DSLR or Mirrorless

Ok, so I was set on a DSLR and now I'm not to sure. I already ordered a Nikon 5300, but I can return it. Hasn't even shipped yet. Therefore I'm not invested in anything and a complete noob. I wanted to use my camera as a hobby, but maybe later on sell some photos on etsy or something. I usually tend to take pictures with my iphone and now I want something that will be a bit more professional. I've actually been able to sell some iphone shots online so photography has got me interested in it as a way to make some money on the side. I tend to shoot nature, structures, and people who happen to be on the scene. No sports shooting or trying to capture kids/animals as of yet at least. I want what will be best going forward and what will help me advance and learn photography at its full scale. I've been reading mirrorless are practically on the same playing field and will soon edge out the DSLR, but don't believe everything you read right? So this is where I'd like a little help in which direction I should head.
Hi Jong,

What budget are you looking at ?

Before providing any suggestion would like to let you know that-

Photography and the passion for it can grow based on the tools which are available to you. Example- Driving a station wagon doesn't kindle any passion towards driving and preety much more or less everyone settles down to driving like an 80 yold woman. While a muscular or a sports car gives one the rush to try newer things, kindle the passion and help one grow.

This is the same with passion towards photography about creation. When you are equipped with better tools the interest / passion in general proportionality increases.

Bottom line being, if you believe you want to explore and that you would grow into photography. Then its wiser to invest in a system which has the most number of offerings and wide availability of options and support.

At the APSC range would suggest looking at the Canon 70D system, it is good as both a video and still photography.

The mirrorless systems do offer a size advantage. Sony E-Mount Mirrorless offers APSC sized sensor while Panasonic's systems are more Micro 3/4ths which are great for video but not photography.

The major downside with mirrorless APSC sized / FF is Sony'e E Mount systems for which lenses are preety damn expensive. Example a 50mm Sony E-mount lens costs roughly 3-4 times that of a 50mm Canon FF lens !! With a limited range of lens and expensive line up. When I had to choose, I decided to stick on to the DSLR platform.

On the positive front the APSC Sony cameras do offer features like NFC's, Wifi, menu systems which are like the phone etc.

So if you are going to stick with the Kit-lens package then IMO Mirrorless system of Sony is a good choice. Otherwise for an APSC workout would stick with the Canon (pref) or the Nikon range

Simply due to the vast availability of support you can get, the range of used or aftermarket lenses and other equipments.

Overall the weight difference is just about 250 gms, the benefits outweigh Mirrorless as of today in APSC & overall and will remain the same for atleast the next 5 years.

For those who say DSLR's are dead in the next 2 years, consider this 0ver 90% of people are invested in DSLR's. Its not the lens but the entire system which had taken years to build up. Do you believe they would be chucking away all that gear away and re-invest on a systems just cos its a bit smaller & for which there aren't even that many number of accessories to build on.
You would be surprised.

Many have.

Check out some of the mirrorless forums.
And for those who are to comment on usage of Adapters- The adapters slows down AF considerably,
No it doesn't.

The EM-1 focuses 4/3 lenses faster than some of the 4/3 cameras did.
so if you want to do a quick shot or track movement on video mode- the system is not even remotely gonna be responsive.
How would you know?

You have never even owned a DSLR or a mirrorless ICL camera!

http://www.dpreview.com/forums/post/54970087

Tedolph
Not owning gear never stops you!
Yes, this is true.

But it is also true that no one can be compared to Tedolph.
Clearly.....

Enough said on that!
No more uninformed (and wrong) comments on Sony lenses from you then huh?
You mean Sony kit lenses?

Are those the Sony lenses you are talking about?
In another post in this thread you just referred to Sony lenses (not kit lenses) and even regards the kit lenses you are wrong or selective in your quoting!
Thought not.
Hey, I never commented on Sony Kit Lenses.

I simply re-posted what SLRGear.com said about them.

Take it up with them.
Except the reviews are just someone's opinion but you always leave out the bit (from the SAME opinion) about in the case of the usual 16-50 kit lens that is better than most and for the other 18-55 that is worth what you pay for it.

Funny about that!
 
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I still think the Olympus interface overall offers the widest range of options in its user interface for professional photographers though. The A6000 operates more like a camera phone, where as the OM-D even in the EM5 operates exactly like you would expect a full frame DSLR to operate.
In what way does the A6000 operate anything like a camera phone? It doesn't have a touch screen, like a phone does. It has direct body buttons for 8 camera functions, with 7 of them being user-customizable. It has two control dials. It has 3 memory banks for favorite settings. I'm curious what part of the controls or operation you think have anything in common with a phone? It offers direct body access to shutter, aperture, ISO, drive mode, focus area, EV, focus mode, WB, AE lock, and any of 24 other functions a person might want to place at their fingers, and without menu diving.

The other bonus with Olympus is that all of their cameras operate the same no matter whether you buy an EPM2 or OM-D EM1 once you turn on the super control panel. You don't get that with other mirrrorless cameras.
This sounds much like the Fn menu screen on the A6000. You can store and directly access and alter settings on 12 different camera functions, all of which can be user-set. And the same Fn menu screen is on the A7 series, RX series, A5100, A77, and pretty much all other current Sony models across full frame and APS-C, A and E mount, as well as 1" fixed cameras, so they all operate the same.

I personally feel the e-mount, M4:3, and Fuji mirrorless options are all excellent choices, each with some advantages and disadvantages, and someone won't go wrong picking from any of them, but I do find some odd comments on the A6000 that don't seem to match with the camera at all.
 
The Nikon is a wonderful place to start, as are others in it's range including Mirrorless.

I've been taking pictures for about 18 months now, and I have been through a handful of cameras (note I didn't start with a DSLR).

Others will tell you to research, but I would tell you to get that Nikon and go with it. You can take amazing pictures and learn everything to an advanced level with it. Lenses are plentiful and you will use it to discover what you REALLY want.

Until you learn what you like or don't, everyone else will cast opinions which might not matter to you. Or might. Don't rely on them. Especially not here with the crowd...which <ahem> is quite opinionated.

Have fun and learn, you started with a good one among many.

R
 
Ok, so I was set on a DSLR and now I'm not to sure. I already ordered a Nikon 5300, but I can return it. Hasn't even shipped yet. Therefore I'm not invested in anything and a complete noob. I wanted to use my camera as a hobby, but maybe later on sell some photos on etsy or something. I usually tend to take pictures with my iphone and now I want something that will be a bit more professional. I've actually been able to sell some iphone shots online so photography has got me interested in it as a way to make some money on the side. I tend to shoot nature, structures, and people who happen to be on the scene. No sports shooting or trying to capture kids/animals as of yet at least. I want what will be best going forward and what will help me advance and learn photography at its full scale. I've been reading mirrorless are practically on the same playing field and will soon edge out the DSLR, but don't believe everything you read right? So this is where I'd like a little help in which direction I should head.
Hi Jong,

What budget are you looking at ?

