Printer for high volume A4

Fishman Dan

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After 18 months printing volume on an Epson P906, I can safely say there is an enormous gulf in cost when it comes to high volume A4 printers.

My previous fortnight was printing 400-500 team photos, and I have carnivals booked between now and the New Year, with a potential for Santa photos.

I can't fault the price and quality of the P906, but at 2-3 minutes per print it's not quick (after all, it's a fine art printer). It cost me around $1500 with the cashback (still available) so for the money, it's a great printer.

However I really want speed, and I can potentially outsource my A3 needs. The next step with Epson (at least here in Australia) is the SureLab D1060 - a dry lab printer, 720x1440 res which costs around $8k before add-ons like additional warranty and the duplexer. The local camera store runs 2 of these ... I'm not really in that market.

Per print it is around half the P906. The supplier suggested buying another P906 instead ... and to be honest, it's not such a silly idea.

Can anyone suggest a brand or competitor printer that matches quality, fast-A4 needs?
 
Have a look at https://www.theprintspace.co.uk/ and google for an equivalent service in Australia. Commercial printers will beat a wall of P900s every time when it comes to speed or volume at scale.
The trick here is keeping things in house for a few reasons, mainly speed back to the visitors and also having the ownership of the final product.

I'm also in a rural area in Australia so delivery times are usually +1 or 2 days from advertised. Another thing that just popped into my head is that print services around Christmas are so busy their delivery times can blow out.

My volume is only going to increase over time if things continue to expand as they are, my issue is - have they expanded to a $9k+ solution yet.
 
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Good fortune with the project. As you know, the real key is the rapport with families and producing a photo that is memorable, even in this type of milieu. And it can lead to other work if you expand your services in the future.

Always impressed with someone who can make earnings from photography or art!
 
Always impressed with someone who can make earnings from photography or art!
I've always maintained that the tide will turn, and that people will pay for services.

I have a few staples for large media businesses, and picked up the odd good paying video job. Now local sports associations are finding me and replacing the "Parent with a good camera" for someone who knows how/what to shoot.

In this case, I realised sports clubs were not doing any decent memorabilia any longer, so I knew as long as I have the product and the opportunity (I'm fairly confident with the rapport side) that what I am doing would be popular.

Today I received the EOI for the Santa photos job referred to in this thread. I have a great 2 year record with the Santa photo setup, so hoping it comes my way again. It's more than just lighting, shooting and printing though, it's owning and using a booking system that can drive the whole process (I use Pixieset with some customisations).
 
I wonder if a Dye Sub printer is best suited to your needs?

Such as...

https://www.photomart.co.uk/dnp-ds820-8-inch-roll-fed-dye-sublimation-photo-printer.html

Not A4 (8.3 x 11.7 inches) but 8 x 12 inch prints with a print every 33.9 seconds, according to the specs on that website.
Thanks I'll take a look.

I think one of the themes here is that 8x12 is dead, and A4 is the new standard. Or according to my grumpy commercial printer, that has been the case for a while.
As mentioned in my amended post, A4 is accommodated by that dye sub printer. So, potentially a relatively budget route to achieve what you seek from a printer with a modest footprint.

All the best with the getting the business:)
 
I wonder if a Dye Sub printer is best suited to your needs?

Such as...

https://www.photomart.co.uk/dnp-ds820-8-inch-roll-fed-dye-sublimation-photo-printer.html

Not A4 (8.3 x 11.7 inches) but 8 x 12 inch prints with a print every 33.9 seconds, according to the specs on that website.
Been looking at this .. there are Dye-Sub printer dealers in Australia, but I note this format is largely used for surfaces other than photo paper. I'll try and speak to some of these businesses tomorrow and see if they can impress me enough.

The Epson F560 seems to be priced in that void between what I have, and what I want (but can't afford).
 
Another option is a 24" pigment roll printer and Image Print Red with Cut It Out from ColorByte. Requires a purchase of a cutter like the Graphtec Ce-7000-60. Several videos of the process on YouTube.
 
