R5 to Rii for stills shooters?

I shoot stills and action. I wonder if this is worth the upgrade. I'm calculating how much I can sell my R5 to how much it'll cost for this. Just to be clear...I love the R5...will this camera ship or will it be like the R5 with months of waiting.

Stacked sensor with 1/160s readout should be a nice upgrade for the action shots.

Morvegil said:

I shoot stills and action. I wonder if this is worth the upgrade.

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That is the question! Even trading in my R5 I would probably have to spend another $3000. It isn’t a compelling upgrade to me for that much money. I don’t care about video and the photo enhancements are just incremental to me. I think a lot of people will buy it, though. My thoughts have turned to lenses while I wait for news of an R6 iii or R7 ii. I thought Canon was going to announce some new lenses today, but they didn’t.

Morvegil said:

I'm calculating how much I can sell my R5 to how much it'll cost for this. Just to be clear...I love the R5...will this camera ship or will it be like the R5 with months of waiting.

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Only pros shoot with Canon.

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Morvegil said:

I shoot stills and action. I wonder if this is worth the upgrade.

Click to expand...

I don't think anyone can tell you that. People value things differently, specially when it comes to luxury and ease of life

For stills:

• stacked sensor, faster readout - means I can finally transition to ES as daily driver
• ES Related improvements
  • Flash in ES mode
  • multiple burst modes (8 choices)
  • 1/32000 max shutter
• AF improvements
  • the subject tracking seems improved
  • Action Priority AF feature itself can be worth the upgrade if it works well
  • People priority - this is a common use case
• DR needs to be seen when someone measures it. The inclusion of CLOG2 in video suggests at least in that mode the DR is improved (for R5, CLOG3 is enough). We need to see whether it translates to any benefits in stills
• It seems you get 14bit output in ES now (???)
• Eye Control AF / improved viewfinder (2x brighter)
• In-Camera processing features if you are a jpg shooter
• Pre Capture if you are an action shooter
• Improved IBIS (half stop?)
• EV-6.5 focusing (half stop improvement)
• All the improvements from R7/R8/R6II that came after R5

Morvegil said:

I'm calculating how much I can sell my R5 to how much it'll cost for this. Just to be clear...I love the R5...will this camera ship or will it be like the R5 with months of waiting.

Click to expand...

I think this depends a lot on where you are. I think where I am, I can upgrade foe about 2k, which translates to $400/year to be on the latest body

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PicPocket

Morvegil said:

I shoot stills and action. I wonder if this is worth the upgrade. I'm calculating how much I can sell my R5 to how much it'll cost for this. Just to be clear...I love the R5...will this camera ship or will it be like the R5 with months of waiting.

Click to expand...

I'm not going to upgrade unless something catastrophic happens to my R5. The R5Mk2 looks great but my R5 is way more than capable than I am.

If I didn't have an R5 and was shopping for a high end canon I'd probably have a pre-order already.

I have a couple of R5's, one converted for infrared, and as Boris said, my R5's are far more capable than I am. Especially given that most of what I shoot doesn't move -- landscapes, flowers, travel photography -- the R5 Mark II wouldn't seem to offer much if anything that would benefit my photography. Too bad, as it is such fun to buy new gear :-D!

PicPocket said:

Morvegil said:

I shoot stills and action. I wonder if this is worth the upgrade.

Click to expand...

I don't think anyone can tell you that. People value things differently, specially when it comes to luxury and ease of life

For stills:

• stacked sensor, faster readout - means I can finally transition to ES as daily driver
• ES Related improvements
  • Flash in ES mode
  • multiple burst modes (8 choices)
  • 1/32000 max shutter
• AF improvements
  • the subject tracking seems improved
  • Action Priority AF feature itself can be worth the upgrade if it works well
  • People priority - this is a common use case
• DR needs to be seen when someone measures it. The inclusion of CLOG2 in video suggests at least in that mode the DR is improved (for R5, CLOG3 is enough). We need to see whether it translates to any benefits in stills
• It seems you get 14bit output in ES now (???)
• Eye Control AF / improved viewfinder (2x brighter)
• In-Camera processing features if you are a jpg shooter
• Pre Capture if you are an action shooter
• Improved IBIS (half stop?)
• EV-6.5 focusing (half stop improvement)
• All the improvements from R7/R8/R6II that came after R5

PicPocket said:

I'm calculating how much I can sell my R5 to how much it'll cost for this. Just to be clear...I love the R5...will this camera ship or will it be like the R5 with months of waiting.

