A Few Questions Regarding Medium Format

Batdude said:

The Fujifilm 50S is not a sports camera, is a medium format, correct? How come Fujifilm immediately removed the ISO and SS top dials on the 50SII?? I don't get that. IMHO I think Fujifilm is ruining the feeling by removing the top dials.

Thanks.

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I agree, seems mad to me as well but manufacturers do some odd things. I’m sure there are some users that like not having the dials though.

Batdude said:

1. How come there is no dedicated Fujifilm GFX medium format forum?

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Anticipated message volume, I suspect.

Batdude said:

2. Out of plain curiosity I took a look at Fujifilm's website GFX availability and how come there is not even a wide angle zoom lens available, not even in the road map? Widest is a 23mm prime lens only.

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20-35 wide enough for you?

Batdude said:

3. Will there be any third party lens support for G mount any time soon?

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I think there already is.

Batdude said:

4. Are there any interesting and awesome portrait lenses you can pop on with a Fringer adapter to get AF?

4. The Fujifilm 50S is not a sports camera, is a medium format, correct? How come Fujifilm immediately removed the ISO and SS top dials on the 50SII??

Click to expand...

Probably because they got pushback from people who wanted a PASM user interface.

Batdude said:

I don't get that. IMHO I think Fujifilm is ruining the feeling by removing the top dials.

Click to expand...

I like the top dials, too.

Batdude said:

Thanks.

Click to expand...

Batdude said:

1. How come there is no dedicated Fujifilm GFX medium format forum?

2. Out of plain curiosity I took a look at Fujifilm's website GFX availability and how come there is not even a wide angle zoom lens available, not even in the road map? Widest is a 23mm prime lens only.

Click to expand...

Not sure what roadmap you're looking at?

https://fujifilm-x.com/global/products/g-mount-lens-roadmap/

Batdude said:

3. Will there be any third party lens support for G mount any time soon?

4. Are there any interesting and awesome portrait lenses you can pop on with a Fringer adapter to get AF?

4. The Fujifilm 50S is not a sports camera, is a medium format, correct? How come Fujifilm immediately removed the ISO and SS top dials on the 50SII?? I don't get that. IMHO I think Fujifilm is ruining the feeling by removing the top dials.

Thanks.

Click to expand...

I'm not a medium format shooter... yet. But I suspect I will be in the future.

I do hope you know that Fuji GFX has changed the landscape for digital medium format? They have created a much lower price of entry, along with unique offerings that make a transition from other formats much more "familiar". I believe their -already proven- success in this market suggests they might just know what they are doing.

BTW, did you also ask the Canon forum why no 3rd party RF lenses?

koweb said:

(...) Fuji GFX has changed the landscape for digital medium format? They have created a much lower price of entry, along with unique offerings that make a transition from other formats much more "familiar". I believe their -already proven- success in this market suggests they might just know what they are doing.

Click to expand...

I give Pentax the nod for being the first in providing 33x44mm sensor medium format at a palatable price (Pentax 645D) along with common DSLR familiarity... then followed up with the 645Z.

I think Fuji came along roughly seven (7) years later.

I don't usually do portraits but a friend is asking so I will bring these two lenses, with adapters. One has AF, other is MF

Canon 200mm f/1.8

Zeiss 85mm f/1.4 Otus

I hope to get some pop

JimKasson said:

Batdude said:

1. How come there is no dedicated Fujifilm GFX medium format forum?

Click to expand...

Anticipated message volume, I suspect.

JimKasson said:

2. Out of plain curiosity I took a look at Fujifilm's website GFX availability and how come there is not even a wide angle zoom lens available, not even in the road map? Widest is a 23mm prime lens only.

Click to expand...

20-35 wide enough for you?

Click to expand...

Medium format 20mm is what 16mm on FF? It could work. One FL lens I have been wanting is the Sigma 14-24. Very decent wide angle but I would prefer it just a little wider because often I photoshoot right in front of stages and don't have flexibility to move back.

JimKasson said:

JimKasson said:

3. Will there be any third party lens support for G mount any time soon?

Click to expand...

I think there already is.

