Let's see some "L" 100% crops for a change

--There is a lot of discussion on this forum about posting 100%
crops, especially from owners of "L" lenses directed toward owners
of consumer lenses. In actuality, I don't remember seeing any 100%
crops or full files posted by "L" owners, and it would be nice if
they would like to "share" their expertise. So "L" people, how
about some links to a few of your full files or 100% crops for a
change. I would appreciate seeing some from lenses at 300 mm and
max aperture as well as EXIF info. Thanks...

Ranger a.k.a chammett
http://www.pbase.com/chammett
Here's some from my 400mm, 0 sharpening on the rebel.
f5.6



full res of a lysol can at f5.6
http://www.pbase.com/image/30575902
200 2.8 L at f4.5



100mm macro at f5 using MLU and tripod with digital rebel. Not an
L lens though.



200 2.8L at f4, i cropped this to show the strange dark halo around
the birds head which i now believe is sharpening artifacts, so even
at 0 sharpening the rebel is still doing some sharpening when
shooting jpg fine.



400 f5.6L at f8



400 f5.6 at f8



400 f5.6L at f8



--
http://www.pbase.com/paulyoly/root

--These are fantastic! I can see why people like these lenses. I wish I had a caddy to carry them, and I'm sure I would love them too ! Thanks for taking the time to post them . I'm trying to get a handle on what people the " L people" want to see and why, and pictures like these are a good example of what I'm talking about.
Ranger a.k.a chammett
http://www.pbase.com/chammett
 
I seem to remember a quote that I read around here one time. It
was something along the lines of, If I show someone a picture and
they tell me. “Wow! What a sharp picture” then I know I
have failed.

Is photography supposed to be about the pictures or is it about
ultimate sharpness and lack of CA? Can a less than L lens produce
a powerful and lasting image? Sure it would be great to have a
powerful image that has ultimate sharpness and lack of CA with
perfect color and contrast but as long as the technical aspects are
reasonably well handled the picture will retain its power. I have
yet to walk through a photo gallery and observe someone looking at
a large print up close through a magnifying glass to check for CA.

Greg

--

--Your comments are right on. I doubt that Ansel Adams, Cartier-Bresson and others of their type used L lenses, and I haven't seen too many criticisms of their lack of sharpness or contrast. It was their ability to capture the essence of the subject and to render that feeling in the finished product. Has photography slipped a cog in emphasizing sharpness and contrast and lack of CA or whatever else one can pick at, at the expense of "getting the REAL picture" ?

Ranger a.k.a chammett
http://www.pbase.com/chammett
 
--Your comments are right on. I doubt that Ansel Adams,
Cartier-Bresson and others of their type used L lenses, and I
haven't seen too many criticisms of their lack of sharpness or
contrast.
Ansel Adams requirements were far stricter for good quality than anybody touting L lenses. If I had large format lenses that good I wouldn't have to worry about L's either. If he were stuck with 35mm lenses he'd be using the best there were, whether that'd be an L lens or say a Zeiss lens he'd be using it.

Jason
 


What i did here would disqualify this pic as a 100% crop by definition.

Taken with the rebel and 400 f5.6L
--There is a lot of discussion on this forum about posting 100%
crops, especially from owners of "L" lenses directed toward owners
of consumer lenses. In actuality, I don't remember seeing any 100%
crops or full files posted by "L" owners, and it would be nice if
they would like to "share" their expertise. So "L" people, how
about some links to a few of your full files or 100% crops for a
change. I would appreciate seeing some from lenses at 300 mm and
max aperture as well as EXIF info. Thanks...

Ranger a.k.a chammett
http://www.pbase.com/chammett
--
http://www.pbase.com/paulyoly/root

 
--Your comments are right on. I doubt that Ansel Adams,
Cartier-Bresson and others of their type used L lenses, and I
haven't seen too many criticisms of their lack of sharpness or
contrast.
Ansel Adams requirements were far stricter for good quality than
anybody touting L lenses. If I had large format lenses that good I
wouldn't have to worry about L's either. If he were stuck with
35mm lenses he'd be using the best there were, whether that'd be an
L lens or say a Zeiss lens he'd be using it.

Jason
--But he didn't have that option, and he did pretty well with what he had ! My original post wasn't meant to get into a discussion about what photographers in the past worked with, but rather to see what the L lens people were constantly referring to in their critiques of the various lenses bought/used by people on the forum. I kind of had the feeling that photography was more of an art form for them (the photographers mentioned above) than a technologically perfect achievement, which seems to be at least equally important now. That isn't to say that the latter is not significant , but rather to say that one CAN make beautiful images without L lenses! And one can make crummy images wiith one, I'd venture to say! I have one L lens, and I've certainly tossed a few from it ! Maybe a few of you get it right 100% all the time, but if truth be known, even Leonardo probably had a few of his efforts hit the magnificent circular file!

