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828 (not) hitting the shelfs

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That local camera store will not stay long in business.
This "statement"proves they are not very knowlegable......
Which camera do you own and what do you think of it?

Rob
BigMouth said:
Ok folks,

Just got a mail from a good friend, he went to his friendly local
camera store to check out the 828 and they told him that they
refuse to sell it. After their in-house tests they came to the
conclusion that the quality is just terrible.
Click to expand...
 
If you think I am trolling, ask Shutter or Uly. They both know me; Uly from the forum a bit and Shutter otherwise.
BigMouth said:
Ok folks,

Just got a mail from a good friend, he went to his friendly local
camera store to check out the 828 and they told him that they
refuse to sell it. After their in-house tests they came to the
conclusion that the quality is just terrible.
Click to expand...
--
Laurence

There is a tide in the affairs of men,
Which, taken at the flood, leads on to fortune;
Omitted, all the voyage of their life
Is bound in shallows and in miseries.

Laurence

http://www.pbase.com/lmatson/root
http://www.pbase.com/sigmasd9/root
http://www.pbase.com/cameras/sigma/sd10
http://www.pbase.com/cameras/sigma/sd9
http://www.beachbriss.com (eternal test site)
 
I know Laurence...

I, without a doubt, take his experience as the 100% truth.

Given the reported and experiential problems with the camera, it is not an implausible scenario.

Jim
auh2o said:
If you refuse to name the shop or person then I refuse to take your
comments seriously. If you are going to make such accusations,
then it is indeed material to the discussion.

I have a friend - that owns a camera shop - that refuses to sell
Sigma SLR’s - because of all the quality issues with them…… that
statement is as absurd as this thread and your reply are.
Laurence Matson said:
BigMouth picked this up from a chat session.

The shop is the largest in St.Gallen, Switzerland. I asked about
the 828 when I was there today, and the head of the camera
department told me that he had one. I asked him if I could try it.
He said sure, but he is not going to sell it to anyone and will not
be ordering any more.

He then took me over to his computer, where he and I have discussed
many other cameras and images, and he showed me his samples. He was
appalled, and frankly I was stunned. He had a set of his own
samples at all focal lengths and all had incredible amounts of PF
and CA.

We discussed whether we could get decent images out of his Epson
2100 but after calculating realized that would not wash. We also
discussed theoretical sources (blue channel) and possible solutions
(a blue channel resize algorithm scaled to the focal length of the
lens).

He is a regular dpreview reader and had Phil's samples there to
underscore his results. He will read this tomorrow, I'm sure.

As you can see from my profile, I use another camera. However, I am
not uninterested in any technology and still own a 707, although it
is on loan to a friend in China as a backup.

If you doubt my credibility, fine. Others who know me could vouch
for me. I am obviously not going to name the name of that head or
the specific shop, since it is not material to the discussion.

--
Laurence

There is a tide in the affairs of men,
Which, taken at the flood, leads on to fortune;
Omitted, all the voyage of their life
Is bound in shallows and in miseries.

http://www.pbase.com/lmatson/root
http://www.pbase.com/sigmasd9/root
http://www.pbase.com/cameras/sigma/sd10
http://www.pbase.com/cameras/sigma/sd9
http://www.beachbriss.com (eternal test site)
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
--
Jim Fuglestad
http://www.pbase.com/jfuglestad/366
  • You're not in third grade anymore. Take as many recesses as you want!
  • Why simply live and let live? Live and help live.
http://www.pbase.com/jfuglestad/galleries
 
They have been in business for 50 years and have done so by sticking to their principles.
Rob Vermaas said:
Rob
BigMouth said:
Ok folks,

Just got a mail from a good friend, he went to his friendly local
camera store to check out the 828 and they told him that they
refuse to sell it. After their in-house tests they came to the
conclusion that the quality is just terrible.
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
--
Laurence

There is a tide in the affairs of men,
Which, taken at the flood, leads on to fortune;
Omitted, all the voyage of their life
Is bound in shallows and in miseries.

Laurence

http://www.pbase.com/lmatson/root
http://www.pbase.com/sigmasd9/root
http://www.pbase.com/cameras/sigma/sd10
http://www.pbase.com/cameras/sigma/sd9
http://www.beachbriss.com (eternal test site)
 
I just got my catalogs from B n H and i dont see the 828 anywhere in them
they have everything else but no 828??????
Laurence Matson said:
auh2o said:
BigMouth said:
Ok folks,

Just got a mail from a good friend, he went to his friendly local
camera store to check out the 828 and they told him that they
refuse to sell it. After their in-house tests they came to the
conclusion that the quality is just terrible.
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
--
Laurence

There is a tide in the affairs of men,
Which, taken at the flood, leads on to fortune;
Omitted, all the voyage of their life
Is bound in shallows and in miseries.

