D2H : is it true , noise ? D2H owner honest opinions pse

I just ordered a D2H and while waiting on my order to arrive I've been reading tons of website postings on different forums.

A lot of people owning a D2H are concerned about the noise, they tell that it's a wonderfull camera but the sensor is to sensitive for noise. Most of them find even D100 images more noise free and say that D2H only works as advertised in good lighting conditions at iso200.

I must admit I'm concerned now that I've made the right decission. I have doubt now. Perhaps I shouldn't have sold my D100.

I hope for honest replies, even if it means that I would cancel my order.
--
have fun shooting !
Sincerely, Philippe http://www.funfoto.be
(some albums @ http://public.funfoto.be )

funfoto said:

I must admit I'm concerned now that I've made the right decission.
I have doubt now. Perhaps I shouldn't have sold my D100.

I hope for honest replies, even if it means that I would cancel my

Click to expand...

see http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1021&message=9135271

The repies you seek are going to vary from user to user.

I own a D2H and I can tell you it is very sensative to getting the exposure right on. There is really zero tolerance for mess ups So if you know how to use the tool you should be in good shape.

I very rarely shoot in RAW so that is part of my problem. I've just been so used to shooting in jpeg mode on my D100, which I kept as a backup, that I continued to do that with the D2H. From now on I will shoot primarliy in RAW because I think you can change the settings w/o as much damage to the photo. This may be a naive expectation and others may be able to address this better.

The D2H is no good for sports action in very poor lighting. However, I've come to the conlcusion that its not the camera because there isn't a camera out there that can handle these horrid conditions. At least digital that is. I don't know about film.

On the other hand, the words that I have heard is that the firmware upgrade is going to take care of this issue. However that remains to be seen for the masses.

So to make this long answer even longer I think the answer to your question is yes and no. And I think it will be just as confusing the more responses you get.

funfoto said:

I just ordered a D2H and while waiting on my order to arrive I've
been reading tons of website postings on different forums.

A lot of people owning a D2H are concerned about the noise, they
tell that it's a wonderfull camera but the sensor is to sensitive
for noise. Most of them find even D100 images more noise free and
say that D2H only works as advertised in good lighting conditions
at iso200.

I must admit I'm concerned now that I've made the right decission.
I have doubt now. Perhaps I shouldn't have sold my D100.

I hope for honest replies, even if it means that I would cancel my
order.
--
have fun shooting !
Sincerely, Philippe http://www.funfoto.be
(some albums @ http://public.funfoto.be )

Click to expand...

Philippe,

I shoot primarily birds in flight, and often the best shot opportunities come in failing light. As a result, I often shoot at ISO 400, 500, or 640. If I don't get the exposure right, I get noise. When I do expose correctly, the noise is there, but not at all objectionable.

My only points of camparison are the Sony 828 which was much, much worse, and the D70 which was about the same. Haven't shot with the D100.

I like my D2H a lot BTW. Hope this helps.

Frank

funfoto said:

I just ordered a D2H and while waiting on my order to arrive I've
been reading tons of website postings on different forums.

A lot of people owning a D2H are concerned about the noise, they
tell that it's a wonderfull camera but the sensor is to sensitive
for noise. Most of them find even D100 images more noise free and
say that D2H only works as advertised in good lighting conditions
at iso200.

I must admit I'm concerned now that I've made the right decission.
I have doubt now. Perhaps I shouldn't have sold my D100.

I hope for honest replies, even if it means that I would cancel my
order.
--
have fun shooting !
Sincerely, Philippe http://www.funfoto.be
(some albums @ http://public.funfoto.be )

Click to expand...

--
Frank Wilson
Huntsville, AL
http://flew.smugmug.com
Looking, listening, learning....

The lastest word out is that the new firmware version XX will address noise issues?? My new D2H just arrived yesterday but I'm not real concerned based on the firmware stories.
Search this forum with "D2H firmware" and you'll get a number of hits.

jjolly (former D100 shooter)

funfoto said:

I just ordered a D2H and while waiting on my order to arrive I've
been reading tons of website postings on different forums.

A lot of people owning a D2H are concerned about the noise, they
tell that it's a wonderfull camera but the sensor is to sensitive
for noise. Most of them find even D100 images more noise free and
say that D2H only works as advertised in good lighting conditions
at iso200.

I must admit I'm concerned now that I've made the right decission.
I have doubt now. Perhaps I shouldn't have sold my D100.

