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MkII Main Dial Problem on 2 Cameras- Please Test

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Earlier I made two posts in reference to the first 1D MKII I recieved two weeks ago. The major issue with that camera was intermittent AF point dimming on two points and 2-3 stop overexposure when those points were selected. A second problem with the camera was less serious but annoying (although potentially very serious): there were two points on the main command dial, 180 degrees from each other, where the dial would "double step". That is, when scrolling through photos, it would skip a photo in the sequence (from 17 to 19, for instance). It would do it while dial Exp compensation, or during any function of the main dial, as long as either one of the two points was being selected. I put a small sticker on the dial to indicate where the points were, and consistency was the rule.

After getting my second MkII, I quickly looked it over, and thankfully there is not a problem with the exposure or AF points (yet). But the second body has the exact same problem with the main command dial. I hesitate to bother Calumet again (especially since they have people waiting in line), but I want a product that works right. Getting two cameras with identical problems leads me to think the problem is widespread. Anyone else notice this? If it is widespread, I think we need to demand a fix as this already has led to inaccurate deletions, settings, menu selections, etc. for me.

If you have a MkII, please quickly test this by slowly scrolling through a set of photos on the camera and see if it skips as I described, and let us know. As it doesn't directly affect image quality, it isn't hugely important, but it does have disastrous possibilities (esp. when selecting critical functions like format, delete, etc.)

-Ken
--
http://www.kennethturley.com
 
.. to say whether or not they have a problem.

You are refering to the thumb dial on the back of the camera??
Ken T said:
Earlier I made two posts in reference to the first 1D MKII I
recieved two weeks ago. The major issue with that camera was
intermittent AF point dimming on two points and 2-3 stop
overexposure when those points were selected. A second problem
with the camera was less serious but annoying (although potentially
very serious): there were two points on the main command dial, 180
degrees from each other, where the dial would "double step". That
is, when scrolling through photos, it would skip a photo in the
sequence (from 17 to 19, for instance). It would do it while dial
Exp compensation, or during any function of the main dial, as long
as either one of the two points was being selected. I put a small
sticker on the dial to indicate where the points were, and
consistency was the rule.

After getting my second MkII, I quickly looked it over, and
thankfully there is not a problem with the exposure or AF points
(yet). But the second body has the exact same problem with the
main command dial. I hesitate to bother Calumet again (especially
since they have people waiting in line), but I want a product that
works right. Getting two cameras with identical problems leads me
to think the problem is widespread. Anyone else notice this? If
it is widespread, I think we need to demand a fix as this already
has led to inaccurate deletions, settings, menu selections, etc.
for me.

If you have a MkII, please quickly test this by slowly scrolling
through a set of photos on the camera and see if it skips as I
described, and let us know. As it doesn't directly affect image
quality, it isn't hugely important, but it does have disastrous
possibilities (esp. when selecting critical functions like format,
delete, etc.)

-Ken
--
http://www.kennethturley.com
Click to expand...
--
Dayton in SC USA - PBase Supporter
http://www.pbase.com/daytontp/ -- More Than 161,740 Views
 
Are you sure they completly replaced the camera?
Ken T said:
Earlier I made two posts in reference to the first 1D MKII I
recieved two weeks ago. The major issue with that camera was
intermittent AF point dimming on two points and 2-3 stop
overexposure when those points were selected. A second problem
with the camera was less serious but annoying (although potentially
very serious): there were two points on the main command dial, 180
degrees from each other, where the dial would "double step". That
is, when scrolling through photos, it would skip a photo in the
sequence (from 17 to 19, for instance). It would do it while dial
Exp compensation, or during any function of the main dial, as long
as either one of the two points was being selected. I put a small
sticker on the dial to indicate where the points were, and
consistency was the rule.

After getting my second MkII, I quickly looked it over, and
thankfully there is not a problem with the exposure or AF points
(yet). But the second body has the exact same problem with the
main command dial. I hesitate to bother Calumet again (especially
since they have people waiting in line), but I want a product that
works right. Getting two cameras with identical problems leads me
to think the problem is widespread. Anyone else notice this? If
it is widespread, I think we need to demand a fix as this already
has led to inaccurate deletions, settings, menu selections, etc.
for me.

If you have a MkII, please quickly test this by slowly scrolling
through a set of photos on the camera and see if it skips as I
described, and let us know. As it doesn't directly affect image
quality, it isn't hugely important, but it does have disastrous
possibilities (esp. when selecting critical functions like format,
delete, etc.)

-Ken
--
http://www.kennethturley.com
Click to expand...
 
I have noticed the same thing, only when rotating anti-clockwise, and assumed it was because I was going a bit fast when trying to find a particular shot.