I wonder if a Dye Sub printer is best suited to your needs?

Such as...

https://www.photomart.co.uk/dnp-ds820-8-inch-roll-fed-dye-sublimation-photo-printer.html

Not A4 (8.3 x 11.7 inches) but 8 x 12 inch prints with a print every 33.9 seconds, according to the specs on that website.
Been looking at this .. there are Dye-Sub printer dealers in Australia, but I note this format is largely used for surfaces other than photo paper. I'll try and speak to some of these businesses tomorrow and see if they can impress me enough.

The Epson F560 seems to be priced in that void between what I have, and what I want (but can't afford).
AFAIK and can tell the Epson F560 has one market and one only.....

It is intended for use by the graphics products/production trade and its output it designed to be used to transfer print onto the likes of garments and hard (and some soft e.g. vinyl ?) surfaces like signage & 'gifts' such as coasters and mugs.

My interpretation is that the dye sub function is 'activated'(?) by the heat process used to transfer the print to the target surface.

Of course, I stand to be corrected;)

On the other hand the printer I posted about is specifically for photography printing on it's specialised media.

It utilises a ribbon with areas of the CYMK colours in sequence on the ribbon and lays down the colours 1 by 1 and then a finish top coat to protect the image surface.

NB the media is sold in packs of ribbon & media and will print a set number e.g. 220 photos per ribbon and media pack set.

NB it works by "thermal transfer technology" akin to the monochrome 'Thermal Transfer Label Printers' of which there are two methods

(a) that use a ribbon printing onto various substrates like paper or synthetic e g. Polypropylene.

(b) direct (without a ribbon) onto thermal paper.
 
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...If you want to remain in the inkjet realm rather than dye-sub, then there is the Epson P5300 (Europe number, not sure what it is in Australia).

It is a beast of a printer, not cheap, but is capable of sustaining commercial size runs of prints. According to my information, you should be able to get about 39 A4 size prints per minute.*

*From Brave Search (AI)
In summary, the Epson SureColor P5300 can print A4 pages at up to 39 pages per minute under optimal conditions , but real-world performance will depend heavily on print settings, media type, and desired output quality. For professional applications where image fidelity is paramount, print speeds will naturally be slower to maintain the exceptional color accuracy and detail this printer is known for.

FeatureSpecificationPrinter ModelEpson SureColor P5300 (C11CL14301A0)

Print Technology Inkjet – Micro Piezo TFP

Printhead Maximum Print Resolution5760 x 1440 dpi

A4 Print Speed (Max)39 pages per minute

Duplex Printing No (Manual only)

Media Formats SupportedA4, A3, A3+, A2, A2+, Letter, 17", Custom

Ink System10-color UltraChrome Pro10 (incl. Photo Black, Matte Black, Violet)

AI-generated answer. Please verify critical facts.
39 prints per minute returns about a 12 minute run for your 500 prints, although I do not know the resolution level setting for this speed.

In addition ink carts are 200ml, so you won't be changing carts every other day, has a paper cassette, and a very robust roll paper capacity with auto cutter.

Hope this helps
 
If you want to remain in the inkjet realm rather than dye-sub, then there is the Epson P5300 (Europe number, not sure what it is in Australia).

It is a beast of a printer, not cheap, but is capable of sustaining commercial size runs of prints. According to my information, you should be able to get about 39 A4 size prints per minute.*

*From Brave Search (AI)
I've got $100 US that says the P5300 / P5370 / P53x0 in Oz prints at more like 39 A4 prints per hour, not per minute, at least at any sort of good photo quality setting. Sometimes artificial intelligence has an IQ of about ... 39.

That said, if the OP really wants to print these sorts of photos on an art-type printer--I'm not so sure that doing so would be a wise use of his time or money--then a P5300-series is likely a considerably better choice than a / another P900 / P907 or whatever, other than that the latter is much lighter (35 lbs versus 117 lbs) and easier to move around, if the OP ever wants to do that.
 
