The image with the desaturated green is a GX8 file, not a SONY file!
Pedestrian I find the camera design, not its ability!
Writing from iPhone so will leave it at that.
Thanks
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10 months with MFT: likes/dislikes and where from here (pics)
- Thread starter deednets
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Pedestrian I find the camera design, not its ability!
Writing from iPhone so will leave it at that.
Thanks
Isn't the E-P5 like that as well?
paul cool
Senior Member
think you will find that the gx8 is honest in its colours maybe unflattering ,I like choosing vivid for colour landscapes flowers, birds ,natural for portraits ,standard for anything else when using jpeg
Sony sensors are known for cool edge to there images better for blues ,panasonic better for greens similar to canon I believe .
the pen is a great camera perhaps you should watch this price is more though
Sony sensors are known for cool edge to there images better for blues ,panasonic better for greens similar to canon I believe .
the pen is a great camera perhaps you should watch this price is more though
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peppermonkey
Veteran Member
HornOUBet
Senior Member
LOL I was beginning to wonder if anyone would notice that... and I stated, I used the shade WB setting but I also shoot RAW...here is the original posted photo and the Olympus Viewer 3 conversion to Auto WB....is this more "in" or is it still "out"???his wife isn't the one pregnant
Shade WB with my beautiful wife and pregnant stray cat....
Auto WB and my beautiful wife and STILL PREGNANT stray cat....
I think I labeled these correctly, but anyway, still loving my classic OM-D EM-5.....
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Dwight
take a peek at the world I see at
Attachments
I am sorry I stopped reading the sentence halfway through, happens when you cross/read a section ...LOL I was beginning to wonder if anyone would notice that... and I stated, I used the shade WB setting but I also shoot RAW...here is the original posted photo and the Olympus Viewer 3 conversion to Auto WB....is this more "in" or is it still "out"???his wife isn't the one pregnant
Shade WB with my beautiful wife and pregnant stray cat....
Auto WB and my beautiful wife and STILL PREGNANT stray cat....
I think I labeled these correctly, but anyway, still loving my classic OM-D EM-5.....
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Dwight
take a peek at the world I see at
http://www.flickr.com/photos/96816407@N07/
http://picasaweb.google.com/dwightparker
I like the shade WB much better in your shot, which begs the question as to what exactly it is that makes the shot so difficult to judge for the GX8 as there is plenty of actual white to pick. Of course there is a chance that Panasonic calibrated it orangy-ish and enhanced the greens (like in your shot). To pick "shade" is of course not really a satisfactory solution in the long run as "shade" can differ substantially.
I now carry a grey card with me and whenever I am not too lazy, I measure the WB first as I find that I get better results with the GX8. I would prefer though if the GX8 was closer to the Olympus default WB as it gives you a different less labour intensive starting point.
This is how I typically work when either at a photo shoot or in some overseas location (at home I usually only take one camera when I go out):
- Calibrate the cameras I have with me regarding the time stamp
- Open the files in Capture One and sort them according to the time stamp - and not according to the file name. This ensures that I have the timeline right and don't have to re-start the day's shoot in another section of the thumbnails. Simply my preference to have ALL files in chronological order.
- Then click one GX8 file, adjust the WB and then click the GX8 files, one by one and then apply the saved WB from the first shot.
Does this make it a little clearer what I mean? The other thread regarding the Pen-F files compared to the GX8 shows quite clearly how the Pana is "out" drifting into some orangy-brown. Easily corrected of course when you only have 30 images, but since this changes depending on where you shoot, it is far from straightforward. I have files from the 5DII, D800, D300s, Fuji X-E1-T1, SONY RX1 & RX1r and only go through this with the GX8, the others are all close enough as a starting point.
There is a lot to like about the GX8, so I won't part ways any time soon, but can see how it adds a quirk to my personal workflow.
Peace??
Deed
For those Olympians not versed in Panasonic cameras. The GX7 also has a front and back dial that are very intuitively placed. The method of use is much the same as described for the E-M1 and the rear dial has a push-click switch that changes its function as a toggle. There is no need even to take ones thumb off the rear dial to do this. The evf mirrors every on-going change for the user.