I thought it was meant to happen.
Ken T said:
Earlier I made two posts in reference to the first 1D MKII I
recieved two weeks ago. The major issue with that camera was
intermittent AF point dimming on two points and 2-3 stop
overexposure when those points were selected. A second problem
with the camera was less serious but annoying (although potentially
very serious): there were two points on the main command dial, 180
degrees from each other, where the dial would "double step". That
is, when scrolling through photos, it would skip a photo in the
sequence (from 17 to 19, for instance). It would do it while dial
Exp compensation, or during any function of the main dial, as long
as either one of the two points was being selected. I put a small
sticker on the dial to indicate where the points were, and
consistency was the rule.

After getting my second MkII, I quickly looked it over, and
thankfully there is not a problem with the exposure or AF points
(yet). But the second body has the exact same problem with the
main command dial. I hesitate to bother Calumet again (especially
since they have people waiting in line), but I want a product that
works right. Getting two cameras with identical problems leads me
to think the problem is widespread. Anyone else notice this? If
it is widespread, I think we need to demand a fix as this already
has led to inaccurate deletions, settings, menu selections, etc.
for me.

If you have a MkII, please quickly test this by slowly scrolling
through a set of photos on the camera and see if it skips as I
described, and let us know. As it doesn't directly affect image
quality, it isn't hugely important, but it does have disastrous
possibilities (esp. when selecting critical functions like format,
delete, etc.)

-Ken
--
http://www.kennethturley.com
Click to expand...
 
AllenGC said:
I have noticed the same thing, only when rotating anti-clockwise,
and assumed it was because I was going a bit fast when trying to
find a particular shot.

I thought it was meant to happen.
Click to expand...
Maybe it happened on my other 1D and 1Ds, and yes it is mainly counter-clockwise. But I test it and it occurs even when I go slow.

-Ken
 
AllenGC said:
I have noticed the same thing, only when rotating anti-clockwise,
and assumed it was because I was going a bit fast when trying to
find a particular shot.
Click to expand...
I have tested with two CF cards a Canon and a Transcend Ultra, that this issue absolutely does not occur with my camera either clockwise or anticlockwise.

I placed a stickem note sliver in the back diel as a register point. A worked out that there are 16 clic steps. I rotated clockwise twice to 32 click by clck, from the last frame of the CF card to #1-32.

The frame number and click number were in step, even when trwo or three clicks wewre done rapidly (one can recognise the cadence of two 3 or 4 clicks quite readily after practice, LOL!

Going bacwards antyiclockwise produced the same results and always ended on the same frame. 32 clicks bacwards ended up on the lasst frame of the CF card, 32 frames forward (ie clockwise) always yielded the 32cd frame.

The click number was absolutely indentical with the frame number.

I would have expected any multiple frame jumps per click to reveal an asynchrony between frame # and click#. That didn't occur.

Now the Canon CF cardwas merely a 32 MB card from way long ago for preliminary tests. The detailed testing was with the 1GB brand new Transcend card full of wedding pictures.

Now the next question is has it occurred in my experience shooting 9GB last week?

Well, it may have, but who knows? It was certainly not obvious. I will look out for it.

Sometimes, unless one is on the lookout, a rare phenomenon may go unnoticed.

did you use an old card or one formatted for another camera or formatted on your computer or portable hard drive image vault/flashtrax or what ever?

did you use a Hitachi drive filcvhed from a Muvo?

It could be something we all have but are not doing what you did to elicit it.

I will try more tests as you keep posting conditions you can elicit this phenomenon.

As far as the
AllenGC said:
AllenGC said:
intermittent AF point dimming on two points and 2-3 stop
overexposure when those points were selected.
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
problem, I have not yet doen enough work with this to give any feedback.

I will try to test this fully if someone else confirms this issue.

Keep posting,

Asher
 
Asher,

Thank you for testing! I am really weirded out about this. The problem occurs with both the 1GB IBM Microdrive and the Lexar 40x 1GB CF on both cameras.

It took me a week to notice, but now it is hard for me not to notice.

-Ken
med007 said:
Sometimes, unless one is on the lookout, a rare phenomenon may go
unnoticed.

did you use an old card or one formatted for another camera or
formatted on your computer or portable hard drive image
vault/flashtrax or what ever?

did you use a Hitachi drive filcvhed from a Muvo?
Click to expand...
 