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If you want to remain in the inkjet realm rather than dye-sub, then there is the Epson P5300 (Europe number, not sure what it is in Australia).

It is a beast of a printer, not cheap, but is capable of sustaining commercial size runs of prints. According to my information, you should be able to get about 39 A4 size prints per minute.*

*From Brave Search (AI)
I've got $100 US that says the P5300 / P5370 / P53x0 in Oz prints at more like 39 A4 prints per hour, not per minute, at least at any sort of good photo quality setting. Sometimes artificial intelligence has an IQ of about ... 39.

That said, if the OP really wants to print these sorts of photos on an art-type printer--I'm not so sure that doing so would be a wise use of his time or money--then a P5300-series is likely a considerably better choice than a / another P900 / P907 or whatever, other than that the latter is much lighter (35 lbs versus 117 lbs) and easier to move around, if the OP ever wants to do that.
NAC is correct, the P5300 is not a fast printer.

Quick Thoughts on P5300 for this thread imho

Pro's:

-- has a cassette feeder for normal photo paper takes up to 17" x 22" sheets -- won't work for "fine art" papers, too thick

-- 17" roll printer, with built in cutter, so could do the horizontal cuts in machine and borderless

-- built for production amounts of printing

-- ink is approx 50% cheaper than P900

Con's

-- doubt it is possible to do two sided on roll feeder

-- wonder if it is possible to to two sided on cassette feeder

-- cut sheet (top) feeder is slow to use.

-- weight, 115 lbs. and size is larger.
 
.. is what I'm thinking.

If I had a 400-500 print run, I wouldn't even think of a fine art printer unless the price per print were "fine art" prices. 400 prints at $675 per print (for example) would be something I would entertain because it makes business sense.
Thanks for your post. Just to elaborate;

The P906 is a Fine Art printer capable of sizes up to A2, and can be purchased for under $1500 AU (plus ink, paper etc) with the current cashback offer.
Please send a link to the specifications of the printer you're talking about, as I may be thinking of something different than what you mean.
At 2-3 minutes per print it's slow, but of course the quality is terrific. Mind you I am only using the 'Standard' setting of 720 x 1440 dpi, which is the same maximum res for the D1060.
Sounds like all ok in the quality department.
The ink in a P906 is rated better than the ink in the D1060.

It costs about $0.70 per sheet of A4, and about the same in ink (costs have increased slightly, I could round-up to $1 per page for ink but that would be overstating it). There are 10 inks in the P906.
You rounding up to $1.00 per page would actually be a sound business practice, but we'll save that for another thread on another day. So let's go with $0.80 per print, to include some ink loss, a bit of wear and tear, etc.. $.0.80 x 450 prints = $360.00, which I would round up to $400 since it's a "cost". It it were an income, I'll often round down even if it's more than half way to the next hundred dollars. I do that to ensure a layer of income reality wiggle-room as unexpected cost or problems can pop up at any given time, and me making allowances for such has served me well over the decades.

Ok, so let's stick with the (estimated) $360.00 in ink/wear and tear costs.
The D1060 is a 5-tank system, and costs of ink and paper are roughly 1/2 that of the P906. So if I get the spreadsheet out, I could probably work out my 'breakeven' in costs.

I'm not yet sure how many prints per tank in the D1060. The ink carts in the P906 are 50ml, they are 250ml in the D1060.

So it's swings and roundabouts somewhat. What I have is very adequate (for price and function), but not the most efficient for time.

Everything about the D1060 says "this is real, bro".
The part that I can't get around is the time factor and how long your printer is working to complete the print job. To me.. that's an indicator to me that it's the wrong tool for the job.

So let's say you're printing 450 prints at 3 minutes/print..

That's 3 min. x 450 = 1,350 minutes or 22.5 hours. Probably a good bit longer than that if using a non roll paper option.