I hope for honest replies, even if it means that I would cancel my
order.
--
have fun shooting !
Sincerely, Philippe http://www.funfoto.be
(some albums @ http://public.funfoto.be )

Click to expand...

Member said:

The lastest word out is that the new firmware version XX will
address noise issues?? My new D2H just arrived yesterday but I'm
not real concerned based on the firmware stories.

Click to expand...

I think your dreaming for a mircle fix and will probably just get a placebo effect with some minor bug fixes.

Gregory

I have to agree. Noise is caused by cranking up the gain on the sensor and is essentially a physical reality. It will vary from one sensor type / configuration to another, but is not something that can be easily fixed in software. I can be cleaned up (as in NN and NI), but it won't go away with a firmware fix.

That being said, I still don't think that the D2H is all that bad. You just have to get the exposure right.

Frank

gho said:

gho said:

The lastest word out is that the new firmware version XX will
address noise issues?? My new D2H just arrived yesterday but I'm
not real concerned based on the firmware stories.

Click to expand...

I think your dreaming for a mircle fix and will probably just get a
placebo effect with some minor bug fixes.

Gregory

Click to expand...

--
Frank Wilson
Huntsville, AL
http://flew.smugmug.com
Looking, listening, learning....

IMHO the D2h is noisier than my D100 - but the D100 is Nikon's low noise king, even my D70 is ever so slightly noiser.

When I do get exposure spot on, the noise is still there, its not really bad but its there. With the D100 - there's no noise at base ISO with good exposures. If I have to do digital exposure compensation with a D2h file, then noise begins to appear and a lot faster than the D100.

There are others that would argue otherwise though. Seems most D2h owners on this forum don't have any noise issues whatsoever even at higher ISOs, so its prolly just me.

Gregory

My posts above say exactly the same thing, except that I never owned a D100. There is noise in my D2H shots. Much more if I have to do a lot of post-processing exposure comp (which with my shooting skills, I have to do a lot....;-).

One thing I find hard to understand is why the D70 would be much different than the D100. Maybe the in-camera NR is a little lighter in the D70, but you still can't 'eliminate' noise if the sensor is noisy, and they both use essentially the same sensor.

Regards,

Frank

gho said:

IMHO the D2h is noisier than my D100 - but the D100 is Nikon's low
noise king, even my D70 is ever so slightly noiser.

When I do get exposure spot on, the noise is still there, its not
really bad but its there. With the D100 - there's no noise at
base ISO with good exposures. If I have to do digital exposure
compensation with a D2h file, then noise begins to appear and a lot
faster than the D100.

There are others that would argue otherwise though. Seems most
D2h owners on this forum don't have any noise issues whatsoever
even at higher ISOs, so its prolly just me.

Gregory

Click to expand...

--
Frank Wilson
Huntsville, AL
http://flew.smugmug.com
Looking, listening, learning....

flew said:

My posts above say exactly the same thing, except that I never
owned a D100. There is noise in my D2H shots. Much more if I have
to do a lot of post-processing exposure comp (which with my
shooting skills, I have to do a lot....;-).

Click to expand...

Read your posts, thanks for the support! I usually don't make posts about D2h noise issues because those posts usally get pounced on. I guess I must be feeling couragous today. I'm glad to know that there are others out there that agree with my observations.

flew said:

One thing I find hard to understand is why the D70 would be much
different than the D100. Maybe the in-camera NR is a little
lighter in the D70, but you still can't 'eliminate' noise if the
sensor is noisy, and they both use essentially the same sensor.

Click to expand...

I'm not sure why, I would have thought it would be less than the D100 with a more advanced and updated sensor and all. I've heard that the sensor is no longer a Sony sensor and is now sourced from Sanyo or something. I'm not sure though - I read it in a post and haven't confirmed it, it could be pure conjecture. Noise on the D70 is better than the D2h and very very close to the levels of the D100.

Gregory

Phil did say in his review that the D2H sensor had more noise than he was hoping for. Personally, I'm a little surprised by how much there is if you don't nail the exposure. Don't know why anyone would flame you for saying the same thing. Are you supposed to lie??!?

As I said above, all in all, I like my D2H and my D70. I just have to work on shooting in good light and / or getting the exposure right. The noise is certainly acceptable if you do one or both of these.

