Why Canon is Better than Sony

I've compared the Canon 5D Mark IV (and similar) to the Sony A7R III (and similar). Here is why I think Canon is a much better camera than Sony. In summary: It's a lot easier to take pictures with a Canon.

Let's take a look at the top of these cameras. This explains a lot:

When you look at the top of the Canon, you can see that there are controls for Exposure Mode (PASM), White Balance, Metering Pattern, Continuous/Single Drive, Continuous/Single Auto Focus, Flash Exposure Compensation, and ISO. And I can see all of those settings, even in total darkness. Oh, and there's a useless button called M-Fn. In decades of photography, I've never learned what an "M-Fn" is, so I never press that button.


Top side view of the Canon EOS 5D Mark IV

Now let's take a look at the top of the Sony:



The top of this camera has Exposure Mode, and what looks like Exposure Comp. How do I set my metering pattern, or change White Balance, or drive mode, or any of those other things I can directly do on the Canon? Let's look at the back of the Sony, maybe they're there?


Back of the Sony A7R III

Huh. Looking at the top, I can make the Menu appear. And it looks like there's a Record button, which starts video recording? And I can start back-button Focus with AF-ON, and Lock Exposure with AEL. Ok, Sony gets a point here for labelling AE Lock as AEL instead of *, like Canon does.

Looks like there's a way to set drive mode and ISO by tapping that dial.

So how do you operate this camera? Well.... you've got two basic choices: Assign features you need to the C1 - C4 buttons. And maybe the Fn button. And if you can remember that C3 is Flash Exposure Compensation... Whoopie! Otherwise, you're going to hit that menu button.

Summary: The bottom line for me, at this point, is that this Sony design is not a usable camera design for me. I don't use Flash Exposure Comp very often, but when I do, I need it. I change drive and focus modes constantly. Most of the top-mounted settings are changed every time I shoot, often several times. For me, personally, I am not able to remember what each of those C1 through C4 settings will do. I assume I can assign White Balance to C1... but I won't be able to remember that as I'm shooting. That is why, for me, Canon is better than Sony.

About Sony's menu button: It's a great camera, but when you hit that Menu button, you're going to navigate through THIRTY-FIVE MENU PAGES. (My head is numb). That "Fn" button will help you, it tries to give you commonly-used settings, like so:



Um... This is still a pretty confusing menu. You can set DRO. Cool, I learned all about DRO when I studied photography. DRO is, uh... probably related to PP. It's in the chapter on the other weird icons. I can't make sense of this screen. Apparently it has a zebra stripes feature, which Canon doesn't have. Cool, I think.

Canon has a much cleaner rear panel:


Canon 5D Mark IV Rear

Lots of customizability, but seven well-labeled buttons on the left (apart from the one with the paintbrush). Another six buttons on the right, each is pretty well-labeled, except for Q and the top-right button, which is as useful to me as the Paintbrush and the M-Fn button.

The Canon has a Quick Menu; that's what the Q button is for:



You can completely customize the Q menu, although I guess the Sony can as well. These items are each adjustable using the touchscreen... tap on 1/125, and you can change the shutter speed. Touch Exposure Comp, you can change that, and so forth.

In summary, for me, I think Canon has a much more usable camera than Sony. I've used Canon cameras for many years, and I've gained a lot of experience with them. Nonetheless, I put most of the full feature set of my camera to use. I use nearly all of the labeled buttons on my Canon nearly every time I go out shooting. With Sony, there are no buttons for those features, and memorizing the customized button functions probably wouldn't work for me, without at least a year of experience. Look at the top of the Canon again... now imagine those four little buttons weren't labeled. Would you remember which one is the Drive Mode button?

The Canon is a well refined design where as the Sony is clearly not.

MarshallG said:

I've compared the Canon 5D Mark IV (and similar) to the Sony A7R III (and similar). Here is why I think Canon is a much better camera than Sony. In summary: It's a lot easier to take pictures with a Canon.

Let's take a look at the top of these cameras. This explains a lot:

When you look at the top of the Canon, you can see that there are controls for Exposure Mode (PASM), White Balance, Metering Pattern, Continuous/Single Drive, Continuous/Single Auto Focus, Flash Exposure Compensation, and ISO. And I can see all of those settings, even in total darkness. Oh, and there's a useless button called M-Fn. In decades of photography, I've never learned what an "M-Fn" is, so I never press that button.


