Analysis of the Lightroom situation

DerKeyser

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Like many of you on this forum the new lightroom situation has left me with some heavy choices to make.

I have put together a little writeup of my analysis of the situation. I have been working with commercial IT and infrastructure development for 25 years. Maybe my analysis, thoughts and reasoning can help you making your decision?

You can find it here: http://wolffmadsen.dk/articles/rip-lightroom/
 
The title of your blog link and post — RIP LIGHTROOM — is enough to tell readers What you think. I looked, and I’m right.

I’ve been using LR since 2007 and it has served me well. Perhaps as a professional, you can make your arguments that Adobe has abandoned you. But for the typical user, who is non-professional, LR hasn’t kept up with the total photographic environment, which includes smartphones and mobile devices like iPads for posting and disseminating photos.

Adobe’s initial attempt at integrating mobile has been terrible. Three weeks ago, I was ready to abandon Adobe for Google, which has evolved into some pretty impressive intelligence added to its photo handling.

For the last several months, I’ve been looking for a LR alernative that respects the moving environment of photography, integrating disparate systems like mine - I have a high powered desktop Win10 i7 PC, an IPad Pro, and a Samsung Galaxy S7, Between my Olympus cameras and my S7, I take about 4-6000 pictures a year, some more some less, but the average number is growing. That’s nowhere near a professional’s numbers, but I want to be able to edit and manage my photos from all three devices seamlessly.

A few days ago, I switched my subscription over to Lightroom CC ( that’s now the cloud-based application) and I am very glad I did. It took about 24 hours to get my 32,000+ files (a little over half a gig) uploaded and everything set up.

Now, I can access any picture on any of my devices (or even at a computer in the local library), make edits, apply keywords, titles, or captions. I can add photos from my camera via WiFi to my phone wherever I have a signal. SItting in a doctors office waiting for an appointment? I can tag and edit pictures while I sit there.

Is it perfect? Not yet. Round trips to anything other than Photoshop don’t appear to be there. Some of the editing features in the old LR aren’t there. There isn’t support for things like Jeffrey Friedl’s add-ins. Plenty more. But, when I look at what LRCC offers as a total package vs Google (which again, most of us don’t realize how advanced their platform has becomeAdobe has recognized that those of us who use multiple platforms, some of which are mobile, are a significant current and future user base.

I was days away from abandoning Adobe, and their package integrating the TOTAL environment sold me. It is version 1.0. There are lots of further capabilities that are needed, but what Ive used so far is good. I’m very pleased...

But, as we say, YMMV...
 
RIP - I don't think so. I have been a LR CC 2015 user (and many versions before that back to 2.0). I have also used multiple other packages, including Capture One. I now use LR Classic. I recently tried out LR CC v1.0

Given the changes that are happening in the camera business, and in the computer business, the changes that Adobe are making were inevitable.

IMO, LR CC and LR Classic will merge in the not so distant future into one package - call it LR CC Complete. It will be fully functional with ability to store photos in the cloud - or not.
 
I belive you didn’t read the whole piece then - my section about the new CC states exactly what you’re saying. That it is the future and indeed a very good software idea by Adobe.

it’s the “disconnect” that will happen for all that sees no future i the new CC that’s the problem.

And I’m not blaming Adobe for doing this - it’s actually a very smart move financially. i just dont understand why they didn’t make this two completely seperate products and keept lightroom “classic” on perpetual licensing with a new pricing and support structure.
 
Like many of you on this forum the new lightroom situation has left me with some heavy choices to make.

I have put together a little writeup of my analysis of the situation. I have been working with commercial IT and infrastructure development for 25 years. Maybe my analysis, thoughts and reasoning can help you making your decision?

You can find it here: http://wolffmadsen.dk/articles/rip-lightroom/
Rather doom-laden assessment, but I agree with some of your comments.

Lightroom - what is now Classic - has not had much development since about 2013 (Lightroom 5). In fact, raw processing has not changed significantly since LR4 in 2012.

The subscription model does not incentivise Adobe to do much for existing customers, but rather to use revenue from existing customers to create new markets for new customers. Hence the investment in the new Lightroom CC.

