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Future of Nikon Z APS- C Format Cameras ?

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Leonard Shepherd said:
John Gellings said:
Leonard Shepherd said:
YouTube gets millions of hits for camera reviews just in English.
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There are a lot of dreamers out there who aren't buying apparently.
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There are also many photographers without the experience or expertise to enable them to know whether a specific YouTube video is it good or garbage.
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I agree. I see people quoting these entertainers like they are great photographers and it is a bit concerning. They are third party camera advertisers for the most part. I mean, I get it... the more views, the more money they get. I do not blame them for doing it and they certainly can regurgitate comparison specs ad nauseam. However, that doesn't mean they know how to make compelling photographs. Flash a few cliches on the screen and people seem hooked.

--
https://www.johngellings.com
Instagram = @johngellings0
 
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I give up on DX waiting for a D400 to replace my D300.

If I want to shoot DX now, I turn DX mode on in my Z9.

If there is a future for Nikon DX, I'd say it is in amateur zoom lenses priced low.

The only place DX makes sense is with wide optics where they can be cheaper and lighter.
 
I use the same exact lenses when comparing my 24 and 21mp Nikon's. So no lens difference in the mix.
 
That is easy to understand at least in the Nikon line up. Their prices are way far and above what this market can even consider.
 
chrisD46 said:
Most of the Nikon Z mirrorless camera talk centers around full frame format Z cameras . What do you believe the future direction will be for Nikon Z APS - C cameras - especially for people who have no desire to “upgrade” to full frame camera systems ? Can Nikon refine and improve APS-C format sensor cameras & lenses further to provide even better image quality , performance , etc. ?
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It kills me to hear all the talk about "entry level" this and that.....

I've been doing digital photography for more than 20 years, and have been really serious about bird photography for more than 3 yrs.

My first mirrorless camera, was the Canon R5. It had some strong points, but being a Full Frame, it almost never gave me enough reach, even with an 800mm lens ! 100% crops were common.

After a year of that, I "upgraded" to the APS-C R7. Loved it so much, I sold the R5 to buy a second R7. Super anxious and hopeful that the R7 Mk II will have a bunch of nice upgrades, and honestly, I don't care how much they cost. I want the closest thing to a straight up pro level APS-C body I can buy.

Heck I'd love to see a stacked sensor (of course) 35-40mp's, way faster processor, better viewfinder, bigger buffer.... With all this stuff ^ they could leave out the lame mechanical shutter altogether.

And then, at least an available grip, but better yet, a wide body "pro" format, with an alloy body (knowing this won't ever happen) but I'd give $3000K for it, if they did.

It's kind of funny, as a bird photographer I see LOTS of other serious birders with all kinds of expensive gear... Not usually as long as my 800 F11+ R7.... And I listen to them complain about wanting something longer, yet camera manufacturers seem totally def to this ?

Anyway, it's still good to see Nikon coming out with an APS-C. Although Canon is the only one making a 200-800 zoom.... Which is the Holy Grail for small bird photography. I was all sprung on the Nikon PF 800 F6.3 for quite a while, but I've come to feel (after 300K shots with my 800 F11's) that 800mm primes are just not versatile enough for my shooting.

Hopefully the Nikon Z90 will be good enough to put some more fire under Canon's but 🙂

Sony needs to make one too. Sure would love to see more competition.
 
Chris Wolfgram said:
chrisD46 said:
Most of the Nikon Z mirrorless camera talk centers around full frame format Z cameras . What do you believe the future direction will be for Nikon Z APS - C cameras - especially for people who have no desire to “upgrade” to full frame camera systems ? Can Nikon refine and improve APS-C format sensor cameras & lenses further to provide even better image quality , performance , etc. ?
Click to expand...
It kills me to hear all the talk about "entry level" this and that.....

I've been doing digital photography for more than 20 years, and have been really serious about bird photography for more than 3 yrs.

