please read my 2nd response to OP!
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Changing my thinking when shooting with a 5DSR
- Thread starter denverdonate
- Start date
I read all of your posts in this thread and I still don't get your point here. I've have tried overtime to understand it, but it does not make sense to me.
Lawn Lends
Senior Member
He may not understand the difference between making an in-camera jpeg and making a jpeg copy from an in-camera RAW file copied from the camera.
Huh?
John Sheehy
Forum Pro
It should be the case that if you get focus with the 90D, a normalized subject with the same optics and shutter speed should be less noisy than the 7D2 or 5DSR in any light, especially with HTP enabled at low and medium ISOs in the shadows. You are probably looking at over-sharpened 100% pixel views. Canon does not make any sensor with less noise in an APS-C area than the 90D/M6-II sensor, except that the base-ISO DR goes a little deeper with the 1Dx3 (but the cropped 1Dx3 is not better at high ISOs).
The fact that a sensor with higher pixel density provides finer details, doesn't mean that you have to sharpen the finest details, especially when comparing to a lower pixel density. You are exaggerating what does't even exist with the other options.
Customer: "What is the difference between the handling in these 2 cars?"
Salesman: "Car A gets tough to handle at its top speed of 180 MPH. Car B is a little bit easier to handle at its top speed of 110 MPH."
Customer: "That settles it, I'll take the better-handling car B."
denverdonate
Well-known member
I know, these files are huge and packed with lots of image capture but that was the point of my post entirely. My 1DSMKII and 1DSMKIII easily pulled full-page spreads (about A3 size) for magazines. I don't mean home printer or a larger poster printer that up-sizes the image with its software, I mean offset press.
What I find the 5DSR can do that almost none of the other Canon bodies can do is be cropped in substantially. This is %100 due to the 50 megapixel size. None of these other bodies can do this it's a very unique thing that I had only ever seen done myself with 67 slide film. (medium format) This is just from my experience so this could be truer or less so for someone with more experience with this.
During these riots in the city I live in I was a few floors up in my apartment standing on my balcony and could see the police taking down people in the parking lot that's probably 100+ feet from where I was. I took a picture with my 5DSR + 21mm Zeiss and the image filled up only a tiny part of the frame. Download this JPG and open it in Photoshop then click zoom to %100. All of that area on the photo would be 300DPI and totally usable retaining detail. That's what you can do with the 5DSR and what makes it even better is that the "R" model has no low-pass anti-aliasing filter. That is impossible to do with a 16.7 or 21 megapixel image.
View attachment 77a2e5c0c0c04d84b0e1536fcc69648d.jpg
5DSR pixel dimensions
Here another image that shows a crop into a 5DSR image. This image is not the original dimensions because like you said the JPG files are so big so I resized it into a composite to show what I'm referring to. That detail comes from a tiny portion of the image you can barely even see. Look at all of that detail in a portion of the image so small you can barely see where it's from. That's the real strength of the Canon 5DSR over every Canon 1D series body.
5DSR Crop
What I find the 5DSR can do that almost none of the other Canon bodies can do is be cropped in substantially. This is %100 due to the 50 megapixel size. None of these other bodies can do this it's a very unique thing that I had only ever seen done myself with 67 slide film. (medium format) This is just from my experience so this could be truer or less so for someone with more experience with this.
During these riots in the city I live in I was a few floors up in my apartment standing on my balcony and could see the police taking down people in the parking lot that's probably 100+ feet from where I was. I took a picture with my 5DSR + 21mm Zeiss and the image filled up only a tiny part of the frame. Download this JPG and open it in Photoshop then click zoom to %100. All of that area on the photo would be 300DPI and totally usable retaining detail. That's what you can do with the 5DSR and what makes it even better is that the "R" model has no low-pass anti-aliasing filter. That is impossible to do with a 16.7 or 21 megapixel image.
View attachment 77a2e5c0c0c04d84b0e1536fcc69648d.jpg
5DSR pixel dimensions
Here another image that shows a crop into a 5DSR image. This image is not the original dimensions because like you said the JPG files are so big so I resized it into a composite to show what I'm referring to. That detail comes from a tiny portion of the image you can barely even see. Look at all of that detail in a portion of the image so small you can barely see where it's from. That's the real strength of the Canon 5DSR over every Canon 1D series body.
