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Olympus hype...
- Thread starter Petteri Sulonen
- Start date
Matt105483
Senior Member
it may not suck .. but why would someone sane create a hype which makes the camera look like "gods own camera" to quote another forum member, then send that jewel for a review where it is revealed that it needs some more tweaking ..
then they go: "oopsie, lets develop this more" .... give me a break, this is below amateurish.
then they go: "oopsie, lets develop this more" .... give me a break, this is below amateurish.
.......... too long a story to recall again, but my second only new camera up to that time and the “Rolls Royce” of film cameras, the OM-1 ~ it’s meter was not working at the counter out of the box ~ I should have walked then, but that’s easy to say now, I still remember the IR£341 (old Irish punts) I spent on it and the IR£475 for the 75~150mm F4 (or was that 70~150?), never had any value out of it or the good money after bad following the body line to the OM-4 (not the Ti version) and my “bad luck” did not break until I bought Nikon.
Let’s say that history repeated itself with the E10 a few years ago and I don’t believe I actually have “bad luck”.
When I was buying the E10 I said my only reservation was that it was an Olympus and unfortunately for my samples and me they lived up to my previous experiences.
Now third time around and I heard the “hyperbole” the same hyperbole going back thirty years and I for one just shiver with fright, you see that first “real” new camera cost me too much at 19/20 years of age and too many years were wasted trying to salvage something from it, it represented a bigger chunk of change than the D1x’s or the 1D’s that I can buy now on a credit card and are far more disposable and less pivotal.
I’m not so fragile anymore and have come to demand a high standard for my money, when the E1’s concept was announced two years ago I was interested, then and I’d most probably have bought one, but now today (too late) and the totally over the wall marketing, well, maybe history won’t repeat itself again, but I’m not exposing myself to the possibilities, any thoughts of trying one have left me.
otherwise they wont get ur attention
beam me up scotty
im giving it all shes got captain
--
beam me up scotty
im giving it all shes got captain
Just Looking
Veteran Member
Isn't that what they did? They called it 10.2 million photodetectors in most material I've seen, and also 3.4 MP x 3 layers. Trouble is, dealers, reviewers, etc., didn't know what to do with those numbers, and just put 3.4 MP into their tables, making for a ridiculous spec for a camera with higher photodiode count, resolution, and sharpness than a 6 MP camera. What should they try next?
j
D
David Martin
Guest
Doug Brown
Veteran Member
Just as bad as Foveon/Sigma?!
At least the Foveon sensor was a bonafide unique technical innovation.
What have Olympus done?
Designed four lenses around an oddball sensor size (one of which is so hyper expensive they'll be lucky to sell a dozen world-wide) and that's about it.
They didn't invent weather-sealed DSLR's.
There is no consortium of any substance behind this concept (heard any 4/3's announcements from reputed partners Fuji and Kodak?)
They aren't the first to design lenses to digital specifications (Canon, Nikon and Sigma can all lay claim to having been there, done that)
The lenses aren't substantially lighter, sharper, or less expensive.
The camera body is larger than the Pentax with an APS sensored body (ouch, that's got to be embarrassing)
I have a hard time figuring out what it was exactly that they thought was so revolutionary about the 4/3's idea that they would stick to it doggedly over the roughly 3 years this camera was in development.
Must have been the dust shaker thingy (and no one knows for sure whether it works long term, or how long it will last- considering the E10's shutter life expectancy I don't hold out much hope on this)
Regards,
Doug B
Torontowide.com
At least the Foveon sensor was a bonafide unique technical innovation.
What have Olympus done?
Designed four lenses around an oddball sensor size (one of which is so hyper expensive they'll be lucky to sell a dozen world-wide) and that's about it.
They didn't invent weather-sealed DSLR's.
There is no consortium of any substance behind this concept (heard any 4/3's announcements from reputed partners Fuji and Kodak?)
They aren't the first to design lenses to digital specifications (Canon, Nikon and Sigma can all lay claim to having been there, done that)
The lenses aren't substantially lighter, sharper, or less expensive.
The camera body is larger than the Pentax with an APS sensored body (ouch, that's got to be embarrassing)
I have a hard time figuring out what it was exactly that they thought was so revolutionary about the 4/3's idea that they would stick to it doggedly over the roughly 3 years this camera was in development.