So the print job will take you practically an entire day. How much is your time worth? If you were to earn $10/hr.. that's 22.5 x $10 = $225 out of your profits, and when added to the $360 ink/wear-and-tear cost, your estimated cost has risen to $585, or basically $600. What if your time is worth $25 or $50 per hour? We haven't even thrown in paper yet and depending on the type of paper you're using, that expense can be notable, especially if you're not buying it on a roll and cutting it A4 size yourself. Pre-cut sheets can be pricey.

I see how the Epson D1060/1070 series are "mini lab" printers which have never given me a warm and fuzzy feeling. They're too one-trick-pony type of printers for my liking when it comes to business printing. Perhaps I'm just not intimately familiar with them. I recall the Fuji mini lab printers were decent several decades ago but (a) not without issues (b) not versatile enough (to me).

https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/prod...173&gbraid=0AAAAAD7yMh1t3UPvppIpyeNwaR9UQUSQR

So that's a snapshot of how I think it and there's even more to consider, but where I sit you'd be doing yourself a favor letting print professionals do the job on a much larger machine, which could complete a 450 page print job in 45-60 minutes.

I recommend pricing the job with the professionals first, before paying a few thousand dollars and or spending an entire day of your time printing and having to possibly deal with printer issues, etc., since the P906 probably isn't designed for such sustained/commercial printing.

Either way you go, I hope you are very successful and profitable in your endeavor!

I give an extra respectful nod to anyone working smart and hard trying to make money on their own, outside of a traditional job.

--
Teila K. Day
http://teiladay.com
 
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If you want to remain in the inkjet realm rather than dye-sub, then there is the Epson P5300 (Europe number, not sure what it is in Australia).

It is a beast of a printer, not cheap, but is capable of sustaining commercial size runs of prints. According to my information, you should be able to get about 39 A4 size prints per minute.*

*From Brave Search (AI)
I've got $100 US that says the P5300 / P5370 / P53x0 in Oz prints at more like 39 A4 prints per hour, not per minute, at least at any sort of good photo quality setting. Sometimes artificial intelligence has an IQ of about ... 39.
Ok, so it wasn't just me raising a 'brow at that "per minute" figure. I just can't see printing an artful print run of 500 prints in 12 minutes... or even 12 hours for that matter, on a typical (non commercial-volume printer) printer.

.. don't get me started on AI spouted figures in google searches. Hit and miss, with a lot of misses absolutely ridiculous answers, that plainly defy basic math and common sense. I bet school teachers are reeling with disgust when their students put such AI gotten info in their "research" papers.
 
You could be right about the ppm/ pph. I could not find A4 or 8x10 printer times referenced in my 5370 manual, but did see the reference twice in searches. Pph does sound more realistic though.

For the ops purposes, I Personally think a dye-sub makes more sense. I was just offering another option.
 
Yes. For production, offset or dye sub is probably better.

But with pigment ink jet you need the wider carriage printers, 24-44 inches, where you can up "gang" prints on roll paper.

Was interested in seeing a local, out of the way CVS drug store have a 24" it looked like Epson printer in house.
 
Please send a link to the specifications of the printer you're talking about, as I may be thinking of something different than what you mean.
At 2-3 minutes per print it's slow, but of course the quality is terrific. Mind you I am only using the 'Standard' setting of 720 x 1440 dpi, which is the same maximum res for the D1060.
Sounds like all ok in the quality department.
The 'Quality' setting adds no res, but a 'Black overcoat'. Then there are higher quality settings ... all of these add ink use and Standard is perfectly good.
You rounding up to $1.00 per page would actually be a sound business practice, but we'll save that for another thread on another day. So let's go with $0.80 per print, to include some ink loss, a bit of wear and tear, etc.. $.0.80 x 450 prints = $360.00, which I would round up to $400 since it's a "cost". It it were an income, I'll often round down even if it's more than half way to the next hundred dollars. I do that to ensure a layer of income reality wiggle-room as unexpected cost or problems can pop up at any given time, and me making allowances for such has served me well over the decades.

