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For Faster BIF focusing.

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Roland Karlsson said:
audiobomber said:
brandrx said:
Not only what you wrote but another thing that I noticed when comparing my Nikon to my Pentax. When using the Pentax, if your focus ring is set in such a way, let's say from your previous last shot, and if you look through the viewfinder and everything going longer is so OOF that there is very little to no definition to anything, then the Pentax will first rack to minimum distance then focus towards infinity to find the subject. That takes a lot of time, especially for a long focus throw lens,
Click to expand...
I agree, I've also noted this behaviour. That's why I started resetting focus to infinity in the first place. I reset now as a reflex action, I don't even have to think about it.
Click to expand...
Interesting (and useful) thread. You always hear that phase focusing is so good because it can find out how far to move from the phase difference. But, if the image is totally blurred, the phase difference cannot be found. Then, it has to have some fallback algorithm.

Just out of curiosity. What did the Nikon do?
Click to expand...
The Nikon always focuses towards the subject you point at, no matter if there is no definition to see, no matter if you are starting from 10 feet or infinity.

Ron
 
LaRee said:
brandrx said:
Hi Folks,

Always be ready for a BIF (actually most any kind of shot) by pre-setting your lens near infinity to be ready for the shot.

When you point your lens in the direction of the subject you want to take then if the definition of what you are pointing at is such that it shows very little definition then the Pentax camera will attempt to go to minimum focus first then back towards infinity. If you first set your lens towards infinity then the definition of most subjects will be such that the Pentax will go directly to the subject to lock on.

Test it out yourself with your 300mm or longer lenses. Set to infinity to be ready for BIF. Then keep track if you lock on to your subject faster all the time.

Ron
Click to expand...
I will definitely try this out. This is my major frustration with birds in flight. It is always an exercise in frustration for me. I do get lucky at times but it is mostly frustrating. Thank you for the tip Ron.
Click to expand...
I hope it helps you LaRee. However, IMO, for shooting BIF you need a (set up properly) Pentax K-3 / K-3II, or a Pentax K-1 to maximize your chances of capturing them.

Ron
 
brandrx said:
Roland Karlsson said:
audiobomber said:
brandrx said:
Not only what you wrote but another thing that I noticed when comparing my Nikon to my Pentax. When using the Pentax, if your focus ring is set in such a way, let's say from your previous last shot, and if you look through the viewfinder and everything going longer is so OOF that there is very little to no definition to anything, then the Pentax will first rack to minimum distance then focus towards infinity to find the subject. That takes a lot of time, especially for a long focus throw lens,
Click to expand...
I agree, I've also noted this behaviour. That's why I started resetting focus to infinity in the first place. I reset now as a reflex action, I don't even have to think about it.
Click to expand...
Interesting (and useful) thread. You always hear that phase focusing is so good because it can find out how far to move from the phase difference. But, if the image is totally blurred, the phase difference cannot be found. Then, it has to have some fallback algorithm.

Just out of curiosity. What did the Nikon do?
Click to expand...
The Nikon always focuses towards the subject you point at, no matter if there is no definition to see, no matter if you are starting from 10 feet or infinity.
Click to expand...
This makes me wonder what their secret sauce is and why Pentax can't do the same.
brandrx said:
Ron
Click to expand...
 
MightyMike said:
brandrx said:
Roland Karlsson said:
audiobomber said:
brandrx said:
Not only what you wrote but another thing that I noticed when comparing my Nikon to my Pentax. When using the Pentax, if your focus ring is set in such a way, let's say from your previous last shot, and if you look through the viewfinder and everything going longer is so OOF that there is very little to no definition to anything, then the Pentax will first rack to minimum distance then focus towards infinity to find the subject. That takes a lot of time, especially for a long focus throw lens,
Click to expand...
I agree, I've also noted this behaviour. That's why I started resetting focus to infinity in the first place. I reset now as a reflex action, I don't even have to think about it.
Click to expand...
Interesting (and useful) thread. You always hear that phase focusing is so good because it can find out how far to move from the phase difference. But, if the image is totally blurred, the phase difference cannot be found. Then, it has to have some fallback algorithm.

Just out of curiosity. What did the Nikon do?
Click to expand...
The Nikon always focuses towards the subject you point at, no matter if there is no definition to see, no matter if you are starting from 10 feet or infinity.
Click to expand...
This makes me wonder what their secret sauce is and why Pentax can't do the same.
Click to expand...
Mike,

Seems to me that all Pentax has to do, when everything is so OOF that there is no definition, is the opposite of what they are doing now. In other words, focus towards infinity instead of towards minimum. If they did that then it would work just like Nikon does.