Ken T said:
Asher,

Thank you for testing! I am really weirded out about this. The
problem occurs with both the 1GB IBM Microdrive and the Lexar 40x
1GB CF on both cameras.
Click to expand...
Hi Ken,

I feel for you! It's a bummer. My problem has been lack of focus in low light, but it is not repeatable---except after 2/3 of an event, LOL when you need high ISO. (look at the Robgalbraith forum for the discussion on this. Occurs with 70-200 2.8 esp but also with 17-35 L, and 300 2.8 and 70-200 in coastal scene towards rocks and water in daylight. )

I'll test my 4GB Hitachi Drive and Several .5 GB Lexar x40 cards shortly and post again.

Asher
 
a person said:
If you have a MkII, please quickly test this by slowly scrolling
through a set of photos on the camera and see if it skips as I
described, and let us know.
Click to expand...
Yes, as I wrote in one my earlier reviews of the Mark II in this forum, I have the exact same problem. The position where is happens is consistent.

Grtz,
Marco
 
that managers like to think are going to save the company. Most are equally ineffective.

Steven
med007 said:
Steven Noyes said:
I should suspect the same exact design unless they TQP'd/6
Sigmaed/5S'd the design somehow to make it "better"
Click to expand...
Hi Steve, is TQP'd/6 an acronym for scewed up? like ....cked up.

and what is Sigmaed/5S'd, 4gawsake!!!???

Asher
Click to expand...
--
---
New and Updated!!!
Spring 2004: http://www.pbase.com/snoyes/spring_2004
Mosaics: http://www.pbase.com/snoyes/high_res_mosaics
 
Marco Miltenburg said:
Marco Miltenburg said:
If you have a MkII, please quickly test this by slowly scrolling
through a set of photos on the camera and see if it skips as I
described, and let us know.
Click to expand...
Yes, as I wrote in one my earlier reviews of the Mark II in this
forum, I have the exact same problem. The position where is happens
is consistent.

Grtz,
Marco
Click to expand...
Thanks, Marco. I have another (third) MkII that is ready to come next week- but if I get the feeling that too many MkII's have the problem, it isn't worth the hassle of trying to find one that doesn't do it, especially if I might find one with a worse problem. But maybe I will switch anyways- it is just tough to have to be Canon's QC. Think I should go for the new one or just live with it? It is annoying, that is for sure.

-Ken
--
http://www.kennethturley.com
 
Ken,

I just tried this with a 4GB Hitachi and a 1GB IBM microdrive and neither of them exhibit any problems. However, going in reverse IS noticeably slower and more jerky than going forward. My suspicion is that the camera caches the images in advance and anticipates the user moving forward through the photos, not reverse.

It might not be a button problem, it might be a buffer problem. If you pause a few seconds prior to getting to the jump click, does it still do it?

Good luck,

Mark
Ken T said:
Earlier I made two posts in reference to the first 1D MKII I
recieved two weeks ago. The major issue with that camera was
intermittent AF point dimming on two points and 2-3 stop
overexposure when those points were selected. A second problem
with the camera was less serious but annoying (although potentially
very serious): there were two points on the main command dial, 180
degrees from each other, where the dial would "double step". That
is, when scrolling through photos, it would skip a photo in the
sequence (from 17 to 19, for instance). It would do it while dial
Exp compensation, or during any function of the main dial, as long
as either one of the two points was being selected. I put a small
sticker on the dial to indicate where the points were, and
consistency was the rule.

After getting my second MkII, I quickly looked it over, and
thankfully there is not a problem with the exposure or AF points
(yet). But the second body has the exact same problem with the
main command dial. I hesitate to bother Calumet again (especially
since they have people waiting in line), but I want a product that
works right. Getting two cameras with identical problems leads me
to think the problem is widespread. Anyone else notice this? If
it is widespread, I think we need to demand a fix as this already
has led to inaccurate deletions, settings, menu selections, etc.
for me.

If you have a MkII, please quickly test this by slowly scrolling
through a set of photos on the camera and see if it skips as I
described, and let us know. As it doesn't directly affect image
quality, it isn't hugely important, but it does have disastrous
possibilities (esp. when selecting critical functions like format,
delete, etc.)

-Ken
--
http://www.kennethturley.com
Click to expand...
--
Truly great madness cannot be achieved without significant intelligence.
Henrik Tikkanen
 
Ken T said:
Marco Miltenburg said:
a person said:
If you have a MkII, please quickly test this by slowly scrolling
through a set of photos on the camera and see if it skips as I
described, and let us know.
Click to expand...
Yes, as I wrote in one my earlier reviews of the Mark II in this
forum, I have the exact same problem. The position where is happens
is consistent.
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
Well, it does seem that more than a few bodies are involved.

Perhaps in one run because there is virtually no cvhance of getting two identical problems in this camera which is only uncommon to rare unless:

someone damaged a batch,

quality control lapsed for one batch

If this was a generalized but rare problem, then with maybe 10,000 or more cameras sold so far, the chances of two cameras afflicted falling to your lap are too low to matter.

