BIF with RX100 7 - tips sought

Has anyone been able to squeeze good BIF from this camera? I know distance isn't it's strong point.

Even with birds fairly close by (IF and still) I'm not getting anywhere near good results.

Below is one from Santa Barbara. SOOC







--
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HRC2016 said:

Even with birds fairly close by (IF and still) I'm not getting anywhere near good results.

Click to expand...

Sharp pictures with good details is more about technique than the camera. What focus modes have you tried? Your example was taken from too far and not fast enough shutter speed. Is this a simple crop? Nothing is in focus or is blurred by camera movement.

Last week I went to a raptor demonstration where several Harris's hawks were showing off their hunting technique in the open desert. One person was using a RX100 VI and wondered why she couldn't get a sharp picture, even with the hawks perched on a relatively close snag. She was holding the camera at arm's length and had no idea what shutter speed was being used. With cloudly late afternoon lighting and strong gusty winds the 1/250 shutter speed wasn't fast enough.

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Phil

Hi Phil, i'll check my ss later. I've shot BIF successfully for years but not with a P&S. So I'm wondering if there is something specific with this camera or just my expectations are too high, relative to other formats.

I generally shot single point AF. No spray and pray here.

HRC2016 said:

Hi Phil, i'll check my ss later. I've shot BIF successfully for years but not with a P&S. So I'm wondering if there is something specific with this camera or just my expectations are too high, relative to other formats.

Click to expand...

Again, is this a crop or a down sampled image? If this is a small crop from the entire image, you are shooting from way to far for this camera. How about posting the original unedited JPEG. So far it looks more like poor technique that no camera setting can correct.

Yes I have but it is still only a 200mm fev lens so the bird has to get close to see feather detail. So it’s definitely not a bird camera.

The best way is to have tracking on by default with the single point or flexible spot. Set it in shutter priority and set the shutter speed high enough. So You need good light too. Start AF by centring the bird on the focus point until the tracking box lights up and then Let the camera track and focus. Wait until the bird half fills the frame and shoot. That’s it really.

It's SOOC, uncropped.

I'm probably just shooting too far away, given that the birds are over water and I'm on land.

HRC2016 said:

Has anyone been able to squeeze good BIF from this camera? I know distance isn't it's strong point.

Even with birds fairly close by (IF and still) I'm not getting anywhere near good results.

Below is one from Santa Barbara. SOOC

Click to expand...

I don't have an RX100VII, but my A6400 with 18-135mm lens (equivalent reach) really struggles with most birds unless I'm right on top of them (e.g. at a feeder). Birds are small things that are far away, and many "birders" shoot 400mm-600mm lenses on APSC bodies to get decent shots. You could try resting the RX10 IV or getting closer to the action.

Shutter time was 1/640, f 6.3, ISO 400. I think it's just the limitations of the camera. Next time I'll have to bring a bigger lens or maybe a blind.

Here's one that's slightly better as the bird was a little closer. Still not something I'd normally keep. Same Exif as the previous image.

Will try the things suggested. Thanks!



--
I believe in science, evolution and light. All opinions are my own. I'm not compensated for any of my posts. Can you honestly say that?

HRC2016 said:

Shutter time was 1/640, f 6.3, ISO 400. I think it's just the limitations of the camera. Next time I'll have to bring a bigger lens or maybe a blind.

Here's one that's slightly better as the bird was a little closer. Still not something I'd normally keep. Same Exif as the previous image.

Will try the things suggested. Thanks!

Click to expand...

Still too far away and in addition poor AF target of white bird against strong background target of ripple reflections. Have you tried the tracking mode with a closer bird yet?

Practice on gulls, get aquisition on their heads and let the AF track them until close and shoot fast burst.

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HRC2016 said:

It's SOOC, uncropped.

Click to expand...

The images you are posting are not SOOC! If they were they would be 5472 x 3648 pixels = 20MP. They are in fact 1440 x 1080 pixels = 1.6MP. So we still don't know whether they have been cropped or downsized.

The camera is good enough to track dragonflies in flight, I’d go so far as to say the AF and tracking is awesome. Agreed with a previous poster, you need to be in AF C and multipoint tracking. For BIF you also need a high shutter speed.