Laurence

http://www.pbase.com/lmatson/root
http://www.pbase.com/sigmasd9/root
http://www.pbase.com/cameras/sigma/sd10
http://www.pbase.com/cameras/sigma/sd9
http://www.beachbriss.com (eternal test site)
Click to expand...
 
printing cycle. look on-line.
alonewolf85 said:
Laurence Matson said:
auh2o said:
BigMouth said:
Ok folks,

Just got a mail from a good friend, he went to his friendly local
camera store to check out the 828 and they told him that they
refuse to sell it. After their in-house tests they came to the
conclusion that the quality is just terrible.
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
--
Laurence

There is a tide in the affairs of men,
Which, taken at the flood, leads on to fortune;
Omitted, all the voyage of their life
Is bound in shallows and in miseries.

Laurence

http://www.pbase.com/lmatson/root
http://www.pbase.com/sigmasd9/root
http://www.pbase.com/cameras/sigma/sd10
http://www.pbase.com/cameras/sigma/sd9
http://www.beachbriss.com (eternal test site)
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
--
Laurence

There is a tide in the affairs of men,
Which, taken at the flood, leads on to fortune;
Omitted, all the voyage of their life
Is bound in shallows and in miseries.

Laurence

http://www.pbase.com/lmatson/root
http://www.pbase.com/sigmasd9/root
http://www.pbase.com/cameras/sigma/sd10
http://www.pbase.com/cameras/sigma/sd9
http://www.beachbriss.com (eternal test site)
 
If you post positives about Sony, they would praise you to death, if you post negatives, they'd call you a troll. Sony is a religion ya know...
Laurence Matson said:
BigMouth said:
Ok folks,

Just got a mail from a good friend, he went to his friendly local
camera store to check out the 828 and they told him that they
refuse to sell it. After their in-house tests they came to the
conclusion that the quality is just terrible.
Click to expand...
--
Laurence

There is a tide in the affairs of men,
Which, taken at the flood, leads on to fortune;
Omitted, all the voyage of their life
Is bound in shallows and in miseries.

Laurence

http://www.pbase.com/lmatson/root
http://www.pbase.com/sigmasd9/root
http://www.pbase.com/cameras/sigma/sd10
http://www.pbase.com/cameras/sigma/sd9
http://www.beachbriss.com (eternal test site)
Click to expand...
--
http://lpta.home.comcast.net
 
When I said anonymous, I certainly did not mean you, I'm talking about the source you are releuctant to cite. Some unnamed manager/salesperson at some undisclosed store. Anyway, this is statistically insignificant. If this was a story of several stores doing this then maybe it would be important.
Laurence Matson said:
I am hardly anonymous. If someone from Sony wants to discuss this
with that shop, they will know how to find him. It is a small city.
However, I am not about to put that out without first clearing it
with him.

The point is that his images clearly showed problems that could not
be cleared up with some sort of action. They were also not taken to
show how bad the camera is; he takes the same set from in front of
the shop and has done for ages.

Also, this is not the first difficult camera we have discussed. He
responded the same way when the 14n was giving him grief. We spent
a long time on that and it was information from the Kodak thread
that helped get it back on track. He hesitated with the 10D for
some reason (duh). He takes this approach because it is the
interest of his customers. You don't stay in business that long by
just selling whatever you can get out the door.

--
Laurence

There is a tide in the affairs of men,
Which, taken at the flood, leads on to fortune;
Omitted, all the voyage of their life
Is bound in shallows and in miseries.

Laurence

http://www.pbase.com/lmatson/root
http://www.pbase.com/sigmasd9/root
http://www.pbase.com/cameras/sigma/sd10
http://www.pbase.com/cameras/sigma/sd9
http://www.beachbriss.com (eternal test site)
Click to expand...
 
Laurence Matson said:
I am hardly anonymous. If someone from Sony wants to discuss this
with that shop, they will know how to find him. It is a small city.
However, I am not about to put that out without first clearing it
with him.

The point is that his images clearly showed problems that could not
be cleared up with some sort of action. They were also not taken to
show how bad the camera is; he takes the same set from in front of
the shop and has done for ages.