TESTS:

I have tested my camera (from competitive Camera, 2/52 ago) with the following cards for a minimum of 64 steps backward and forward on

Sandisk Extreme 1GB (I thought it was Ultra 2 but was mistaken)

.5 GB 40X Lexar WA

4GB hitachi blue card, not filched from a Muvo, LOL!

All worked flawlessly, even at fast peeds bacwards or forwards at least 1, 2, 3, 4 or 16 steps forward or backward.

well that establishes that at least 1 solitary 1DII having gone through 10,000 shots, can work with the rear wheel to select pictures flawlessly with a full card!

Remember, this test was performed not in a busy shoot but at my desk.

I did notice that going very fast say 6 steps, the card may pause a 1/2 second for the buffer to catch up, it seems. However, beyond an occaisonal delay, no jumping of images.

Asher
 
Dr_ML said:
I just tried this with a 4GB Hitachi and a 1GB IBM microdrive and
neither of them exhibit any problems. However, going in reverse IS
noticeably slower and more jerky than going forward. My suspicion
is that the camera caches the images in advance and anticipates the
user moving forward through the photos, not reverse.

It might not be a button problem, it might be a buffer problem. If
you pause a few seconds prior to getting to the jump click, does it
still do it?

Good luck,

Mark
Ken T said:
Earlier I made two posts in reference to the first 1D MKII I
recieved two weeks ago. The major issue with that camera was
intermittent AF point dimming on two points and 2-3 stop
overexposure when those points were selected. A second problem
with the camera was less serious but annoying (although potentially
very serious): there were two points on the main command dial, 180
degrees from each other, where the dial would "double step". That
is, when scrolling through photos, it would skip a photo in the
sequence (from 17 to 19, for instance). It would do it while dial
Exp compensation, or during any function of the main dial, as long
as either one of the two points was being selected. I put a small
sticker on the dial to indicate where the points were, and
consistency was the rule.

After getting my second MkII, I quickly looked it over, and
thankfully there is not a problem with the exposure or AF points
(yet). But the second body has the exact same problem with the
main command dial. I hesitate to bother Calumet again (especially
since they have people waiting in line), but I want a product that
works right. Getting two cameras with identical problems leads me
to think the problem is widespread. Anyone else notice this? If
it is widespread, I think we need to demand a fix as this already
has led to inaccurate deletions, settings, menu selections, etc.
for me.

If you have a MkII, please quickly test this by slowly scrolling
through a set of photos on the camera and see if it skips as I
described, and let us know. As it doesn't directly affect image
quality, it isn't hugely important, but it does have disastrous
possibilities (esp. when selecting critical functions like format,
delete, etc.)

-Ken
--
http://www.kennethturley.com
Click to expand...
--
Truly great madness cannot be achieved without significant
intelligence.
Henrik Tikkanen
Click to expand...
 
Dr_ML said:
It might not be a button problem, it might be a buffer problem. If
you pause a few seconds prior to getting to the jump click, does it
still do it?
Click to expand...
Hi Dr_ML,

Thanks for the ideas. I do not believe it is a buffer problem. Several points support this: 1) the problem occurs at the exact same locations on the dial, 180 degrees from each other 2) the problem occurs not only during image playback, but also in menu selection, AF point selection, exposure compensation 3) the problem occurs regardless of speed at which the dial is moved. 4) the problem occurs with even 2 images on the card (you turn the dial and it comes back to the same image click after click like a dog chasing his tail). Pausing does NOT solve it.

-Ken

http://www.kennethturley.com
 
Ken, got it :) It sounds like you have very soundly troubleshot the issue. I would have to agree that it sounds like a bad switch to me too! It is very unfortunate that you managed to get two that have the same problem. I wonder how the serial numbers compare. There may be a batch of bad ones floating around.

Good luck!

Mark
Ken T said:
a person said:
It might not be a button problem, it might be a buffer problem. If
you pause a few seconds prior to getting to the jump click, does it
still do it?
Click to expand...
Hi Dr_ML,

Thanks for the ideas. I do not believe it is a buffer problem.
Several points support this: 1) the problem occurs at the exact
same locations on the dial, 180 degrees from each other 2) the
problem occurs not only during image playback, but also in menu
selection, AF point selection, exposure compensation 3) the problem
occurs regardless of speed at which the dial is moved. 4) the
problem occurs with even 2 images on the card (you turn the dial
and it comes back to the same image click after click like a dog
chasing his tail). Pausing does NOT solve it.

-Ken

http://www.kennethturley.com
Click to expand...
--
Truly great madness cannot be achieved without significant intelligence.
Henrik Tikkanen
 
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