Must have been the dust shaker thingy (and no one knows for sure whether it works long term, or how long it will last- considering the E10's shutter life expectancy I don't hold out much hope on this)
Regards,
Doug B
Torontowide.com
J
Jon Ragnarsson
Guest
I was talking about the "standard" lens mount. I really want to be able to use my Canon lenses on my Nikons, or Sigma lenses on my Pentaxes, etc... That is the whole concept of the 4/3 system.
(Will it ever work? That is a whole different story)
http://jonr.beecee.org/
(Will it ever work? That is a whole different story)
--Hi Jon - but you are not immune. You have bought the 4/3 concept
The 4/3 concept is not revolutionary at all. Everything you can do
with the 4/3 cameras you can do with a small sensor DSLR, e.g.
10D or D100.
Roland
http://jonr.beecee.org/
J
Jon Ragnarsson
Guest
At least I can get "fitting" 14-54mm (28-105mm eq.) for the E-1. Nikon is doing the right thing, though, with the 18-55mm but no so luck with Canon. I can get close with a expensive 24-70mm, but still quite awkward. (Would you buy a 1kg 38-120mm lens for $1300?)
http://jonr.beecee.org/
--And you should learn some manners
You are right that he said so - and I missed that.
But IMHO - that is not an answer to the question.
The advantages of the 4/3 system are currently none.
all other manufacturresrs have small sensor cameras with
specially adopted lenses. So, there are no advantages.
Roland
http://jonr.beecee.org/
eshropshire
Senior Member
I am not trying to pick on the Olmpus people, and since no one currently owns an E1 I am not slamming anyone. But I just wondering what is the appeal of the E1? I am not trying to get anyone mad, or something, but I looked at the specs and read the previews and nothing jumps out at me as interesting, vs the options from Nikon, Fuji, Canon or Pentax. It just seems like a lot of money to put into an unproven system. I would just be afraid of spending all the money on the camera and lenses and then have the system not take off.
As has been pointed out there is the marketing hype, but I can't believe people have really bought it. Olympus had an SLR like body for their E line. It would not fit an APS sized sensor, but would fit, would you believe it, and how lucky is this, The perfect sensor size for a DSLR.
I guess you can believe that, or the fact that the E cameras were at the end of their life, no one was going to pay for an E30 with with micro sensor with a fixed lens when they could buy a large sensor DSLR for the same price. Olympus did not have a SLR line they could turn to for with a ready supply of lenses so they had to come up with a way to turn the E30 into a DSLR with interchangable lenses and a larger sensor. Figured out the largest sensor that would fit into the body, got Kodak to build it, and they claimed they were a partner in a new standard. I guess the same way Sony is a partner with Nikon on the D100 and Pentax on the *ist.
They then put forth a lot of marketing hype, too bad it was two years too late. Then they released photos that I only hope are from non production firmware cameras. That are well, ok, but not one that yet shows how the 4/3rds is the best concept.
I just don't get the reason why people are so excited about this system. What is the personal appeal? Many of you are very commited to the new system, without any personal experience with the camera. I hope it is successful competition is good for the industry and helps everyone. Just look at the high price and poor quality of office suite software and see what lack of competition brings. But, it is a lot of money to spend on something that is built on such an unstable foundation.
Ed
Ed
http://www.cbrycelea.com/photos/Index.html Old Pictures
As has been pointed out there is the marketing hype, but I can't believe people have really bought it. Olympus had an SLR like body for their E line. It would not fit an APS sized sensor, but would fit, would you believe it, and how lucky is this, The perfect sensor size for a DSLR.
I guess you can believe that, or the fact that the E cameras were at the end of their life, no one was going to pay for an E30 with with micro sensor with a fixed lens when they could buy a large sensor DSLR for the same price. Olympus did not have a SLR line they could turn to for with a ready supply of lenses so they had to come up with a way to turn the E30 into a DSLR with interchangable lenses and a larger sensor. Figured out the largest sensor that would fit into the body, got Kodak to build it, and they claimed they were a partner in a new standard. I guess the same way Sony is a partner with Nikon on the D100 and Pentax on the *ist.
They then put forth a lot of marketing hype, too bad it was two years too late. Then they released photos that I only hope are from non production firmware cameras. That are well, ok, but not one that yet shows how the 4/3rds is the best concept.
