that what -- over 500% larger than the largest memory stick) at a cost low enough that CASIO can bundle it with the QV3000 for an additional $200. That's less than 59 cents a megabyte, Rodger. Now here's a tantalizing offer: Why don't you stay away from the POST button until SONY bundles there storage at under 59 cents a meg? Deal?
ANS: I believe you’ve confused IBM’s Microdrive with a memory card, the subject of our discussion. Nice drive though for owners of the new Casio QV3000EX (or is that Sanyo?), however, the Sony/Sharp drive seems to be at least as small (just 58 x 54 x 4mm) and to hold up to 2GB. Makes even the Microdrive seem rather handicapped as to storage capacity.
As to misrepresentation, there have been dozens of articles and post
comparing MS against SM and CF. They all point out the many advantages
of MS, starting with price and listing the points I have mentioned.
Actually, every advantage I listed for MS was gathered from other posts
or articles, I didn’t originate a single one. So far, I have seen
no articles or posts pointing out technical or price advantages of CF
over MS. "Why, Mike? Why are you misrprepresenting what is easily
verified with a web browser and search engine?"
MIKE: Show us a web site that will contradict any specific statement I've made about CF, Rodger.
ANS: How about all your statements? One reference follows. To save you the effort, it is printed in its entirety below. PAY CLOSE ATTENTION TO THE ITEMS IN CAPS.
http://www.imaging-resource.com/NEWS.HTM
"Sony Memory Stick gains ground
By David Etchells, The Imaging Resource
(Thursday, February 24, 2000 - 12:00 EST)
When we first heard of Sony's "Memory Stick" technology, we weren't shy about our chagrin over
yet another digicam memory format. We were surprised by how much we liked it though, once we played with a few Sony cameras using it. Today, Sony announced a slew of new licensees for the technology (19 to be exact), suggesting that MEMORY STICK MAY IN FACT BECOME SOMETHING OF A STANDARD. The interesting part of the announcement to us though, was that only one of the announced partners makes digicams (Samsung), while most of the partners were in the auto industry (!?) Here's the list, see the press release link below for more details: "The 19 new licensees included General Motors (NYSE:GM - news), Adam Opel AG, Holden, Saab, Vauxhall, Hitachi Ltd , Mitsubishi Electric Corp , Compaq Computer Corp (NYSE:CPQ - news), Samsung Electronics Co Ltd , Texas Instruments Inc (NYSE:TXN - news) and Acer Laboratories Inc.” (AT LEAST 20 MORE MANUFACTURERS HAVE BEEN ADDED SINCE THIS REPORT)
Does the Memory Stick have advantages over current formats? That point is constantly argued. Some feel this is merely a way for Sony to add your money to their pockets (after all, why even make the format if they didn't want to make money on it). On the other hand, there are points that can be made for the new format to actually benefit the user. Regarding this, the Imaging Resource had this to say about the format itself when they reviewed the Sony DSC-F505 digital camera:
"IT'S BAD ENOUGH (THE ARGUMENT GOES) THAT WE HAVE TO CONTEND WITH THE COMPLETELY INCOMPATIBLE SMARTMEDIA AND COMPACTFLASH STANDARDS, why must Sony introduce yet another format into the fray? As noted, we've been strongly in the "oh no, not another memory format" camp ourselves. We were rather surprised then, by how appealing we found the Memory Sticks themselves. OF ALL THE MEMORY FORMATS WE'VE PLAYED WITH TO DATE (DECEMBER 1999), WE ACTUALLY FOUND OURSELVES LIKING THE MEMORY STICK THE MOST. (!?!) We're still not keen to see yet another memory format muddying the waters for consumers, but have to admit that there's a lot to like about the Memory Stick form factor. RELATIVE TO SMARTMEDIA, IT FEELS MORE RUGGED, AND DOESN'T EXPOSE IT'S ELECTRICAL CONTACTS TO THE ENVIRONMENT QUITE AS MUCH. SINCE INSERTION TRAVEL IS MUCH LESS, IT SHOULD ALSO BE LESS SUBJECT TO RUBBING WEAR OF THE PLATING ON THE CONTACTS, SOMETHING WE'VE OBSERVED WITH SMARTMEDIA. RELATIVE TO COMPACTFLASH, IT'S A FAIR BIT MORE COMPACT, AND DOESN'T HAVE THE DOZENS OF PINS THAT CF REQUIRES. (WE'RE FIRMLY OF THE OPINION THAT THE FEWER CONNECTIONS THERE ARE, THE LESS CHANCES THERE ARE FOR SOMETHING TO GO WRONG WITH ONE OF THEM.) WE ALSO LIKE THE WAY THE MEMORY STICK CARDS CAN BE WRITE-PROTECTED BY SLIDING A TINY SWITCH ON THEIR BACK. (CF CARDS HAVE NO SUCH PHYSICAL WRITE-PROTECTION AVAILABLE, AND SMARTMEDIA CARDS REQUIRE THE USE OF EXPENDABLE CONDUCTIVE FOIL DOTS THAT ARE ALSO SUBJECT TO FAILURE DUE TO DIRT OR FINGERPRINTS.) While we don't expect the rest of the world to jump onboard the Memory Stick bandwagon anytime soon, we do feel that it's at least a viable and useful solution within the Sony product line."