Regards,

Frank

gho said:

gho said:

My posts above say exactly the same thing, except that I never
owned a D100. There is noise in my D2H shots. Much more if I have
to do a lot of post-processing exposure comp (which with my
shooting skills, I have to do a lot....;-).

Click to expand...

Read your posts, thanks for the support! I usually don't make
posts about D2h noise issues because those posts usally get pounced
on. I guess I must be feeling couragous today. I'm glad to know
that there are others out there that agree with my observations.

gho said:

One thing I find hard to understand is why the D70 would be much
different than the D100. Maybe the in-camera NR is a little
lighter in the D70, but you still can't 'eliminate' noise if the
sensor is noisy, and they both use essentially the same sensor.

Click to expand...

I'm not sure why, I would have thought it would be less than the
D100 with a more advanced and updated sensor and all. I've heard
that the sensor is no longer a Sony sensor and is now sourced from
Sanyo or something. I'm not sure though - I read it in a post and
haven't confirmed it, it could be pure conjecture. Noise on the
D70 is better than the D2h and very very close to the levels of the
D100.

Gregory

Click to expand...

--
Frank Wilson
Huntsville, AL
http://flew.smugmug.com
Looking, listening, learning....

Suggestion:

Go to the Oly-forum and read about E1 noise and how people get acceptable results at high ISO. After reading the E1 forum you will think "hey, the E1 has some noise but one can live with it".

Then look at Phils noise comparison between E1 and d2H and how much better the d2h does compared to the E1.

I do think that the 1D and even more the 1DII are slightly better regarding noise. If I had to shoot mainly at 1600 ISO and higher I would probably not get the d2h.

For my use I shoot often at 200 and 400, and some few times at1000 ISO. I barely need 1600 ISO.

I own a 1D and ordered a d2H today. For me the slightly more noise in higher ISO is not an issue. But again , IMO I wouldnt get a d2h if I had too shoot indoor sports events every weekend.

funfoto said:

I just ordered a D2H and while waiting on my order to arrive I've
been reading tons of website postings on different forums.

A lot of people owning a D2H are concerned about the noise, they
tell that it's a wonderfull camera but the sensor is to sensitive
for noise. Most of them find even D100 images more noise free and
say that D2H only works as advertised in good lighting conditions
at iso200.

I must admit I'm concerned now that I've made the right decission.
I have doubt now. Perhaps I shouldn't have sold my D100.

I hope for honest replies, even if it means that I would cancel my
order.
--
have fun shooting !
Sincerely, Philippe http://www.funfoto.be
(some albums @ http://public.funfoto.be )

Click to expand...

--
Regards,
TOM

I agree noise-wise the D2H is better than a lot of cameras out there, but when comparing the camera to other cameras in the Nikon line up, it just isn't that great when it comes to high ISO. My 800 ISO shots look fantastic on my old D100 even if I under expose. The D2H just isn't great above 640, it ain't bad, but it isn't great. I expect better performance from a pro-DSLR. On the other side of the coin though, the D2H is extremely sharp for 4 megapixels.

Thomas Streng said:

funfoto said:

I just ordered a D2H and while waiting on my order to arrive I've
been reading tons of website postings on different forums.

A lot of people owning a D2H are concerned about the noise, they
tell that it's a wonderfull camera but the sensor is to sensitive
for noise. Most of them find even D100 images more noise free and
say that D2H only works as advertised in good lighting conditions
at iso200.

I must admit I'm concerned now that I've made the right decission.
I have doubt now. Perhaps I shouldn't have sold my D100.

I hope for honest replies, even if it means that I would cancel my
order.
--
have fun shooting !
Sincerely, Philippe http://www.funfoto.be
(some albums @ http://public.funfoto.be )

Click to expand...

--
Regards,
TOM

Click to expand...

--
--

inhousephoto inc. digital / photography / media
http://www.inhousephoto.com (being updated!)

I agree, the D100 was awesome at high ISO, I even got acceptable stuff at 1250-1600. I sort of wish I got a D100 replacement (since it got stolen) instead of a D70 (also for the vertical grip). I'm in the same camp with you, the D2H from my use in the past 3 months has yeilded good but not fantastic results. Since I shoot a lot of party and club stuff, the noise is very obvious if not exposed right, and my post production is much more tedious to develop cleaner shots. Have you noticed the ones who complain in this forum are all those who shoot in dark venues (artifical lit sports, concerts, clubs, etc.) and all those who argue other wise shoot in bright light.

gho said:

IMHO the D2h is noisier than my D100 - but the D100 is Nikon's low
noise king, even my D70 is ever so slightly noiser.