Ranger a.k.a chammett
http://www.pbase.com/chammett
 
--These are fantastic! I can see why people like these lenses. I
wish I had a caddy to carry them, and I'm sure I would love them
too ! Thanks for taking the time to post them . I'm trying to get
a handle on what people the " L people" want to see and why, and
pictures like these are a good example of what I'm talking about.
Ranger a.k.a chammett
http://www.pbase.com/chammett
first here's the lenses from largest to smallest. None of these i wold consider big or heavy. The heaviest one weighs 2.8lbs, most people carry more weight than that in their colon at all times.



And here's my lens caddy......



I don't care who you are that's funny right there! (quote from larry the cable guy) Bah, ha,ha!

She's really not as p!ssed as she looks. She's squinting and watching for water moccasins. Plus it's 10am and allready freakin hot!
--
http://www.pbase.com/paulyoly/root

 
I have followed the 100% crop posts and all the positives and
negatives, and I thought I would add my 2 cents. While a 100% crop
can and will show the difference between lenses, it matters none to
newspapers and magazines if you are trying to get published. I
don't want people to read these posts and think they need to spend
x amount of money to be a pro. Just think about it before the
digital age, slides were how it was done, and looking at a slide
through a loop is not a 100% crop. The print size you see in the
glossy magazines is always resized, no one prints 100% images. I
understand that to find out a lens sharpness, one might find it
usefull to see these tests, but just try to keep some moderation
with its importance.

http://www.gregkahn.com
--I think this is an incredibly sane post. It exactly reflects
what I think, and I wish others could realize it too. I have just
been trying to figure out what the importance of the 100% crops and
full files was, and what the "L" people saw that I have been
missing. My feeling is that I never print larger than 8 x 10, and
probably would never enlarge an image much bigger than that for
someone else to print for me. But I wanted to see some crops from
the "L" people since they are the "gold standard" by which they
seem to evaluate lenses and the worth of an image.

I was a slide curator for an Art History department at a local
university for 10 years, and have a huge collection of mu own
slides from past trips (about 15,000), some good and some crummy.
I've sharpened my eye to evaluating slides after looking through a
loupe for all those years, and am trying now to do the same with
digital images. Thus my interest in seeing what the "L" people see
in their crops.

Thanks for your very intelligent reply!

Ranger a.k.a chammett
http://www.pbase.com/chammett
It's about autofocus accuracy, autofocus speed and aperture, not to mention build quality. i'm sure my L lenses will long outside my rebel and consumer grade lenses. The same goes for everything, well almost everything. A $60 pair of paints will generally out last at $20 pair, there are exceptions to this rule, some things are made the same just repackaged under a different name and sold as generic, but that is not the case with lenses. Also you can crop much closer and still print 8x10 with an L lens, not to mention you can shoot wide open and get much better results, i'm sure Daniella will tell you that the sigma 70-300 zoom is very soft at 300mm wide open.

But the main reason i buy L lenses is because my printer prints 13x19, but the down side is it cost more to frame a pic that size and you can't fit many on the wall. There's no doubt that an L lens can produce a better picture, this isn't important to some. Maybe L owners are all perfectionists like me.

--
http://www.pbase.com/paulyoly/root

 
Ranger,

This is from the Canon 400mm f5.6 on a 1D Mark II. The file was shot raw, converted with slight EC adjustment. In PS, I made a very slight layers adjustment to tweak the black and white points, and then applied slight sharpening. The file was then saved out to a level 10 .jpg with no resizing.

This shot was handheld, and should have the EXIF data intact.



Regards,
Darrell
 
Ranger,

This is from the Canon 400mm f5.6 on a 1D Mark II. The file was
shot raw, converted with slight EC adjustment. In PS, I made a
very slight layers adjustment to tweak the black and white points,
and then applied slight sharpening. The file was then saved out to
a level 10 .jpg with no resizing.

This shot was handheld, and should have the EXIF data intact.
Regards,
Darrell
I'm seeing a lot of artifacts in your pic, looks like compression artifacts, but i'm no expert. Can you post a crop that isn't compressed instead of the whole pic. Something isn't right.