Ron
 
brandrx said:
MightyMike said:
brandrx said:
Roland Karlsson said:
audiobomber said:
brandrx said:
Not only what you wrote but another thing that I noticed when comparing my Nikon to my Pentax. When using the Pentax, if your focus ring is set in such a way, let's say from your previous last shot, and if you look through the viewfinder and everything going longer is so OOF that there is very little to no definition to anything, then the Pentax will first rack to minimum distance then focus towards infinity to find the subject. That takes a lot of time, especially for a long focus throw lens,
Click to expand...
I agree, I've also noted this behaviour. That's why I started resetting focus to infinity in the first place. I reset now as a reflex action, I don't even have to think about it.
Click to expand...
Interesting (and useful) thread. You always hear that phase focusing is so good because it can find out how far to move from the phase difference. But, if the image is totally blurred, the phase difference cannot be found. Then, it has to have some fallback algorithm.

Just out of curiosity. What did the Nikon do?
Click to expand...
The Nikon always focuses towards the subject you point at, no matter if there is no definition to see, no matter if you are starting from 10 feet or infinity.
Click to expand...
This makes me wonder what their secret sauce is and why Pentax can't do the same.
Click to expand...
Mike,

Seems to me that all Pentax has to do, when everything is so OOF that there is no definition, is the opposite of what they are doing now. In other words, focus towards infinity instead of towards minimum. If they did that then it would work just like Nikon does.

Ron
Click to expand...
 
MightyMike said:
brandrx said:
MightyMike said:
brandrx said:
Roland Karlsson said:
audiobomber said:
brandrx said:
Not only what you wrote but another thing that I noticed when comparing my Nikon to my Pentax. When using the Pentax, if your focus ring is set in such a way, let's say from your previous last shot, and if you look through the viewfinder and everything going longer is so OOF that there is very little to no definition to anything, then the Pentax will first rack to minimum distance then focus towards infinity to find the subject. That takes a lot of time, especially for a long focus throw lens,
Click to expand...
I agree, I've also noted this behaviour. That's why I started resetting focus to infinity in the first place. I reset now as a reflex action, I don't even have to think about it.
Click to expand...
Interesting (and useful) thread. You always hear that phase focusing is so good because it can find out how far to move from the phase difference. But, if the image is totally blurred, the phase difference cannot be found. Then, it has to have some fallback algorithm.

Just out of curiosity. What did the Nikon do?
Click to expand...
The Nikon always focuses towards the subject you point at, no matter if there is no definition to see, no matter if you are starting from 10 feet or infinity.
Click to expand...
This makes me wonder what their secret sauce is and why Pentax can't do the same.
Click to expand...
Mike,

Seems to me that all Pentax has to do, when everything is so OOF that there is no definition, is the opposite of what they are doing now. In other words, focus towards infinity instead of towards minimum. If they did that then it would work just like Nikon does.

Ron
Click to expand...
I would offer a different suggestion, like yours but with more variables considered, 1) if using a macro lens at macro distances then move to the closest point rather than infinity, however if at longer focus distances check infinity first. 2) with most other lenses head to infinity first 3) allow user control the same way we can set AF adjustments for lenses.
Click to expand...
Perhaps, but I think that would be unnecessary.

I don't ever remember my Nikon going the wrong way, no matter where the lens starting point is. Therefore, I do still believe that my suggestion would solve the problem for Pentax. However, just like the SDM problem, we will never in a million years see a fix.

Ron
 
brandrx said:
The Nikon always focuses towards the subject you point at, no matter if there is no definition to see, no matter if you are starting from 10 feet or infinity.
Click to expand...
Ohhhhh... that's impressive.
 
brandrx said:
MightyMike said:
brandrx said:
Seems to me that all Pentax has to do, when everything is so OOF that there is no definition, is the opposite of what they are doing now. In other words, focus towards infinity instead of towards minimum. If they did that then it would work just like Nikon does.

Ron
Click to expand...
I would offer a different suggestion, like yours but with more variables considered, 1) if using a macro lens at macro distances then move to the closest point rather than infinity, however if at longer focus distances check infinity first. 2) with most other lenses head to infinity first 3) allow user control the same way we can set AF adjustments for lenses.
Click to expand...
Perhaps, but I think that would be unnecessary.

