Cafe Racer
Veteran Member
So as you can see I'm not saying a new m4/3 camera targeting video Content Creators should specifically be an S9 clone, but should just have some of the key features of the S9, in particular IBIS, Active I.S. and PDAF.
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M4/3 camera for CONTENT CREATORS
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Cafe Racer
Veteran Member
I know you don't.Don't know the G90, only know the G9, G9II and the G100 (and the GM5). Which camera do I reach for? - well I do swap them around a bit but I don't shun the G100. It is quite likeable and my most fun is in the process of making images. Why use the G100 when I could use the G9II? Well I don't always actually need a sophisticate when I am merely amusing myself testing my own ability to get the shot. A basic camera end to bring out the best personal effort. Like a famous photographer who once said "I take photographs to see what things look like when photographed".
Does anyone else these days practice testing their own skills as a photographer rather than looking for the easiest route to an image that only they ever look at?
I cannot see what is wrong with a basic little camera that competes successfully making 20mp 4/3 sensor images at a very affordable cost. I do find it quite enjoyable to use. Presently fitted up with an Olympus 90/3.5 Macro - this has in-lens IS of course and makes for a very stable package. The lens of course was three+ times the price of the camera body (nice).
Yes we do - the G9II at launch RRP was actually more than both the S5II and S5II street prices. Why might a 4/3-ded S9 cost less?
I was thinking that the M4/3 lenses are here and now to be bought as much as S9 lenses specifically suited are possibly "real soon now" and still have to be bought.
I don't think that they screwed up anything other than the marketing.Just for the benefit of using that off-the-shelf body to remind everyone that they screwed up the first time!
Did you not read what I said above?
I think you're missing that I'm referring to video Content Creation hence video focused features.
I can see you're working hard at promoting the G100 and protecting it's reputation at every opportunity, but you're not always targeting the right people. It's Panasonic that's done the most damage to the reputation of the G100 with their misguided marketing. You're talking to someone that owned the GF7, which is a lovely little camera that I enjoyed using despite having no viewfinder and no IBIS. I'm familiar with the platform it's built on, which is the one used for the G100.
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LeMala
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You mean, reviewed by content creators they carefully selected to pump the sunshine. We have yet to see actual content creators incorporating the S9 into their workflow. The market they want already has the tools they need.
bluevellet
Veteran Member
S9 is so barebones, it doesn't even quite fulfill its promise as a camera for content creator (aka video). The software seems to be there, but the hardware isn't.
As a more still oriented user, I'd even ditch the IBIS and forgo the EVF, just to have a mechanical shutter or a stacked sensor.
Cafe Racer
Veteran Member
If those are the same content creators that trashed the G100 then Panasonic really has problems.
Actual content creators don't just produce camera related videos, so the audience may never know what equipment was incorporated into their workflow.
And new tools are continuously being produced.
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ardohy
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Wow yeah and €1700 they are asking. Shocking miss.
LeMala
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Based on recent revelation there are probably a lot fewer content creators getting hands on with Lumix cameras in general. :-D
But some do and are happy to share what they use and why. If you are suggesting there are secret S9 users out there somewhere I would love to see evidence. It appears everything on my feed was shot with a mobile or a GoPro.
...by Apple, Samsung and Huawei.
Cafe Racer
Veteran Member
Yes, that's right and some don't and are not interested in sharing what they use.
No, I'm not suggesting that, there's just plenty of Content Creators that do not give information about their kit because it's not relevant to their content or income stream.
Yes, and by camera companies too.
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your feed is always filled with similar content, maybe that’s why.
i see people using all type of cameras. GoPro, dji, om-1, gh6, a6700, A7iv , …
There is no guarantee a content creator will show what the brand wants. Many as clearly show the camera limitations
But, camera brand that chose manly ambassadors for their release are 100% pumping it.
You could argue the same for every market.
People with om-1 already had the tools they need. Why om-1 ii?
Lepewhi
Veteran Member
Granted, I'm not a Content Creator. But, it seems to me to be so much hype. I think that most Content Creators actually use their phones. Take for instance the G100. This was pitched as a Content Creators camera. So, it received bad press, as some felt that it was not a good camera for that. However, for stills, it's quite capable. Yes, no IBIS, and blah, blah, blah... I have nothing against people who do CC, but why are camera companies clammering to produce cameras specifically for them. I understand that they feel that they can tap into a new emerging market. Most cameras(and smartphones/Iphones) can handle that. But, that's just my thought.
Adam-T
Veteran Member
Not without IBIS and PDAF which this kind of video really needs , I doubt many Vloggers would use the nice upgraded EVF either ..
IMO the G100D gave Pan an opportunity to forget its failed vlogging target market for this cam and embrace that it`s gained a cult following as a tiny G series and remove the fancy mic system and stuff more of the guts of the GX9 in there such as the full shutter and IBIS , shame they didn`t but it did get a nice EVF .
