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Did you see this about CD storage?

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What may be happening is that as newer CD ROM readers come out (using newer tech.), reading the older CDs becomes a problem. Who knows? I just haven't had any experiences that caused worry about this.
SteveDude said:
SteveDude said:
them in CD holders. I've never had one "go bad." I put this concern
low on my list. If someone does worry about it, why not make back
up copies of the CDs? Just my humble opinion...
Click to expand...
Or simply copy the backup's to newer CDs/dvds after a couple of
years. I think this issue is WAY blown out of proportion.

It's not like there is an "original" on the CD that can't be
copied. It's just a file. Copy from the HD or CDs once every
couple of years using the newer or more stable technologies.

--
http://www.pbase.com/stevegrillo , Equipment on profile page
Click to expand...
--
'I'm not sure I know all I understand about this.'
 
Is is designed for hard drive redundency. It will help you with a hard drive failure but will not backup anything. Delete, move or corrupt a file on a raid array and you have done the same thing on all the drives! Everything will be lost. Hardly a backup. A power supply failure, motherboard glitch and all is lost also. A backup solution needs to be a separate drive, CD, CVD, Tape etc. I've had entire arrays wiped out by a failing motherboard. You need a real backup.

Rich
DakDude said:
There are several RAID modes to be aware of:
  • Stripe (RAID 0): does not ensure data, instead increases speed
(you would not use this for sensitive data)
  • Mirror (RAID 1): each disk is an exact copy of the other. if one
disk dies, the other is intact.
  • Mirror + Stripe (RAID 0 + 1): requires 4 disks of equal size,
increases both speed and reliability.
  • RAID 3 or 5: the ulitmate solutions, but both require an extra
disk to store checksum data (much more costly). NOTE: With RAID 3
or 5, if any disk fails, you can replace it and not lose ANY data.
You see why this is the ultimate solution...

For pure backup purposes, the RAID 1 (mirror) is the least
expensive way to go. You get a complete backup of your whole hard
disk without having to remember to back it up yourself.

Promise Tech. makes excellent RAID controllers for PCs.
http://www.promise.com
  • Darren
Francesco said:
I have my pictures on two different HDD too. One is on my laptop
(that follows me everywhere) and one on my desktop.
I was wondering does anyone know what is the failure rate of HDDs
in average? And does any one use RAID as a solution?
--
Francesco Gallarotti
-----------------------------
http://www.gallarotti.net
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
 
I copy my critical files (including my photo collection)
on two systems, each of which has mirrored disks.
and I back up to tape. I'm using DLT IV, which
is uncompressesd 35GB/tape. I'm using used DLT
drives I bought off ebay for around $300 each, and
used (but excellent condition) DLT IV tapes. I copy
to multiple tapes.

I've also got a set of the type II (?) DVD-Rs (The kinds in
the cartridge). Tapes and DVDs both go into safety
depost box from time-to-time.

I'm looking for a good, used, card punch system... :-)

BTW, I use retrospect for my tape backup for Windows
2000/XP systems - I highly recommend it. Tar works just
fine on my linux system thank you very much.

-Bob
Francesco said:
CDR? it seems they don't last long enough...
DVDR? too many eggs in one basket?
HDD? too many disk failures can happen?
printing? not really the way I think is the better to archive things.
any one has experience with RAID?

--
Francesco Gallarotti
-----------------------------
http://www.gallarotti.net
Click to expand...
 
Juli Valley said:
Groan.

http://www.dpreview.com/news/0404/04042201cdrlifetime.asp
--
I keep trying to find an artist's eye in the B & H catalog.

http://www.pbase.com/julivalley/galleries
http://www.photosig.com/go/users/view?id=19579
Canon 1oD, Olympus C-3o4oZ.
Juli

Click to expand...
I had read about this earlier this year which is why I switched to Mitsui CDs which are supposed to be the most impervious to dye problems, etc. Unfortunately, the article didn't go into the media that is best/better--and there are big differences I found. So--I ordered these after doing a lot of research--even though they are more expensive.

some info on Mitsui
http://www.mam-a.com/products/gold/archive.html
http://www.cascademedia.net/mitsuifaq.html

Diane
--
Diane B
black and white lover, but color is seducing me
http://www.pbase.com/picnic/galleries
 
Delete a file and its gone off the RAID, Raid with a tape drive is backup.

We have to retain data for life (or atleast until the state changes its mind) where I work and its done via tape (Super DLT Drives). RAID on the drives backed up to tape every night. They do make tape drives for home users which would work fine. For home use I would use something like tape and DVD... seperate them and in 5 years back them all up to what ever is new at the time. Keep moving the data forward and you shouldnt have a problem.
DakDude said:
There are several RAID modes to be aware of:
  • Stripe (RAID 0): does not ensure data, instead increases speed
(you would not use this for sensitive data)
  • Mirror (RAID 1): each disk is an exact copy of the other. if one
disk dies, the other is intact.
  • Mirror + Stripe (RAID 0 + 1): requires 4 disks of equal size,
increases both speed and reliability.
  • RAID 3 or 5: the ulitmate solutions, but both require an extra
disk to store checksum data (much more costly). NOTE: With RAID 3
or 5, if any disk fails, you can replace it and not lose ANY data.
You see why this is the ultimate solution...