I don't ever remember my Nikon going the wrong way, no matter where the lens starting point is. Therefore, I do still believe that my suggestion would solve the problem for Pentax. However, just like the SDM problem, we will never in a million years see a fix.
Click to expand...
Lets assume you are right. Nikon always focus further away when all is blurry. Then, you could test it by e.g. starting at 2 meters when the object is 0.2 meters away, and totally blurry.

My personal guess is that Nikon rather goes towards the middle when everything is very blurry. This can (almost?) never be wrong IMHO.
 
brandrx said:
I hope it helps you LaRee. However, IMO, for shooting BIF you need a (set up properly) Pentax K-3 / K-3II, or a Pentax K-1 to maximize your chances of capturing them.
Click to expand...
Well, I sure don't need a whole lot of nudging to want to buy the k-1. It is on my radar and I'd probably already have bought one if they were available. I have notification set up when they come in stock at B&H. I am hoping that happens by mid July .
brandrx said:
Ron
Click to expand...
 
LaRee said:
brandrx said:
I hope it helps you LaRee. However, IMO, for shooting BIF you need a (set up properly) Pentax K-3 / K-3II, or a Pentax K-1 to maximize your chances of capturing them.
Click to expand...
Well, I sure don't need a whole lot of nudging to want to buy the k-1. It is on my radar and I'd probably already have bought one if they were available. I have notification set up when they come in stock at B&H. I am hoping that happens by mid July .
Click to expand...
I will just continue limping along with my four K-3's and one K-3II for now. I took advantage of a bunch of lower lens prices during the latter part of last year and first part of this year. Now my credit card is soooooo dang maxed out, I will most likely buy a K-1 just before spring of next year.

Ron
 
brandrx said:
LaRee said:
brandrx said:
I hope it helps you LaRee. However, IMO, for shooting BIF you need a (set up properly) Pentax K-3 / K-3II, or a Pentax K-1 to maximize your chances of capturing them.
Click to expand...
Well, I sure don't need a whole lot of nudging to want to buy the k-1. It is on my radar and I'd probably already have bought one if they were available. I have notification set up when they come in stock at B&H. I am hoping that happens by mid July .
Click to expand...
I will just continue limping along with my four K-3's and one K-3II for now. I took advantage of a bunch of lower lens prices during the latter part of last year and first part of this year. Now my credit card is soooooo dang maxed out, I will most likely buy a K-1 just before spring of next year.

Ron
Click to expand...
 
brandrx said:
LaRee said:
Well, I sure don't need a whole lot of nudging to want to buy the k-1. It is on my radar and I'd probably already have bought one if they were available. I have notification set up when they come in stock at B&H. I am hoping that happens by mid July .
Click to expand...
I will just continue limping along with my four K-3's and one K-3II for now. I took advantage of a bunch of lower lens prices during the latter part of last year and first part of this year. Now my credit card is soooooo dang maxed out, I will most likely buy a K-1 just before spring of next year.
Click to expand...
Chuckle!

Once it was clear at the start of last year that Ricoh were going to deliver some serious FF equipment, I stopped buying "distractions", sold my Sigma 500mm f/4.5 (!), and started saving.

Ricoh's releases got so delayed that I saved more than expected, so I bought the lot.

If they had delayed any more, I could have saved enough to buy the company!
 
MightyMike said:
brandrx said:
LaRee said:
brandrx said:
I hope it helps you LaRee. However, IMO, for shooting BIF you need a (set up properly) Pentax K-3 / K-3II, or a Pentax K-1 to maximize your chances of capturing them.
Click to expand...
Well, I sure don't need a whole lot of nudging to want to buy the k-1. It is on my radar and I'd probably already have bought one if they were available. I have notification set up when they come in stock at B&H. I am hoping that happens by mid July .
Click to expand...
I will just continue limping along with my four K-3's and one K-3II for now. I took advantage of a bunch of lower lens prices during the latter part of last year and first part of this year. Now my credit card is soooooo dang maxed out, I will most likely buy a K-1 just before spring of next year.

Ron
Click to expand...
Wouldn't selling all 5 of the cameras you mentioned at the very least cover the cost of a K-1?
Click to expand...
If I sold them, then I wouldn't have them anymore. Geesh! :-)

Why does everyone seem to want me to sell my "precious" stuff? :-)

If I really, really, really needed or wanted a K-1 then I would find a way to get it.