On balance of "perfections" and owning both E-M1 and GX7 I would hazard that the Panasonic is slightly more perfect that the E-M1. The only thing that the Olympus uniquely offers is a double press to set magnified screen fixed-on button next to the shutter button.
Getting more plebian: The GM5 only has one dial but this is also a push-click switch. By using the push-click the dial can handle both shutter speed and aperture in M mode. It uses the auto-set methodology of A and S combined in P mode and this can be varied to EV by the click toggle. In A mode the toggle alternates Shutter Speed and EV. In S mode it is more complex, as it varies with the type of lens used in a very logical way as I have demonstrated on another thread. But with normal oem AF lenses the switch toggles between Aperture Control and EV as might be expected.
All this shows up on the GM5 evf kept to the eye when it is used.
I presume that other Panasonic cameras act in the same way, but I have no experience of them.
The GM1 doesn't count as not having a built in evf - but the same series of controls is replicated without a separate wheel. The combinations of up arrow as the toggle switch and the spin of the multi-function wheel (MFW) does exactly the same job. The MFW has taken a lot of verbal battering for its accidental false presses. They (mildly) annoyed me until I became used to its soft touch and now I actually prefer it to the rougher wheel on the GM5.
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Tom Caldwell
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peppermonkey
Veteran Member
Although I prefer Panasonic, I have owned Oly (Specifically E-P2) and to say it's a nightmare is probably extreme. Different. Less intuitive. Definitely not as easy as Panny but like all things, you get used to it. And as you use it more and more, less need to go dumpster diving into the menus. Still, ergonomically and menu wise, my hands and mind is more comfortable with Panasonic so I would lean towards it more if given the chance.I know that I can make any camera potentially work well for me, pick the settings and the way a camera works, map a couple of custom settings to the C1-Cx selection - and off I go.his wife isn't the one pregnant
Since I never shoot jpg, only RAW, all I ever need is M (for obvious reasons) and A (standard) plus C1 for Auto ISO.
My guess (and really no more than that!!) is that Oly is a nightmare to tame because of the depth of the menus, so would possibly assing a button - or C2 - for High Res and C3 for live bulb (whatever that is called really??).
With those settings in place I would be good to go, customise the direction the front and rear wheels go maybe, but once set, I would basically flick in between A/M, C1 and on the odd occasion C2 or C3.
Voigtlander Vitessa? Sweet. Always wanted one. Have too many rangefinder cameras (well, cameras in general) at the moment though (Voigtlander Bessa R, Zorki 4, Fed 2...blah blah blah...yes, a rather recent obsession). Also own a Pentax K1000, Contax Rx, Aria, blah blah blah. And although the SLR's (well, the Contax's, Nikon F80 etc. etc.) are definitely more capable, I definitely enjoy using the rangefinders more so do understand what you mean.
1) important for sure but do you prefer the Oly shooting experience? Just asking because, in general, Oly's aesthetics trumps Panny but I find I enjoy shooting with the Panasonic's more (well, GF1 and GX8). Pen-F is somewhat a Frankenstein camera (buttons and dials of the OM series but body style of a Pen-F) but it's one gorgeous Frankenstein
I just know that I will find problems with the menus and Oly'isms. Panasonic generally gets out of my way.2) Nice, albeit rather limiting and would mostly go unused for my needs. Would only want it for landscape photos...but that means landscapes of no wind...
3) I think the term is correct but irregardless...this is something I would love to have.
4) Not sure. I do take videos (albeit casual) so the lack may cause problems.
5) As another raw shooter, I find no problems with colour mostly. I can get the colours I want 99.9% of the time in PP.
Sounds like a solid plan.
Hmm...if given two equal lenses, one beautiful and one a pig, sure, I'll go with the prettier one but if it's the only one you have, it takes fantastic photos then aesthetics generally would take a backseat. I love my PL 25mm 1.4 but do admit it's rather fat and the hood is inconveniently large and certainly isn't a sexy lens but the IQ...