Before providing any suggestion would like to let you know that-

Photography and the passion for it can grow based on the tools which are available to you. Example- Driving a station wagon doesn't kindle any passion towards driving and preety much more or less everyone settles down to driving like an 80 yold woman. While a muscular or a sports car gives one the rush to try newer things, kindle the passion and help one grow.

This is the same with passion towards photography about creation. When you are equipped with better tools the interest / passion in general proportionality increases.

Bottom line being, if you believe you want to explore and that you would grow into photography. Then its wiser to invest in a system which has the most number of offerings and wide availability of options and support.

At the APSC range would suggest looking at the Canon 70D system, it is good as both a video and still photography.

The mirrorless systems do offer a size advantage. Sony E-Mount Mirrorless offers APSC sized sensor while Panasonic's systems are more Micro 3/4ths which are great for video but not photography.

The major downside with mirrorless APSC sized / FF is Sony'e E Mount systems for which lenses are preety damn expensive. Example a 50mm Sony E-mount lens costs roughly 3-4 times that of a 50mm Canon FF lens !! With a limited range of lens and expensive line up. When I had to choose, I decided to stick on to the DSLR platform.

On the positive front the APSC Sony cameras do offer features like NFC's, Wifi, menu systems which are like the phone etc.

So if you are going to stick with the Kit-lens package then IMO Mirrorless system of Sony is a good choice. Otherwise for an APSC workout would stick with the Canon (pref) or the Nikon range

Simply due to the vast availability of support you can get, the range of used or aftermarket lenses and other equipments.

Overall the weight difference is just about 250 gms, the benefits outweigh Mirrorless as of today in APSC & overall and will remain the same for atleast the next 5 years.

For those who say DSLR's are dead in the next 2 years, consider this 0ver 90% of people are invested in DSLR's. Its not the lens but the entire system which had taken years to build up. Do you believe they would be chucking away all that gear away and re-invest on a systems just cos its a bit smaller & for which there aren't even that many number of accessories to build on.
You would be surprised.

Many have.

Check out some of the mirrorless forums.
Nikon & Canon combined control over 70% of Interchangeable lens camera market share. Nikon, Sony & Canon combined control 60% of overall market share (all types of cameras included)

Mirrorless cameras market share in the US, Europe is estimated at about 10% of overall sales in 2013 (across all formats inclusive of non interchangable lens ones)


The top point is just sales figures, given that DSLR's have been out there for much longer than Mirrorless systems. Running any statistics will rule out that most users (atleast & over 90%) of them using ICL's will fit the DSLR catogory.

- IDC figures
And for those who are to comment on usage of Adapters- The adapters slows down AF considerably,
No it doesn't.

The EM-1 focuses 4/3 lenses faster than some of the 4/3 cameras did.
Comment was specific to using Metabones adapters both the regular & speed booster on Sony E mount cameras. And using them on Sony cameras. (was specific about it)
so if you want to do a quick shot or track movement on video mode- the system is not even remotely gonna be responsive.
How would you know?

You have never even owned a DSLR or a mirrorless ICL camera!

http://www.dpreview.com/forums/post/54970087

Tedolph
I have had several SLR's in the past, so am not a general noobie. I do shoot using DLSR's on and off (borrowed /rented ones) but not full time.

Had spent whole 2 days on a mirrorless A7 using metabones speed booster (which sells for a ridiculous $800 here) and canon lenses.

IMO its just a fan boy thing, to compensate for lack of any proper lens line up (ones that are there also damn expensive)

For still yeah its good, but try shooting moving subjects or at family gatherings with running around (not even actual sports or wildlife photography). Its called capturing the moment not posing for one...
 
Ok, so I was set on a DSLR and now I'm not to sure. I already ordered a Nikon 5300, but I can return it. Hasn't even shipped yet. Therefore I'm not invested in anything and a complete noob. I wanted to use my camera as a hobby, but maybe later on sell some photos on etsy or something. I usually tend to take pictures with my iphone and now I want something that will be a bit more professional. I've actually been able to sell some iphone shots online so photography has got me interested in it as a way to make some money on the side. I tend to shoot nature, structures, and people who happen to be on the scene. No sports shooting or trying to capture kids/animals as of yet at least. I want what will be best going forward and what will help me advance and learn photography at its full scale. I've been reading mirrorless are practically on the same playing field and will soon edge out the DSLR, but don't believe everything you read right? So this is where I'd like a little help in which direction I should head.
Hi Jong,

What budget are you looking at ?

Before providing any suggestion would like to let you know that-

Photography and the passion for it can grow based on the tools which are available to you. Example- Driving a station wagon doesn't kindle any passion towards driving and preety much more or less everyone settles down to driving like an 80 yold woman. While a muscular or a sports car gives one the rush to try newer things, kindle the passion and help one grow.

This is the same with passion towards photography about creation. When you are equipped with better tools the interest / passion in general proportionality increases.

Bottom line being, if you believe you want to explore and that you would grow into photography. Then its wiser to invest in a system which has the most number of offerings and wide availability of options and support.

At the APSC range would suggest looking at the Canon 70D system, it is good as both a video and still photography.

The mirrorless systems do offer a size advantage. Sony E-Mount Mirrorless offers APSC sized sensor while Panasonic's systems are more Micro 3/4ths which are great for video but not photography.

The major downside with mirrorless APSC sized / FF is Sony'e E Mount systems for which lenses are preety damn expensive. Example a 50mm Sony E-mount lens costs roughly 3-4 times that of a 50mm Canon FF lens !! With a limited range of lens and expensive line up. When I had to choose, I decided to stick on to the DSLR platform.

On the positive front the APSC Sony cameras do offer features like NFC's, Wifi, menu systems which are like the phone etc.

So if you are going to stick with the Kit-lens package then IMO Mirrorless system of Sony is a good choice. Otherwise for an APSC workout would stick with the Canon (pref) or the Nikon range

Simply due to the vast availability of support you can get, the range of used or aftermarket lenses and other equipments.

Overall the weight difference is just about 250 gms, the benefits outweigh Mirrorless as of today in APSC & overall and will remain the same for atleast the next 5 years.

For those who say DSLR's are dead in the next 2 years, consider this 0ver 90% of people are invested in DSLR's. Its not the lens but the entire system which had taken years to build up. Do you believe they would be chucking away all that gear away and re-invest on a systems just cos its a bit smaller & for which there aren't even that many number of accessories to build on.
You would be surprised.

Many have.

Check out some of the mirrorless forums.
Nikon & Canon combined control over 70% of Interchangeable lens camera market share.
It used to be about 100%.

Think about it.



