Reading mode: Light Dark

Have you wondered why Fujifilm increased contrast/ decreased DR in X-E2/ X-T1?

Go to last post
illogical

illogical

Active member
Messages
54
Reaction score
40
While I was clicking portraits of my nieces behind the windshield of my car, my X-E1 was unable to focus accurately due to low contrast in the scene then it clicked to my mind as why Fujifilm would have increased contrast or decreased DR in X-E2/ X-T1. The major complaints that Fujifilm was hearing from its customers was about slow AF so they made all best efforts to improve it and increase in contrast or decrease in DR is one of the measures they took.

Even if AF would have improved in X-E2/ X-T1, I will still pick X-E1 because I prefer more DR over a bit better AF. I understand that preferences change as per needs so yours might be different from mine :)

P.S. Well, while writing it, I just remembered that they have phase detect AF in newer cameras, well, I don't know, there might be a hybrid version of it.
 
illogical said:
While I was clicking portraits of my nieces behind the windshield of my car, my X-E1 was unable to focus accurately due to low contrast in the scene then it clicked to my mind as why Fujifilm would have increased contrast or decreased DR in X-E2/ X-T1. The major complaints that Fujifilm was hearing from its customers was about slow AF so they made all best efforts to improve it and increase in contrast or decrease in DR is one of the measures they took.

Even if AF would have improved in X-E2/ X-T1, I will still pick X-E1 because I prefer more DR over a bit better AF. I understand that preferences change as per needs so yours might be different from mine :)

P.S. Well, while writing it, I just remembered that they have phase detect AF in newer cameras, well, I don't know, there might be a hybrid version of it.
Click to expand...
 
You might be right Jim. I will need to research more how focussing works in mirrorless cameras. However, if you are right then I would wonder why Fujifilm increased contrast/ decreased DR in the new sensor. I prefer the old one.
 
illogical said:
You might be right Jim. I will need to research more how focussing works in mirrorless cameras. However, if you are right then I would wonder why Fujifilm increased contrast/ decreased DR in the new sensor. I prefer the old one.
Click to expand...
 
Sal Baker said:
illogical said:
You might be right Jim. I will need to research more how focussing works in mirrorless cameras. However, if you are right then I would wonder why Fujifilm increased contrast/ decreased DR in the new sensor. I prefer the old one.

--
Regards
Anurag Arora
http://www.aperture.in/
Click to expand...
You must be referring to how the camera processes JPEG images. That has nothing to do with the sensor. The new Fuji sensors actually have increased bit-depth with more tonality than the original X-Trans sensors, but you have to shoot RAW to have access to the increased data. The problem with letting the camera process the RAW data is you're stuck with the "look" that programmers decided on. :)

Sal
Click to expand...
There might be something in this. I remember in the dim and distant reports that Olympus cameras focus faster in 'vivd' mode. So, I had a look around the net, and it seems like it is true. Here's one link.

https://www.flickr.com/groups/om-d_user/discuss/72157631237901324/
 
Last edited:
illogical said:
While I was clicking portraits of my nieces behind the windshield of my car, my X-E1 was unable to focus accurately due to low contrast in the scene then it clicked to my mind as why Fujifilm would have increased contrast or decreased DR in X-E2/ X-T1. The major complaints that Fujifilm was hearing from its customers was about slow AF so they made all best efforts to improve it and increase in contrast or decrease in DR is one of the measures they took.

Even if AF would have improved in X-E2/ X-T1, I will still pick X-E1 because I prefer more DR over a bit better AF. I understand that preferences change as per needs so yours might be different from mine :)

P.S. Well, while writing it, I just remembered that they have phase detect AF in newer cameras, well, I don't know, there might be a hybrid version of it.
Click to expand...
 
wchutt said:
I have not wondered this because the contrast of rendered images is irrelevant to AF effectiveness. The contrast of the lens could have an effect though.

Second, there is quantitative data that contradicts you guess that the analog DR of the XTrans II sensor is lower.

http://home.comcast.net/~nikond70/Charts/PDR.htm#X-E1,X-T1
Click to expand...
About my thought on the AF, I agree that I need do research as how AF works in a mirrorless camera and it is more probable that you would be correct.

Thank you for sharing the link. I like to know whether to trust the DR charts you suggested or the DXO ratings. Apart from discrepancies in their DR values, the chart you suggested shows D800 to have less DR than D800E whereas, it's the other way round in DXO charts.
 
illogical said:
wchutt said:
I have not wondered this because the contrast of rendered images is irrelevant to AF effectiveness. The contrast of the lens could have an effect though.

Second, there is quantitative data that contradicts you guess that the analog DR of the XTrans II sensor is lower.

http://home.comcast.net/~nikond70/Charts/PDR.htm#X-E1,X-T1
Click to expand...
About my thought on the AF, I agree that I need do research as how AF works in a mirrorless camera and it is more probable that you would be correct.

Thank you for sharing the link. I like to know whether to trust the DR charts you suggested or the DXO ratings. Apart from discrepancies in their DR values, the chart you suggested shows D800 to have less DR than D800E whereas, it's the other way round in DXO charts.
Click to expand...
 
illogical said:
You might be right Jim. I will need to research more how focussing works in mirrorless cameras. However, if you are right then I would wonder why Fujifilm increased contrast/ decreased DR in the new sensor. I prefer the old one.
Click to expand...
Fuji made jpegs in std mode more punchy in X-E2/M1/A1/T1. I guess that's what their research indicated, many people complained X-E1 jpegs colors looked bland and images looked flat. That works well for portraits, but for anything else X-E1 colors were dissatisfactory.
 
You can trust Bill Claff's charts. The difference in analog DR between the XTrans I and XTrans II sensors is small.
 
wchutt said:
You can trust Bill Claff's charts. The difference in analog DR between the XTrans I and XTrans II sensors is small.
Click to expand...
Alright, what I do not understand is why DR is so much different for X-E2 and X-T1, both sharing the same sensor. Whereas X-T1 graph almost coincides with X-E1's. Do you have any idea?
 
illogical said:
wchutt said:
You can trust Bill Claff's charts. The difference in analog DR between the XTrans I and XTrans II sensors is small.
Click to expand...
Alright, what I do not understand is why DR is so much different for X-E2 and X-T1, both sharing the same sensor. Whereas X-T1 graph almost coincides with X-E1's. Do you have any idea?
Click to expand...
 
The Y axis is scaled as a binary logarithm (log2 n), or the logarithm to the base 2.

This allows the differences to be compared in terms of stops. The maximum difference is 1/2 a stop. Most are much less.

So the differences are small. Only the XE-2 data is a bit different. This could be due to measurement error or manufacturing variations.

Considering all the data, there is enough evidence to contradict your hypothesis that Fujifilm decided to degrade the sensor's analog dynamic range in order to improve AF speed.
 
As you noticed by now the DR is at leats equal or even slightly better

If you want to get a similar apparent Dr in JPEGs use ProNeg S with color +2 it produces very subtle middle tones and a good rendition in very high contrast scenes

For more contrast use standard simulation film

The Proneg S is interesting fo foluiage to avoid the Hollywood Fuji Green
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Keyboard shortcuts

f
Forum
m
My threads
Mobile site
About
Editorial content
Cameras & Lenses
Community
All content, design, and layout are Copyright © 1998–2025 Digital Photography Review All Rights Reserved.
Reproduction in whole or part in any form or medium without specific written permission is prohibited.
When you use DPReview links to buy products, the site may earn a commission.
©GPS Media - Guides, Products, Services.
Back
Top