I just don't get the reason why people are so excited about this system. What is the personal appeal? Many of you are very commited to the new system, without any personal experience with the camera. I hope it is successful competition is good for the industry and helps everyone. Just look at the high price and poor quality of office suite software and see what lack of competition brings. But, it is a lot of money to spend on something that is built on such an unstable foundation.
Ed
--Re the official UK prices for the E-system: is anyone else as
turned off by the superlatives in Olympus marketing hype?
"Revolutionary," "presenting new benchmarks for professional image
quality and performance," "hails a new chapter in the history of
photography," and to top it off, "world’s first professional use
digital SLR system" (I suppose the D1's and 1D's of this world are
just for rich snapshooters, then).
Really, the E-1 looks like a pretty decent machine, but with
phraseology like this, it'd take God's own digital camera not to
disappoint. I'd have thought they'd know enough to tone it down by
now; instead, they're getting shriller and shriller.
Petteri
--
Portfolio: [ http://www.seittipaja.fi/index/ ]
Pontification: [ http://www.seittipaja.fi/ ]
Ed
http://www.cbrycelea.com/photos/Index.html Old Pictures
and I was commenting on your comments of their marketing: Their marketing is claiming what the camera IS (accorrding to them) as a SITE OWNER, I don't feel that it is correct that you take a stand like this in public: It affects waht EVERYONE thinks of Olympus, and thus their camera system.
Geir Ove
Geir Ove
Jukka Jarnberg
Senior Member
-------
Not going to detailed argument but ...
1. We have been satisfied with E-10 though we have encountered its limitations
+ points have been
stable
solid build
handling controls suits us
good lens
2. E-1 is built similar body type tht we are accustomed
3. all who have handled it point out the excellent build quality
4. offered lenses (50-200mm zoom specially) fits our needs
5. system overall weight is less than 10D with similar lenses
6. picture quality is not so bad in real life situation as Phil's test charts suggest
We were originally Canon oriented when shooting film in 1970's - life just threw some curve balls for us and we were doing something else than photography 1980's & 1990's - now we are building up gear from zero level. We are not going to or we do not have budget to buy Canon 1Ds system or comparable Kodak/Nikon system. Olympus E-1 system fills our prescription, even so much condemned price will be sure to settle proper level.
It is very funny how sensible reasonable behaving persons have fallen to 'pick' on advertisement text and policy - ads are always overstatements so they should be able to filter that out and concentrate teir time and energy to more productive type of doings. Even reviewers are human and possible to err.
Have a good photography day
Jukka
--
http://www.sirucats.com/
http://www.kotiposti.net/jjg47/
P
Phil Askey
Guest
Geir, I'm surprised by your response because you know that I (and others) regularly make comments about press releases in a far more public manner than this. Indeed you didn't see one of my "green comments" in the news article did you? Instead I chose to 'discuss' the matter here with those who are interested, instead of doing it a FAR MORE public manner.
Phil Askey
Editor / Owner, dpreview.com
--
Phil Askey
Editor / Owner, dpreview.com
Jorgen Bergfors
Leading Member
Two things from the top of my head:
Automatic sensor cleaning. No-one else have this.
Covers 28 - 108 mm in one fairly fast (F/2,8-3,5) lens. No one except Canon 1Ds can match this.
Jorgen
I too, hope for there sake, that there production model is better. I recently looked at large advertisement section in a pro photo mag. While they go on and on about the merits of having the only pro digital camera system (give me a break), the proof is in the pudding.
They have a studio shot of somone holding a bike. It's not that great, and certainly not acceptable for high-profile advertisements. Certainly no comparison to medium format.
As far as I see it, Canon is the only company with a high-end pro digital system, the 1Ds. It goes toe to toe with medium format, only a bit smaller. If your intention is to shoot 3:2 images, Canon has the best pro digital system out there. And, compared to its competition, it's cheap. The Kodak pro back, for medium format, is more than double the price of the 1Ds, and of course does not include a camera!
Olympus is trying hard to build a name for themselves. It is possible that future releases in the new line will be outstanding. But, for now, the E1 is no bargain.
-¥akuza
Jono Slack
Forum Pro
1. small and light
2. really good build quality
3. huge range in three zoom lenses
4. sensor cleaning
5. perspective correction
6. splashproof
That's why I'm interested!
(mainly for travel)
kind regards
jono slack
Jono Slack
http://www.slack.co.uk
2. really good build quality
3. huge range in three zoom lenses
4. sensor cleaning
5. perspective correction
6. splashproof
That's why I'm interested!