Think about this too:

In Japan, mirroless cameras make up over 50% of the ICL market.
Nikon, Sony & Canon combined control 60% of overall market share (all types of cameras included)

Mirrorless cameras market share in the US, Europe is estimated at about 10% of overall sales in 2013 (across all formats inclusive of non interchangable lens ones)


The top point is just sales figures, given that DSLR's have been out there for much longer than Mirrorless systems. Running any statistics will rule out that most users (atleast & over 90%) of them using ICL's will fit the DSLR catogory.

- IDC figures
And for those who are to comment on usage of Adapters- The adapters slows down AF considerably,
No it doesn't.

The EM-1 focuses 4/3 lenses faster than some of the 4/3 cameras did.
Comment was specific to using Metabones adapters both the regular & speed booster on Sony E mount cameras. And using them on Sony cameras. (was specific about it)
so if you want to do a quick shot or track movement on video mode- the system is not even remotely gonna be responsive.
How would you know?

You have never even owned a DSLR or a mirrorless ICL camera!

http://www.dpreview.com/forums/post/54970087

Tedolph
I have had several SLR's in the past, so am not a general noobie.
But not a DSLRs or any other kind of digital ICL camera.

Right?
I do shoot using DLSR's on and off (borrowed /rented ones) but not full time.
Of course.
Had spent whole 2 days on a mirrorless A7 using metabones speed booster (which sells for a ridiculous $800 here) and canon lenses.
Well, then 2 days with an A7 clearly makes you an expert on all mirrorless cameras.
IMO its just a fan boy thing,
What is?
to compensate for lack of any proper lens line up (ones that are there also damn expensive)

For still yeah its good, but try shooting moving subjects or at family gatherings with running around (not even actual sports or wildlife photography). Its called capturing the moment not posing for one...

E-pl1, Rokkor M 90mm, f/4


E-pl1, Rokkor M 90mm, f/4


E-pl1, Rokkor M 90mm, f/4

????



Tedolph
 
Ok, so I was set on a DSLR and now I'm not to sure. I already ordered a Nikon 5300, but I can return it. Hasn't even shipped yet. Therefore I'm not invested in anything and a complete noob. I wanted to use my camera as a hobby, but maybe later on sell some photos on etsy or something. I usually tend to take pictures with my iphone and now I want something that will be a bit more professional. I've actually been able to sell some iphone shots online so photography has got me interested in it as a way to make some money on the side. I tend to shoot nature, structures, and people who happen to be on the scene. No sports shooting or trying to capture kids/animals as of yet at least. I want what will be best going forward and what will help me advance and learn photography at its full scale. I've been reading mirrorless are practically on the same playing field and will soon edge out the DSLR, but don't believe everything you read right? So this is where I'd like a little help in which direction I should head.
Hi Jong,

What budget are you looking at ?

Before providing any suggestion would like to let you know that-

Photography and the passion for it can grow based on the tools which are available to you. Example- Driving a station wagon doesn't kindle any passion towards driving and preety much more or less everyone settles down to driving like an 80 yold woman. While a muscular or a sports car gives one the rush to try newer things, kindle the passion and help one grow.

This is the same with passion towards photography about creation. When you are equipped with better tools the interest / passion in general proportionality increases.

Bottom line being, if you believe you want to explore and that you would grow into photography. Then its wiser to invest in a system which has the most number of offerings and wide availability of options and support.

At the APSC range would suggest looking at the Canon 70D system, it is good as both a video and still photography.

The mirrorless systems do offer a size advantage. Sony E-Mount Mirrorless offers APSC sized sensor while Panasonic's systems are more Micro 3/4ths which are great for video but not photography.

The major downside with mirrorless APSC sized / FF is Sony'e E Mount systems for which lenses are preety damn expensive. Example a 50mm Sony E-mount lens costs roughly 3-4 times that of a 50mm Canon FF lens !! With a limited range of lens and expensive line up. When I had to choose, I decided to stick on to the DSLR platform.

On the positive front the APSC Sony cameras do offer features like NFC's, Wifi, menu systems which are like the phone etc.

So if you are going to stick with the Kit-lens package then IMO Mirrorless system of Sony is a good choice. Otherwise for an APSC workout would stick with the Canon (pref) or the Nikon range

Simply due to the vast availability of support you can get, the range of used or aftermarket lenses and other equipments.

Overall the weight difference is just about 250 gms, the benefits outweigh Mirrorless as of today in APSC & overall and will remain the same for atleast the next 5 years.

For those who say DSLR's are dead in the next 2 years, consider this 0ver 90% of people are invested in DSLR's. Its not the lens but the entire system which had taken years to build up. Do you believe they would be chucking away all that gear away and re-invest on a systems just cos its a bit smaller & for which there aren't even that many number of accessories to build on.
You would be surprised.

Many have.

Check out some of the mirrorless forums.
Nikon & Canon combined control over 70% of Interchangeable lens camera market share.
It used to be about 100%.

Think about it.

Think about this too:

In Japan, mirroless cameras make up over 50% of the ICL market.
Nikon, Sony & Canon combined control 60% of overall market share (all types of cameras included)

Mirrorless cameras market share in the US, Europe is estimated at about 10% of overall sales in 2013 (across all formats inclusive of non interchangable lens ones)


The top point is just sales figures, given that DSLR's have been out there for much longer than Mirrorless systems. Running any statistics will rule out that most users (atleast & over 90%) of them using ICL's will fit the DSLR catogory.

- IDC figures
And for those who are to comment on usage of Adapters- The adapters slows down AF considerably,
No it doesn't.

The EM-1 focuses 4/3 lenses faster than some of the 4/3 cameras did.
Comment was specific to using Metabones adapters both the regular & speed booster on Sony E mount cameras. And using them on Sony cameras. (was specific about it)
so if you want to do a quick shot or track movement on video mode- the system is not even remotely gonna be responsive.
How would you know?

You have never even owned a DSLR or a mirrorless ICL camera!

http://www.dpreview.com/forums/post/54970087

Tedolph
I have had several SLR's in the past, so am not a general noobie.
But not a DSLRs or any other kind of digital ICL camera.

Right?
I do shoot using DLSR's on and off (borrowed /rented ones) but not full time.
Of course.
Had spent whole 2 days on a mirrorless A7 using metabones speed booster (which sells for a ridiculous $800 here) and canon lenses.
Well, then 2 days with an A7 clearly makes you an expert on all mirrorless cameras.
Ted am speaking purely in context of Sony, 2 days doesn't make me an expert but anyone who uses an adapter can clearly make up the struggling AF functionality- which goes back and forth to get a fiz. And does the same after each consecutive shutter.

It doesn't take an expert to deduce that. Try using the metabones speed booster on a sony and let me know your opinion.
IMO its just a fan boy thing,
What is?
to compensate for lack of any proper lens line up (ones that are there also damn expensive)

For still yeah its good, but try shooting moving subjects or at family gatherings with running around (not even actual sports or wildlife photography). Its called capturing the moment not posing for one...
????