Also, this is not the first difficult camera we have discussed. He
responded the same way when the 14n was giving him grief. We spent
a long time on that and it was information from the Kodak thread
that helped get it back on track. He hesitated with the 10D for
some reason (duh). He takes this approach because it is the
interest of his customers. You don't stay in business that long by
just selling whatever you can get out the door.

--
Laurence

There is a tide in the affairs of men,
Which, taken at the flood, leads on to fortune;
Omitted, all the voyage of their life
Is bound in shallows and in miseries.

Laurence
Click to expand...
Erm i dont doubt you for a second, and i seriously dont understand whats all the fuzz is about ? a shop wont retail the sony f828 ? so what ? did i miss something ?.

I mean nothing new here everyone knows what the f828 is capable of and what not. and the fact that ur local photo retailer thinks it's not worth selling aint the same as it aint worth buying :-) just a thought.

oh btw sony's biggest retailer aint the local photo store down the block, so im sure they will survive :-)

Regards
Paul L.

--
Just ordered a Sony DSC-F828
 
I too, can attest to the fact that you are not now, or have even been, a troll.

Please forgive my over-zealous brethern. I don't see why this is such a big deal, either way. If a shop decides not to sell something. That's their choice. What difference does it make, why they decided not to sell it?

Lot's of people still adhere to that "the only good digitals, are the ones made by camera companies" adage. So what? Does their thinking effect the quality of the images we get with our Sony's?

To the rest of the forum,

Laurence knows what he's talking about. He spends most of his forum time defending a camera(s) that most Dslr elitists, keep bashing. Does he still use this camera to capture outstanding shots? You better believe it.

He doesn't care what others say about his photographic tool, of choice. Neither should we :-)

Just my opinion,
Steve
H4ng0ver said:
Laurence Matson said:
BigMouth said:
Ok folks,

Just got a mail from a good friend, he went to his friendly local
camera store to check out the 828 and they told him that they
refuse to sell it. After their in-house tests they came to the
conclusion that the quality is just terrible.
Click to expand...
--
Laurence

There is a tide in the affairs of men,
Which, taken at the flood, leads on to fortune;
Omitted, all the voyage of their life
Is bound in shallows and in miseries.

Laurence

http://www.pbase.com/lmatson/root
http://www.pbase.com/sigmasd9/root
http://www.pbase.com/cameras/sigma/sd10
http://www.pbase.com/cameras/sigma/sd9
http://www.beachbriss.com (eternal test site)
Click to expand...
--
http://lpta.home.comcast.net
Click to expand...
--
http://www.pbase.com/slo2k
'The question is not what you look at, but what you see' - Thoreau
 
As near as I can tell, the troll comments were not addressed to Laurence, but to Big Mouth
Mel
Steve Cavigliano said:
Please forgive my over-zealous brethern. I don't see why this is
such a big deal, either way. If a shop decides not to sell
something. That's their choice. What difference does it make, why
they decided not to sell it?

Lot's of people still adhere to that "the only good digitals, are
the ones made by camera companies" adage. So what? Does their
thinking effect the quality of the images we get with our Sony's?

To the rest of the forum,
Laurence knows what he's talking about. He spends most of his
forum time defending a camera(s) that most Dslr elitists, keep
bashing. Does he still use this camera to capture outstanding
shots? You better believe it.

He doesn't care what others say about his photographic tool, of
choice. Neither should we :-)

Just my opinion,
Steve
H4ng0ver said:
Laurence Matson said:
BigMouth said:
Ok folks,

Just got a mail from a good friend, he went to his friendly local
camera store to check out the 828 and they told him that they
refuse to sell it. After their in-house tests they came to the
conclusion that the quality is just terrible.
Click to expand...
--
Laurence

There is a tide in the affairs of men,
Which, taken at the flood, leads on to fortune;
Omitted, all the voyage of their life
Is bound in shallows and in miseries.