JimKasson said:

4. Are there any interesting and awesome portrait lenses you can pop on with a Fringer adapter to get AF?

4. The Fujifilm 50S is not a sports camera, is a medium format, correct? How come Fujifilm immediately removed the ISO and SS top dials on the 50SII??

Click to expand...

Probably because they got pushback from people who wanted a PASM user interface.

JimKasson said:

I don't get that. IMHO I think Fujifilm is ruining the feeling by removing the top dials.

Click to expand...

I like the top dials, too.

JimKasson said:

Thanks.

Click to expand...

Click to expand...

Batdude said:

JimKasson said:

Batdude said:

1. How come there is no dedicated Fujifilm GFX medium format forum?

Click to expand...

Anticipated message volume, I suspect.

Batdude said:

2. Out of plain curiosity I took a look at Fujifilm's website GFX availability and how come there is not even a wide angle zoom lens available, not even in the road map? Widest is a 23mm prime lens only.

Click to expand...

20-35 wide enough for you?

Click to expand...

Medium format 20mm is what 16mm on FF?

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14.5 mm in the short direction. 16.4 mm in the long direction.

Batdude said:

It could work. One FL lens I have been wanting is the Sigma 14-24. Very decent wide angle but I would prefer it just a little wider because often I photoshoot right in front of stages and don't have flexibility to move back.

Batdude said:

Batdude said:

3. Will there be any third party lens support for G mount any time soon?

Click to expand...

I think there already is.

Batdude said:

4. Are there any interesting and awesome portrait lenses you can pop on with a Fringer adapter to get AF?

4. The Fujifilm 50S is not a sports camera, is a medium format, correct? How come Fujifilm immediately removed the ISO and SS top dials on the 50SII??

Click to expand...

Probably because they got pushback from people who wanted a PASM user interface.

Batdude said:

I don't get that. IMHO I think Fujifilm is ruining the feeling by removing the top dials.

Click to expand...

I like the top dials, too.

Batdude said:

Thanks.

Click to expand...

Click to expand...

Click to expand...

Batdude said:

1. How come there is no dedicated Fujifilm GFX medium format forum?

Click to expand...

I thought this was it

Batdude said:

2. Out of plain curiosity I took a look at Fujifilm's website GFX availability and how come there is not even a wide angle zoom lens available, not even in the road map? Widest is a 23mm prime lens only.

Click to expand...

I've noticed as well. While I find wide zoom lenses very useful, a 23mm prime is notably wider than what I get with a 28-45 lens, and there are some times I'd much rather have a really wide prime though I probably prefer the zoom in most cases.

On the larger sensor camera's, I'd much rather a manufacturer keen on making a premium 23mm lens or wider lens, as distortion free as practical... as opposed to having a zoom that compromises on being able to provide that wider field of view.

My beloved Pentax 28-45 f/4.5 that is a quality bread-n-butter lens, however wide primes are what's most common, and I think more in-demand.

Pentax discontinued its 25mm prime (replaced by the wide zoom)... and some other lenses including their longer focal length lenses 300, 400, 600mm.. It's one of the benefits of shooting Pentax; lenses to choose from, and thankfully a lot of those lenses are still readily available whether you're shooting medium format digital or 120 film.

Primes are the order of the day..

https://dtcommercialphoto.com/product-category/phaseone/ls-lenses/

https://www.hasselblad.com/x-system/lenses/

--

Teila K. Day
http://teiladay.com

Batdude said:

JimKasson said:

Batdude said:

1. How come there is no dedicated Fujifilm GFX medium format forum?

Click to expand...

Anticipated message volume, I suspect.

Batdude said:

2. Out of plain curiosity I took a look at Fujifilm's website GFX availability and how come there is not even a wide angle zoom lens available, not even in the road map? Widest is a 23mm prime lens only.

Click to expand...

20-35 wide enough for you?

Click to expand...

Medium format 20mm is what 16mm on FF? It could work. One FL lens I have been wanting is the Sigma 14-24. Very decent wide angle but I would prefer it just a little wider because often I photoshoot right in front of stages and don't have flexibility to move back.

Batdude said:

Batdude said:

3. Will there be any third party lens support for G mount any time soon?

Click to expand...