Interesting points, I'd say. If you already own several pieces of memory of another format, then it is perfectly legitimate to go for a camera that will utilize your investment. IT'S YOUR MONEY, AND YOU DON'T WANT TO WAIST IT. However, if you don't have much money tied up in any particular format, then it really does not matter what format the camera uses, as long as that memory is reliable and will take, protect, and hold your images for years to come. THE MEMORY STICK DOES THESE THINGS AT LEAST AS WELL AS THE OTHER FORMATS, AND POSSIBLY MORE EFFICIENTLY. HOW SO?
THE MEMORY STICK HAS A GREAT LITTLE PROTECT SWITCH THAT KEEPS YOU FROM ACCIDENTALLY ERASING THE DATA ON THE STICK. IT HAS THOSE PROTECTED METAL CONTACTS, AS MENTIONED IN THE REVIEW COMMENTS ABOVE, SO IT IS LIABLE TO LAST LONGER BEFORE FAILURE THAN COMPETING FORMATS. THE LARGER FORMATTED MEMORY STICKS ON UP TO 256MB OR EVEN 1GB ARE EXPECTED TO BE COMPATIBLE WITH EXISTING DEVICES. WITH CF CARDS AT THIS POINT, THERE IS A DIVISION INTO TYPE I AND TYPE II CARDS BECAUSE OF INCREASING MEMORY SIZE; NOT LIKELY TO HAPPEN FOR QUITE A WHILE WITH MEMORY STICK. THE MEMORY STICK WILL AS LICENSED TO OTHERS WILL GET FASTER IN ITS READ/WRITE CAPABILITY, AS SONY HAS MADE A LICENSING DEAL WITH LEXAR MEDIA, WHO PRODUCE SOME OF THE "FASTEST" MEMORY MEDIA AROUND, ACCORDING TO THEM.
SO, IT MAY BE EASILY ARGUED THAT WE DON'T NEED ANOTHER FORMAT. HOWEVER, THE FORMAT IS HERE TO STAY, AND IT SEEMS THAT THERE WILL BE LOTS OF REASONS TO USE IT BY THE TIME OTHER MANUFACTURERS JUMP ON BOARD.
MIKE: The facts I'm referring to are the technical architecture of both CF and MS. They are what control the rate of capacity increase in the two product types. I'll be happy to look at whatever site you want to point me to that has FACTS -- not speculation -- about the two product types.
ANS: You won’t accept the word of independent reviewers, and won’t accept the word of Sony which has publicly stated that the MS has a max capacity of 1.3GB which they intend to reach by 2002. If you won’t take the word of independent reviewers or the manufacturer of the item and refer to their statements as “speculation,” what do you want from me?
ANS: I guess you set some kind of new record every month for wasted
shots. Kind of going on the theory that if you take a few zillion photos
some are bound to occasionally turn out right.
MIKE: No I go on the REALITY that digital shots are essentially free if you haven't hamstrung yourself by buying a camera that only take Liliputian size storage.
ANS: Free, yes, but not an excuse for careless photography. I use my digicam the same way I use my film camera---I take each photo the best way I know how, and with one major question in mind, “Will it be a really good image that people enjoy viewing?” I avoid exces shots just as though I had to pay film prices
MIKE: No, the other drive I mentioned is a 1Gb Micro IDE drive in the same product family as IBM's 340Mb Microdrive. Perhaps prospective Memory Stick providers should hold off purchases until Sony tells them what their storage strategy is. The MO technology is interesting, though I doubt seriously that we'll see it in digital cameras any time soon, for a number of reasons: 1) the size given is the media alone, not the write mechanism which will add size and weight; 2) MO is much more energy intensive. Battery life is already an issue with digital cameras.
ANS: Cartridge size is 58 x 54 x 4mm, pretty small in my book. Four mm is less than 3/16 of an inch thick. As to drive, Sony has had no problem putting floppy drives in their cameras---and with the FD-91/95, a big zoom and image stabilization too—all for the same price other as digicams (made by Sanyo in most cases) without those three additional cost-of-manufacturing items. As to energy use, if your digicam (a Sanyo?) had the powerful lithium ion battery and charger that Sony includes with their digicams you would know that energy consumption is a non-issue.
Elvis says Hi. He’s doing fine and taking lots of photos with his Sony digicam (really likes the convenience of a Mavica). I mentioned CF to him. He said, What, you mean corn flakes? I said, No, Compact Flash image storage memory cards. He said, “Sorry, we up here can see into the future and there is no future for CF!”
MIKE: Somehow this is all making sense Rodger. A 25 year old corpse would probably be thrilled with a Mavica.
ANS: Indeed. Even the dead know enough not to buy a Sanyo with someone else’s name glued on to it.
Rodger