I know Tom Hogarty has promised to keep enhancing Classic (http://blogs.adobe.com/lightroomjou...ghtroom-cc-lightroom-classic-cc-and-more.html) but then he also promised that "Future versions of Lightroom will be made available via traditional perpetual licenses indefinitely" (http://blogs.adobe.com/lightroomjournal/2013/05/lightroom-and-the-creative-cloud.html).

I'm not immediately leaving Adobe, but I expect that Lightroom Classic will stagnate and that the competition will become increasing attractive. I wouldn't be surprised if I'm using something else within a year or two.
 
Like many of you on this forum the new lightroom situation has left me with some heavy choices to make.

I have put together a little writeup of my analysis of the situation. I have been working with commercial IT and infrastructure development for 25 years. Maybe my analysis, thoughts and reasoning can help you making your decision?

You can find it here: http://wolffmadsen.dk/articles/rip-lightroom/
One of your basic premises is, I believe, very wrong. You're basically saying that Adobe is going to eventually kill off a standalone version of LR that people can run on their machines in favor of a cloud only application. That's a common thread one sees around these forums, but it in order to buy that, you would have to believe that Adobe is willing to ax one very large segment of its user base in favor of another.

Typically, that's just not how companies do business. The goal for most companies, Adobe probably included, is to expand their user base.

As it stands now, most enthusiasts and professionals who use LR use it on their computers as part of a development flow. A cloud based flow just isn't viable. That's not going to change for some time. Notice I'm not saying will never change. As we all know, when it comes to the information technology age, the only constant is the constant change. But, for now and the foreseeable future, the average pro/enthusiast/prosumer with thousands of files, the new CC version won't fly. And Adobe isn't going to dump them.

Whether you agree with it or not, the subscription model makes a lot of sense from both a consumer and business standpoint; especially from a development standpoint.

It also makes it a lot easier for people to come into the ecosystem. The increasing numbers of people using both LR and PS since the advent of the subscription model seem to bear that out.

As far as the new CC, cloud only model, that also makes a lot of sense. It enables Adobe to expand their base into an otherwise ignored yet growing segment of potential users. But the notion that it's at the expense of an existing base is, in my opinion, absurd.

They're basically creating options for more people in order to expand their user base. That's basic business growth 101.
 
I know Tom Hogarty has promised to keep enhancing Classic (http://blogs.adobe.com/lightroomjou...ghtroom-cc-lightroom-classic-cc-and-more.html) but then he also promised that "Future versions of Lightroom will be made available via traditional perpetual licenses indefinitely" (http://blogs.adobe.com/lightroomjournal/2013/05/lightroom-and-the-creative-cloud.html).
This is not a disconnect. People keep using the "indefinitely" quote as an example of disingenuousness. It's not. Indefinitely is an adverb of the adjective "indefinite" which literally means an unknown or unstated length of time. It doesn't mean forever.
 
I know Tom Hogarty has promised to keep enhancing Classic (http://blogs.adobe.com/lightroomjou...ghtroom-cc-lightroom-classic-cc-and-more.html) but then he also promised that "Future versions of Lightroom will be made available via traditional perpetual licenses indefinitely" (http://blogs.adobe.com/lightroomjournal/2013/05/lightroom-and-the-creative-cloud.html).
This is not a disconnect. People keep using the "indefinitely" quote as an example of disingenuousness. It's not. Indefinitely is an adverb of the adjective "indefinite" which literally means an unknown or unstated length of time. It doesn't mean forever.
The word "indefinite" has multiple meanings. It can mean "of undetermined period". However, taking that meaning, Tom's original statement is meaningless: "I have no idea how long Lightroom will be made available via traditional perpetual licence". That's clearly not the meaning he intended to convey.

The more colloquial usage is that an "indefinite" period is one without end.

Tom did not tell an untruth, but he must have known that the meaning most people inferred was not that within a few years Adobe would end perpetual licences of Lightroom.
 
Like many of you on this forum the new lightroom situation has left me with some heavy choices to make.