Top side view of the Canon EOS 5D Mark IV

Now let's take a look at the top of the Sony:



The top of this camera has Exposure Mode, and what looks like Exposure Comp. How do I set my metering pattern, or change White Balance, or drive mode, or any of those other things I can directly do on the Canon? Let's look at the back of the Sony, maybe they're there?


Back of the Sony A7R III

Huh. Looking at the top, I can make the Menu appear. And it looks like there's a Record button, which starts video recording? And I can start back-button Focus with AF-ON, and Lock Exposure with AEL. Ok, Sony gets a point here for labelling AE Lock as AEL instead of *, like Canon does.

Looks like there's a way to set drive mode and ISO by tapping that dial.

So how do you operate this camera? Well.... you've got two basic choices: Assign features you need to the C1 - C4 buttons. And maybe the Fn button. And if you can remember that C3 is Flash Exposure Compensation... Whoopie! Otherwise, you're going to hit that menu button.

Summary: The bottom line for me, at this point, is that this Sony design is not a usable camera design for me. I don't use Flash Exposure Comp very often, but when I do, I need it. I change drive and focus modes constantly. Most of the top-mounted settings are changed every time I shoot, often several times. For me, personally, I am not able to remember what each of those C1 through C4 settings will do. I assume I can assign White Balance to C1... but I won't be able to remember that as I'm shooting. That is why, for me, Canon is better than Sony.

About Sony's menu button: It's a great camera, but when you hit that Menu button, you're going to navigate through THIRTY-FIVE MENU PAGES. (My head is numb). That "Fn" button will help you, it tries to give you commonly-used settings, like so:



Um... This is still a pretty confusing menu. You can set DRO. Cool, I learned all about DRO when I studied photography. DRO is, uh... probably related to PP. It's in the chapter on the other weird icons. I can't make sense of this screen. Apparently it has a zebra stripes feature, which Canon doesn't have. Cool, I think.

Canon has a much cleaner rear panel:


Canon 5D Mark IV Rear

Lots of customizability, but seven well-labeled buttons on the left (apart from the one with the paintbrush). Another six buttons on the right, each is pretty well-labeled, except for Q and the top-right button, which is as useful to me as the Paintbrush and the M-Fn button.

The Canon has a Quick Menu; that's what the Q button is for:



You can completely customize the Q menu, although I guess the Sony can as well. These items are each adjustable using the touchscreen... tap on 1/125, and you can change the shutter speed. Touch Exposure Comp, you can change that, and so forth.

In summary, for me, I think Canon has a much more usable camera than Sony. I've used Canon cameras for many years, and I've gained a lot of experience with them. Nonetheless, I put most of the full feature set of my camera to use. I use nearly all of the labeled buttons on my Canon nearly every time I go out shooting. With Sony, there are no buttons for those features, and memorizing the customized button functions probably wouldn't work for me, without at least a year of experience. Look at the top of the Canon again... now imagine those four little buttons weren't labeled. Would you remember which one is the Drive Mode button?

Click to expand...

Amen, end of discussion ;-)

This is easily one of the most ridiculous posts I've ever seen here. How about showing what shows up in the EVF of the Sony compared to the Canon? Things like blown out highlights or focus peaking that allow you to avoid needing to look at that display on top of the Canon because more relevant info shows up in the Sony viewfinder before you even take a picture.

And if you are serious about this you aren't looking at the button labels on a Canon while you're shooting. I've used them for 15 years and I can tell what all of them are by feel and location. And you know what? The Sony is the same way.

Sanderman said:

This is easily one of the most ridiculous posts I've ever seen here. How about showing what shows up in the EVF of the Sony compared to the Canon? Things like blown out highlights or focus peaking that allow you to avoid needing to look at that display on top of the Canon because more relevant info shows up in the Sony viewfinder before you even take a picture.

And if you are serious about this you aren't looking at the button labels on a Canon while you're shooting. I've used them for 15 years and I can tell what all of them are by feel and location. And you know what? The Sony is the same way.

Click to expand...

On the fast draw the Canon wins.

MarshallG said:

I've compared the Canon 5D Mark IV (and similar) to the Sony A7R III (and similar). Here is why I think Canon is a much better camera than Sony. In summary: It's a lot easier to take pictures with a Canon.