--
http://www.pbase.com/paulyoly/root

 
We are talking about the sharpest L-primes there, not to be
mistaken with affordable but highly useable zoom lenses. You cannot
get any better than those, but do we all need them to shoot
everything? At least I don't. I'd take my Sigma 70-300 or even the
Bigma for a walk rather than my 300/2.8IS.
The Bigma is your idea of a compact light-weight walkabout lens??

I knew I should never have given up on that Charles Atlas body-building course...

I salute you!
--
Brian
Dallas, TX
D60 -> 10D -> 1D -> 1D+300D -> 300D
http://www.pbase.com/drip
--
TonySD
 

What i did here would disqualify this pic as a 100% crop by
definition.

Taken with the rebel and 400 f5.6L
I'm not sure but it looks like you just cropped an image that was
already at 100% to me and resized it larger.
--
Ranger a.k.a chammett
http://www.pbase.com/chammett
It is a 100% crop, but it doesn't qualify because i added sharpening in photoshop, not much, but enough to make a noticeable difference. Most peoples definition of 100% crop is a piece of a photo that isn't resized or sharpened. i just wanted to see if anyone could tell i sharpened it. I added the unsharpened crop below it. It seems easier to sharpen an image from an L lens as well, i mean sharpening halos don't show up as quickly as they do with an image from a non L lens, this is just my experience.

--
http://www.pbase.com/paulyoly/root

 
I think the best thing to do is to take pictures like you will
actually be taking in real life. Test pictures of brick walls,
newsprint, dollar bills… are fine and good for nitpicking
lenses and academic studies but I have found that they rarely tell
enough of the story to make any sort of decision. The lens tests
that I have done that I have actually found useful were along these
lines. Take the lens out for the day, use it exactly how you plan
to be using it most of the time. Take lots of pictures in as many
different situations as you can come up with. When you review the
pictures at the end of the day see how happy you are with them.
The next day take lens #2 out and do the same thing. Testing like
this not only tells you useful information about the image quality
that the lens is producing but it tells you very important
information about how the lens handles.

For instance, a while back I purchased an EF 100-300mm f/5.6L. I
did the usual testing in the house with test targets in controlled
lighting with MLU and the whole nine yards. The image quality
looked great and the lens really looked like a keeper to me. That
weekend I took the lens with me to the renaissance festival. I
found that the lens creep with that lens got very annoying while I
was carrying the lens mounted on my 10D. I also missed lots of
shots of the falconry demonstration and some of the jousting and
sword fighting because the autofocus was so darn slow. When that
lens hunts it takes a long time for it to rack all the way in and
back out. After a few more outings like that one I decided that
the lens was not for me, despite its excellent image quality.

When I got my 70-300 DO and did my controlled testing with it, I
found it to be a bit disappointing in the optical quality
department. I am not saying that the lens was bad but just not
quite up to my expectations, which were admittedly pretty high. If
I had just done that testing I would have shipped the lens back
right away in total disappointment. When I did my real world
testing I discovered a lot more about the lens that I really liked.
The AF speed, IS and general feel of the lens were very good. This
made my decision to keep or return the lens a much more difficult
one. The final clincher for me was that in certain lighting
conditions I got the “dreaminess.” I think you
probably can remember the dragonfly picture (and there were many
others that had similar results). For the type of shooting that I
do I use 300mm and f/5.6 quite a bit and am frequently shooting
under the type of conditions that yield the dreamy effect. For
others this isn’t a problem because they aren’t using
these settings under these conditions as frequently as I do.

I hope this makes some sort of sense and is helpful.

Greg

--

--I do pretty much what you talked about. I just take the lenses I buy and go out and have fun taking pictures. If they aren't so hot (the pictures) , I delete them and try again, hopefully learning from my mistakes. And it mostly works. I'm sure there might be a better way, and part of that better way is observing and participating on this forum. Which is what broght me to post the original message at the top of this thread. I never realized that looking at full files and 100% crops was such a big deal till I got on this forum, and noted that some people seem obsessed with seeing them. So I just decided I'd better see what was so important.

I have determined from this exercise, that if you are going to do major cropping or print extremely large images, or send your work for publication, critical sharpness would be important, but for those of us who print 8 x 10 or maybe 11 x 14, and/or who (GOD FORBID and with apologies to the "L crowd "! ) find it necessary to compromise on weight due to our ancient age or small size, often we have to give precedence to these factors.

I appreciate all the people who have taken the time to post their large files and crops. It has been very informative, though I had hoped that some of the more vocal people might also post some of theirs.

