EOS RP or A6400 for upcoming Hawaii trip

Hey all,

Back in March I purchased an A7iii, FE 24-105 G and 50mm f1.8 kit. I used it for a few shoots but ended up selling it a few months ago because I realizEd that for the cost (about $4,500-5,000 CAD), it just wasn't worth it for the number of times using it. I got most of my money back but I want to grab something for an upcoming Hawaii trip. I also briefly (few days) had an RP with RF 35mm (in march as well) which was good, but not as good as the A7iii, so kept the A7iii.

I really liked the RP ergonomics, user experience, touch screen, etc and got some good shots with it, but was bummed about the Eye AF, tracking, etc (this was with FW 1.0).

Here's what I prefer to shoot: Landscapes, street, our dogs.

Hoping some people can shine some light on the RP vs A6400, specifically:

- Is there a clear cut winner, if so why?

- Is the RP significantly closer to the 6400 with FW 1.4?

- The 6400 has object tracking (which the A7iii lacks), how is object tracking with the RP comparatively (with the new firmware)?

- How is low light performance? Hoping to get some night shots around Hawaii

- What starter lens(es) would you recommend (the RF 35mm is only $225 USD when purchased with the RP so I'd get that), but hoping for something with some long reach. For the 6400, not sure what would be good to start.

Here are the purchasing options we have in canada right now:

• 6400: $1299 CAD (999 USD) base
• 6400: $1399 CAD ($1050 USD) with the 16-35,
• 6400: $1749 CAD ($1325 USD) with the 18-135
• RP: $1299 CAD (999 USD) base, includes EF to RF adapter
• RP: $1599 CAD (1200 USD) with RF 35
• RP: $1999 CAD (1500 USD) with the RF 24-240 - this is getting a bit expensive, limited low-light performance
• RP: $2499 CAD (1875 USD) with the RF 24-105 - a bit over my price range, limited low-light, less versatile overall.

I feel with both these I could grow to better bodies later on (A7IV, RP2, R2) if I end up making good use of the kit.

Thanks!

Stokkes said:

Hey all,

Back in March I purchased an A7iii, FE 24-105 G and 50mm f1.8 kit. I used it for a few shoots but ended up selling it a few months ago because I realizEd that for the cost (about $4,500-5,000 CAD), it just wasn't worth it for the number of times using it. I got most of my money back but I want to grab something for an upcoming Hawaii trip. I also briefly (few days) had an RP with RF 35mm (in march as well) which was good, but not as good as the A7iii, so kept the A7iii.

Click to expand...

In what ways did you find the RP not as good?

Stokkes said:

I really liked the RP ergonomics, user experience, touch screen, etc and got some good shots with it, but was bummed about the Eye AF, tracking, etc (this was with FW 1.0).

Here's what I prefer to shoot: Landscapes, street, our dogs.

Hoping some people can shine some light on the RP vs A6400, specifically:

- Is there a clear cut winner, if so why?

Click to expand...

No

Stokkes said:

- Is the RP significantly closer to the 6400 with FW 1.4?

Click to expand...

The A6100/A6400/A6600/A7RIV/A9/A9II's tracking AF is considered by many to be significantly better than any of their competition.

Stokkes said:

- The 6400 has object tracking (which the A7iii lacks), how is object tracking with the RP comparatively (with the new firmware)?

- How is low light performance? Hoping to get some night shots around Hawaii

Click to expand...

The RP should do better in this area, but lenses are a factor too.

Stokkes said:

- What starter lens(es) would you recommend (the RF 35mm is only $225 USD when purchased with the RP so I'd get that), but hoping for something with some long reach. For the 6400, not sure what would be good to start.

Click to expand...

Based on what you're saying, I'd definitely recommend the A6400. It has the better AF, more affordable lenses to purchase, and options that would make it just as good in low-light as the RP. For example, if you are considering the Canon 35mm f/1.8 but want something longer, the Sigma 30mm f/1.4 or 56mm f/1.4 would be better focal lengths for you, and because of the larger aperture, could do better in low-light. You could also get the 18-135mm for versatility.