Let's take a look at the top of these cameras. This explains a lot:

When you look at the top of the Canon, you can see that there are controls for Exposure Mode (PASM), White Balance, Metering Pattern, Continuous/Single Drive, Continuous/Single Auto Focus, Flash Exposure Compensation, and ISO. And I can see all of those settings, even in total darkness. Oh, and there's a useless button called M-Fn. In decades of photography, I've never learned what an "M-Fn" is, so I never press that button.


Top side view of the Canon EOS 5D Mark IV

Now let's take a look at the top of the Sony:



The top of this camera has Exposure Mode, and what looks like Exposure Comp. How do I set my metering pattern, or change White Balance, or drive mode, or any of those other things I can directly do on the Canon? Let's look at the back of the Sony, maybe they're there?


Back of the Sony A7R III

Huh. Looking at the top, I can make the Menu appear. And it looks like there's a Record button, which starts video recording? And I can start back-button Focus with AF-ON, and Lock Exposure with AEL. Ok, Sony gets a point here for labelling AE Lock as AEL instead of *, like Canon does.

Looks like there's a way to set drive mode and ISO by tapping that dial.

So how do you operate this camera? Well.... you've got two basic choices: Assign features you need to the C1 - C4 buttons. And maybe the Fn button. And if you can remember that C3 is Flash Exposure Compensation... Whoopie! Otherwise, you're going to hit that menu button.

Summary: The bottom line for me, at this point, is that this Sony design is not a usable camera design for me. I don't use Flash Exposure Comp very often, but when I do, I need it. I change drive and focus modes constantly. Most of the top-mounted settings are changed every time I shoot, often several times. For me, personally, I am not able to remember what each of those C1 through C4 settings will do. I assume I can assign White Balance to C1... but I won't be able to remember that as I'm shooting. That is why, for me, Canon is better than Sony.

About Sony's menu button: It's a great camera, but when you hit that Menu button, you're going to navigate through THIRTY-FIVE MENU PAGES. (My head is numb). That "Fn" button will help you, it tries to give you commonly-used settings, like so:



Um... This is still a pretty confusing menu. You can set DRO. Cool, I learned all about DRO when I studied photography. DRO is, uh... probably related to PP. It's in the chapter on the other weird icons. I can't make sense of this screen. Apparently it has a zebra stripes feature, which Canon doesn't have. Cool, I think.

Canon has a much cleaner rear panel:


Canon 5D Mark IV Rear

Lots of customizability, but seven well-labeled buttons on the left (apart from the one with the paintbrush). Another six buttons on the right, each is pretty well-labeled, except for Q and the top-right button, which is as useful to me as the Paintbrush and the M-Fn button.

The Canon has a Quick Menu; that's what the Q button is for:



You can completely customize the Q menu, although I guess the Sony can as well. These items are each adjustable using the touchscreen... tap on 1/125, and you can change the shutter speed. Touch Exposure Comp, you can change that, and so forth.

In summary, for me, I think Canon has a much more usable camera than Sony. I've used Canon cameras for many years, and I've gained a lot of experience with them. Nonetheless, I put most of the full feature set of my camera to use. I use nearly all of the labeled buttons on my Canon nearly every time I go out shooting. With Sony, there are no buttons for those features, and memorizing the customized button functions probably wouldn't work for me, without at least a year of experience. Look at the top of the Canon again... now imagine those four little buttons weren't labeled. Would you remember which one is the Drive Mode button?

Click to expand...

TL;DR New things are scary.

There are still very valid strengths of the Canon bodies over Sony but this post is just a bit ridiculous.

whumber said:

MarshallG said:

I've compared the Canon 5D Mark IV (and similar) to the Sony A7R III (and similar). Here is why I think Canon is a much better camera than Sony. In summary: It's a lot easier to take pictures with a Canon.

Let's take a look at the top of these cameras. This explains a lot:

When you look at the top of the Canon, you can see that there are controls for Exposure Mode (PASM), White Balance, Metering Pattern, Continuous/Single Drive, Continuous/Single Auto Focus, Flash Exposure Compensation, and ISO. And I can see all of those settings, even in total darkness. Oh, and there's a useless button called M-Fn. In decades of photography, I've never learned what an "M-Fn" is, so I never press that button.


Top side view of the Canon EOS 5D Mark IV

Now let's take a look at the top of the Sony:



The top of this camera has Exposure Mode, and what looks like Exposure Comp. How do I set my metering pattern, or change White Balance, or drive mode, or any of those other things I can directly do on the Canon? Let's look at the back of the Sony, maybe they're there?