For pure backup purposes, the RAID 1 (mirror) is the least
expensive way to go. You get a complete backup of your whole hard
disk without having to remember to back it up yourself.

Promise Tech. makes excellent RAID controllers for PCs.
http://www.promise.com
  • Darren
Francesco said:
I have my pictures on two different HDD too. One is on my laptop
(that follows me everywhere) and one on my desktop.
I was wondering does anyone know what is the failure rate of HDDs
in average? And does any one use RAID as a solution?
--
Francesco Gallarotti
-----------------------------
http://www.gallarotti.net
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
 
Jamie H. said:
Once DVD burners come down a little bit more, I'm going to get one
and burn everything I have to DVD-R and put them in a safe
location. For now, multiple hard drives suits me fine.
Click to expand...
But don't forget that DVD-R will have the same shortcomings as CD-R in terms of lifespan. In fact, I think most of the manufacturers rate the DVD-R life as shorter than CD-R.

Personally, I've got three copies of my most pics -- main computer, hard-drive backup (external FW drive), and DVD-R backups. I view the FW drive and the most reliable of backups.
 
Which is why the DVD-Rs would be replaced every 6 months to a year. I believe I said that in my original post. :)
glennp said:
Jamie H. said:
Once DVD burners come down a little bit more, I'm going to get one
and burn everything I have to DVD-R and put them in a safe
location. For now, multiple hard drives suits me fine.
Click to expand...
But don't forget that DVD-R will have the same shortcomings as CD-R
in terms of lifespan. In fact, I think most of the manufacturers
rate the DVD-R life as shorter than CD-R.

Personally, I've got three copies of my most pics -- main computer,
hard-drive backup (external FW drive), and DVD-R backups. I view
the FW drive and the most reliable of backups.
Click to expand...
--
GA Tech Sports action:
http://d33pblue.net/gallery/index.php?cat=10
 
danh said:
RAID can be an excellent solution for reliability, but will be very
expensive for long term archival. They are not perfect either.
Personally I would feel more comfortable burning to high quality
CD's (multiple copies) and making new copies every so often.
Click to expand...
Actually, some friends of mine were looking into archiving a multi-terrabyte digital video repository. It turns out that for archiving something that large, RAID is actually cheaper than tape. The high-capacity tape drives and tapes exceed the cost of a RAID made from low-cost hard drives (you don't need speed, and a single failure is easily replaced, so low-cost drives are ok). DVD would be cheaper, but it has reliability issues.
danh said:
If something happens and you lose the RAID, you just lost it all.
Click to expand...
That's true of tape and CD too. Something catastrophic enough to take out the entire RAID, like a fire, is fatal to CDs and tapes as well. Yeah, you could keep extra copies offsite, but then you've just doubled the cost and time of your archive.
 
Are you sure in newer CDs/disk. I started to use CDR for storage more 5 years ago and had no problem with CD except damages, scratches and etc. I bought at that time best and expensive TDK, Philips sources. But now I am not sure in media, because the price tell nothing :-(. Why?

Do you remember 3.5" floppy disk? They were not bad when they have been just released instead of 5" floppy disk. But last time, the price has been dropped in competition with CD , and I had big troubles with floppy disks quality. I was forced to use 2-3 copies when I drove anywere. I trew bad disks away every day.... I tryed to buy cheapest and most expensive disks with the same result :-(.
I am afraid of newer CDR, like 3.5" floppy disks 5 years ago.
SteveDude said:
SteveDude said:
them in CD holders. I've never had one "go bad." I put this concern
low on my list. If someone does worry about it, why not make back
up copies of the CDs? Just my humble opinion...
Click to expand...
Or simply copy the backup's to newer CDs/dvds after a couple of
years. I think this issue is WAY blown out of proportion.

It's not like there is an "original" on the CD that can't be
copied. It's just a file. Copy from the HD or CDs once every
couple of years using the newer or more stable technologies.

--
http://www.pbase.com/stevegrillo , Equipment on profile page
Click to expand...
 
I use multiple hard drives as a backup store, supplemented by CD-R as well. The claim that CD-Rs only last two years is absolutely stupid ... I have CD-Rs made a decade ago or more that are 100% perfectly usable today. I also have a set of CDR-MP3 CDs that I made a year ago and have been rattling about in my car ever since, all are working perfectly despite miserable storage conditions.

So don't worry too much. Take reasonable precautions, make MULTIPLE backups of important data (it's cheap and easy) and relax.

Godfrey
Juli Valley said:
Groan.

http://www.dpreview.com/news/0404/04042201cdrlifetime.asp
--
I keep trying to find an artist's eye in the B & H catalog.

http://www.pbase.com/julivalley/galleries
http://www.photosig.com/go/users/view?id=19579
Canon 1oD, Olympus C-3o4oZ.
Juli

Click to expand...
 