(mainly for travel)
kind regards
jono slack
--As has been pointed out there is the marketing hype, but I can't
believe people have really bought it. Olympus had an SLR like body
for their E line. It would not fit an APS sized sensor, but would
fit, would you believe it, and how lucky is this, The perfect
sensor size for a DSLR.
I guess you can believe that, or the fact that the E cameras were
at the end of their life, no one was going to pay for an E30 with
with micro sensor with a fixed lens when they could buy a large
sensor DSLR for the same price. Olympus did not have a SLR line
they could turn to for with a ready supply of lenses so they had to
come up with a way to turn the E30 into a DSLR with interchangable
lenses and a larger sensor. Figured out the largest sensor that
would fit into the body, got Kodak to build it, and they claimed
they were a partner in a new standard. I guess the same way Sony
is a partner with Nikon on the D100 and Pentax on the *ist.
They then put forth a lot of marketing hype, too bad it was two
years too late. Then they released photos that I only hope are from
non production firmware cameras. That are well, ok, but not one
that yet shows how the 4/3rds is the best concept.
I just don't get the reason why people are so excited about this
system. What is the personal appeal? Many of you are very commited
to the new system, without any personal experience with the camera.
I hope it is successful competition is good for the industry and
helps everyone. Just look at the high price and poor quality of
office suite software and see what lack of competition brings. But,
it is a lot of money to spend on something that is built on such an
unstable foundation.
Ed
--Re the official UK prices for the E-system: is anyone else as
turned off by the superlatives in Olympus marketing hype?
"Revolutionary," "presenting new benchmarks for professional image
quality and performance," "hails a new chapter in the history of
photography," and to top it off, "world’s first professional use
digital SLR system" (I suppose the D1's and 1D's of this world are
just for rich snapshooters, then).
Really, the E-1 looks like a pretty decent machine, but with
phraseology like this, it'd take God's own digital camera not to
disappoint. I'd have thought they'd know enough to tone it down by
now; instead, they're getting shriller and shriller.
Petteri
--
Portfolio: [ http://www.seittipaja.fi/index/ ]
Pontification: [ http://www.seittipaja.fi/ ]
Ed
http://www.cbrycelea.com/photos/Index.html Old Pictures
Jono Slack
http://www.slack.co.uk
........ by far the consensus of opinion is that Olympus are making unsustainable claims in a broad market appeal.
In marketing, perception is reality, we have a huge amount of people who will believe blindly, however, the vast majority (apparently) on educated boards like DPreview have a different perception and don’t trust Olympus.
It depends on where Olympus actually believe their market lies, their advertising is certainly aimed at the impressionable amateur who may lack the knowledge to disclaim them. But it also leads the “professional” to dismiss the system as a serious professional tool.
However, from the inside, like you are with an E10 already and a happy customer, then it certainly is the top of the Olympus line and does carry professional characteristics, based on the previous E10/20 models for sure. In this light it’s a winner and you are sensible enough to see through the haze, it’s an improvement that I, if I still had an E10 would have been very pleased with. However, I think we’d make up a fairly small market segment.
And this is where I tend to draw swords, Olympus are challenging everybody including me with my Nikon and Canon systems, and frankly I have them well beaten.
Best of luck with your E1, maybe you and few of the boys and girls would do an E1 day special, I’d like to see that.
))
Cheers.
In marketing, perception is reality, we have a huge amount of people who will believe blindly, however, the vast majority (apparently) on educated boards like DPreview have a different perception and don’t trust Olympus.
It depends on where Olympus actually believe their market lies, their advertising is certainly aimed at the impressionable amateur who may lack the knowledge to disclaim them. But it also leads the “professional” to dismiss the system as a serious professional tool.
However, from the inside, like you are with an E10 already and a happy customer, then it certainly is the top of the Olympus line and does carry professional characteristics, based on the previous E10/20 models for sure. In this light it’s a winner and you are sensible enough to see through the haze, it’s an improvement that I, if I still had an E10 would have been very pleased with. However, I think we’d make up a fairly small market segment.
And this is where I tend to draw swords, Olympus are challenging everybody including me with my Nikon and Canon systems, and frankly I have them well beaten.
Best of luck with your E1, maybe you and few of the boys and girls would do an E1 day special, I’d like to see that.
))Cheers.
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