Tedolph
My point being instead of just looking at the body, see it as an eco-system. Availability and costs of lenses and all other accesories. I love that small foam factor but that ain't enough.

I have a Sony A7R sitting at the dealer just 4000 shutters and a year's warranty left for $1100 but was very reluctant to pick it up and instead picked up a D750 considering other cost & total ownership factors. Still considering the purchases I have planned for am not loosing money.

Am not denying that the latest Mirrorless doesn't offer an edge, they do. But with the current state of available supporting ecosystem. Specially if one wants to grow to FF Mirrorless.
 
Ok, so I was set on a DSLR and now I'm not to sure. I already ordered a Nikon 5300, but I can return it. Hasn't even shipped yet. Therefore I'm not invested in anything and a complete noob. I wanted to use my camera as a hobby, but maybe later on sell some photos on etsy or something. I usually tend to take pictures with my iphone and now I want something that will be a bit more professional. I've actually been able to sell some iphone shots online so photography has got me interested in it as a way to make some money on the side. I tend to shoot nature, structures, and people who happen to be on the scene. No sports shooting or trying to capture kids/animals as of yet at least. I want what will be best going forward and what will help me advance and learn photography at its full scale. I've been reading mirrorless are practically on the same playing field and will soon edge out the DSLR, but don't believe everything you read right? So this is where I'd like a little help in which direction I should head.
Hi Jong,

What budget are you looking at ?

Before providing any suggestion would like to let you know that-

Photography and the passion for it can grow based on the tools which are available to you. Example- Driving a station wagon doesn't kindle any passion towards driving and preety much more or less everyone settles down to driving like an 80 yold woman. While a muscular or a sports car gives one the rush to try newer things, kindle the passion and help one grow.

This is the same with passion towards photography about creation. When you are equipped with better tools the interest / passion in general proportionality increases.

Bottom line being, if you believe you want to explore and that you would grow into photography. Then its wiser to invest in a system which has the most number of offerings and wide availability of options and support.

At the APSC range would suggest looking at the Canon 70D system, it is good as both a video and still photography.

The mirrorless systems do offer a size advantage. Sony E-Mount Mirrorless offers APSC sized sensor while Panasonic's systems are more Micro 3/4ths which are great for video but not photography.

The major downside with mirrorless APSC sized / FF is Sony'e E Mount systems for which lenses are preety damn expensive. Example a 50mm Sony E-mount lens costs roughly 3-4 times that of a 50mm Canon FF lens !! With a limited range of lens and expensive line up. When I had to choose, I decided to stick on to the DSLR platform.

On the positive front the APSC Sony cameras do offer features like NFC's, Wifi, menu systems which are like the phone etc.

So if you are going to stick with the Kit-lens package then IMO Mirrorless system of Sony is a good choice. Otherwise for an APSC workout would stick with the Canon (pref) or the Nikon range

Simply due to the vast availability of support you can get, the range of used or aftermarket lenses and other equipments.

Overall the weight difference is just about 250 gms, the benefits outweigh Mirrorless as of today in APSC & overall and will remain the same for atleast the next 5 years.

For those who say DSLR's are dead in the next 2 years, consider this 0ver 90% of people are invested in DSLR's. Its not the lens but the entire system which had taken years to build up. Do you believe they would be chucking away all that gear away and re-invest on a systems just cos its a bit smaller & for which there aren't even that many number of accessories to build on.
You would be surprised.

Many have.

Check out some of the mirrorless forums.
Nikon & Canon combined control over 70% of Interchangeable lens camera market share.
It used to be about 100%.

Think about it.

Think about this too:

In Japan, mirroless cameras make up over 50% of the ICL market.
Nikon, Sony & Canon combined control 60% of overall market share (all types of cameras included)

Mirrorless cameras market share in the US, Europe is estimated at about 10% of overall sales in 2013 (across all formats inclusive of non interchangable lens ones)


The top point is just sales figures, given that DSLR's have been out there for much longer than Mirrorless systems. Running any statistics will rule out that most users (atleast & over 90%) of them using ICL's will fit the DSLR catogory.

- IDC figures
And for those who are to comment on usage of Adapters- The adapters slows down AF considerably,
No it doesn't.

The EM-1 focuses 4/3 lenses faster than some of the 4/3 cameras did.
Comment was specific to using Metabones adapters both the regular & speed booster on Sony E mount cameras. And using them on Sony cameras. (was specific about it)
so if you want to do a quick shot or track movement on video mode- the system is not even remotely gonna be responsive.
How would you know?

You have never even owned a DSLR or a mirrorless ICL camera!

http://www.dpreview.com/forums/post/54970087

Tedolph
I have had several SLR's in the past, so am not a general noobie.
But not a DSLRs or any other kind of digital ICL camera.

Right?
I do shoot using DLSR's on and off (borrowed /rented ones) but not full time.
Of course.
Had spent whole 2 days on a mirrorless A7 using metabones speed booster (which sells for a ridiculous $800 here) and canon lenses.
Well, then 2 days with an A7 clearly makes you an expert on all mirrorless cameras.
Ted am speaking purely in context of Sony, 2 days doesn't make me an expert but anyone who uses an adapter can clearly make up the struggling AF functionality- which goes back and forth to get a fiz. And does the same after each consecutive shutter.

It doesn't take an expert to deduce that. Try using the metabones speed booster on a sony and let me know your opinion.
Speed Booster or EF-E mount AF adapter?

The Metabones adapter is just fine for me.

Full electronic connection with EXIF.

AF is unusable with some lenses and mostly slower with others......a lens like the 135 f2 L is usable for me.

That I can use EF, A or E mount lenses at all with so much functionality is amazing.

As for cost, the Sony Zeiss 55 1.8 is a wonderful lens but a lot cheaper than two of my Canon lenses.......that's what I like about the E mount, being able to pick and choose.

If I wanted to, I could get a cheap Canon DSLR for my Canon EF lenses but why would I.

If Canon puts out a FF mirrorless with an EVF for EF lenses, I would consider it.....right now, the Canon 24 3.5 TS-E ii L lens alone is worth a A7/A7s........or as many are using them on, an A7R and now stabilized on an A7ii.

To each their own.

If you prefer a OVF and mirror, then a Canon FF camera makes a great choice.....I prefer a FF mirrorless with an EVF and choosing lenses I like from across systems, not what I have to choose with some.



IMO its just a fan boy thing,
What is?
to compensate for lack of any proper lens line up (ones that are there also damn expensive)

For still yeah its good, but try shooting moving subjects or at family gatherings with running around (not even actual sports or wildlife photography). Its called capturing the moment not posing for one...
????

Tedolph
My point being instead of just looking at the body, see it as an eco-system. Availability and costs of lenses and all other accesories. I love that small foam factor but that ain't enough.