5DSR Crop
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denverdonate
Well-known member
The 5DSR RAW (.CR2) files can get much bigger than 70....this is one of my 5DSR RAW files and the resulting JPG file saved after importing the RAW file with Photoshop. That's quite a bit of detail captured.
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denverdonate
Well-known member
denverdonate
Well-known member
Yea, his post confused me as well...images do better than my explanation maybe.
5DSR RAW and JPG files
5DSR RAW and JPG files
denverdonate
Well-known member
Yes, you said what I was saying but in a clearer and more concise manner. The real strength of the 5DSR....cropping power.
John Sheehy
Forum Pro
What ISO and picture style? Some max-quality, full-res OOC JPEGs should be down around 25MP (or less) with the 5Dsr at ISO 100.
The sharper the image, the more noise there is, the larger the hi-Q JPEG, per original RAW pixel.
EDIT: I see in another post that you used Photoshop first. Photoshop may have increased the apparent detail or used less compression than the camera would have.
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i fully understand this, denverdonate, this lower chart shoes the CR2 files, that perectly alright and expected from 5DsR--now show me a column to indicate these CR2 files converted to jepeg files!!! my point is not the CR2 files, it is when CR2 files are converted to jpeg, which is about half of the CR2 files. i hope i was able to communicate my point!denverdonate said:
by the way, where and how did you get that jpeg file at 86.8MB? when i use DPP for file conversion, like i have said many many times before, i end up pretty much with almost half of the RAW file, which is expected due to jpeg being a high file compression standard.
where this 86.8 MP JPG file come from???? i don't see any column to show jpeg files and their sizes, CR2 files only?Member said:
--
We are ephemeral dreamers, like surfers on evanescent waves!!!
where is the jpeg file colum in this chart that indicate the size of the jpeg files???? and how did you get the jpeg file size????
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We are ephemeral dreamers, like surfers on evanescent waves!!!
i understand every word you are saying, but that is not my argument here, not at all, in fact that is mere fact! let me explain something very simple: RC2 file from 5DsR camera is about, lets say 60MB on the average--now if this CR2 file is converted to lossy compressed file standard, which jpeg is, then your 60MB CR2 file shrinks into say, 28MB jpeg, which is perfectly understandable and expected! so, the question is: how can a 28MB jpeg file gives you so much latitude to magnify a spot so much? that is the question! oh, and please, i don't want to hear about comparing 5DsR to other cameras or what lens is used, etc, etc, etc...i understand all of that perfectly, my only specific question is about files size and conversion, please!
View attachment 77a2e5c0c0c04d84b0e1536fcc69648d.jpg
5DSR pixel dimensions
Here another image that shows a crop into a 5DSR image. This image is not the original dimensions because like you said the JPG files are so big so I resized it into a composite to show what I'm referring to. That detail comes from a tiny portion of the image you can barely even see. Look at all of that detail in a portion of the image so small you can barely see where it's from. That's the real strength of the Canon 5DSR over every Canon 1D series body.
5DSR Crop
--
We are ephemeral dreamers, like surfers on evanescent waves!!!
denverdonate
Well-known member
I just set the picture style to fine detail inside the 5DSR. I meant to look up what the other styles do and you comment reminded me to do just that. Any suggestion on them? Also, the shot I posted was 100 ISO.
denverdonate
Well-known member
That comes from opening the .CR2 file in ACR ,making adjustments, then saving as a JPG.
denverdonate
Well-known member
That file comes from opening the .CR2 in Adobe Camera Raw, making adjustments, then saving out the JPG file.
denverdonate
Well-known member
You saw in another comment that my JPG saved from the Canon .CR2 file was 86 Megs in size not 28. I open the .CR2 in ACR, make the adjustments there, then save the JPG file.
just doesn't make any sense! you are kidding yourself.
I am not looking at over-sharpened 100% pixel views...I simply avoid using a crop sensor in low light, as I said above.
???
Ok, if you are making a general point, fine, but there are other ways to express a point rather than using the word "you", since you have no idea what i am or am not doing.
Geez.
Do you forum hounds ever do any real photography or do you just post all the time? It's like "theoretical photography" here. I can't seem to remember every seeing a single shot of anything from you, John. What kind of photography do you do, again?
Anyway, I think you probably know what you're talking about, but I suspect most don't understand what you are saying.
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