Of course. I understand. Take a look at pretty much anything Apple. Aesthetics are generally gorgeous. Or at the very least, very very important. Anyone who can look at it objectively would say that capability wise or tech wise, Apple is almost never leading the pact (albeit, it's much more complex than that). Oly (at least in m43) has generally trumped Panasonic aesthetically and marketing (albeit, they do need to improve in that as well). I have been saying this for years but Panasonic really really needs to put more effort into making more aesthetically desirable cameras and do a complete and utter reboot on their marketing strategy (or frankly total lack of). Hopefully the new GX80/85 would be the start of it because for the first time in a long time they seem to have gotten the capabilities right to the point that even Oly fanboys can't really complain (well, EVF is rather disappointing as is no mic input
). If the IBIS is even comparable to Oly's then the fact that it's now available with 4K video... And it's smaller than GX8 and more aesthetically pleasing...it could be a hit...if Panasonic had any marketing...which they don't so...Good, but in that case you have to get a Pen-F into your hands to see if the camera feels right in your hands. Can't say about the Pen-F but all OMD's so far, haven't felt 'right' in my hands, hence upgrading to the GX8 (from GF1).
If you HAD paid more attention *ahem*
, you would have noticed the smiley I.e. just teasing you. I don't pay any attention to grammatical errors nor mistakes on points that aren't important, unless I find it amusing 
As for Pen-F vs GX8...well, other than the Jpeg engines...think all current m43 are generally comparable to the point that any differences are just nitpicks that won't have any impact in real life unless you are a true pixel peeper or a professional that demands much much more than us (or at least me) regular Joe's. Any differences you see between the two cameras I would attribute it to better lenses, better PP skills and more importantly, better photographic skills (minus high-res mode photos).
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Hubert
My non-digital gear: Agfa Isolette, Ricohflex VII, Bessa R, Bessa L, Zorky 4, Fed 2, Konica Big Mini, Konica Auto S2, K1000, Yashica Electro 35 GX, Recesky
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2034/2457111090_00eafbf8a4_m.jpg
http://www.flickr.com/photos/peppermonkey/
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I had downloaded the Pen-F and the GX8 that the guy kidly made available so know that the RAW files have a rather strong brownish-orangy hue compared to the rather excellent Pen-F files. Could be a one-of of course but have noticed the same thing ...Hopefully the new GX80/85 would be the start of it because for the first time in a long time they seem to have gotten the capabilities right to the point that even Oly fanboys can't really complain (well, EVF is rather disappointing as is no mic inputGood, but in that case you have to get a Pen-F into your hands to see if the camera feels right in your hands. Can't say about the Pen-F but all OMD's so far, haven't felt 'right' in my hands, hence upgrading to the GX8 (from GF1).
If you HAD paid more attention *ahem*
As for Pen-F vs GX8...well, other than the Jpeg engines...think all current m43 are generally comparable to the point that any differences are just nitpicks that won't have any impact in real life unless you are a true pixel peeper or a professional that demands much much more than us (or at least me) regular Joe's. Any differences you see between the two cameras I would attribute it to better lenses, better PP skills and more importantly, better photographic skills (minus high-res mode photos).
--
Hubert
My non-digital gear: Agfa Isolette, Ricohflex VII, Bessa R, Bessa L, Zorky 4, Fed 2, Konica Big Mini, Konica Auto S2, K1000, Yashica Electro 35 GX, Recesky
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2034/2457111090_00eafbf8a4_m.jpg
http://www.flickr.com/photos/peppermonkey/
The PL 25/1.4 has a rather large 25 number on the barrel - in orange! I must say I could almost let the 15/1.7 get away with it, for the sake of keeping the aperture ring ...
And design wise, I think that the LX100 is one of the nicest camera ever made, I used it on my travels to Nepal last year and really like the multi-aspect/shutter dial/aperture ring design. One of the few cameras I regretted when I sold her ...
The camera had its quirks so I sold it but for print size up to 12" the results were actually ok. Motorised zoom lever not high on my list as such but you could use the lens instead, zoom by wire so wasn't so bad ...
I will keep my eyes open for an LX200, that could be interesting ... the LX100 has 4K of course and manual focusing is a breeze with that camera.
Only Frankenstein really make the camera I would like in its entirety I guess??
Deed
Bill Wallace
Veteran Member
Excellent work Deeds, very well done. I can't help with your conundrum tho. For your shooting with this gear all primes seems like a sweet way to go tho.....that 75 is a terrific piece of glass.
Best
Bill
Best
Bill
HornOUBet
Senior Member
Without a doubt, peace.....
You are apparently fastidious about your WB......
If I look at it and it looks pretty close, I am good...