That being said, you still may lose out on the things you liked about the RP like how you preferred the ergonomics, user experience, and touchscreen.

Stokkes said:

Hey all,

Back in March I purchased an A7iii, FE 24-105 G and 50mm f1.8 kit. I used it for a few shoots but ended up selling it a few months ago because I realizEd that for the cost (about $4,500-5,000 CAD), it just wasn't worth it for the number of times using it. I got most of my money back but I want to grab something for an upcoming Hawaii trip. I also briefly (few days) had an RP with RF 35mm (in march as well) which was good, but not as good as the A7iii, so kept the A7iii.

I really liked the RP ergonomics, user experience, touch screen, etc and got some good shots with it, but was bummed about the Eye AF, tracking, etc (this was with FW 1.0).

Here's what I prefer to shoot: Landscapes, street, our dogs.

Hoping some people can shine some light on the RP vs A6400, specifically:

- Is there a clear cut winner, if so why?

- Is the RP significantly closer to the 6400 with FW 1.4?

- The 6400 has object tracking (which the A7iii lacks), how is object tracking with the RP comparatively (with the new firmware)?

- How is low light performance? Hoping to get some night shots around Hawaii

- What starter lens(es) would you recommend (the RF 35mm is only $225 USD when purchased with the RP so I'd get that), but hoping for something with some long reach. For the 6400, not sure what would be good to start.

Here are the purchasing options we have in canada right now:

• 6400: $1299 CAD (999 USD) base
• 6400: $1399 CAD ($1050 USD) with the 16-35,
• 6400: $1749 CAD ($1325 USD) with the 18-135
• RP: $1299 CAD (999 USD) base, includes EF to RF adapter
• RP: $1599 CAD (1200 USD) with RF 35
• RP: $1999 CAD (1500 USD) with the RF 24-240 - this is getting a bit expensive, limited low-light performance
• RP: $2499 CAD (1875 USD) with the RF 24-105 - a bit over my price range, limited low-light, less versatile overall.

I feel with both these I could grow to better bodies later on (A7IV, RP2, R2) if I end up making good use of the kit.

Thanks!

Click to expand...

I'd go with the Canon RP but primarily because the RP can easily use older Canon lenses. For lightweight travel I use the older Canon M5 mirrorless and "pancake" lenses.

www.flickr.com/photos/mmirrorless

I tried both cameras before and recently bought the A6400 to replace my 77D. The RP is full frame and should result in better low light images. But the Sony sensor is very good and I doubt you will see that much of a difference below ISO 3200. In addition, you can use fast primes like the Sigma 16/30/56mm 1.4 to offset the disadvantage of a smaller sensor. Paired with full frame lenses, the RP is considerably bulkier than the Sony. But for me, the most significant argument is Sony's AF System. I used the RP with the RF35mm and, being used to a dslr-system, it just was not up to shooting moving objects. The A6400, on the other hand, was the only mirrorless system that fully convinced me to get rid of my dslr camera. The AF is just incredible. As you said you want to take Pictures of your dogs, I would recommend the Sony, they even included animal eye AF. I am not so happy with the lens choices for the Sony system, though. I use it with the 18-135 kit zoom, which is decent but I am reluctant to spend $700 or more for a 10-18 wide angle lens.

I think that you need to give some thought as to what kind of camera you need.


You have just got rid of the A7iii, which is a great camera, because you didn’t use it very much. Are you getting a new camera just for the Hawaii trip or do you expect to make more use of it after the trip? The A6400, in particular, is inferior to the A7iii. Are you really going to use it more than the A7iii after the trip?

If you are thinking of getting something just for the trip, how about getting something smaller and cheaper, e.g. an older Sony RX100, say the Mk3 or 4, or a Panasonic LX100?

Canon2018 said:

The A6400, on the other hand, was the only mirrorless system that fully convinced me to get rid of my dslr camera. The AF is just incredible. As you said you want to take Pictures of your dogs, I would recommend the Sony, they even included animal eye AF. I am not so happy with the lens choices for the Sony system, though. I use it with the 18-135 kit zoom, which is decent but I am reluctant to spend $700 or more for a 10-18 wide angle lens.