Back of the Sony A7R III

Huh. Looking at the top, I can make the Menu appear. And it looks like there's a Record button, which starts video recording? And I can start back-button Focus with AF-ON, and Lock Exposure with AEL. Ok, Sony gets a point here for labelling AE Lock as AEL instead of *, like Canon does.

Looks like there's a way to set drive mode and ISO by tapping that dial.

So how do you operate this camera? Well.... you've got two basic choices: Assign features you need to the C1 - C4 buttons. And maybe the Fn button. And if you can remember that C3 is Flash Exposure Compensation... Whoopie! Otherwise, you're going to hit that menu button.

Summary: The bottom line for me, at this point, is that this Sony design is not a usable camera design for me. I don't use Flash Exposure Comp very often, but when I do, I need it. I change drive and focus modes constantly. Most of the top-mounted settings are changed every time I shoot, often several times. For me, personally, I am not able to remember what each of those C1 through C4 settings will do. I assume I can assign White Balance to C1... but I won't be able to remember that as I'm shooting. That is why, for me, Canon is better than Sony.

About Sony's menu button: It's a great camera, but when you hit that Menu button, you're going to navigate through THIRTY-FIVE MENU PAGES. (My head is numb). That "Fn" button will help you, it tries to give you commonly-used settings, like so:



Um... This is still a pretty confusing menu. You can set DRO. Cool, I learned all about DRO when I studied photography. DRO is, uh... probably related to PP. It's in the chapter on the other weird icons. I can't make sense of this screen. Apparently it has a zebra stripes feature, which Canon doesn't have. Cool, I think.

Canon has a much cleaner rear panel:


Canon 5D Mark IV Rear

Lots of customizability, but seven well-labeled buttons on the left (apart from the one with the paintbrush). Another six buttons on the right, each is pretty well-labeled, except for Q and the top-right button, which is as useful to me as the Paintbrush and the M-Fn button.

The Canon has a Quick Menu; that's what the Q button is for:



You can completely customize the Q menu, although I guess the Sony can as well. These items are each adjustable using the touchscreen... tap on 1/125, and you can change the shutter speed. Touch Exposure Comp, you can change that, and so forth.

In summary, for me, I think Canon has a much more usable camera than Sony. I've used Canon cameras for many years, and I've gained a lot of experience with them. Nonetheless, I put most of the full feature set of my camera to use. I use nearly all of the labeled buttons on my Canon nearly every time I go out shooting. With Sony, there are no buttons for those features, and memorizing the customized button functions probably wouldn't work for me, without at least a year of experience. Look at the top of the Canon again... now imagine those four little buttons weren't labeled. Would you remember which one is the Drive Mode button?

Click to expand...

TL;DR New things are scary.

There are still very valid strengths of the Canon bodies over Sony but this post is just a bit ridiculous.

Click to expand...

You should see some of the service menus in Sony TVs.

Or a Sony TV service manual.

Those camera menus are pure Sony.

whumber said:

MarshallG said:

I've compared the Canon 5D Mark IV (and similar) to the Sony A7R III (and similar). Here is why I think Canon is a much better camera than Sony. In summary: It's a lot easier to take pictures with a Canon.

Let's take a look at the top of these cameras. This explains a lot:

When you look at the top of the Canon, you can see that there are controls for Exposure Mode (PASM), White Balance, Metering Pattern, Continuous/Single Drive, Continuous/Single Auto Focus, Flash Exposure Compensation, and ISO. And I can see all of those settings, even in total darkness. Oh, and there's a useless button called M-Fn. In decades of photography, I've never learned what an "M-Fn" is, so I never press that button.


Top side view of the Canon EOS 5D Mark IV

Now let's take a look at the top of the Sony:



The top of this camera has Exposure Mode, and what looks like Exposure Comp. How do I set my metering pattern, or change White Balance, or drive mode, or any of those other things I can directly do on the Canon? Let's look at the back of the Sony, maybe they're there?


Back of the Sony A7R III

Huh. Looking at the top, I can make the Menu appear. And it looks like there's a Record button, which starts video recording? And I can start back-button Focus with AF-ON, and Lock Exposure with AEL. Ok, Sony gets a point here for labelling AE Lock as AEL instead of *, like Canon does.

Looks like there's a way to set drive mode and ISO by tapping that dial.