Laurence

http://www.pbase.com/lmatson/root
http://www.pbase.com/sigmasd9/root
http://www.pbase.com/cameras/sigma/sd10
http://www.pbase.com/cameras/sigma/sd9
http://www.beachbriss.com (eternal test site)
Click to expand...
--
http://lpta.home.comcast.net
Click to expand...
--
http://www.pbase.com/slo2k
'The question is not what you look at, but what you see' - Thoreau
Click to expand...
--
Digital Fan F Seven One Seven, Vee One, F Eight Two Eight(soon)
 
My reply was adressed to Bigmouth.
Still think his initial post contributes nothing to STF.
regards,

Rob
Laurence Matson said:
Rob Vermaas said:
Rob
BigMouth said:
Ok folks,

Just got a mail from a good friend, he went to his friendly local
camera store to check out the 828 and they told him that they
refuse to sell it. After their in-house tests they came to the
conclusion that the quality is just terrible.
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
--
Laurence

There is a tide in the affairs of men,
Which, taken at the flood, leads on to fortune;
Omitted, all the voyage of their life
Is bound in shallows and in miseries.

Laurence

http://www.pbase.com/lmatson/root
http://www.pbase.com/sigmasd9/root
http://www.pbase.com/cameras/sigma/sd10
http://www.pbase.com/cameras/sigma/sd9
http://www.beachbriss.com (eternal test site)
Click to expand...
 
Steve Cavigliano said:
Please forgive my over-zealous brethern. I don't see why this is
such a big deal, either way. If a shop decides not to sell
something. That's their choice. What difference does it make, why
they decided not to sell it?

Lot's of people still adhere to that "the only good digitals, are
the ones made by camera companies" adage. So what? Does their
thinking effect the quality of the images we get with our Sony's?

To the rest of the forum,
Laurence knows what he's talking about. He spends most of his
forum time defending a camera(s) that most Dslr elitists, keep
bashing. Does he still use this camera to capture outstanding
shots? You better believe it.

He doesn't care what others say about his photographic tool, of
choice. Neither should we :-)

Just my opinion,
Steve
H4ng0ver said:
Laurence Matson said:
BigMouth said:
Ok folks,

Just got a mail from a good friend, he went to his friendly local
camera store to check out the 828 and they told him that they
refuse to sell it. After their in-house tests they came to the
conclusion that the quality is just terrible.
Click to expand...
--
Laurence

There is a tide in the affairs of men,
Which, taken at the flood, leads on to fortune;
Omitted, all the voyage of their life
Is bound in shallows and in miseries.

Laurence

http://www.pbase.com/lmatson/root
http://www.pbase.com/sigmasd9/root
http://www.pbase.com/cameras/sigma/sd10
http://www.pbase.com/cameras/sigma/sd9
http://www.beachbriss.com (eternal test site)
Click to expand...
--
http://lpta.home.comcast.net
Click to expand...
--
http://www.pbase.com/slo2k
'The question is not what you look at, but what you see' - Thoreau
Click to expand...
...I disagree with lawrence, but he is a straight arrow, and would never make anything like this up.

He didn't particularly lay any significance on the incident, he is just reporting what happened. How you assess it is up to you, but he is just saying what happened.
And I'm speaking as the owner of a 10D which Lawrence just dissed!

Maybe the shop just got a bad copy - there does seem to be variability, both in 10D focussing and 828 CA/PF!
--
Regards,
DaveMart
Please see profile for equipment
 
I see you guys have fun.

I already feel sorry for the trouble Laurence now has because he thought he had to defend what he told me.

If such a shop is not going to sell the 828 this has a certain message. And you can't get around acknowledging that by saying that they should sell used cars or are full of sh*t. Making comments like this is the real trolling.

The comments about Sony in general being cr@p or not, or asking me which Camera I own and what I think about it turns this into a rather ridiculous debatte. It just does not matter for this topic.

Anyway here is my POV concerning the 828 and Sony.

I know that the 707 and 717 are good Cameras and I know that Sony Camcorders are good (although I went for a different Brand). I even recommended the 717 a few times when people asked me which Camera to buy because it is a good Camera.

This 828 is not what it should be, the marketing noise around the 8 Megapixel and the "real color*" as well as the really good 717 / 717 set expectations high and now even basic problems are not solved.

If you guys have nothing better to do than to jump on anybody who speaks truth about the 828 I wish you good luck. My Language and style certainly is provoking but I am by no means a troll.

I know quite a few owners of digital Cameras and some with either a 717 or 707 and they are mostly unimpressed (to say it mildly) or current laugh their ass off about the 828 and its die hard defenders.

Rember the guy who posted a picture full of purple fringe and claimed that there is none? I had lots of fun with some other people on IRC because of that...

*
Btw.:

I never got the impression that real color was of any importance for any manufacturer neither concerning digital nor film. And Sony is no exception, actually they were pretty high on my list of "not real but pleasing" colors.