Honestly, you’re expecting too much from the camera, it is ‘only’ 200mm max which is nothing for things like BIFs. Often the RX10iv is lacking in zoom for birding even at 600mm. You’ll get plenty of feather detail in good light, and with a bird close enough to capture that sort of detail, not a long way off. Sorry! Look at the RX100vii as a very capable all rounder with zoom benefits for casual shots not a dedicated wildlife camera. I have a lot of excellent BIF shots with feather detail pretty much all of things like gulls waiting for free handouts!

These images are so small that they are either embedded jpegs from your ARW files or you are for some reason shooting at 1.6MP (which I don't think is even an option). Even with perfect focus you are not going to get much detail at that low res.

Shoot at 1/1000 or more, make sure you are using AF-C, lock on Expand Flexible Spot. The camera is more than capable of decent BIF but be reasonable with how far away you expect it to do so.

I stand corrected.

They were not straight out of the camera. They were uploaded directly from camera to smartphone via the Sony app, then uploaded to DPR. No manipulation.

I viewed last night on a monitor. Didn't notice any significant improvement.

Yes, I realized this is not the best camera for wildlife that's more than 25 feet away. It does surprisingly good at large stationery objects at a distance.


From the courthouse tower


From the courthouse tower.

I'll try using multipoint CAF tracking next time. When using other gear I shoot BIF with SAF, no tracking or burst.

I'd like to hear abour your settings/technique for dragonfly shots, including your distance to the subject.

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I believe in science, evolution and light. All opinions are my own. I'm not compensated for any of my posts. Can you honestly say that?

Be careful. The Sony app needs to be configured to send full size JPEGs to your phone. I think it defaults to small JPEGs.

Thanks for the tip about the app and image size. It's on original.

Below was uploaded from camera to laptop (via cable) to smartphone to DPR. No app used. That's my usual method.

[ATTACH]2481877[/ATTACH] BrentSchumer said:

Be careful. The Sony app needs to be configured to send full size JPEGs to your phone. I think it defaults to small JPEGs.

Click to expand...

--
I believe in science, evolution and light. All opinions are my own. I'm not compensated for any of my posts. Can you honestly say that?

HRC2016 said:

Thanks for the tip about the app and image size. It's on original.

Below was uploaded from camera to laptop (via cable) to smartphone to DPR. No app used. That's my usual method.

Click to expand...

Why are you shooting in AF-S mode? That uses slow CDAF and negates one of the primary advantages of this camera.

I don't understand your reluctance to shoot in continuous mode. I don't think you'll find any of the top bird photographers in this forum limiting themselves to single shot mode. There's nothing wrong with firing off short bursts as you follow the action. You don't need to blast away at 20fps. You have options to use the Mid or Lo rates.

Looking at the full res image, it seems to be suffering from camera motion blur. Shutter speed is sort of marginal for this sort of shot. But I think your hand held shooting technique is also at fault. Your choice of shooting position also wasn't ideal. The bird and the ripples in the water provides a confusing scene for the AF system to evaluate. Had you shot lower (closer to water level), there would had been better subject and background separation.

You're shooting in manual mode with aperture set to f/6.3. The lens remains remarkably sharp wide open at the telephoto end. Had you shot at f/4.5 you would have gained a full stop. You could have increased shutter speed or decreased ISO. You should reconsider your exposure strategy.

Why do you have ISO locked to 400? It's probably better to use either aperture or shutter priority with auto ISO. Also, 2 of your other examples are shot a f/11. That's somewhat into diffraction territorial for a 1" sensor. It makes no sense to use ISO 400 for static landscape shots in good light..

f/11 is far into diffraction territory. That's f/30 FF equivalent.

You might want to revisit this thread in which there are tips from several people on setting up the RX100M7 for everyday use, birds in flight and dragonflies in flight.

RX100M7 tricks and tips

--
Cheers, Brandon
FlickR Photostream
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Flickr AFS- 200-500 AFS VR gallery
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FlickR Nikon1 V1 & V3 gallery
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200mm is simply not enough for BIF. Your sample shoes that you are simply not getting enough pixels on the bird for good results.

Horacecoker said:

HRC2016 said:

It's SOOC, uncropped.

Click to expand...

The images you are posting are not SOOC! If they were they would be 5472 x 3648 pixels = 20MP. They are in fact 1440 x 1080 pixels = 1.6MP. So we still don't know whether they have been cropped or downsized.

Click to expand...

He said uncropped so it must be downsized.