I have a Sony A7R sitting at the dealer just 4000 shutters and a year's warranty left for $1100 but was very reluctant to pick it up and instead picked up a D750 considering other cost & total ownership factors. Still considering the purchases I have planned for am not loosing money.

Am not denying that the latest Mirrorless doesn't offer an edge, they do. But with the current state of available supporting ecosystem. Specially if one wants to grow to FF Mirrorless.
 
Ok, so I was set on a DSLR and now I'm not to sure. I already ordered a Nikon 5300, but I can return it. Hasn't even shipped yet. Therefore I'm not invested in anything and a complete noob. I wanted to use my camera as a hobby, but maybe later on sell some photos on etsy or something. I usually tend to take pictures with my iphone and now I want something that will be a bit more professional. I've actually been able to sell some iphone shots online so photography has got me interested in it as a way to make some money on the side. I tend to shoot nature, structures, and people who happen to be on the scene. No sports shooting or trying to capture kids/animals as of yet at least. I want what will be best going forward and what will help me advance and learn photography at its full scale. I've been reading mirrorless are practically on the same playing field and will soon edge out the DSLR, but don't believe everything you read right? So this is where I'd like a little help in which direction I should head.
Hi Jong,

What budget are you looking at ?

Before providing any suggestion would like to let you know that-

Photography and the passion for it can grow based on the tools which are available to you. Example- Driving a station wagon doesn't kindle any passion towards driving and preety much more or less everyone settles down to driving like an 80 yold woman. While a muscular or a sports car gives one the rush to try newer things, kindle the passion and help one grow.

This is the same with passion towards photography about creation. When you are equipped with better tools the interest / passion in general proportionality increases.

Bottom line being, if you believe you want to explore and that you would grow into photography. Then its wiser to invest in a system which has the most number of offerings and wide availability of options and support.

At the APSC range would suggest looking at the Canon 70D system, it is good as both a video and still photography.

The mirrorless systems do offer a size advantage. Sony E-Mount Mirrorless offers APSC sized sensor while Panasonic's systems are more Micro 3/4ths which are great for video but not photography.

The major downside with mirrorless APSC sized / FF is Sony'e E Mount systems for which lenses are preety damn expensive. Example a 50mm Sony E-mount lens costs roughly 3-4 times that of a 50mm Canon FF lens !! With a limited range of lens and expensive line up. When I had to choose, I decided to stick on to the DSLR platform.

On the positive front the APSC Sony cameras do offer features like NFC's, Wifi, menu systems which are like the phone etc.

So if you are going to stick with the Kit-lens package then IMO Mirrorless system of Sony is a good choice. Otherwise for an APSC workout would stick with the Canon (pref) or the Nikon range

Simply due to the vast availability of support you can get, the range of used or aftermarket lenses and other equipments.

Overall the weight difference is just about 250 gms, the benefits outweigh Mirrorless as of today in APSC & overall and will remain the same for atleast the next 5 years.

For those who say DSLR's are dead in the next 2 years, consider this 0ver 90% of people are invested in DSLR's. Its not the lens but the entire system which had taken years to build up. Do you believe they would be chucking away all that gear away and re-invest on a systems just cos its a bit smaller & for which there aren't even that many number of accessories to build on.
You would be surprised.

Many have.

Check out some of the mirrorless forums.
Nikon & Canon combined control over 70% of Interchangeable lens camera market share.
It used to be about 100%.

Think about it.

Think about this too:

In Japan, mirroless cameras make up over 50% of the ICL market.
Nikon, Sony & Canon combined control 60% of overall market share (all types of cameras included)

Mirrorless cameras market share in the US, Europe is estimated at about 10% of overall sales in 2013 (across all formats inclusive of non interchangable lens ones)


The top point is just sales figures, given that DSLR's have been out there for much longer than Mirrorless systems. Running any statistics will rule out that most users (atleast & over 90%) of them using ICL's will fit the DSLR catogory.

- IDC figures
And for those who are to comment on usage of Adapters- The adapters slows down AF considerably,
No it doesn't.

The EM-1 focuses 4/3 lenses faster than some of the 4/3 cameras did.
Comment was specific to using Metabones adapters both the regular & speed booster on Sony E mount cameras. And using them on Sony cameras. (was specific about it)
so if you want to do a quick shot or track movement on video mode- the system is not even remotely gonna be responsive.
How would you know?

You have never even owned a DSLR or a mirrorless ICL camera!

http://www.dpreview.com/forums/post/54970087

Tedolph
I have had several SLR's in the past, so am not a general noobie.
But not a DSLRs or any other kind of digital ICL camera.

Right?
I do shoot using DLSR's on and off (borrowed /rented ones) but not full time.
Of course.
Had spent whole 2 days on a mirrorless A7 using metabones speed booster (which sells for a ridiculous $800 here) and canon lenses.
Well, then 2 days with an A7 clearly makes you an expert on all mirrorless cameras.
Ted am speaking purely in context of Sony, 2 days doesn't make me an expert but anyone who uses an adapter can clearly make up the struggling AF functionality- which goes back and forth to get a fiz. And does the same after each consecutive shutter.
Except nobody does this. Nobody buys an A7 to shoot with adapted Sony lenses.

People do buy an Em-1 to shoot with adapted 4/3 lenses and they work great! In fact that is why the EM-1 was designed-to shoot well with 4/3 lenses and give Oly's 4/3 customers a painless migration path.
It doesn't take an expert to deduce that. Try using the metabones speed booster on a sony and let me know your opinion.
Only a fool would use a Metabones adapter on an A7.

Why would anybody do that?
IMO its just a fan boy thing,
What is?
to compensate for lack of any proper lens line up (ones that are there also damn expensive)

For still yeah its good, but try shooting moving subjects or at family gatherings with running around (not even actual sports or wildlife photography). Its called capturing the moment not posing for one...
????

Tedolph
My point being instead of just looking at the body, see it as an eco-system. Availability and costs of lenses and all other accesories. I love that small foam factor but that ain't enough.
What ecosystem are you talking about? The 60+ native m4/3 lenses or the dozens of 4/3 lenses?

The native lens system that is larger than Sony's or Pentax's?
I have a Sony A7R sitting at the dealer just 4000 shutters and a year's warranty left for $1100 but was very reluctant to pick it up
I wouldn't pick it up either.

Now a Sony A7II with IBIS, that is a different story.
and instead picked up a D750 considering other cost & total ownership factors. Still considering the purchases I have planned for am not loosing money.

Am not denying that the latest Mirrorless doesn't offer an edge, they do. But with the current state of available supporting ecosystem. Specially if one wants to grow to FF Mirrorless.
Look, don't try to change the subject.

The issue is how silly it is to buy crop sensor lenses for a full frame camera.