Click to expand...

I have an 800d and I love it but I want to go lighter. The 6400 is what I'm looking at.

are the images from the 6400 as good as the 77d ? I have both the Nano lenses on my canon the 18-135 USM and the 70-300 USM II . I would get the Sony lenses 18-135 and 70-350 if I get the A6400. Autofocus is important to me too

I also had the 18-135 USM on my 77D as well as the 24mm and 60mm 2.8 primes. Like you, I loved my Canon but wanted a smaller system so I bought the A6400. The sharpness of the pictures is amazing. The Sony 18-135 kitzoom produces much clearer images than even my Canon primes. In additon, it is way lighter and smaller. So picture quality is much better with the Sony but the menu is unnecessarily complicated. Once you have it figured out and set up, it won't cause you any more trouble.

Canon2018 said:

I also had the 18-135 USM on my 77D as well as the 24mm and 60mm 2.8 primes. Like you, I loved my Canon but wanted a smaller system so I bought the A6400. The sharpness of the pictures is amazing. The Sony 18-135 kitzoom produces much clearer images than even my Canon primes. In additon, it is way lighter and smaller. So picture quality is much better with the Sony but the menu is unnecessarily complicated. Once you have it figured out and set up, it won't cause you any more trouble.

Click to expand...

Thank you. That's what I needed it to know. My heart will always be with Canon , I just wish the M6ii had a built it EVF and more lenses without having to use an adapter. I know the trade offs with the Sony, the menu, battery life and rolling shutter . I'm used to the menu somehow because I have the RX100 VI but of course Canon's is way much better.

Cato1040 said:

Stokkes said:

Hey all,

Back in March I purchased an A7iii, FE 24-105 G and 50mm f1.8 kit. I used it for a few shoots but ended up selling it a few months ago because I realizEd that for the cost (about $4,500-5,000 CAD), it just wasn't worth it for the number of times using it. I got most of my money back but I want to grab something for an upcoming Hawaii trip. I also briefly (few days) had an RP with RF 35mm (in march as well) which was good, but not as good as the A7iii, so kept the A7iii.

Click to expand...

In what ways did you find the RP not as good?

Click to expand...

Primarily for me was the tracking autofocus that was not as good, but this was back with FW 1.0. I dont' care much for FPS (yes the A7iii is incredibly quick), but it's more the ability to just track a moving subject. I'm more familiar with Sony's system and knew the A7iii had the old "tracking" system for objects, while the A9 and a6400 had the new object tracking system.

This is important for when I take pictures of our dogs. Yes Sony has animal EyeAF, but at a pace a dog can move around the yard, there's no way that the Sony was able to always lock onto the eye, and since it's not a human, it wouldn't go back to Face detection like it would a person/child. When it lost the Eye, the Sony would often scan the frame and not always find the dog moving within the frame.

From what I hear, the object tracking is almost like glue on the 6400/A9 and should work well with dogs.

From some of the videos I was able to find on the 1.4 FW, the tracking seems a lot snappier on the RP than it was when I had it.

Cato1040 said:

Cato1040 said:

I really liked the RP ergonomics, user experience, touch screen, etc and got some good shots with it, but was bummed about the Eye AF, tracking, etc (this was with FW 1.0).

Here's what I prefer to shoot: Landscapes, street, our dogs.

Hoping some people can shine some light on the RP vs A6400, specifically:

- Is there a clear cut winner, if so why?

Click to expand...

No

Cato1040 said:

- Is the RP significantly closer to the 6400 with FW 1.4?

Click to expand...

The A6100/A6400/A6600/A7RIV/A9/A9II's tracking AF is considered by many to be significantly better than any of their competition.

Click to expand...

Even with 1.4? Does it bridge the gap? From my point of reference I have to compare to the A7iii without the object tracking that the 6400 has, so if the RP has gotten better and the gap is closer between the tracking on the A7iii and the RP, then it may be good enough.

Cato1040 said:

Cato1040 said:

- The 6400 has object tracking (which the A7iii lacks), how is object tracking with the RP comparatively (with the new firmware)?