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Cafe Racer
Veteran Member
Thanks for your input. It probably seems like hype to you because you're unfamiliar with what's potentially involved. I have no idea what percentage of people create video content using dedicated cameras vs smartphones but many people I see and have spoken to shooting video content in London are using dedicated cameras. Sony cameras are a common choice. I think it really depends on what people are shooting, how they choose to shoot it and the difference between casual, serious and professional content creation.
It was pitched specifically as a 'vlogging' camera and that's what it received bad press for.
It's also capable for video, just not particularly good for smooth vlogging footage unless attached to a gimbal.
To make money!
Lepewhi
Veteran Member
Points well taken
pipituni
Leading Member
surely they didn't develop a brand new 25 mp PDAF sensor just to put in 1 camera body?
they have the sensor, they have finally embraced IBIS and they have some of my favourite RF style aesthetics
now all they need to do is join the dots and listen to what pretty much the entire camera community (incl. young content creators) is clamouring for - premium compacts
there is no equal to the m43 compact size when combined with the fantastic compact lenses we have
The S9 is 126 x 74 x 47 mm, 486g without the optional grip
The A7Cii is 124 x 71 x 63 mm, 514g including grip and protruding eyecup for EVF
The OM5 is 125 x 85 x 50mm, 414g including grip and protruding eyecup
The EP7 is 118 x 69 x 38mm, 337g
I prefer centre EVF for larger bodies and the OM5 grip is handy. I can shoot with the GM1 and the Sigma Merrills (no grip and no EVF). With a lens of any size at all a centre EVF makes shooting a more natural experience for me.
The 12-45/4 is pretty compact and also a premium lens. It feels a bit big on the OM5. Of course we have some small primes, but they are a mixed bunch in terms of characteristics and copy variation.
Sony seem to be putting a lot of effort into G primes and zooms, both FF and APSC.
For example
The 20/2.5 G is optically slightly better and £100 cheaper from Wex than the 20/1.4 today. The higher SA of the 20/1.4 is probably a deliberate design choice for smooth background bokeh - so I'd take that as a plus.
You can make endless comparisons between systems, but I'd not make broad generalisations. Actually, I'm happy to have choices between two large and rather different lens catalogues.
Not being a content creator, I'm not sure what they look for in lenses. Maybe it's as variable as it is for other photographers. I guess Panasonic will have a view what lenses they need to add to L-mount to make the S9 attractive. If it succeeds they might revisit their strategy not to make smaller or RF style MFT bodies.
Meanwhile OMDS will carry on with the EP7 with its tilt screen. Maybe an EP8 will have PDAF and WR in addition to the IBIS of the EP7. They clearly have a good demand in Japan, enough demand in Europe, and not enough demand to justify selling in North America.
Actually developing a premium EP8 with subject detection, PDAF, uploadable Custom Modes, and better smartphone integration ought to be part of any rational platform technology strategy for OMDS.
Andrew
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LeMala
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Which means you cannot tell anyway so why would they need a S9?
You mean it does not affect their reach and influence. So no reason to use S9.
Camera company products are a rounding error by comparison. There are 1.4B camera phones sold every year and 8M cameras.
Cafe Racer
Veteran Member
Much like photography, gear choice for video content creation can tend to be subjective as well as being dictated by budget.The S9 is 126 x 74 x 47 mm, 486g without the optional grip
The A7Cii is 124 x 71 x 63 mm, 514g including grip and protruding eyecup for EVF
The OM5 is 125 x 85 x 50mm, 414g including grip and protruding eyecup
The EP7 is 118 x 69 x 38mm, 337g
I prefer centre EVF for larger bodies and the OM5 grip is handy. I can shoot with the GM1 and the Sigma Merrills (no grip and no EVF). With a lens of any size at all a centre EVF makes shooting a more natural experience for me.
The 12-45/4 is pretty compact and also a premium lens. It feels a bit big on the OM5. Of course we have some small primes, but they are a mixed bunch in terms of characteristics and copy variation.
Sony seem to be putting a lot of effort into G primes and zooms, both FF and APSC.
For example
The 20/2.5 G is optically slightly better and £100 cheaper from Wex than the 20/1.4 today. The higher SA of the 20/1.4 is probably a deliberate design choice for smooth background bokeh - so I'd take that as a plus.
You can make endless comparisons between systems, but I'd not make broad generalisations. Actually, I'm happy to have choices between two large and rather different lens catalogues.
Not being a content creator, I'm not sure what they look for in lenses. Maybe it's as variable as it is for other photographers.
I see no reason why Panasonic cannot produce a video focused m4/3 camera that's reasonably compact and can serve as a good all rounder targeting solo video content creators.
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Cafe Racer
Veteran Member
Which is what I was pointing out as highlighted above.
Who said anything about needing an S9?
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Cafe Racer
Veteran Member
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