When I do get exposure spot on, the noise is still there, its not
really bad but its there. With the D100 - there's no noise at
base ISO with good exposures. If I have to do digital exposure
compensation with a D2h file, then noise begins to appear and a lot
faster than the D100.

There are others that would argue otherwise though. Seems most
D2h owners on this forum don't have any noise issues whatsoever
even at higher ISOs, so its prolly just me.

Gregory

Click to expand...

--
--

inhousephoto inc. digital / photography / media
http://www.inhousephoto.com (being updated!)

funfoto said:

A lot of people owning a D2H are concerned about the noise...

Click to expand...

Well ignore the quasi-religious admiration many people on dpreview have about the D2H. It's a great tool. It has fantastic features but, YES, it has a noise problem!

Anyway, I own a D100, a D2H and a Fuji S2Pro. Of all 3, the S2Pro is the least noisy. At base ISO (100) The s2 beats the D100 which beats the D2H hands down. At high ISO (800+) The S2 is KING.

(and to those who feel like "oh my god, what is he talking about, the D2H is not a noisy camera!", Go ahead! Flame me. Like I give a sh:it. If you flame, you probably haven't done your homework or you don't own a D2H, or you don't shoot low light stuff or a VERY noisy D2H image doesn't bother you... And please quit posting scaled down images to show that there is "no" noise in your image. Scaling down reduces high frequency noise in an image. And quit posting high iso images taken in broad daylight. Post a crop of the full size image taken in low light, or heck even at 200 ISO, and make sure you show some dark/shadowy tones as well. Thank you.)

As you may have read already, the D2H is super sensitive to under-exposure. In other words, the chip is very noisy. That's exactly what that means. Even at base ISO, the D2H is noisier than any other dSLR from nikon.

Now, I have done quite a lot of low light stuff with the D2H in the past few months. Both long exposures on a tripod and shooting concerts in very dark, badly lit venues. My conclusions are that the D2H has SUPERB long exposure noise reduction, If you're into night photography/ long exposures (tripod), the D2H is a fantastic tool!

If you're shooting 800-1000 ISO in very dark places, think again about getting the D2H. You will probably be way better off with a fuji S2Pro. That camera is amazing both for its colors and its very low noise levels at ALL ISOs including 1600.
If you insist on getting a D2H for low light stuff, this is what I found out:

-forget Auto WB. Get a direct sensor WB reading if your main subject is illuminated one main light or if one light dominates. Place your camera right under it and do a sensor WB.

• if there are several lights without a dominating one falling on your subject, dial your WB in Kelvins. Usually I get better results (less noise) if I use 2800-4000K if the lights are warm (yellow, reds etc...)

• do not use "low contrast" tone curves if you're shooting in DARK venues. This is basically leaving too much dynamic range in the shadows. You need to be able to "crush your black level" a bit to reduce the appearance of noise. If you shoot JPEG with that tone curve setting and you underexpose, you're f.Kd. You'll have to use a serious noise removal tool like noiseNinja or Neat Image.

• shoot RAW. Forget JPEG. (forget it forever anyway. Unless you work as a PJ and don't have time to dic-k around)

• spot meter or set your center weight average zone to 6% coverage if you insist on using CWAverage.

If you're shooting in low light, get fast glass! 70-200 VR f/2.8 is AWESOME for lowlight. The 17-55 DX f/2.8 and the 17-35 f/2.8 are both great. I have all of these and have had great results at f/2.8 in low light venues...

Hope that helps. Here are a few of the low light shots I took recently:
http://www.karimsahai.com/gallery/photo.php?photo=665
http://www.karimsahai.com/gallery/photo.php?photo=663
http://www.karimsahai.com/gallery/photo.php?photo=633
http://www.karimsahai.com/gallery/photo.php?photo=634
http://www.karimsahai.com/gallery/photo.php?photo=649
http://www.karimsahai.com/gallery/photo.php?photo=411

k.
--
http://karimsahai.com

Jonathan F. said:

Have you noticed the ones who complain in this forum
are all those who shoot in dark venues (artifical lit sports,
concerts, clubs, etc.) and all those who argue other wise shoot in
bright light.

Click to expand...

SO TRUE!!! Thanks for pointing that out!

k.
--
http://karimsahai.com

http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1021&message=7749010

Bill

funfoto said:

I just ordered a D2H and while waiting on my order to arrive I've
been reading tons of website postings on different forums.