So how do you operate this camera? Well.... you've got two basic choices: Assign features you need to the C1 - C4 buttons. And maybe the Fn button. And if you can remember that C3 is Flash Exposure Compensation... Whoopie! Otherwise, you're going to hit that menu button.

Summary: The bottom line for me, at this point, is that this Sony design is not a usable camera design for me. I don't use Flash Exposure Comp very often, but when I do, I need it. I change drive and focus modes constantly. Most of the top-mounted settings are changed every time I shoot, often several times. For me, personally, I am not able to remember what each of those C1 through C4 settings will do. I assume I can assign White Balance to C1... but I won't be able to remember that as I'm shooting. That is why, for me, Canon is better than Sony.

About Sony's menu button: It's a great camera, but when you hit that Menu button, you're going to navigate through THIRTY-FIVE MENU PAGES. (My head is numb). That "Fn" button will help you, it tries to give you commonly-used settings, like so:



Um... This is still a pretty confusing menu. You can set DRO. Cool, I learned all about DRO when I studied photography. DRO is, uh... probably related to PP. It's in the chapter on the other weird icons. I can't make sense of this screen. Apparently it has a zebra stripes feature, which Canon doesn't have. Cool, I think.

Canon has a much cleaner rear panel:


Canon 5D Mark IV Rear

Lots of customizability, but seven well-labeled buttons on the left (apart from the one with the paintbrush). Another six buttons on the right, each is pretty well-labeled, except for Q and the top-right button, which is as useful to me as the Paintbrush and the M-Fn button.

The Canon has a Quick Menu; that's what the Q button is for:



You can completely customize the Q menu, although I guess the Sony can as well. These items are each adjustable using the touchscreen... tap on 1/125, and you can change the shutter speed. Touch Exposure Comp, you can change that, and so forth.

In summary, for me, I think Canon has a much more usable camera than Sony. I've used Canon cameras for many years, and I've gained a lot of experience with them. Nonetheless, I put most of the full feature set of my camera to use. I use nearly all of the labeled buttons on my Canon nearly every time I go out shooting. With Sony, there are no buttons for those features, and memorizing the customized button functions probably wouldn't work for me, without at least a year of experience. Look at the top of the Canon again... now imagine those four little buttons weren't labeled. Would you remember which one is the Drive Mode button?

Click to expand...

TL;DR New things are scary.

There are still very valid strengths of the Canon bodies over Sony but this post is just a bit ridiculous.

Click to expand...

you have to remember that this is OP's personal experience and opinion and there are lots more that feel the same way, include me as one of those ;-)

I have an A7 and a 5DIV, both have benefits and downsides.

I actually find that I spend less time looking at the controls of the Sony than I do on the 5D1V. The Sony has fewer buttons and they are spread out, not in a row. I know which button does which, and since they are not next to each other, I don't have to look at them to find them. I don't seem to need more than three buttons to adjust what I need to adjust for my way of shooting.

I have never been happy with evaluative metering on any camera, as I find it too unpredictable. I don't change metering modes, I prefer centerweighted and adjust with exposure comp. Sony implementation beats Canon here

Clearly my way of using a camera is different than yours, so my overall experience is different. With the 5DIV, I can go through a whole day of shooting 1000+ pictures and not look at the top LCD once. Everything I need is in the viewfinder anyway.

The OVF on the 5DIV crushes the EVF on the Sony. The A7 EVF is so bad, I just use the rear LCD all the time.

Sanderman said:

And if you are serious about this you aren't looking at the button labels on a Canon while you're shooting. I've used them for 15 years and I can tell what all of them are by feel and location. And you know what? The Sony is the same way.

Click to expand...

If you like your Sony, that’s really great, have a lot of fun, peace and love. I gave the reasons why I can’t shoot with a Sony. Those are my reasons. I’ve written up a very long post elsewhere describing how I shoot with my Canon, and if you shoot differently, peace and love. But my techniques are pretty complicated and I could not do what I do with a Sony, without a lot of work to remember what a C2 is for. I know how often I need to look at those buttons to figure out which is which. I cannot use a camera with four unlabeled buttons. Maybe you can, peace and love, but I cannot.

TrackDayLT4 said:

I have an A7 and a 5DIV, both have benefits and downsides.

I actually find that I spend less time looking at the controls of the Sony than I do on the 5D1V. The Sony has fewer buttons and they are spread out, not in a row. I know which button does which, and since they are not next to each other, I don't have to look at them to find them. I don't seem to need more than three buttons to adjust what I need to adjust for my way of shooting.