I have put together a little writeup of my analysis of the situation. I have been working with commercial IT and infrastructure development for 25 years. Maybe my analysis, thoughts and reasoning can help you making your decision?

You can find it here: http://wolffmadsen.dk/articles/rip-lightroom/
One of your basic premises is, I believe, very wrong. You're basically saying that Adobe is going to eventually kill off a standalone version of LR that people can run on their machines in favor of a cloud only application.
No, I'm saying that they will not develop Classic much; it will not get the love and attention that Lightroom CC will. Perhaps when CC catches up with Classic they'll merge the two as Jim B suggests, but they may just leave Classic eventually with little or no further enhancement. No need to kill it off.
That's a common thread one sees around these forums, but it in order to buy that, you would have to believe that Adobe is willing to ax one very large segment of its user base in favor of another.
As I say, I don't think that's a correct understanding of what I'm suggesting.
Typically, that's just not how companies do business. The goal for most companies, Adobe probably included, is to expand their user base.
Not always. Sometimes they decide that some sector of their customer base isn't worth supporting. However in this case more likely is that they encourage users to migrate to CC simply by not enhancing Classic.

The point here is that they don't need to do much to keep Classic customers, at least in the short term. As an illustration: they've done very little to enhance Classic for several years, but AFAIK they've increased the customer base. More useful to Adobe is to expand their user base into new areas by launching new products, such as Lightroom CC.
As it stands now, most enthusiasts and professionals who use LR use it on their computers as part of a development flow. A cloud based flow just isn't viable. That's not going to change for some time. Notice I'm not saying will never change. As we all know, when it comes to the information technology age, the only constant is the constant change. But, for now and the foreseeable future, the average pro/enthusiast/prosumer with thousands of files, the new CC version won't fly. And Adobe isn't going to dump them.

Whether you agree with it or not, the subscription model makes a lot of sense from both a consumer...
I don't agree. They may put it at a lower price point (which they have with the LR photography package) but I don't see any inherent benefit to consumers from the subscription model.
...and business standpoint;
I fully agree with that. It means that they do not need to innovate in order to secure recurring revenues. With perpetual licence, they need to launch new features from time to time to get more revenue from existing customers. With a subscription they can do didly swat and still get monthly revenues - provided they are market leader, which is the case for Adobe. Eventally the competition will have a better product if Adobe don't continue to enhance their product, but at they moment it's questionable whether there is a complete, equally capable competitor to Lightroom and Photoshop.
especially from a development standpoint.

It also makes it a lot easier for people to come into the ecosystem. The increasing numbers of people using both LR and PS since the advent of the subscription model seem to bear that out.

As far as the new CC, cloud only model, that also makes a lot of sense. It enables Adobe to expand their base into an otherwise ignored yet growing segment of potential users. But the notion that it's at the expense of an existing base is, in my opinion, absurd.
I don't agree, for the reasons I've explained.
They're basically creating options for more people in order to expand their user base. That's basic business growth 101.
As I say, I don't think that's an accurate representation of the position. But who knows? Your analysis might be right and mine wrong.
--
I feel more like I do now than I did before ...
https://www.flickr.com/photos/144454453@N02/
--
Simon
 
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I know Tom Hogarty has promised to keep enhancing Classic (http://blogs.adobe.com/lightroomjou...ghtroom-cc-lightroom-classic-cc-and-more.html) but then he also promised that "Future versions of Lightroom will be made available via traditional perpetual licenses indefinitely" (http://blogs.adobe.com/lightroomjournal/2013/05/lightroom-and-the-creative-cloud.html).
This is not a disconnect. People keep using the "indefinitely" quote as an example of disingenuousness. It's not. Indefinitely is an adverb of the adjective "indefinite" which literally means an unknown or unstated length of time. It doesn't mean forever.
The word "indefinite" has multiple meanings. It can mean "of undetermined period". However, taking that meaning, Tom's original statement is meaningless: "I have no idea how long Lightroom will be made available via traditional perpetual licence". That's clearly not the meaning he intended to convey.

The more colloquial usage is that an "indefinite" period is one without end.