Hi Juli,

I think diversification is the key, I have several computers and they all have our photography base on them. I ensure the disks are different makes purchased at different times and I have a USB2 / Firewire external disk I use for Backup of this and other information.

Normally disks fail infrequently, in my experience either in the first month of usage or after 2-5 years of usage. But in several cases I have seen similair disks fail one after the other hence my liking for purchasing various brands and using several computers.

My 2 Pennies worth.
Sven
--

The good news: Computers allow us to work 100% faster. The bad news: They generate 300% more work.
 
I save to DLT tape for long term archival storage and DVD for near term access. You can pick up an external 20/40gb unit pretty cheap on ebay.

I have many DVD's and CD's that have been kept in a CD folder in a drawer not exposed to sunlight and there are many that have pits and other anomolies in them. I would not trust a CD or DVD for long term storage.

dlesko
Francesco said:
CDR? it seems they don't last long enough...
DVDR? too many eggs in one basket?
HDD? too many disk failures can happen?
printing? not really the way I think is the better to archive things.
any one has experience with RAID?

--
Francesco Gallarotti
-----------------------------
http://www.gallarotti.net
Click to expand...
 
Diane B said:
Juli Valley said:
Groan.

http://www.dpreview.com/news/0404/04042201cdrlifetime.asp
--
I keep trying to find an artist's eye in the B & H catalog.

http://www.pbase.com/julivalley/galleries
http://www.photosig.com/go/users/view?id=19579
Canon 1oD, Olympus C-3o4oZ.
Juli

Click to expand...
I had read about this earlier this year which is why I switched to
Mitsui CDs which are supposed to be the most impervious to dye
problems, etc. Unfortunately, the article didn't go into the media
that is best/better--and there are big differences I found. So--I
ordered these after doing a lot of research--even though they are
more expensive.

some info on Mitsui
http://www.mam-a.com/products/gold/archive.html
http://www.cascademedia.net/mitsuifaq.html

Diane
--
Diane B
black and white lover, but color is seducing me
http://www.pbase.com/picnic/galleries
Click to expand...
--
Steve
 
Blu Ray, a year or less away...27 gigs per disk...t
SvenJ said:
Hi Juli,

I think diversification is the key, I have several computers and
they all have our photography base on them. I ensure the disks are
different makes purchased at different times and I have a USB2 /
Firewire external disk I use for Backup of this and other
information.

Normally disks fail infrequently, in my experience either in the
first month of usage or after 2-5 years of usage. But in several
cases I have seen similair disks fail one after the other hence my
liking for purchasing various brands and using several computers.

My 2 Pennies worth.
Sven
--
The good news: Computers allow us to work 100% faster. The bad
news: They generate 300% more work.
Click to expand...
--
Click below for my website:
http://www.glorifychrist.com/
 
Just keep shooting to replace the ones that become corrupt. Chances are your skills will be better the next time, I know mine could sure some improvement.

What about shots of the kids growing up you say? Easy answer, either have some more kids or borrow a few, they all pretty much look the same when they're young anyway.

But my the marriage of my _ _ _ _ (son/daughter/niece/friend/whatever), how will I record these precious memories you ask? Easy, your (above) will probably get divorced soon and you can “capture the moment” all over again. You can't keep the earlier shots then anyway, why waste disk space.

And what about my cat Fluffy? Another easy answer, we have seen enough cat shots, its time for a new pet, maybe a tarantula with incredibly fine hair that can be shot with more megapixels, a better flash, a sharper lens, a…..

It’s been a long week, have a great weekend everyone.

--
Doug
http://pbase.com/dougj
 
I professionally use CD-RW as a backup medium. With a lifespan of min 100years i'll be fine I guess.

However, I have about 700 CD-R and 70 DVD-R, and only 1 became unreadable after 3 years, but if you want to CD-RW or DVD RW.
Francesco said:
CDR? it seems they don't last long enough...
DVDR? too many eggs in one basket?
HDD? too many disk failures can happen?
printing? not really the way I think is the better to archive things.
any one has experience with RAID?

--
Francesco Gallarotti
-----------------------------
http://www.gallarotti.net
Click to expand...
--
Happy shooting!
http://www.pbase.com/zorro44/
 
as it only served to scare, and as typical of many sloppy journalists today there were no alternative facts laid out just antidoctal stories of early failures of a few isolated Cd-r's by some folks who profit from failed CD's. I am not saying it's true or not true, but based on that horribly written scare piece I am no closer to 'the truth'.
Just my opinion,
Michael
Juli Valley said:
Groan.

http://www.dpreview.com/news/0404/04042201cdrlifetime.asp
--
I keep trying to find an artist's eye in the B & H catalog.

http://www.pbase.com/julivalley/galleries
http://www.photosig.com/go/users/view?id=19579
Canon 1oD, Olympus C-3o4oZ.
Juli

Click to expand...
 
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