I have never been happy with evaluative metering on any camera, as I find it too unpredictable. I don't change metering modes, I prefer centerweighted and adjust with exposure comp. Sony implementation beats Canon here

Clearly my way of using a camera is different than yours, so my overall experience is different. With the 5DIV, I can go through a whole day of shooting 1000+ pictures and not look at the top LCD once. Everything I need is in the viewfinder anyway.

The OVF on the 5DIV crushes the EVF on the Sony. The A7 EVF is so bad, I just use the rear LCD all the time.

Click to expand...

If this post were about the original A7 series, I would agree completely. Those bodies had mostly great sensors but were an ergonomic disaster. Sony's iterated on that original design twice now and has made very significant improvements. Are they as good as Canon/Nikon ergonomics yet? Not quite, but most of the issues outlined by the OP are just complaints that Sony hasn't made an exact copy of the layout he already knows. If the OP actually tried one of the cameras he'd almost certainly find that many of the weakness/problems he commented on are non-issues and then would find some of the actual warts that remain in the system, =).

MarshallG said:

I've compared the Canon 5D Mark IV (and similar) to the Sony A7R III (and similar). Here is why I think Canon is a much better camera than Sony. In summary: It's a lot easier to take pictures with a Canon.

Click to expand...

The subject line of your post reads "Why Canon is Better than Sony."

The opening paragraph of your post reads "Here is why I think Canon is a much better camera than Sony."

The subject line reads as a statement of fact. The body text reads as an opinion. So, which is it?

BTW, I have a little point-and-shoot that is much easier to use than my 5D4. So, according to you, even though this camera cost less than $100, it is a much better camera because it is easier to use.

Either way, thanks for providing a good laugh. And it's not even April Fool's Day!

MarshallG said:

I've compared the Canon 5D Mark IV (and similar) to the Sony A7R III (and similar). Here is why I think Canon is a much better camera than Sony. In summary: It's a lot easier to take pictures with a Canon.

Click to expand...

lets be honest, some of this is because you use canon and haven’t used Sony. You’re just used to it

MarshallG said:

Let's take a look at the top of these cameras. This explains a lot:

When you look at the top of the Canon, you can see that there are controls for Exposure Mode (PASM), White Balance, Metering Pattern, Continuous/Single Drive, Continuous/Single Auto Focus, Flash Exposure Compensation, and ISO. And I can see all of those settings, even in total darkness. Oh, and there's a useless button called M-Fn. In decades of photography, I've never learned what an "M-Fn" is, so I never press that button.


Top side view of the Canon EOS 5D Mark IV

Now let's take a look at the top of the Sony:



The top of this camera has Exposure Mode, and what looks like Exposure Comp. How do I set my metering pattern, or change White Balance, or drive mode, or any of those other things I can directly do on the Canon? Let's look at the back of the Sony, maybe they're there?


Back of the Sony A7R III

Huh. Looking at the top, I can make the Menu appear. And it looks like there's a Record button, which starts video recording? And I can start back-button Focus with AF-ON, and Lock Exposure with AEL. Ok, Sony gets a point here for labelling AE Lock as AEL instead of *, like Canon does.

Looks like there's a way to set drive mode and ISO by tapping that dial.

So how do you operate this camera? Well.... you've got two basic choices: Assign features you need to the C1 - C4 buttons. And maybe the Fn button. And if you can remember that C3 is Flash Exposure Compensation... Whoopie! Otherwise, you're going to hit that menu button.

Summary: The bottom line for me, at this point, is that this Sony design is not a usable camera design for me. I don't use Flash Exposure Comp very often, but when I do, I need it. I change drive and focus modes constantly. Most of the top-mounted settings are changed every time I shoot, often several times. For me, personally, I am not able to remember what each of those C1 through C4 settings will do. I assume I can assign White Balance to C1... but I won't be able to remember that as I'm shooting. That is why, for me, Canon is better than Sony.

Click to expand...

you won’t be able to remember what you’ve assigned to four buttons?? I certainly remember where many buttons are on my canon are without even looking at them, and I think many others do too. I think you’re underestimating yourself

MarshallG said:

About Sony's menu button: It's a great camera, but when you hit that Menu button, you're going to navigate through THIRTY-FIVE MENU PAGES. (My head is numb). That "Fn" button will help you, it tries to give you commonly-used settings, like so:



Um... This is still a pretty confusing menu. You can set DRO. Cool, I learned all about DRO when I studied photography. DRO is, uh... probably related to PP. It's in the chapter on the other weird icons. I can't make sense of this screen. Apparently it has a zebra stripes feature, which Canon doesn't have. Cool, I think.