Click to expand...

I think this depends a lot on where you are. I think where I am, I can upgrade foe about 2k, which translates to $400/year to be on the latest body

Click to expand...

Now I can shoot:

1. ES with flash (1/160),
2. Can shoot ES in 3 frame/sec (8 choices) and assign a button to burst at 30 frames/sec when needed,
3. 1/32000 - allows shooting f1.2 in bright light without needing ND filter,
4. On paper the AF is greatly inproved over the R5, Any improvement is welcomed (much improved, according to Canon),
5. Eye control AF, much improved - nice to have if it works as described.
6. Pre-capture - nice to have,
7. Audio in slow motion video - wonderful.

Many more improvement over the R5 - enough for me to pre-order.

Anyone want to buy my R5 ?

Morvegil said:

I shoot stills and action. I wonder if this is worth the upgrade. I'm calculating how much I can sell my R5 to how much it'll cost for this. Just to be clear...I love the R5...will this camera ship or will it be like the R5 with months of waiting.

Click to expand...

I would start thinking if you're missing anything in your current R5mk1, especially for AF. If yes, you might hire the R5II to see what it's like. If no, I think it's pretty hard to justify the upgrade.

The R wasn't a mature camera, especially for AF. The R6 was fine, but the 20Mp was a bit on the low side. The R5 was a bit overkill for Mp's, but it was the first mature Canon mirrorless full frame camera with an adequate Mp-count surpassing the 20 and 24Mp restrictions.

You and me did of course pay a premium price to shoot this camera 3 years before everyone could get it for a low price, caused by upgraders to the mk2 wanting the latest and greatest. The pics I've made with the R5 in those years where worth it to me, as the R couldn't have done it. The very few extra keepers I would get with the mkII aren't worth it to me. I can get my shots with that R5mk1. But everyone has to decide for him/her self, to each his/her own.

bodeswell said:

Morvegil said:

I shoot stills and action. I wonder if this is worth the upgrade.

Click to expand...

That is the question! Even trading in my R5 I would probably have to spend another $3000. It isn’t a compelling upgrade to me for that much money.

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It would cost me around £3850 (just over $4700) to upgrade if I sold my 5Ds to help pay for it. It's tempting, but...

It's still more tempting than upgrading to the original R5 for half that cost though. The photo enhancements would be huge increments for me, but then a car that will do 200mph is twice as fast as one that will only do 100mph.

bodeswell said:

I don’t care about video and the photo enhancements are just incremental to me. I think a lot of people will buy it, though. My thoughts have turned to lenses while I wait for news of an R6 iii or R7 ii. I thought Canon was going to announce some new lenses today, but they didn’t.

bodeswell said:

I'm calculating how much I can sell my R5 to how much it'll cost for this. Just to be clear...I love the R5...will this camera ship or will it be like the R5 with months of waiting.

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Only pros shoot with Canon.

Click to expand...

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Morvegil said:

I shoot stills and action. I wonder if this is worth the upgrade. I'm calculating how much I can sell my R5 to how much it'll cost for this. Just to be clear...I love the R5...will this camera ship or will it be like the R5 with months of waiting.

Click to expand...

It is a better R5, but it’s not yet clear how much better. Face it, if we could all trade in our R5’s for this new camera for only, say, $100, we’d all excitedly do it!

I have upgraded from an XSi to 7D to 7D Mark II to 5D Mark IV to R5. I always waited until the new model was on the market for around 18 months or more before buying it.

I didn’t buy the EOS R when it came out; that upgrade didn’t seem worthwhile. This R5 Mark II is very appealing to me, but the cost of upgrade is too high for me. With R5, the focus hit rate went way up from my 5D Mark IV, which was already outstanding. A really big factor for me is that I can focus on eyes even close to the edge of the frame. With fast-moving subjects in low light, especially shooting with fast prime lenses, the R5’s ability to focus at the edge of the frame is a big win for me.

I don’t think we know enough about the new sensor yet. It looks like electronic shutter will be practical with this camera. That would be great for, say, shooting wedding ceremonies. With the R5, I feel that Electronic shutter is unsafe, because it works poorly on fast moving subjects and it can produce very bad artifacts under artificial lighting, especially LED’s… leaving me wondering what it’s good for. The Mark II has apparently solved this.

We also don’t know if the new camera will perform better in low light. And, maybe it will stay cooler, so less noise after shooting lots of bursts. Not sure if they got rid of the 30 minute video recording limit; that would be nice. These are all the things I’m considering.