Ok, so let's stick with the (estimated) $360.00 in ink/wear and tear costs.
Note - ink + paper .. so $1.50'ish per print. I won't say what I sell them for, it's not a Kings Ransom because I like to deal with clubs and ensure I'm doing entire teams, not just interested parties.
The part that I can't get around is the time factor and how long your printer is working to complete the print job. To me.. that's an indicator to me that it's the wrong tool for the job.
I went into this knowing it's the wrong tool, and the high volume can't be good for it. However it's not so bad - while I send one squad to print, I work on preparing the next squad, export from InDesign and I'm ready.

So the process flows, and gives me time to raid the pantry 😂
We haven't even thrown in paper yet and depending on the type of paper you're using, that expense can be notable, especially if you're not buying it on a roll and cutting it A4 size yourself. Pre-cut sheets can be pricey.
Purchasing A4 Ilford Smooth Pearl, 250 sheets a box. Again it's functional, and was the right thing to do for someone who had never printed and didn't know what I was getting into. I'm making money on the current process, now it's a matter of making it more time and cost efficient.

With the EOI for the Christmas Photo project in my Inbox yesterday, it brings more options to the table. If I am successful I know roughly what it's worth to me, and we finished up last year talking about a contract for the next 'x' years.

If I can get a 24+ month commitment, the cost of the D1060 is very much in play.
I see how the Epson D1060/1070 series are "mini lab" printers which have never given me a warm and fuzzy feeling. They're too one-trick-pony type of printers for my liking when it comes to business printing.
They are the go-to for high volume places such as camera stores and kiosks, so they have the track record. I just never pictured a one-man band being in that space.

I need to do a spreadsheet of costs per print and work out where the breakeven is in terms of prints produced. While the D1060 is approximately half the cost in terms of paper + ink, there are other factors affecting things, such as freight costs for the A4 sheets, 50ml tanks vs 250ml etc.
I recommend pricing the job with the professionals first, before paying a few thousand dollars and or spending an entire day of your time printing and having to possibly deal with printer issues, etc., since the P906 probably isn't designed for such sustained/commercial printing.
This is the reason it's in-house. The "professionals" don't want to talk to you unless you are printing in the thousands. I now have a commercial printer on speed dial (he coats the A3 player cards I do - that's another issue!!), but his prints do not have the quality of either the P906 or the D1060.

Local suppliers are happy to talk a little, but ultimately they want sales. They import limited products, so if you ask "What else is out there", they simply say nothing.
Either way you go, I hope you are very successful and profitable in your endeavor!
Thanks .. it's fun. Can be stressful obviously but seeing the benefits now. Just need someone to do my admin, website, socials ... 😂
I give an extra respectful nod to anyone working smart and hard trying to make money on their own, outside of a traditional job.
I'm fortunate to have the latitude to try given our current life phase. But it's certainly starting to pay it's way (the accountant wife will be pleased).
 
...If you want to remain in the inkjet realm rather than dye-sub, then there is the Epson P5300 (Europe number, not sure what it is in Australia).
I was very close to purchasing this before the P906 came into light. And right now the currently model is discounted with a newer version coming out.

https://www.kayellaustralia.com.au/product/15115-epson-surecolor-p5360-432mm-printer-5yr-warranty

But I think it will take up too much space for my corner of the house ... i think I read somewhere the delivery come on a palette and was something like 60 kg's or heavier. That scared me!

Where this remains relevant is that it works off paper rolls, which I have basically decided is is important in any new printer. Much more flexibility and a big cost saving.
 
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If you want to remain in the inkjet realm rather than dye-sub, then there is the Epson P5300 (Europe number, not sure what it is in Australia).

It is a beast of a printer, not cheap, but is capable of sustaining commercial size runs of prints. According to my information, you should be able to get about 39 A4 size prints per minute.*

*From Brave Search (AI)
I've got $100 US that says the P5300 / P5370 / P53x0 in Oz prints at more like 39 A4 prints per hour, not per minute, at least at any sort of good photo quality setting. Sometimes artificial intelligence has an IQ of about ... 39.