My first mirrorless camera, was the Canon R5. It had some strong points, but being a Full Frame, it almost never gave me enough reach, even with an 800mm lens ! 100% crops were common.
Click to expand...
How do you still have an image left after cropping 100% of the pixels...?
Chris Wolfgram said:
After a year of that, I "upgraded" to the APS-C R7. Loved it so much, I sold the R5 to buy a second R7. Super anxious and hopeful that the R7 Mk II will have a bunch of nice upgrades, and honestly, I don't care how much they cost. I want the closest thing to a straight up pro level APS-C body I can buy.

Heck I'd love to see a stacked sensor (of course) 35-40mp's, way faster processor, better viewfinder, bigger buffer.... With all this stuff ^ they could leave out the lame mechanical shutter altogether.

And then, at least an available grip, but better yet, a wide body "pro" format, with an alloy body (knowing this won't ever happen) but I'd give $3000K for it, if they did.

It's kind of funny, as a bird photographer I see LOTS of other serious birders with all kinds of expensive gear... Not usually as long as my 800 F11+ R7.... And I listen to them complain about wanting something longer, yet camera manufacturers seem totally def to this ?

Anyway, it's still good to see Nikon coming out with an APS-C. Although Canon is the only one making a 200-800 zoom.... Which is the Holy Grail for small bird photography. I was all sprung on the Nikon PF 800 F6.3 for quite a while, but I've come to feel (after 300K shots with my 800 F11's) that 800mm primes are just not versatile enough for my shooting.

Hopefully the Nikon Z90 will be good enough to put some more fire under Canon's but 🙂

Sony needs to make one too. Sure would love to see more competition.

--
Every day in the field is a blessing. Nice photos, of beautiful birds and wildlife are just a bonus.
https://www.flickr.com/photos/161603079@N02/page1
No time or attention given for negativity or trolls.
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Suntan said:
Chris Wolfgram said:
chrisD46 said:
Most of the Nikon Z mirrorless camera talk centers around full frame format Z cameras . What do you believe the future direction will be for Nikon Z APS - C cameras - especially for people who have no desire to “upgrade” to full frame camera systems ? Can Nikon refine and improve APS-C format sensor cameras & lenses further to provide even better image quality , performance , etc. ?
Click to expand...
It kills me to hear all the talk about "entry level" this and that.....

I've been doing digital photography for more than 20 years, and have been really serious about bird photography for more than 3 yrs.

My first mirrorless camera, was the Canon R5. It had some strong points, but being a Full Frame, it almost never gave me enough reach, even with an 800mm lens ! 100% crops were common.
Click to expand...
How do you still have an image left after cropping 100% of the pixels...?
Click to expand...
🤣 Lol that's funny 🙂

A 100% crop, is a pretty common photography term which means, that the pixels you have left after a large crop, are used on the monitor as 1 pixel of the file, for 1 pixel on the monitor. No downsizing required.

So on a 4k monitor, I can size and image from 45mp's to about 4 to 6 mp's, and still have enough for a shot that almost fills the monitor

Top to bottom anyway.
Suntan said:
Suntan said:
After a year of that, I "upgraded" to the APS-C R7. Loved it so much, I sold the R5 to buy a second R7. Super anxious and hopeful that the R7 Mk II will have a bunch of nice upgrades, and honestly, I don't care how much they cost. I want the closest thing to a straight up pro level APS-C body I can buy.

Heck I'd love to see a stacked sensor (of course) 35-40mp's, way faster processor, better viewfinder, bigger buffer.... With all this stuff ^ they could leave out the lame mechanical shutter altogether.

And then, at least an available grip, but better yet, a wide body "pro" format, with an alloy body (knowing this won't ever happen) but I'd give $3000K for it, if they did.

It's kind of funny, as a bird photographer I see LOTS of other serious birders with all kinds of expensive gear... Not usually as long as my 800 F11+ R7.... And I listen to them complain about wanting something longer, yet camera manufacturers seem totally def to this ?