Fuji, M4/3 et al. are doing just fine. So is Sony for that matter.

It is Nikon and Canon that are struggling in the mirrorless realm.

TEdolph
 
For those who say DSLR's are dead in the next 2 years, consider this 0ver 90% of people are invested in DSLR's. Its not the lens but the entire system which had taken years to build up. Do you believe they would be chucking away all that gear away and re-invest on a systems just cos its a bit smaller & for which there aren't even that many number of accessories to build on.
You would be surprised.

Many have.

Check out some of the mirrorless forums.
Very true. I don't understand why so many people think it's so very, very difficult to switch systems. Just because you start out using one system doesn't mean you have to be wedded to it forever. If in time you find another system better fits your needs, all you have to do is sell your old gear and then buy into the new system. it's not difficult.

The last thing newbies need to think is that buying a camera is like a wedding. Reciting "'till death do us part" is not a part of the camera buying experience.
And for those who are to comment on usage of Adapters- The adapters slows down AF considerably,
No it doesn't.

The EM-1 focuses 4/3 lenses faster than some of the 4/3 cameras did.
This is very true. The main disadvantage of using 4/3s lenses on Oly m4/3s cameras is just that the lenses are larger and heavier than their m4/3s equivalents.
so if you want to do a quick shot or track movement on video mode- the system is not even remotely gonna be responsive.
The least time I checked, the best camera (as opposed to professional camcorder) for shooting video was the Panasonic GH4, a mirrorless m4/3s camera. No DSLR even comes close to the performance of that Panasonic camera when it comes to shooting video.
Agree.

Unless you are one of those early adopter of four third (not micro)
Which can hardly sell the gear to anyone.
 
Agree.

Unless you are one of those early adopter of four third (not micro)
Which can hardly sell the gear to anyone.
Funny you should say that, as I was a 4/3s shooter and just recently sold off all my 4/3s gear for a very good price. The camera bodies didn't fetch a lot - but what several-years-old digital camera body does? The lenses, though, were another story entirely.
 
Agree.

Unless you are one of those early adopter of four third (not micro)
Which can hardly sell the gear to anyone.
Funny you should say that, as I was a 4/3s shooter and just recently sold off all my 4/3s gear for a very good price. The camera bodies didn't fetch a lot - but what several-years-old digital camera body does? The lenses, though, were another story entirely.
Everything that's old is new again, particularly with the ability to mount legacy lenses.
 
Either will serve you well. I started out with a DSLR, and now have an OMD E-M10. I seem to shoot pretty much the same sort of things you are interested in and my E-M10 works just fine.

Mirrorless is a bit lighter and compact while the major DSLR brands offer a bit more flexibility in the number of fully automatic lens options. Particularly so in 3rd party lens support; though m43s is starting to capture the interest of the cine lens manufacturers and as a result, some good 3rd party lenses are starting to become available.

If you know what sort of lenses you need and your mirrorless brand of choice offers those lenses I would probably tell you to lean towards mirrorless. This is the situation I am in. But if you just don't know what you will need optically, I think a DSLR is probably a safer bet.
 
Agree.

Unless you are one of those early adopter of four third (not micro)
Which can hardly sell the gear to anyone.
Funny you should say that, as I was a 4/3s shooter and just recently sold off all my 4/3s gear for a very good price. The camera bodies didn't fetch a lot - but what several-years-old digital camera body does? The lenses, though, were another story entirely.
Everything that's old is new again, particularly with the ability to mount legacy lenses.
It is interesting.



When m4/3 first came out, the prices of certian film 35mm lenses started to rise, and some even became hard to get.



I bet that since the EM-1 has been out, some of the prices of certian desirable 4/3 lenses has started to rise.



Tedolph
 
Agree.

Unless you are one of those early adopter of four third (not micro)
Which can hardly sell the gear to anyone.
Funny you should say that, as I was a 4/3s shooter and just recently sold off all my 4/3s gear for a very good price. The camera bodies didn't fetch a lot - but what several-years-old digital camera body does? The lenses, though, were another story entirely.
Good to know that your zuiko lens fetched a good price. :D

Not in my area though.

Thus i will encourage newbie to go for canon/nikon instead of niche brand :D
--
Do not fear the photographer who shot with a thousand lens, but fear the one who shot with the one lens a thousand times -Bruce Lee
 
Agree.

Unless you are one of those early adopter of four third (not micro)
Which can hardly sell the gear to anyone.
Funny you should say that, as I was a 4/3s shooter and just recently sold off all my 4/3s gear for a very good price. The camera bodies didn't fetch a lot - but what several-years-old digital camera body does? The lenses, though, were another story entirely.
Everything that's old is new again, particularly with the ability to mount legacy lenses.
It is interesting.

When m4/3 first came out, the prices of certian film 35mm lenses started to rise, and some even became hard to get.

I bet that since the EM-1 has been out, some of the prices of certian desirable 4/3 lenses has started to rise.

Tedolph
You are right. Try finding an Olympus 4/3 50-200mm SWD.

My favorite two adapted lenses, a Canon FD 50mm f/1.8 and a Vemar 135mm f/2.8, were $5 at thrift stores - but good luck searching for a cheap Canon FD 50mm f/1.4!
 
Ok, so I was set on a DSLR and now I'm not to sure. I already ordered a Nikon 5300, but I can return it. Hasn't even shipped yet. Therefore I'm not invested in anything and a complete noob. I wanted to use my camera as a hobby, but maybe later on sell some photos on etsy or something. I usually tend to take pictures with my iphone and now I want something that will be a bit more professional. I've actually been able to sell some iphone shots online so photography has got me interested in it as a way to make some money on the side. I tend to shoot nature, structures, and people who happen to be on the scene. No sports shooting or trying to capture kids/animals as of yet at least. I want what will be best going forward and what will help me advance and learn photography at its full scale. I've been reading mirrorless are practically on the same playing field and will soon edge out the DSLR, but don't believe everything you read right? So this is where I'd like a little help in which direction I should head.
Hi Jong,

What budget are you looking at ?

Before providing any suggestion would like to let you know that-

Photography and the passion for it can grow based on the tools which are available to you. Example- Driving a station wagon doesn't kindle any passion towards driving and preety much more or less everyone settles down to driving like an 80 yold woman. While a muscular or a sports car gives one the rush to try newer things, kindle the passion and help one grow.

This is the same with passion towards photography about creation. When you are equipped with better tools the interest / passion in general proportionality increases.

Bottom line being, if you believe you want to explore and that you would grow into photography. Then its wiser to invest in a system which has the most number of offerings and wide availability of options and support.

At the APSC range would suggest looking at the Canon 70D system, it is good as both a video and still photography.

The mirrorless systems do offer a size advantage. Sony E-Mount Mirrorless offers APSC sized sensor while Panasonic's systems are more Micro 3/4ths which are great for video but not photography.