A lot of people owning a D2H are concerned about the noise, they
tell that it's a wonderfull camera but the sensor is to sensitive
for noise. Most of them find even D100 images more noise free and
say that D2H only works as advertised in good lighting conditions
at iso200.

I must admit I'm concerned now that I've made the right decission.
I have doubt now. Perhaps I shouldn't have sold my D100.

I hope for honest replies, even if it means that I would cancel my
order.
--
have fun shooting !
Sincerely, Philippe http://www.funfoto.be
(some albums @ http://public.funfoto.be )

Click to expand...

Philippe,

If you were satisfied with the level of noise in your D100, I think you'll be satisfied with noise from the D2H. And IMHO every other aspect of the D2H is better. (OK, it is bigger and heavier.)

Here is a direct noise comparision - D2H & D100 noise. I believe the D2H is equal or better than the D100 in every test. Certainly nothing for you to worry about. The rest of the review is pretty interesting as well... http://www.photo-miracles.com/D2H/Page04.html

Here's more, including noise examples... The entire review is worth a read. http://www.naturfotograf.com/index2_nPC.html

Want more? Here's a comparison of D2H and Canon 1D at various ISOs. IMHO very similar, a slight edge to the 1D at 1600 ISO. http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/nikond2h/page19.asp

All digital cameras have noise. At higher ISOs the noise increases in all digital cameras. It does in the D2H as well. High ISO noise is amplified by underexpose in all digital cameras. The D2H may be more sensitive to exposure errors than some other cameras. To avoid this problem expose correctly. Also, set the Tone Compensation to Low. If the camera boosts contrast because you set Tone Compensation to High or Auto it may increase noise in the process.

This is kind of fun, check thousands of random D2H samples here... http://www.pbase.com/cameras/nikon/d2h

Another D2H review worth a read... http://www.moose395.net/gear/d2h.html

I hope this helped. I'm confident you won't be dissapointed.

Regards,
JB

funfoto said:

I just ordered a D2H and while waiting on my order to arrive I've
been reading tons of website postings on different forums.

A lot of people owning a D2H are concerned about the noise, they
tell that it's a wonderfull camera but the sensor is to sensitive
for noise. Most of them find even D100 images more noise free and
say that D2H only works as advertised in good lighting conditions
at iso200.

I must admit I'm concerned now that I've made the right decission.
I have doubt now. Perhaps I shouldn't have sold my D100.

I hope for honest replies, even if it means that I would cancel my
order.
--
have fun shooting !
Sincerely, Philippe http://www.funfoto.be
(some albums @ http://public.funfoto.be )

Click to expand...

--
----
JB

Some have issues, some don't.

I remember when I was saying that the D-100 was not noisy at all, everybody were going ... "are you blind/crazy/denying the fact ... "

The fact for ME is, it is not at all noisier than my D-100 along with my shooting style. It is easier to get a fine exposure (better metering system) and the colors and definition are fantastic.

funfoto said:

I just ordered a D2H and while waiting on my order to arrive I've
been reading tons of website postings on different forums.

A lot of people owning a D2H are concerned about the noise, they
tell that it's a wonderfull camera but the sensor is to sensitive
for noise. Most of them find even D100 images more noise free and
say that D2H only works as advertised in good lighting conditions
at iso200.

I must admit I'm concerned now that I've made the right decission.
I have doubt now. Perhaps I shouldn't have sold my D100.

I hope for honest replies, even if it means that I would cancel my
order.
--
have fun shooting !
Sincerely, Philippe http://www.funfoto.be
(some albums @ http://public.funfoto.be )

Click to expand...

--
Yves P.
Share the Knowledge

PBASE Supporter

Some pictures I like:
http://www.pbase.com/yp8/root

The noise in the D2H files is there but no more than I experienced in a d100 file. Perhaps a tad more , but the noise is Way more behaved and with tools like Neat or Noise Ninja , I believe Nikon has a winning solution for sure , digic is totally needed for a CMOS sensor as the imager is inherently More noisy than a CCD sensor, but the issue I have with Canon is that there is no way to turn it Off, I much prefer the "tooth" it gives to the image and I can take it out if I wish to very easily in post processing.

There is So much more to an image than noise and I Never for One minute regretted my d2h purchase nor the sale of my d100 to help pay for it

J