Anyway, it's still good to see Nikon coming out with an APS-C. Although Canon is the only one making a 200-800 zoom.... Which is the Holy Grail for small bird photography. I was all sprung on the Nikon PF 800 F6.3 for quite a while, but I've come to feel (after 300K shots with my 800 F11's) that 800mm primes are just not versatile enough for my shooting.

Hopefully the Nikon Z90 will be good enough to put some more fire under Canon's but 🙂

Sony needs to make one too. Sure would love to see more competition.
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
 
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Chris Wolfgram said:
Hopefully the Nikon Z90 will be good enough to put some more fire under Canon's butt
Click to expand...
It would certainly make sense that if Nikon was going to make more expensive/higher performance DX bodies that they would make lenses for them, but from the side of the bodies what would a high performance DX body do that a higher end Z doesn't already do? The only things I can think of are make it smaller but who cares about that, and make it a little bit less expensive than the FF bodies. Now if they brought out a sensor with higher pixel density than the current 21MP that would be a benefit but does anybody think they would really do that? I would expect them to make a higher pixel density FF sensor first and they seem to avoid doing that.
 
Chris Wolfgram said:
It kills me to hear all the talk about "entry level" this and that.....

I've been doing digital photography for more than 20 years, and have been really serious about bird photography for more than 3 yrs.

My first mirrorless camera, was the Canon R5. It had some strong points, but being a Full Frame, it almost never gave me enough reach, even with an 800mm lens ! 100% crops were common.

After a year of that, I "upgraded" to the APS-C R7. Loved it so much, I sold the R5 to buy a second R7. Super anxious and hopeful that the R7 Mk II will have a bunch of nice upgrades, and honestly, I don't care how much they cost. I want the closest thing to a straight up pro level APS-C body I can buy.

Heck I'd love to see a stacked sensor (of course) 35-40mp's, way faster processor, better viewfinder, bigger buffer.... With all this stuff ^ they could leave out the lame mechanical shutter altogether.

And then, at least an available grip, but better yet, a wide body "pro" format, with an alloy body (knowing this won't ever happen) but I'd give $3000K for it, if they did.

It's kind of funny, as a bird photographer I see LOTS of other serious birders with all kinds of expensive gear... Not usually as long as my 800 F11+ R7.... And I listen to them complain about wanting something longer, yet camera manufacturers seem totally def to this ?
Click to expand...
This I consider an interesting summary of a "birding" issue.

An observation - going down another format size below DX the Olympus 150-400 with 1.25 built in TC has a similar to 24x36 1,000mm angle of view using the TC, 8 stops in camera IBIS, a relative wide aperture with the TC - and a few more MP than 45 MP cropped to DX format.

The Nikon 800mm cropped to DX is close to 1200mm angle of view, but without zoom flexibility.

A Nikon around 400-1000mm perhaps f8 zoom with a built in TC would cost a lot of money as the minimum front element size would need to be not less than 125mm.

Viewing at 100% and sometimes 200% (on a 5K monitor) is part of my routine for PP image processing.
 
bjn70 said:
bjn70 said:
Hopefully the Nikon Z90 will be good enough to put some more fire under Canon's butt
Click to expand...
It would certainly make sense that if Nikon was going to make more expensive/higher performance DX bodies that they would make lenses for them, but from the side of the bodies what would a high performance DX body do that a higher end Z doesn't already do? The only things I can think of are make it smaller but who cares about that, and make it a little bit less expensive than the FF bodies. Now if they brought out a sensor with higher pixel density than the current 21MP that would be a benefit but does anybody think they would really do that? I would expect them to make a higher pixel density FF sensor first and they seem to avoid doing that.
Click to expand...
The Fuji xt5 is smaller, cheaper, has 40mp, is weather sealed, and does 6k video at 1699. now that might take away from their own cameras but it is compelling. To get just the specs in Nikon u have to be in the 2500-3000 range for 6k or 40+mp. If u want both, only the z8 does that at 4000.

A lot of people, esp those choosing dx bodies care about size.
 
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