The major downside with mirrorless APSC sized / FF is Sony'e E Mount systems for which lenses are preety damn expensive. Example a 50mm Sony E-mount lens costs roughly 3-4 times that of a 50mm Canon FF lens !! With a limited range of lens and expensive line up. When I had to choose, I decided to stick on to the DSLR platform.

On the positive front the APSC Sony cameras do offer features like NFC's, Wifi, menu systems which are like the phone etc.

So if you are going to stick with the Kit-lens package then IMO Mirrorless system of Sony is a good choice. Otherwise for an APSC workout would stick with the Canon (pref) or the Nikon range

Simply due to the vast availability of support you can get, the range of used or aftermarket lenses and other equipments.

Overall the weight difference is just about 250 gms, the benefits outweigh Mirrorless as of today in APSC & overall and will remain the same for atleast the next 5 years.

For those who say DSLR's are dead in the next 2 years, consider this 0ver 90% of people are invested in DSLR's. Its not the lens but the entire system which had taken years to build up. Do you believe they would be chucking away all that gear away and re-invest on a systems just cos its a bit smaller & for which there aren't even that many number of accessories to build on.
You would be surprised.

Many have.

Check out some of the mirrorless forums.
Nikon & Canon combined control over 70% of Interchangeable lens camera market share.
It used to be about 100%.

Think about it.

Think about this too:

In Japan, mirroless cameras make up over 50% of the ICL market.
Nikon, Sony & Canon combined control 60% of overall market share (all types of cameras included)

Mirrorless cameras market share in the US, Europe is estimated at about 10% of overall sales in 2013 (across all formats inclusive of non interchangable lens ones)


The top point is just sales figures, given that DSLR's have been out there for much longer than Mirrorless systems. Running any statistics will rule out that most users (atleast & over 90%) of them using ICL's will fit the DSLR catogory.

- IDC figures
And for those who are to comment on usage of Adapters- The adapters slows down AF considerably,
No it doesn't.

The EM-1 focuses 4/3 lenses faster than some of the 4/3 cameras did.
Comment was specific to using Metabones adapters both the regular & speed booster on Sony E mount cameras. And using them on Sony cameras. (was specific about it)
so if you want to do a quick shot or track movement on video mode- the system is not even remotely gonna be responsive.
How would you know?

You have never even owned a DSLR or a mirrorless ICL camera!

http://www.dpreview.com/forums/post/54970087

Tedolph
I have had several SLR's in the past, so am not a general noobie.
But not a DSLRs or any other kind of digital ICL camera.

Right?
I do shoot using DLSR's on and off (borrowed /rented ones) but not full time.
Of course.
Had spent whole 2 days on a mirrorless A7 using metabones speed booster (which sells for a ridiculous $800 here) and canon lenses.
Well, then 2 days with an A7 clearly makes you an expert on all mirrorless cameras.
Ted am speaking purely in context of Sony, 2 days doesn't make me an expert but anyone who uses an adapter can clearly make up the struggling AF functionality- which goes back and forth to get a fiz. And does the same after each consecutive shutter.
Except nobody does this. Nobody buys an A7 to shoot with adapted Sony lenses.

People do buy an Em-1 to shoot with adapted 4/3 lenses and they work great! In fact that is why the EM-1 was designed-to shoot well with 4/3 lenses and give Oly's 4/3 customers a painless migration path.
It doesn't take an expert to deduce that. Try using the metabones speed booster on a sony and let me know your opinion.
Only a fool would use a Metabones adapter on an A7.

Why would anybody do that?
because it works very well (not a speedbooster though but the Metabones IV is great for adapting EF lenses and the LA-EA4 is great for adapting A mount.

If you buy a Sony camera in some markets you get either a free Metabones IV or a free LA-EA4 (or choice of some others too) by redemption.



IMO its just a fan boy thing,
What is?
to compensate for lack of any proper lens line up (ones that are there also damn expensive)

For still yeah its good, but try shooting moving subjects or at family gatherings with running around (not even actual sports or wildlife photography). Its called capturing the moment not posing for one...
????

Tedolph
My point being instead of just looking at the body, see it as an eco-system. Availability and costs of lenses and all other accesories. I love that small foam factor but that ain't enough.
What ecosystem are you talking about? The 60+ native m4/3 lenses or the dozens of 4/3 lenses?

The native lens system that is larger than Sony's or Pentax's?
I have a Sony A7R sitting at the dealer just 4000 shutters and a year's warranty left for $1100 but was very reluctant to pick it up
I wouldn't pick it up either.

Now a Sony A7II with IBIS, that is a different story.
and instead picked up a D750 considering other cost & total ownership factors. Still considering the purchases I have planned for am not loosing money.

Am not denying that the latest Mirrorless doesn't offer an edge, they do. But with the current state of available supporting ecosystem. Specially if one wants to grow to FF Mirrorless.
Look, don't try to change the subject.

The issue is how silly it is to buy crop sensor lenses for a full frame camera.

Fuji, M4/3 et al. are doing just fine. So is Sony for that matter.

It is Nikon and Canon that are struggling in the mirrorless realm.

TEdolph
 
Buying the D5300 will get you same sensor as the D7100 which is considered top APSC sensor for now at a budget price. However, D5300, while good with reasonably good phase AF speed, does not have the better AF system of D7100, and liveview is slow in D5300 while mirrorless has great live view. So apples and oranges.

With mirrorless, some systems are fast in AF, some are not if you have not the right lenses.

Best quality in mirrorless to match DSLR includes putting on very good lens optics, and some kit lenses are not as good as other lenses you can add to mirrorless instead of kit, such as very good primes.

I have Panasonic GX1 which has great HD video with autofocus as Panasonic does great video in m43. GX7 and GH3/4 are even better than GX1. The original 14-45mm OIS lens is not too expensive which I have and better than the kit. Will add primes/fast lenses in future.

The Panasonic GX1, GX7, GM1 and Fujifilm lower level Xtrans bodies (below XT1 are priced well for beginners, as are the Olympus EPL series and EM10.

Olympus and Fuji are known for their out of camera jpegs, while Panasonic is known for video. Although with this years models, video and OOC jpegs are getting better in both brands.

At beginner level and budget prices, more advanced m43 like GH4, EM1 and Sony A7 are likely too pricey for most starters unless buyer wants the best in mirrorless bodies and willing to spend.
 
Last edited:
Ok, so I was set on a DSLR and now I'm not to sure. I already ordered a Nikon 5300, but I can return it. Hasn't even shipped yet. Therefore I'm not invested in anything and a complete noob. I wanted to use my camera as a hobby, but maybe later on sell some photos on etsy or something. I usually tend to take pictures with my iphone and now I want something that will be a bit more professional. I've actually been able to sell some iphone shots online so photography has got me interested in it as a way to make some money on the side. I tend to shoot nature, structures, and people who happen to be on the scene. No sports shooting or trying to capture kids/animals as of yet at least. I want what will be best going forward and what will help me advance and learn photography at its full scale. I've been reading mirrorless are practically on the same playing field and will soon edge out the DSLR, but don't believe everything you read right? So this is where I'd like a little help in which direction I should head.
Hi Jong,

What budget are you looking at ?