I think there already is.

Batdude said:

4. Are there any interesting and awesome portrait lenses you can pop on with a Fringer adapter to get AF?

4. The Fujifilm 50S is not a sports camera, is a medium format, correct? How come Fujifilm immediately removed the ISO and SS top dials on the 50SII??

Click to expand...

Probably because they got pushback from people who wanted a PASM user interface.

Batdude said:

I don't get that. IMHO I think Fujifilm is ruining the feeling by removing the top dials.

Click to expand...

I like the top dials, too.

Batdude said:

Thanks.

Click to expand...

Click to expand...

Click to expand...

I am not sure that shooting things taking place on a stage (presumably music or theatre) is really what the GFX was intended for.

The GF20-35 is on the roadmap and I think is due this year sometime but I can't recall the exact date given.

Teila Day said:

Teila Day said:

Fuji GFX has changed the landscape for digital medium format? They have created a much lower price of entry, along with unique offerings that make a transition from other formats much more "familiar". I believe their -already proven- success in this market suggests they might just know what they are doing.

Click to expand...

I give Pentax the nod for being the first in providing 33x44mm sensor medium format at a palatable price (Pentax 645D) along with common DSLR familiarity... then followed up with the 645Z.

I think Fuji came along roughly seven (7) years later.

Click to expand...

At first I thought no way, it wasn't seven years--but upon investigation, it was more than six years, so that's close:



So although I can't recall what was the least expensive digital medium format camera or really body + back before the Pentax 645D, and although the GFX 50S upon introduction and the GFX 50R (at $3500 net!) a couple of years ago set new lows, it seems likely that Pentax led the way with a larger percentage price reduction, compared to what was available before, than what has come since.

Methodology: Announcement dates were taken from each DPReview news item, as were initial prices, except for the GFX 50S, whose initial price was stated then as well below $10,000 not given as a dollar figure until later. Adjustments are by U.S. Consumer Price Index through the government's calculator (at https://data.bls.gov/cgi-bin/cpicalc.pl) to July 2022 (the last month for which it is available).

NAwlins Contrarian said:

NAwlins Contrarian said:

NAwlins Contrarian said:

Fuji GFX has changed the landscape for digital medium format? They have created a much lower price of entry, along with unique offerings that make a transition from other formats much more "familiar". I believe their -already proven- success in this market suggests they might just know what they are doing.

Click to expand...

I give Pentax the nod for being the first in providing 33x44mm sensor medium format at a palatable price (Pentax 645D) along with common DSLR familiarity... then followed up with the 645Z.

I think Fuji came along roughly seven (7) years later.

Click to expand...

At first I thought no way, it wasn't seven years--but upon investigation, it was more than six years, so that's close:



So although I can't recall what was the least expensive digital medium format camera or really body + back before the Pentax 645D, and although the GFX 50S upon introduction and the GFX 50R (at $3500 net!) a couple of years ago set new lows, it seems likely that Pentax led the way with a larger percentage price reduction, compared to what was available before, than what has come since.

Methodology: Announcement dates were taken from each DPReview news item, as were initial prices, except for the GFX 50S, whose initial price was stated then as well below $10,000 not given as a dollar figure until later. Adjustments are by U.S. Consumer Price Index through the government's calculator (at https://data.bls.gov/cgi-bin/cpicalc.pl) to July 2022 (the last month for which it is available).

Click to expand...

It's worth noting that the 645D uses a CCD sensor.

--
https://blog.kasson.com

JimKasson said:

JimKasson said:

JimKasson said:

JimKasson said:

Fuji GFX has changed the landscape for digital medium format? They have created a much lower price of entry, along with unique offerings that make a transition from other formats much more "familiar". I believe their -already proven- success in this market suggests they might just know what they are doing.

Click to expand...

I give Pentax the nod for being the first in providing 33x44mm sensor medium format at a palatable price (Pentax 645D) along with common DSLR familiarity... then followed up with the 645Z.

I think Fuji came along roughly seven (7) years later.

Click to expand...