Morvegil said:

I shoot stills and action. I wonder if this is worth the upgrade. I'm calculating how much I can sell my R5 to how much it'll cost for this. Just to be clear...I love the R5...will this camera ship or will it be like the R5 with months of waiting.

Click to expand...

The new stacked sensor reduces the rolling shutter issue when using e-shutter. And R5ii offers 30 fps @45MP 14-bit raw in e-shutter mode - this is insane and even better than my Z8 on paper.

I doubt I would for stills. This is the plain old R.







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You just need to keep the forests wet

Zeee said:

I doubt I would for stills. This is the plain old R.

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cameras much older than the R can do this, so why did you get the R

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PicPocket

PicPocket said:

Zeee said:

I doubt I would for stills. This is the plain old R.

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cameras much older than the R can do this, so why did you get the R

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Because I wanted an ML and my EF 24-105 F4 was not as good in the corners or as sharp. While it had a slow fps and bad blackout my 7D2 never came out of my bag for a year after getting the R. AF for BIF was just too much fun and more challenging.

I guess my point was why upgrade to an R5II when even much older cameras than the R can do this for stills. The R5 can easily do this.

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You just need to keep the forests wet

The thing that really excites me is the “2x” brighter viewfinder. But not enough to accept the upgrade cost. Many be I’ll get a used one when the R5iii comes out!

Zeee said:

PicPocket said:

Zeee said:

I doubt I would for stills. This is the plain old R.

Click to expand...

cameras much older than the R can do this, so why did you get the R

Click to expand...

Because I wanted an ML and my EF 24-105 F4 was not as good in the corners or as sharp. While it had a slow fps and bad blackout my 7D2 never came out of my bag for a year after getting the R. AF for BIF was just too much fun and more challenging.

I guess my point was why upgrade to an R5II when even much older cameras than the R can do this for stills. The R5 can easily do this.

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because there is always something on the lines of the bolded part above. You upgraded even though cameras before ML could do this, and the same applies to anyone who upgrades now. No one upgrades for no reason

I am not arguing for your choice, I get your point

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PicPocket

I've asked myself the same question! Was on the point of a preorder but reconsidered, will wait until we see real 'in the field' performance. I like the idea of improved AF and the ability to dial back on the electronic shutter and the benefits of stacked sensor, I'm sure there are others that will become obvious in use. Are these enough for an upgrade? Probably but as others have said the R5 is enough for me at present, time will tell if I can resist!

Morvegil said:

I shoot stills and action. I wonder if this is worth the upgrade. I'm calculating how much I can sell my R5 to how much it'll cost for this. Just to be clear...I love the R5...will this camera ship or will it be like the R5 with months of waiting.

Click to expand...

I shoot action sometimes, and sometimes birds (although I'm not a very dedicated birder), but most of the time I shoot landscapes, and so far it looks like the R5II offers zero new features or improvements for landscape photography.

I'm not sure, at this point, if it's worth upgrading from the R5 to R5II, if we talk about the landscape photography.

I'm not preordering t the R5II, will wait for reviews and for full user manual to be available.

Quarkcharmed said:

so far it looks like the R5II offers zero new features or improvements for landscape photography.

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Chances are quite high that the BSI sensor of R5ii can give better dynamic range than R5. This should benefit landscape photo - need to wait for review of production units to verify this though.

The other possible benefit is the 1/32000 electronic shutter speed. In an extremely bright scene, (the sun is in the picture for example) you have a wider choice of aperture to choose from. Less need to choose a very small aperture (diffraction at tiny aperture may degrade the image) nor add ND filter.

Wing2 said:

Quarkcharmed said:

so far it looks like the R5II offers zero new features or improvements for landscape photography.

Click to expand...

Chances are quite high that the BSI sensor of R5ii can give better dynamic range than R5. This should benefit landscape photo - need to wait for review of production units to verify this though.

The other possible benefit is the 1/32000 electronic shutter speed. In an extremely bright scene, (the sun is in the picture for example) you have a wider choice of aperture to choose from. Less need to choose a very small aperture (diffraction at tiny aperture may degrade the image) nor add ND filter.

Click to expand...

One of the most overlooked changes in the R5II, as far as I understand it, is the opposite - the available ES shutter speeds expanded downward. The R5 could only use the ES down to 1/2 second. When I had stationary macro subjects that required slow shutter speeds, I often had to switch out of the vibration-less ES mode to expose at one second or longer.