That said, if the OP really wants to print these sorts of photos on an art-type printer--I'm not so sure that doing so would be a wise use of his time or money--then a P5300-series is likely a considerably better choice than a / another P900 / P907 or whatever, other than that the latter is much lighter (35 lbs versus 117 lbs) and easier to move around, if the OP ever wants to do that.
Just replied to this above ... the 5360 is seriously large. I was close to purchasing prior to the P906 but I think it's too big physically for my situation (watching closely as a new model is expected).
 
I wonder if a Dye Sub printer is best suited to your needs?

Such as...

https://www.photomart.co.uk/dnp-ds820-8-inch-roll-fed-dye-sublimation-photo-printer.html

Not A4 (8.3 x 11.7 inches) but 8 x 12 inch prints with a print every 33.9 seconds, according to the specs on that website.
I reached out to a Dye Sub printer dealer in Australia and they were quick to respond. I've sent them some images that they will produce and mail back to me.

Dye Sub are apparently widely used in kiosk and photo booth type setups. Interesting to say the least. When I think about it my 'trusted source' (x2) only deal in fine art supplies.

Just having a quick glance at the costs, a 200 photo roll of paper is around $250 ... that's more expensive than using A4 sheets.
 
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I wonder if a Dye Sub printer is best suited to your needs?

Such as...

https://www.photomart.co.uk/dnp-ds820-8-inch-roll-fed-dye-sublimation-photo-printer.html

Not A4 (8.3 x 11.7 inches) but 8 x 12 inch prints with a print every 33.9 seconds, according to the specs on that website.
I reached out to a Dye Sub printer dealer in Australia and they were quick to respond. I've sent them some images that they will produce and mail back to me.

Dye Sub are apparently widely used in kiosk and photo booth type setups. Interesting to say the least. When I think about it my 'trusted source' (x2) only deal in fine art supplies.
Yes, AFAIK though in a kiosk environment it may be a model where the count available is higher than a model used at an event?
Just having a quick glance at the costs, a 200 photo roll of paper is around $250 ... that's more expensive than using A4 sheets.
As for costs

DNP DS820 A4 Pure Premium Media Pack (220 Prints Per Box)

£208.78

Based on the above and adding UK Vat of 20% that works out at approx £1.13 per A4 print.
 
I wonder if a Dye Sub printer is best suited to your needs?

Such as...

https://www.photomart.co.uk/dnp-ds820-8-inch-roll-fed-dye-sublimation-photo-printer.html

Not A4 (8.3 x 11.7 inches) but 8 x 12 inch prints with a print every 33.9 seconds, according to the specs on that website.
I reached out to a Dye Sub printer dealer in Australia and they were quick to respond. I've sent them some images that they will produce and mail back to me.
Good to investigate.
Dye Sub are apparently widely used in kiosk and photo booth type setups. Interesting to say the least.
Yes, they're relatively fast, and their prints look good and are relatively durable.
When I think about it my 'trusted source' (x2) only deal in fine art supplies.
Funny that, sellers recommending what they have to sell, and not what they don't.
Just having a quick glance at the costs, a 200 photo roll of paper is around $250 ... that's more expensive than using A4 sheets.
Some thoughts on cost:

* I cannot imagine a viable business taking photos where, within reason, the cost of having them printed is an important fraction of the total business costs. If you sell something for e.g. 20 (your currency) or 30 (your currency), then whether manufacturing that thing costs 1.5 (your currency) or 2.2 (your currency) seems unlikely to be important.

* What's your time worth? If a dye sub could print with five hours of your supervision what your inkjet would require ten hours of your supervision, that ought to be factored in.

* Inkjet costs depend hugely on the paper on which you're printing. U.S. letter size is close to A4. Looking just now, papers I use range from $0.34 (Canon PM-101 Pro Premium Matte) to $2.71 (Hahnemuhle Photo Rag Pearl) per sheet, an almost 8x cost range. Of course ink costs matter too, and aren't likely to differ too much based on the paper.
 

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