Ron
 
brandrx said:
If I sold them, then I wouldn't have them anymore. Geesh! :-)
Click to expand...
he he he ... you are one of those. Have to admit that I am one too.

Once, when I was young and foolish, I sold my Miranda Sensorex. When getting older, and more sensible, I regretted that and bought one from eBay. Not the same thing, and it is missing two lenses and the waist level finder. But ... a small compensation.
 
brandrx said:
MightyMike said:
brandrx said:
LaRee said:
brandrx said:
I hope it helps you LaRee. However, IMO, for shooting BIF you need a (set up properly) Pentax K-3 / K-3II, or a Pentax K-1 to maximize your chances of capturing them.
Click to expand...
Well, I sure don't need a whole lot of nudging to want to buy the k-1. It is on my radar and I'd probably already have bought one if they were available. I have notification set up when they come in stock at B&H. I am hoping that happens by mid July .
Click to expand...
I will just continue limping along with my four K-3's and one K-3II for now. I took advantage of a bunch of lower lens prices during the latter part of last year and first part of this year. Now my credit card is soooooo dang maxed out, I will most likely buy a K-1 just before spring of next year.

Ron
Click to expand...
Wouldn't selling all 5 of the cameras you mentioned at the very least cover the cost of a K-1?
Click to expand...
If I sold them, then I wouldn't have them anymore. Geesh! :-)
Click to expand...
Yes that is how it works! :-)
brandrx said:
Why does everyone seem to want me to sell my "precious" stuff? :-)
Click to expand...
Why do you complain about not having enough money for the K-1 if you're happy with the precious stuff you don't want to sell :-)
brandrx said:
If I really, really, really needed or wanted a K-1 then I would find a way to get it.
Click to expand...
We all do find a way, some people sell organs while others rob banks. :-)
brandrx said:
Ron
Click to expand...
 
brandrx said:
LaRee said:
brandrx said:
I hope it helps you LaRee. However, IMO, for shooting BIF you need a (set up properly) Pentax K-3 / K-3II, or a Pentax K-1 to maximize your chances of capturing them.
Click to expand...
Well, I sure don't need a whole lot of nudging to want to buy the k-1. It is on my radar and I'd probably already have bought one if they were available. I have notification set up when they come in stock at B&H. I am hoping that happens by mid July .
Click to expand...
I will just continue limping along with my four K-3's and one K-3II for now. I took advantage of a bunch of lower lens prices during the latter part of last year and first part of this year. Now my credit card is soooooo dang maxed out, I will most likely buy a K-1 just before spring of next year.

Ron
Click to expand...
I can understand that Ron. I haven't bought a new camera since the k-5. I did buy one lens since the k-5 first came out but it was under $350.00. My husband once sold a camera that I owned because he bought me an "upgraded" model. I hated the upgraded model and was so bummed not to have my old one. Then the person who bought it destroyed/broke it. Bleh. I know I have things I could sell around here. But chances are none of them are really worth a whole lot of money and the ones that are, I don't want to part with! I am sitting with almost zero credit card debt at the moment so that makes it a bit easier to order the k-1 with Amazon's 12 month no interest financing. Now that I've made the decision I'll be on pins and needles waiting to get the shipment email. They had me all worked up by showing delivery tomorrow when I first ordered it, then they changed to "we'll let you know". Bah!
 
DOes not work with DA*300 always goes back to closest then infinity..with DFA150-450 much easier... but too heavy for swallows ! ;)





OOC Jpeg..in Raw can pull shadow more..but lazy ;)
OOC Jpeg..in Raw can pull shadow more..but lazy ;)



--
LOVE LIFE & LAUGHTER
 
I tried it with my 28-105/3.5-5.6. No matter what focal length and no matter starting or end point. It always move in the right direction. I tried the best I could, but could not make it go to nearest and then back again.
 
Roland Karlsson said:
I tried it with my 28-105/3.5-5.6. No matter what focal length and no matter starting or end point. It always move in the right direction. I tried the best I could, but could not make it go to nearest and then back again.
Click to expand...
Read the OP again. We are talking about BIF shooting with 300mm or longer lenses.

Ron
 
I've had to do this a lot. And it's frustrating, because it isn't necessary. If they just set the focusing algorithm's fallback behavior to default toward trying infinity first, instead of trying close focus first, we wouldn't have to manually intervene, and we'd miss a lot fewer shots.
 
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