At first I thought no way, it wasn't seven years--but upon investigation, it was more than six years, so that's close:



So although I can't recall what was the least expensive digital medium format camera or really body + back before the Pentax 645D, and although the GFX 50S upon introduction and the GFX 50R (at $3500 net!) a couple of years ago set new lows, it seems likely that Pentax led the way with a larger percentage price reduction, compared to what was available before, than what has come since.

Methodology: Announcement dates were taken from each DPReview news item, as were initial prices, except for the GFX 50S, whose initial price was stated then as well below $10,000 not given as a dollar figure until later. Adjustments are by U.S. Consumer Price Index through the government's calculator (at https://data.bls.gov/cgi-bin/cpicalc.pl) to July 2022 (the last month for which it is available).

Click to expand...

It's worth noting that the 645D uses a CCD sensor.

Click to expand...

Yep. Also, FWIW:

(1) I think the first medium format CMOS sensor was the Sony 44x33mm 51 MP used in all of those except the 645D, and the sensor was introduced in maybe late 2013.

(2) Memory is hazy, but I seem to think maybe the least expensive medium format digital before the Pentax 645D was a Mamiya kit with one of the M645 AF-D models (II or III?) with a back featuring a 22 MP, 49x37mm CCD sensor, that was not well-regarded. I think that a slightly revamped version of the back was later called the ZD back.

Batdude said:

4. Are there any interesting and awesome portrait lenses you can pop on with a Fringer adapter to get AF?

Click to expand...

Sigma 135mm f/1.8





Canon 200mm f/2.8 II



Both have some imperfections in use, but for how little they cost compared to GF glass, I can live with it.

--

NAwlins Contrarian said:

Yep. Also, FWIW:

(1) I think the first medium format CMOS sensor was the Sony 44x33mm 51 MP used in all of those except the 645D, and the sensor was introduced in maybe late 2013.

(2) Memory is hazy, but I seem to think maybe the least expensive medium format digital before the Pentax 645D was a Mamiya kit with one of the M645 AF-D models (II or III?) with a back featuring a 22 MP, 49x37mm CCD sensor, that was not well-regarded. I think that a slightly revamped version of the back was later called the ZD back.

Click to expand...

I think it was probably the least expensive at the time, but if memory serves me correctly, it was a dog and the price wasn't such that compelled people to buy. Other than price, what was the advantage over similar medium format offerings?

When I think of the cheaper (worthy) medium format cameras of the mid to late aughts, I think of Hasselblad mainly.


The Pentax 645Z for example was notably less than $10k USD, offered a higher frame rate than most MF cameras, multiple focus points, high iso performance (cmos), weather resistant, tilt screen, no back-to-body connectivity issues (one piece), and relatively cheap (and plentiful) lenses including 200, 300, 400 and 600mm focal lengths.

The Pentax 645Z was basically like buying any other Pentax off-the-shelf, but with a larger sensor - at the time, other MF manufacturers weren't give that kind of user experience... and this was at a time where many MF shooters still had a painfully slow, electronically glitchy, battery eating, single-center-focus-point, non weather resistant medium format camera in their midsts.

The Pentax 645D changed the game. Pentax I think was the first company that offered a digital medium format solution that made 40, 50, and 60mp options from Phase/Hasselblad's pricing look silly when doing an overall price-to-performance analysis against Pentax's 645Z.

All I have is this from the 200/1.8, people-wise









--
GFX100s and Lenses

Teila Day said:

koweb said:

(...) Fuji GFX has changed the landscape for digital medium format? They have created a much lower price of entry, along with unique offerings that make a transition from other formats much more "familiar". I believe their -already proven- success in this market suggests they might just know what they are doing.

Click to expand...

I give Pentax the nod for being the first in providing 33x44mm sensor medium format at a palatable price (Pentax 645D) along with common DSLR familiarity... then followed up with the 645Z.

I think Fuji came along roughly seven (7) years later.

Click to expand...

Yes, totally agree. But, you'll note that I didn't say Fuji was the first, rather that they changed the landscape. Part of why I say that is watching Fuji's development of the GFX system, then seeing Pentax basically abandon their MF systems while Hasselblad seemed to be making very slow changes. As the OP and others alluded to, this forum seems to be more the "GFX forum" than the "MF Forum". If nothing else, Fuji GFX dominates the current discussion around MF.