Canon has a much cleaner rear panel:


Canon 5D Mark IV Rear

Lots of customizability, but seven well-labeled buttons on the left (apart from the one with the paintbrush). Another six buttons on the right, each is pretty well-labeled, except for Q and the top-right button, which is as useful to me as the Paintbrush and the M-Fn button.

The Canon has a Quick Menu; that's what the Q button is for:



You can completely customize the Q menu, although I guess the Sony can as well. These items are each adjustable using the touchscreen... tap on 1/125, and you can change the shutter speed. Touch Exposure Comp, you can change that, and so forth.

In summary, for me, I think Canon has a much more usable camera than Sony. I've used Canon cameras for many years, and I've gained a lot of experience with them. Nonetheless, I put most of the full feature set of my camera to use. I use nearly all of the labeled buttons on my Canon nearly every time I go out shooting. With Sony, there are no buttons for those features, and memorizing the customized button functions probably wouldn't work for me, without at least a year of experience. Look at the top of the Canon again... now imagine those four little buttons weren't labeled. Would you remember which one is the Drive Mode button?

Click to expand...

I agree that I prefer canon ergonomics, but I think the post is a little over dramatic

whumber said:

TrackDayLT4 said:

I have an A7 and a 5DIV, both have benefits and downsides.

I actually find that I spend less time looking at the controls of the Sony than I do on the 5D1V. The Sony has fewer buttons and they are spread out, not in a row. I know which button does which, and since they are not next to each other, I don't have to look at them to find them. I don't seem to need more than three buttons to adjust what I need to adjust for my way of shooting.

I have never been happy with evaluative metering on any camera, as I find it too unpredictable. I don't change metering modes, I prefer centerweighted and adjust with exposure comp. Sony implementation beats Canon here

Clearly my way of using a camera is different than yours, so my overall experience is different. With the 5DIV, I can go through a whole day of shooting 1000+ pictures and not look at the top LCD once. Everything I need is in the viewfinder anyway.

The OVF on the 5DIV crushes the EVF on the Sony. The A7 EVF is so bad, I just use the rear LCD all the time.

Click to expand...

If this post were about the original A7 series, I would agree completely. Those bodies had mostly great sensors but were an ergonomic disaster. Sony's iterated on that original design twice now and has made very significant improvements. Are they as good as Canon/Nikon ergonomics yet? Not quite, but most of the issues outlined by the OP are just complaints that Sony hasn't made an exact copy of the layout he already knows. If the OP actually tried one of the cameras he'd almost certainly find that many of the weakness/problems he commented on are non-issues and then would find some of the actual warts that remain in the system, =).

Click to expand...

I study the manuals and practice and practice hoping when my chance comes to get the really great shot I am ready.

Switching from a 5D, 30D,7D to a 6D was bad enough.

By the time I get used to a A7RIII the A7RXII will be out ?

To this day I was fastest with the 7D.

I tried out a 5DIV at BB and started to get the feel of it real fast.

And it was real fast too.

whumber said:

most of the issues outlined by the OP are just complaints that Sony hasn't made an exact copy of the layout he already knows. If the OP actually tried one of the cameras he'd almost certainly find that many of the weakness/problems he commented on are non-issues and then would find some of the actual warts that remain in the system, =).

Click to expand...

Layout?

Dude, enjoy your camera. Really.

Let me give you and example: I use the RATE button on my camera every time I go out shooting. I definitely cannot use that feature if it was buried in a menu. If the button isn't there, it's not usable to me, because I review, tap RATE, review, tap RATE, etc. It has to be really fast because I do it between taking shots.

If the RATE button were just labeled something like C2, I couldn't use it. Maybe you can, and that's fine, but I could not. I know that I could not because I have to look for RATE.

For that matter, there's that paintbrushy button on the Canon... If I re-labeled it to something useful, it wouldn't help me because I can't remember that paintbrush means Drive Mode or Set Focus Point. Those abstractions don't work for me when I'm working.

Ergonomics goes a long way...