Before providing any suggestion would like to let you know that-

Photography and the passion for it can grow based on the tools which are available to you. Example- Driving a station wagon doesn't kindle any passion towards driving and preety much more or less everyone settles down to driving like an 80 yold woman. While a muscular or a sports car gives one the rush to try newer things, kindle the passion and help one grow.

This is the same with passion towards photography about creation. When you are equipped with better tools the interest / passion in general proportionality increases.

Bottom line being, if you believe you want to explore and that you would grow into photography. Then its wiser to invest in a system which has the most number of offerings and wide availability of options and support.

At the APSC range would suggest looking at the Canon 70D system, it is good as both a video and still photography.

The mirrorless systems do offer a size advantage. Sony E-Mount Mirrorless offers APSC sized sensor while Panasonic's systems are more Micro 3/4ths which are great for video but not photography.

The major downside with mirrorless APSC sized / FF is Sony'e E Mount systems for which lenses are preety damn expensive. Example a 50mm Sony E-mount lens costs roughly 3-4 times that of a 50mm Canon FF lens !! With a limited range of lens and expensive line up. When I had to choose, I decided to stick on to the DSLR platform.

On the positive front the APSC Sony cameras do offer features like NFC's, Wifi, menu systems which are like the phone etc.

So if you are going to stick with the Kit-lens package then IMO Mirrorless system of Sony is a good choice. Otherwise for an APSC workout would stick with the Canon (pref) or the Nikon range

Simply due to the vast availability of support you can get, the range of used or aftermarket lenses and other equipments.

Overall the weight difference is just about 250 gms, the benefits outweigh Mirrorless as of today in APSC & overall and will remain the same for atleast the next 5 years.

For those who say DSLR's are dead in the next 2 years, consider this 0ver 90% of people are invested in DSLR's. Its not the lens but the entire system which had taken years to build up. Do you believe they would be chucking away all that gear away and re-invest on a systems just cos its a bit smaller & for which there aren't even that many number of accessories to build on.
You would be surprised.

Many have.

Check out some of the mirrorless forums.
Nikon & Canon combined control over 70% of Interchangeable lens camera market share.
It used to be about 100%.

Think about it.

Think about this too:

In Japan, mirroless cameras make up over 50% of the ICL market.
Nikon, Sony & Canon combined control 60% of overall market share (all types of cameras included)

Mirrorless cameras market share in the US, Europe is estimated at about 10% of overall sales in 2013 (across all formats inclusive of non interchangable lens ones)


The top point is just sales figures, given that DSLR's have been out there for much longer than Mirrorless systems. Running any statistics will rule out that most users (atleast & over 90%) of them using ICL's will fit the DSLR catogory.

- IDC figures
And for those who are to comment on usage of Adapters- The adapters slows down AF considerably,
No it doesn't.

The EM-1 focuses 4/3 lenses faster than some of the 4/3 cameras did.
Comment was specific to using Metabones adapters both the regular & speed booster on Sony E mount cameras. And using them on Sony cameras. (was specific about it)
so if you want to do a quick shot or track movement on video mode- the system is not even remotely gonna be responsive.
How would you know?

You have never even owned a DSLR or a mirrorless ICL camera!

http://www.dpreview.com/forums/post/54970087

Tedolph
I have had several SLR's in the past, so am not a general noobie.
But not a DSLRs or any other kind of digital ICL camera.

Right?
I do shoot using DLSR's on and off (borrowed /rented ones) but not full time.
Of course.
Had spent whole 2 days on a mirrorless A7 using metabones speed booster (which sells for a ridiculous $800 here) and canon lenses.
Well, then 2 days with an A7 clearly makes you an expert on all mirrorless cameras.
Ted am speaking purely in context of Sony, 2 days doesn't make me an expert but anyone who uses an adapter can clearly make up the struggling AF functionality- which goes back and forth to get a fiz. And does the same after each consecutive shutter.
Except nobody does this. Nobody buys an A7 to shoot with adapted Sony lenses.

People do buy an Em-1 to shoot with adapted 4/3 lenses and they work great! In fact that is why the EM-1 was designed-to shoot well with 4/3 lenses and give Oly's 4/3 customers a painless migration path.
It doesn't take an expert to deduce that. Try using the metabones speed booster on a sony and let me know your opinion.
Only a fool would use a Metabones adapter on an A7.

Why would anybody do that?
because it works very well (not a speedbooster though but the Metabones IV is great for adapting EF lenses and the LA-EA4 is great for adapting A mount.

If you buy a Sony camera in some markets you get either a free Metabones IV or a free LA-EA4 (or choice of some others too) by redemption.
Tedolph retracts his statement.
IMO its just a fan boy thing,
What is?
to compensate for lack of any proper lens line up (ones that are there also damn expensive)

For still yeah its good, but try shooting moving subjects or at family gatherings with running around (not even actual sports or wildlife photography). Its called capturing the moment not posing for one...
????

Tedolph
My point being instead of just looking at the body, see it as an eco-system. Availability and costs of lenses and all other accesories. I love that small foam factor but that ain't enough.
What ecosystem are you talking about? The 60+ native m4/3 lenses or the dozens of 4/3 lenses?

The native lens system that is larger than Sony's or Pentax's?
I have a Sony A7R sitting at the dealer just 4000 shutters and a year's warranty left for $1100 but was very reluctant to pick it up
I wouldn't pick it up either.

Now a Sony A7II with IBIS, that is a different story.
and instead picked up a D750 considering other cost & total ownership factors. Still considering the purchases I have planned for am not loosing money.

Am not denying that the latest Mirrorless doesn't offer an edge, they do. But with the current state of available supporting ecosystem. Specially if one wants to grow to FF Mirrorless.
Look, don't try to change the subject.

The issue is how silly it is to buy crop sensor lenses for a full frame camera.

Fuji, M4/3 et al. are doing just fine. So is Sony for that matter.

It is Nikon and Canon that are struggling in the mirrorless realm.

TEdolph
Tedolph,

The Great Retractor.
 
SNIP
Only a fool would use a Metabones adapter on an A7.

Why would anybody do that?
SNIP
My apologies for the snips - I just wanted to respond to one small thing. A number of people use Speed Boosters on the A7 (or A7S) in crop mode in order to dramatically reduce the rolling shutter effect when shooting video. See Phil Bloom's review of this (scroll down about halfway in the review to the July 7 entry): http://philipbloom.net/2014/07/03/a7s/
 

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