If you have a look on succesfull films it was not different in the old film days.
 
BigMouth said:
I see you guys have fun.
I already feel sorry for the trouble Laurence now has because he
thought he had to defend what he told me.

If such a shop is not going to sell the 828 this has a certain
message. And you can't get around acknowledging that by saying that
they should sell used cars or are full of sh*t. Making comments
like this is the real trolling.

The comments about Sony in general being cr@p or not, or asking me
which Camera I own and what I think about it turns this into a
rather ridiculous debatte. It just does not matter for this topic.

Anyway here is my POV concerning the 828 and Sony.

I know that the 707 and 717 are good Cameras and I know that Sony
Camcorders are good (although I went for a different Brand). I even
recommended the 717 a few times when people asked me which Camera
to buy because it is a good Camera.

This 828 is not what it should be, the marketing noise around the 8
Megapixel and the "real color*" as well as the really good 717 /
717 set expectations high and now even basic problems are not
solved.

If you guys have nothing better to do than to jump on anybody who
speaks truth about the 828 I wish you good luck. My Language and
style certainly is provoking but I am by no means a troll.

I know quite a few owners of digital Cameras and some with either a
717 or 707 and they are mostly unimpressed (to say it mildly) or
current laugh their ass off about the 828 and its die hard
defenders.

Rember the guy who posted a picture full of purple fringe and
claimed that there is none? I had lots of fun with some other
people on IRC because of that...

*
Btw.:

I never got the impression that real color was of any importance
for any manufacturer neither concerning digital nor film. And Sony
is no exception, actually they were pretty high on my list of "not
real but pleasing" colors.

If you have a look on succesfull films it was not different in the
old film days.
Click to expand...
So thats what u wanted to say in the first place ? LOL why didnt u, feel better getting that off ur chest ? :-)

let's move on, next!!! :-)

Regards
Paul L.
--

 
Well your reply contributed even less.

What I posted is insignificant for sales figures and I never said it would have any effect on them.

It will have not much of a bad effect on the sales of that store, I am sure about that.

But there is a message behind this, shops like the one mentioned see a lot of Cameras comming and going and opposed to mail order shops and certain big chains they have staff that knows enough to get a good impression of the Cameras, they try them, get feedback from buyers and can compare to many Cameras because, as I said, they have seen plenty.

(Warning the following is my interpretation)

If guys like that decide better not to offer a Camera because they fear that the buyers will throw them back at them there something has to be really wrong.
 
Its a brand new catalog,just came out. I know they sell it but they have not advertised it? strange
Laurence Matson said:
alonewolf85 said:
Laurence Matson said:
auh2o said:
BigMouth said:
Ok folks,

Just got a mail from a good friend, he went to his friendly local
camera store to check out the 828 and they told him that they
refuse to sell it. After their in-house tests they came to the
conclusion that the quality is just terrible.
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
--
Laurence

There is a tide in the affairs of men,
Which, taken at the flood, leads on to fortune;
Omitted, all the voyage of their life
Is bound in shallows and in miseries.

Laurence

http://www.pbase.com/lmatson/root
http://www.pbase.com/sigmasd9/root
http://www.pbase.com/cameras/sigma/sd10
http://www.pbase.com/cameras/sigma/sd9
http://www.beachbriss.com (eternal test site)
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
--
Laurence

There is a tide in the affairs of men,
Which, taken at the flood, leads on to fortune;
Omitted, all the voyage of their life
Is bound in shallows and in miseries.

Laurence

http://www.pbase.com/lmatson/root
http://www.pbase.com/sigmasd9/root
http://www.pbase.com/cameras/sigma/sd10
http://www.pbase.com/cameras/sigma/sd9
http://www.beachbriss.com (eternal test site)
Click to expand...
 
BigMouth said:
Ok folks,

Just got a mail from a good friend, he went to his friendly local
camera store to check out the 828 and they told him that they
refuse to sell it. After their in-house tests they came to the
conclusion that the quality is just terrible.
Click to expand...
Check the posting history.
One guy been registered for 2 days, no e-mail address.
Another for 1 day
I think this must be the school holidays
--
Regards,
DaveMart
Please see profile for equipment
 
No, just write the F828 off, - it's a very poorly performing camera, - unless you appreciate record levels of noise and CA/PF!

I admit that it look's and feel very cool, so if it is a high tech'ish toy you want and do not really care about image quality, F828 is just the cam for you!
 
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