Tom did not tell an untruth, but he must have known that the meaning most people inferred was not that within a few years Adobe would end perpetual licences of Lightroom.
 
I know Tom Hogarty has promised to keep enhancing Classic (http://blogs.adobe.com/lightroomjou...ghtroom-cc-lightroom-classic-cc-and-more.html) but then he also promised that "Future versions of Lightroom will be made available via traditional perpetual licenses indefinitely" (http://blogs.adobe.com/lightroomjournal/2013/05/lightroom-and-the-creative-cloud.html).
This is not a disconnect. People keep using the "indefinitely" quote as an example of disingenuousness. It's not. Indefinitely is an adverb of the adjective "indefinite" which literally means an unknown or unstated length of time. It doesn't mean forever.
The word "indefinite" has multiple meanings. It can mean "of undetermined period". However, taking that meaning, Tom's original statement is meaningless: "I have no idea how long Lightroom will be made available via traditional perpetual licence". That's clearly not the meaning he intended to convey.

The more colloquial usage is that an "indefinite" period is one without end.

Tom did not tell an untruth, but he must have known that the meaning most people inferred was not that within a few years Adobe would end perpetual licences of Lightroom.
 
I know Tom Hogarty has promised to keep enhancing Classic (http://blogs.adobe.com/lightroomjou...ghtroom-cc-lightroom-classic-cc-and-more.html) but then he also promised that "Future versions of Lightroom will be made available via traditional perpetual licenses indefinitely" (http://blogs.adobe.com/lightroomjournal/2013/05/lightroom-and-the-creative-cloud.html).
This is not a disconnect. People keep using the "indefinitely" quote as an example of disingenuousness. It's not. Indefinitely is an adverb of the adjective "indefinite" which literally means an unknown or unstated length of time. It doesn't mean forever.
The word "indefinite" has multiple meanings. It can mean "of undetermined period". However, taking that meaning, Tom's original statement is meaningless: "I have no idea how long Lightroom will be made available via traditional perpetual licence". That's clearly not the meaning he intended to convey.

The more colloquial usage is that an "indefinite" period is one without end.

Tom did not tell an untruth, but he must have known that the meaning most people inferred was not that within a few years Adobe would end perpetual licences of Lightroom.
 
Like many of you on this forum the new lightroom situation has left me with some heavy choices to make.

I have put together a little writeup of my analysis of the situation. I have been working with commercial IT and infrastructure development for 25 years. Maybe my analysis, thoughts and reasoning can help you making your decision?

You can find it here: http://wolffmadsen.dk/articles/rip-lightroom/
I really don't like what Adobe have been doing with licensing either but I guess it's working for them.

Frankly, LR licensing is a bit academic for me these days. I gave up on LR because of poor performance. If they ever address that, I fear I'll face a real dilemma :-(
 
Like many of you on this forum the new lightroom situation has left me with some heavy choices to make.

I have put together a little writeup of my analysis of the situation. I have been working with commercial IT and infrastructure development for 25 years. Maybe my analysis, thoughts and reasoning can help you making your decision?

You can find it here: http://wolffmadsen.dk/articles/rip-lightroom/
One of your basic premises is, I believe, very wrong. You're basically saying that Adobe is going to eventually kill off a standalone version of LR that people can run on their machines in favor of a cloud only application.
No, I'm saying that they will not develop Classic much; it will not get the love and attention that Lightroom CC will. Perhaps when CC catches up with Classic they'll merge the two as Jim B suggests, but they may just leave Classic eventually with little or no further enhancement. No need to kill it off.
That's a common thread one sees around these forums, but it in order to buy that, you would have to believe that Adobe is willing to ax one very large segment of its user base in favor of another.
As I say, I don't think that's a correct understanding of what I'm suggesting.
Typically, that's just not how companies do business. The goal for most companies, Adobe probably included, is to expand their user base.
Not always. Sometimes they decide that some sector of their customer base isn't worth supporting. However in this case more likely is that they encourage users to migrate to CC simply by not enhancing Classic.