- How is low light performance? Hoping to get some night shots around Hawaii

Click to expand...

The RP should do better in this area, but lenses are a factor too.

Click to expand...

Yes as I figured due to the small sensor.

Cato1040 said:

Cato1040 said:

- What starter lens(es) would you recommend (the RF 35mm is only $225 USD when purchased with the RP so I'd get that), but hoping for something with some long reach. For the 6400, not sure what would be good to start.

Click to expand...

Based on what you're saying, I'd definitely recommend the A6400. It has the better AF, more affordable lenses to purchase, and options that would make it just as good in low-light as the RP. For example, if you are considering the Canon 35mm f/1.8 but want something longer, the Sigma 30mm f/1.4 or 56mm f/1.4 would be better focal lengths for you, and because of the larger aperture, could do better in low-light. You could also get the 18-135mm for versatility.

Click to expand...

Cato1040 said:

That being said, you still may lose out on the things you liked about the RP like how you preferred the ergonomics, user experience, and touchscreen.

Click to expand...

The one thing that's in the back of my mind if going with the 6400 would be to potentially acquire FE lenses so I could upgrade to the A7iv later when it comes out, assuming I'm using the camera and there's a need to upgrade. So one lens I was looking at would be the 85mm f1.8, which would be roughly 127mm / 2.8 and should still produce night brokeh on the 6400.

Canon2018 said:

I tried both cameras before and recently bought the A6400 to replace my 77D. The RP is full frame and should result in better low light images. But the Sony sensor is very good and I doubt you will see that much of a difference below ISO 3200. In addition, you can use fast primes like the Sigma 16/30/56mm 1.4 to offset the disadvantage of a smaller sensor. Paired with full frame lenses, the RP is considerably bulkier than the Sony. But for me, the most significant argument is Sony's AF System. I used the RP with the RF35mm and, being used to a dslr-system, it just was not up to shooting moving objects. The A6400, on the other hand, was the only mirrorless system that fully convinced me to get rid of my dslr camera. The AF is just incredible. As you said you want to take Pictures of your dogs, I would recommend the Sony, they even included animal eye AF. I am not so happy with the lens choices for the Sony system, though. I use it with the 18-135 kit zoom, which is decent but I am reluctant to spend $700 or more for a 10-18 wide angle lens.

Click to expand...

Thanks for the responses!

Did you try the RP with the recent FW? I found the RP incredibly slow as well with the original FW, but from Youtube videos (and even the recent video from DPreview), the new FW seems vastly improved.

I think I would almost surely get the cheapest kit lens for the 6400 and then a decent FE lens for portraits (85mm f1.8) with the hopes that if I start using it more I may want to upgrade.

However, the allure of the RF glass with a future RP2 that has better AF, tracking, etc is hard to resist and I'm patient enough to wait).

Chris R-UK said:

I think that you need to give some thought as to what kind of camera you need.

You have just got rid of the A7iii, which is a great camera, because you didn’t use it very much. Are you getting a new camera just for the Hawaii trip or do you expect to make more use of it after the trip? The A6400, in particular, is inferior to the A7iii. Are you really going to use it more than the A7iii after the trip?

If you are thinking of getting something just for the trip, how about getting something smaller and cheaper, e.g. an older Sony RX100, say the Mk3 or 4, or a Panasonic LX100?

Click to expand...

Thanks Chris, you raise some very good points.

I had an Olympus M43 for years, so going to the RX100 is difficult as I'm used to the flexibility of an ILC.

My primary point was to keep costs down. I spent about 5K on my sony gear and accessories, and I'm hoping to keep the new system to 1.5K, 2K tops.

My hope is that going to Hawaii will rejuvenate my love for photography that I had with the M43 and I fully realize the A6400 is likely the better choice, but there's something I can't put my finger on when handling the RP, it's almost romantic like, but I know Canon has that effect on people. The primary reason I think I'd lean towards the RP is for future growth in the camera system.

For example, I was looking at possibly the RP + RF 35mm, + EF 70-300 which is dirt cheap and a fantastic lens, all that is about 2K and I think would make a quite versatile combo,.