As Sly once said, different strokes for different folks......
I just spent the weekend shooting a music festival with a 75 mounted on a Pen-F. I had a ball. That lens worked well with the Pen. I just posted a thread with some captures. Essentially snapshots...jpegs SOOC.
I also had fun with the color knob on front...
I also had fun with the color knob on front...
Thanks for that! But I am possibly a tad picky. I am selling the 45/1.8 as we speak. Not a bad lens as such but leaves me lackluster ...
The 12-35/2.8 on the other hand I find surprises me more than I had though it would:
Hopefully the dpreview upload routine won't butcher the sharpness of that shot too much??
Deed
HornOUBet
Senior Member
I say just get the pen f. Clear to me you are finding every little justification to switch and you want people on here to tell you that you are correct in your complaints of the camera and lens, which is mostle aesthetics. Also, if you don't like the rendering of the gx8, how can you possibly like the lx100 other than form? It even has a worse rendering engine and sensor. If you like the pen f so much just go for it. The title of the thread should be "should I replace my panny system with a pen f system?" Clearly this isn't about the system but you wanting to switch systems but need reassurance and justification. Just do it and get it over with.Have now used MFT since August 2015 and have since had a hate/love relationship - if there is such a thing with photographic gear - with the MFT format.
At the moment I have a GX8 plus the 12-35/2.8 the 45/1.8 and the 75/1.8 Oly. The least used of this little combo is the 45/1.8. Not a bad lens as such but leaves me luke-warmish.
I took this combo to China in March/April this year and enjoyed using it, in Dehang I had a day of constant drizzle in the mountains and was glad that the GX8 was WS. Thought at the time that there was a lot to like about the MFT for the sheer size, easy enough to carry with you without breaking your back - and the bank!
But ... as capable as the GX8 is, I can't get my head around this somewhat pedestrian design. Can't put my finger on it but simply don't like using it as much as I would like (plus the WB seems to be "out" more often than I would wish it was).
The 12-35/2.8 OIS is a fantastic lens I thought, but again the design is an acquired taste the large letters on the lens 12-35 ... I mean really?? But the results are better than just ok, a fantastic lens. (monkey shot, excellent bokeh for a MFT zoom!!)
The lens I really like a lot is the 75/1.8 maybe reason enough to stay with MFT? Well made, fast focus, nice enough bokeh. No WS, but that didn't bother me at all, one lens to be used in the rain is enough for me.
I like the articulating EVF a lot too, really great for low angle shooting (children??)
So as long as I look at the MFT system as a replacement for my LX100 - a camera that I really liked, despite some quirks - I am safe. But I better not compare it to some other cameras that I am using alongside the MFT. That's cool, since I would compare my Golf to a racing car or a truck, it is what it is ...
I did a quick shoot this afternoon and showed the results to my partner on a 30" screen and asked her to pick her favourite shots. Only had an X-T1 paired with a 56/1.2 and an RX1r here but enough I thought for a quick comparison.
She picked some RX1r shots and a few X-T1 shots and thought that the colour of the GX8 was off and the results looked a bit "flat" when compared directly - except the shots taken with the 75/1.8. This didn't bother me as I use the GX8 for certain applications and the files are to be printed to a particular size (11" on 12" canvas high definition, high gloss photo book) and for that size the files are better than "good enough".
So there is the conundrum: I would like to sell the GX8 and maybe get a Pen-F, sell the 12-35/2.8 and get a 12/2.0. Sell the 45/1.8 and maybe get a 25?? The 45 is just like the old 85/1.8 Nikkor, not bad but somewhat uninteresting.
But the Pen-F has a smaller EVF and the EVF is not articulated. I know that I am in trouble as I am sure that I would like the Pen-F much better from a design point of view ... (guess I am not alone here??) I thought it would be fun to use the 75/1.8 on the Pen??
The simple solution would be to keep both, the GX8 plus the Pen-F but this doesn't fit the job description of simplification (just to throw another curve ball into the arena!)
Any opinions on this one would be appreciated, maybe by those who have not just heard about the cameras in question but maybe used them alongside.
A couple of photos taken with the GX8 in China, the format 1x1 is chose here because I find it more challenging, but mainly because the book is going to be in 1x1 format.
Thanks!
Deed
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