The point here is that they don't need to do much to keep Classic customers, at least in the short term. As an illustration: they've done very little to enhance Classic for several years, but AFAIK they've increased the customer base. More useful to Adobe is to expand their user base into new areas by launching new products, such as Lightroom CC.
As it stands now, most enthusiasts and professionals who use LR use it on their computers as part of a development flow. A cloud based flow just isn't viable. That's not going to change for some time. Notice I'm not saying will never change. As we all know, when it comes to the information technology age, the only constant is the constant change. But, for now and the foreseeable future, the average pro/enthusiast/prosumer with thousands of files, the new CC version won't fly. And Adobe isn't going to dump them.

Whether you agree with it or not, the subscription model makes a lot of sense from both a consumer...
I don't agree. They may put it at a lower price point (which they have with the LR photography package) but I don't see any inherent benefit to consumers from the subscription model.
...and business standpoint;
I fully agree with that. It means that they do not need to innovate in order to secure recurring revenues. With perpetual licence, they need to launch new features from time to time to get more revenue from existing customers. With a subscription they can do didly swat and still get monthly revenues - provided they are market leader, which is the case for Adobe. Eventally the competition will have a better product if Adobe don't continue to enhance their product, but at they moment it's questionable whether there is a complete, equally capable competitor to Lightroom and Photoshop.
especially from a development standpoint.

It also makes it a lot easier for people to come into the ecosystem. The increasing numbers of people using both LR and PS since the advent of the subscription model seem to bear that out.

As far as the new CC, cloud only model, that also makes a lot of sense. It enables Adobe to expand their base into an otherwise ignored yet growing segment of potential users. But the notion that it's at the expense of an existing base is, in my opinion, absurd.
I don't agree, for the reasons I've explained.
They're basically creating options for more people in order to expand their user base. That's basic business growth 101.
As I say, I don't think that's an accurate representation of the position. But who knows? Your analysis might be right and mine wrong.
 
Like many of you on this forum the new lightroom situation has left me with some heavy choices to make.

I have put together a little writeup of my analysis of the situation. I have been working with commercial IT and infrastructure development for 25 years. Maybe my analysis, thoughts and reasoning can help you making your decision?

You can find it here: http://wolffmadsen.dk/articles/rip-lightroom/
One of your basic premises is, I believe, very wrong. You're basically saying that Adobe is going to eventually kill off a standalone version of LR that people can run on their machines in favor of a cloud only application.
No, I'm saying that they will not develop Classic much; it will not get the love and attention that Lightroom CC will. Perhaps when CC catches up with Classic they'll merge the two as Jim B suggests, but they may just leave Classic eventually with little or no further enhancement. No need to kill it off.
That's a common thread one sees around these forums, but it in order to buy that, you would have to believe that Adobe is willing to ax one very large segment of its user base in favor of another.
As I say, I don't think that's a correct understanding of what I'm suggesting.
Typically, that's just not how companies do business. The goal for most companies, Adobe probably included, is to expand their user base.
Not always. Sometimes they decide that some sector of their customer base isn't worth supporting. However in this case more likely is that they encourage users to migrate to CC simply by not enhancing Classic.

The point here is that they don't need to do much to keep Classic customers, at least in the short term. As an illustration: they've done very little to enhance Classic for several years, but AFAIK they've increased the customer base. More useful to Adobe is to expand their user base into new areas by launching new products, such as Lightroom CC.
As it stands now, most enthusiasts and professionals who use LR use it on their computers as part of a development flow. A cloud based flow just isn't viable. That's not going to change for some time. Notice I'm not saying will never change. As we all know, when it comes to the information technology age, the only constant is the constant change. But, for now and the foreseeable future, the average pro/enthusiast/prosumer with thousands of files, the new CC version won't fly. And Adobe isn't going to dump them.

Whether you agree with it or not, the subscription model makes a lot of sense from both a consumer...
I don't agree. They may put it at a lower price point (which they have with the LR photography package) but I don't see any inherent benefit to consumers from the subscription model.
...and business standpoint;
I fully agree with that. It means that they do not need to innovate in order to secure recurring revenues. With perpetual licence, they need to launch new features from time to time to get more revenue from existing customers. With a subscription they can do didly swat and still get monthly revenues - provided they are market leader, which is the case for Adobe. Eventally the competition will have a better product if Adobe don't continue to enhance their product, but at they moment it's questionable whether there is a complete, equally capable competitor to Lightroom and Photoshop.
especially from a development standpoint.