Ranger a.k.a chammett
http://www.pbase.com/chammett
 
water mocassin? those are poinsonous I think?

scary.

here I saw a rattle snake on the trail once..starting from there I stopped walking off trail as I was doing.

those are fantastic..as usual.
--These are fantastic! I can see why people like these lenses. I
wish I had a caddy to carry them, and I'm sure I would love them
too ! Thanks for taking the time to post them . I'm trying to get
a handle on what people the " L people" want to see and why, and
pictures like these are a good example of what I'm talking about.
Ranger a.k.a chammett
http://www.pbase.com/chammett
first here's the lenses from largest to smallest. None of these i
wold consider big or heavy. The heaviest one weighs 2.8lbs, most
people carry more weight than that in their colon at all times.



And here's my lens caddy......



I don't care who you are that's funny right there! (quote from
larry the cable guy) Bah, ha,ha!

She's really not as p!ssed as she looks. She's squinting and
watching for water moccasins. Plus it's 10am and allready freakin
hot!
--
http://www.pbase.com/paulyoly/root

--
Minë Corma hostië të ilyë ar mordossë nutië të
Mornórëo Nóressë yassë i Fuini caitar.
Un thoron arart’a s’un hith mal’kemen ioke.
Saurulmaiel
 
It really look oversharpened on my monitor. can you show the same without sharpening?
Ranger,

This is from the Canon 400mm f5.6 on a 1D Mark II. The file was
shot raw, converted with slight EC adjustment. In PS, I made a
very slight layers adjustment to tweak the black and white points,
and then applied slight sharpening. The file was then saved out to
a level 10 .jpg with no resizing.

This shot was handheld, and should have the EXIF data intact.



Regards,
Darrell
--
Minë Corma hostië të ilyë ar mordossë nutië të
Mornórëo Nóressë yassë i Fuini caitar.
Un thoron arart’a s’un hith mal’kemen ioke.
Saurulmaiel
 
but for
those of us who print 8 x 10 or maybe 11 x 14, and/or who (GOD
FORBID and with apologies to the "L crowd "! ) find it necessary to
compromise on weight due to our ancient age or small size....
I haven't figured out which side Peacefrog is on there... he compromises on his weight in some places then carries around giant 12 pound lenses with 4 fingers. :)

jason
 
Here is crop 100% from Jpeg high compress file, taken from 1DM2 with 300f4IS + 1.4xII, any of blur is due to low light condition and the bird is keep on moving.



link to see EXIF here: http://www.pbase.com/image/31885517/original
--There is a lot of discussion on this forum about posting 100%
crops, especially from owners of "L" lenses directed toward owners
of consumer lenses. In actuality, I don't remember seeing any 100%
crops or full files posted by "L" owners, and it would be nice if
they would like to "share" their expertise. So "L" people, how
about some links to a few of your full files or 100% crops for a
change. I would appreciate seeing some from lenses at 300 mm and
max aperture as well as EXIF info. Thanks...

Ranger a.k.a chammett
http://www.pbase.com/chammett
 
Not fair. No one ever carries my stuff up 14ers when I go. And I usually bring my F1N, and hardy FD lenses (they've been field tested for a 15 foot fall...still in tact and working perfectly...somehow I survived the 15 foot fall in tact, and working perfectly, too...he he he).

I used to bring the 20mm f2.8, 35-105mm f3.5, and Tamron SP 80-200mm f2.8. Lately, I've been content to bring the 70-210 f4, or no tele-zoom at all. I've also learned to take the motor drive off the F1N before mountain ascent. Air is a little scarce at 14,000 feet, and my lungs are greatful for any assistance whatsoever!

The rewards of having a trusty rig that always works are great, though. For example:

http://www.pbase.com/image/31864546

Please excuse the bad scan. One of these days, I'm going to have this one drum scanned. The lighting on the keyhole is actually not far from being that gold. I was certainly glad to have incurred future back problems to get this'un!

Chris May
[email protected]
Denver, CO
http://www.pbase.com/copcarss
 
To learn from and enjoy the contributions of the "L crowd" but not to feel obligated to keep up :-).

Lisa
So my interest here is to learn all I can from the L lens people so
that I can get the most out of what I do have to work with. And I
appreciate all the input here and in the myriad of other posts I
keep up with. Thanks for helping "L" lens people. I want to know
what it is all about, even if I "can't keep up with the Joneses" !

Ranger a.k.a chammett
http://www.pbase.com/chammett
--
LisaFX
http://www.pbase.com/lisafx
 

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