This is just my "non-expert" and "outsiders" view and I am on this forum to continue to learn from those much more experienced on MF. So I stand to be corrected.

Of course, interesting timing, Hasselblad seems to have woken from a long nap to introduce the X2D 100C today... so maybe the conversation will change, again.

koweb said:

Teila Day said:

koweb said:

(...) Fuji GFX has changed the landscape for digital medium format? They have created a much lower price of entry, along with unique offerings that make a transition from other formats much more "familiar". I believe their -already proven- success in this market suggests they might just know what they are doing.

Click to expand...

I give Pentax the nod for being the first in providing 33x44mm sensor medium format at a palatable price (Pentax 645D) along with common DSLR familiarity... then followed up with the 645Z.

I think Fuji came along roughly seven (7) years later.

Click to expand...

Yes, totally agree. But, you'll note that I didn't say Fuji was the first, rather that they changed the landscape.

Click to expand...

Fuji did a heck of a job developing the GFX system and I commend them all the time for doing so. Other manufacturers should take note and it seem like Hasselblad has done a better job this time around as their new camera has some nice features.

Part of why I say that is watching Fuji's development of the GFX system said:

koweb said:

koweb said:

Batdude, post: 66458933, member: 1441042"]
1. How come there is no dedicated Fujifilm GFX medium format forum?

Teila: "I thought this was it"

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This is just my "non-expert" and "outsiders" view and I am on this forum to continue to learn from those much more experienced on MF. So I stand to be corrected.

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Nothing to correct - Fuji has done a phenomenal job as you mentioned. You're right on the money.

koweb said:

Of course, interesting timing, Hasselblad seems to have woken from a long nap to introduce the X2D 100C today... so maybe the conversation will change, again.

Click to expand...

I think you're right again. In my view, the X2D 100C is the most interesting camera that Hasselblad has put out in quite some time. The X1D didn't get my attention, but this iteration looks like Hasselblad put forth more effort. Good for Hasselblad. I'd like to see them stick around.

--
Teila K. Day
http://teiladay.com

[/QUOTE]

Teila Day said:

koweb said:

(...) Fuji GFX has changed the landscape for digital medium format? They have created a much lower price of entry, along with unique offerings that make a transition from other formats much more "familiar". I believe their -already proven- success in this market suggests they might just know what they are doing.

Click to expand...

I give Pentax the nod for being the first in providing 33x44mm sensor medium format at a palatable price (Pentax 645D) along with common DSLR familiarity... then followed up with the 645Z.

I think Fuji came along roughly seven (7) years later.

Click to expand...

I would agree that Pentax 645D was the first affordable MFD camera, in a timeframe when competition came at three times the price.

One thing to consider is that there are a lot of Pentax 645 lenses available on places like E-Bay. So we can build an affordable system around it.

With GFX, Fujifilm offers both a modern sensor with affordable pricing, in the GFX 100 models, and also really low prices on GFX 50 models.

I think that the GF system was introduced at the right time and at the right price, especially with the 50R.

Best regards

Erik

Charles_S said:

Charles_S said:

4. Are there any interesting and awesome portrait lenses you can pop on with a Fringer adapter to get AF?

Click to expand...

Sigma 135mm f/1.8



Canon 200mm f/2.8 II



Both have some imperfections in use, but for how little they cost compared to GF glass, I can live with it.

Click to expand...

Nice photos.

I am REALLY interested in (learning) more about what lenses can be adapted to the Fujifilm G mount to get AF.

I am starting to enter an entire new world, the world of shooting weddings and I'm "looking" into a Fujifilm GFX body, but for weddings I mainly need the flexibility of zoom lenses, I need a really nice wide angle similar FL like the Sigma 14-24mm equivalent and a tighter lens that covers around 35 to 100mm, are there any lenses from any brand close to the focal length of the Fuji 45-100 F4 that work with a Fringer AF adapter? For weddings I need lenses that respond fairly fast and accurate.

And what kind of imperfections do your lenses have that you notice?

Thanks.