It also makes it a lot easier for people to come into the ecosystem. The increasing numbers of people using both LR and PS since the advent of the subscription model seem to bear that out.

As far as the new CC, cloud only model, that also makes a lot of sense. It enables Adobe to expand their base into an otherwise ignored yet growing segment of potential users. But the notion that it's at the expense of an existing base is, in my opinion, absurd.
I don't agree, for the reasons I've explained.
They're basically creating options for more people in order to expand their user base. That's basic business growth 101.
As I say, I don't think that's an accurate representation of the position. But who knows? Your analysis might be right and mine wrong.
 
Like many of you on this forum the new lightroom situation has left me with some heavy choices to make.

I have put together a little writeup of my analysis of the situation. I have been working with commercial IT and infrastructure development for 25 years. Maybe my analysis, thoughts and reasoning can help you making your decision?

You can find it here: http://wolffmadsen.dk/articles/rip-lightroom/
One of your basic premises is, I believe, very wrong. You're basically saying that Adobe is going to eventually kill off a standalone version of LR that people can run on their machines in favor of a cloud only application.
No, I'm saying that they will not develop Classic much; it will not get the love and attention that Lightroom CC will. Perhaps when CC catches up with Classic they'll merge the two as Jim B suggests, but they may just leave Classic eventually with little or no further enhancement. No need to kill it off.
That's a common thread one sees around these forums, but it in order to buy that, you would have to believe that Adobe is willing to ax one very large segment of its user base in favor of another.
As I say, I don't think that's a correct understanding of what I'm suggesting.
Typically, that's just not how companies do business. The goal for most companies, Adobe probably included, is to expand their user base.
Not always. Sometimes they decide that some sector of their customer base isn't worth supporting. However in this case more likely is that they encourage users to migrate to CC simply by not enhancing Classic.

The point here is that they don't need to do much to keep Classic customers, at least in the short term. As an illustration: they've done very little to enhance Classic for several years, but AFAIK they've increased the customer base. More useful to Adobe is to expand their user base into new areas by launching new products, such as Lightroom CC.
As it stands now, most enthusiasts and professionals who use LR use it on their computers as part of a development flow. A cloud based flow just isn't viable. That's not going to change for some time. Notice I'm not saying will never change. As we all know, when it comes to the information technology age, the only constant is the constant change. But, for now and the foreseeable future, the average pro/enthusiast/prosumer with thousands of files, the new CC version won't fly. And Adobe isn't going to dump them.

Whether you agree with it or not, the subscription model makes a lot of sense from both a consumer...
I don't agree. They may put it at a lower price point (which they have with the LR photography package) but I don't see any inherent benefit to consumers from the subscription model.
...and business standpoint;
I fully agree with that. It means that they do not need to innovate in order to secure recurring revenues. With perpetual licence, they need to launch new features from time to time to get more revenue from existing customers. With a subscription they can do didly swat and still get monthly revenues - provided they are market leader, which is the case for Adobe. Eventally the competition will have a better product if Adobe don't continue to enhance their product, but at they moment it's questionable whether there is a complete, equally capable competitor to Lightroom and Photoshop.
especially from a development standpoint.

It also makes it a lot easier for people to come into the ecosystem. The increasing numbers of people using both LR and PS since the advent of the subscription model seem to bear that out.

As far as the new CC, cloud only model, that also makes a lot of sense. It enables Adobe to expand their base into an otherwise ignored yet growing segment of potential users. But the notion that it's at the expense of an existing base is, in my opinion, absurd.
I don't agree, for the reasons I've explained.
They're basically creating options for more people in order to expand their user base. That's basic business growth 101.
As I say, I don't think that's an accurate representation of the position. But who knows? Your analysis might be right and mine wrong.
 

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