MarshallG said:

whumber said:

most of the issues outlined by the OP are just complaints that Sony hasn't made an exact copy of the layout he already knows. If the OP actually tried one of the cameras he'd almost certainly find that many of the weakness/problems he commented on are non-issues and then would find some of the actual warts that remain in the system, =).

Click to expand...

Layout?

Dude, enjoy your camera. Really.

Let me give you and example: I use the RATE button on my camera every time I go out shooting. I definitely cannot use that feature if it was buried in a menu. If the button isn't there, it's not usable to me, because I review, tap RATE, review, tap RATE, etc. It has to be really fast because I do it between taking shots.

If the RATE button were just labeled something like C2, I couldn't use it. Maybe you can, and that's fine, but I could not. I know that I could not because I have to look for RATE.

For that matter, there's that paintbrushy button on the Canon... If I re-labeled it to something useful, it wouldn't help me because I can't remember that paintbrush means Drive Mode or Set Focus Point. Those abstractions don't work for me when I'm working.

Click to expand...

How do you even manage to review your pictures, there is no button labeled Review, just a button with a sideways triangle on it.

TrackDayLT4 said:

MarshallG said:

whumber said:

most of the issues outlined by the OP are just complaints that Sony hasn't made an exact copy of the layout he already knows. If the OP actually tried one of the cameras he'd almost certainly find that many of the weakness/problems he commented on are non-issues and then would find some of the actual warts that remain in the system, =).

Click to expand...

Layout?

Dude, enjoy your camera. Really.

Let me give you and example: I use the RATE button on my camera every time I go out shooting. I definitely cannot use that feature if it was buried in a menu. If the button isn't there, it's not usable to me, because I review, tap RATE, review, tap RATE, etc. It has to be really fast because I do it between taking shots.

If the RATE button were just labeled something like C2, I couldn't use it. Maybe you can, and that's fine, but I could not. I know that I could not because I have to look for RATE.

For that matter, there's that paintbrushy button on the Canon... If I re-labeled it to something useful, it wouldn't help me because I can't remember that paintbrush means Drive Mode or Set Focus Point. Those abstractions don't work for me when I'm working.

Click to expand...

How do you even manage to review your pictures, there is no button labeled Review, just a button with a sideways triangle on it.

Click to expand...

If you think that's bad the shutter release doesn't have any markings at all. It's a miracle anyone is able to take photos. =)

stevedavidsonphotography said:

whumber said:

TrackDayLT4 said:

I have an A7 and a 5DIV, both have benefits and downsides.

I actually find that I spend less time looking at the controls of the Sony than I do on the 5D1V. The Sony has fewer buttons and they are spread out, not in a row. I know which button does which, and since they are not next to each other, I don't have to look at them to find them. I don't seem to need more than three buttons to adjust what I need to adjust for my way of shooting.

I have never been happy with evaluative metering on any camera, as I find it too unpredictable. I don't change metering modes, I prefer centerweighted and adjust with exposure comp. Sony implementation beats Canon here

Clearly my way of using a camera is different than yours, so my overall experience is different. With the 5DIV, I can go through a whole day of shooting 1000+ pictures and not look at the top LCD once. Everything I need is in the viewfinder anyway.

The OVF on the 5DIV crushes the EVF on the Sony. The A7 EVF is so bad, I just use the rear LCD all the time.

Click to expand...

If this post were about the original A7 series, I would agree completely. Those bodies had mostly great sensors but were an ergonomic disaster. Sony's iterated on that original design twice now and has made very significant improvements. Are they as good as Canon/Nikon ergonomics yet? Not quite, but most of the issues outlined by the OP are just complaints that Sony hasn't made an exact copy of the layout he already knows. If the OP actually tried one of the cameras he'd almost certainly find that many of the weakness/problems he commented on are non-issues and then would find some of the actual warts that remain in the system, =).

Click to expand...

I study the manuals and practice and practice hoping when my chance comes to get the really great shot I am ready.

Switching from a 5D, 30D,7D to a 6D was bad enough.

By the time I get used to a A7RIII the A7RXII will be out ?

To this day I was fastest with the 7D.

I tried out a 5DIV at BB and started to get the feel of it real fast.

And it was real fast too.

Click to expand...

the Sony guys might get ya for saying this :-D

Fair points.

I know my 5D2 very well and even as a landscape photographer there are times when I am racing to adjust the camera to a particular, fleeting situation.

Still, if I had the option I would own the Sony system. Ultimately I believe they have an IQ / resolution advantage over Canon and adapting would just be part of the challenge.