Stokkes said:

Cato1040 said:

In what ways did you find the RP not as good?

Click to expand...

Primarily for me was the tracking autofocus that was not as good, but this was back with FW 1.0. I dont' care much for FPS (yes the A7iii is incredibly quick), but it's more the ability to just track a moving subject. I'm more familiar with Sony's system and knew the A7iii had the old "tracking" system for objects, while the A9 and a6400 had the new object tracking system.

This is important for when I take pictures of our dogs. Yes Sony has animal EyeAF, but at a pace a dog can move around the yard, there's no way that the Sony was able to always lock onto the eye, and since it's not a human, it wouldn't go back to Face detection like it would a person/child. When it lost the Eye, the Sony would often scan the frame and not always find the dog moving within the frame.

Click to expand...

Yes, I find it doesn't work that well for our dog on the A7III mainly because our dog's eyes are black and fur around it is also black.

Stokkes said:

From what I hear, the object tracking is almost like glue on the 6400/A9 and should work well with dogs.

From some of the videos I was able to find on the 1.4 FW, the tracking seems a lot snappier on the RP than it was when I had it.

Stokkes said:

The A6100/A6400/A6600/A7RIV/A9/A9II's tracking AF is considered by many to be significantly better than any of their competition.

Click to expand...

Even with 1.4? Does it bridge the gap? From my point of reference I have to compare to the A7iii without the object tracking that the 6400 has, so if the RP has gotten better and the gap is closer between the tracking on the A7iii and the RP, then it may be good enough.

Click to expand...

I haven't tried the R with the new firmware update, but solely from what I've seen/heard online, the Sony tracking is still much better.

Stokkes said:

Stokkes said:

Based on what you're saying, I'd definitely recommend the A6400. It has the better AF, more affordable lenses to purchase, and options that would make it just as good in low-light as the RP. For example, if you are considering the Canon 35mm f/1.8 but want something longer, the Sigma 30mm f/1.4 or 56mm f/1.4 would be better focal lengths for you, and because of the larger aperture, could do better in low-light. You could also get the 18-135mm for versatility.

That being said, you still may lose out on the things you liked about the RP like how you preferred the ergonomics, user experience, and touchscreen.

Click to expand...

The one thing that's in the back of my mind if going with the 6400 would be to potentially acquire FE lenses so I could upgrade to the A7iv later when it comes out, assuming I'm using the camera and there's a need to upgrade. So one lens I was looking at would be the 85mm f1.8, which would be roughly 127mm / 2.8 and should still produce night brokeh on the 6400.

Click to expand...

Yes, that is an advantage to having one mount for APS-C and FF.

Stokkes said:

Chris R-UK said:

I think that you need to give some thought as to what kind of camera you need.

You have just got rid of the A7iii, which is a great camera, because you didn’t use it very much. Are you getting a new camera just for the Hawaii trip or do you expect to make more use of it after the trip? The A6400, in particular, is inferior to the A7iii. Are you really going to use it more than the A7iii after the trip?

If you are thinking of getting something just for the trip, how about getting something smaller and cheaper, e.g. an older Sony RX100, say the Mk3 or 4, or a Panasonic LX100?

Click to expand...

Thanks Chris, you raise some very good points.

I had an Olympus M43 for years, so going to the RX100 is difficult as I'm used to the flexibility of an ILC.

My primary point was to keep costs down. I spent about 5K on my sony gear and accessories, and I'm hoping to keep the new system to 1.5K, 2K tops.

My hope is that going to Hawaii will rejuvenate my love for photography that I had with the M43 and I fully realize the A6400 is likely the better choice, but there's something I can't put my finger on when handling the RP, it's almost romantic like, but I know Canon has that effect on people. The primary reason I think I'd lean towards the RP is for future growth in the camera system.

For example, I was looking at possibly the RP + RF 35mm, + EF 70-300 which is dirt cheap and a fantastic lens, all that is about 2K and I think would make a quite versatile combo,.

Click to expand...

the large NY online camera retailers have a 30 day return policy - makes it easy to try out new camera gear

www.flickr.com/photos/mmirrorless