So, if you all really want the XP1, why ain't ya bought these ones?!

:) and that is why some cameras are not for everyone ;) .

To answer your question more specifically: This is the internet and talk is cheap! I also think that many pre-order 'just in case' . It would be interesting, but time consuming, to check some weeks/months from now to see if all of the people complaning about slow distro are posting photos.

Cheers,

--
Anticipate the Light and wing it when you get it wrong
Tom
http://taja.smugmug.com/
 
In some ways the X-Pro 1 makes the x100 look like a bargain.
It actually does - with 2/18 being so so and M lenses hopelessly smeared at the edges, at least for now X-Pro is a single lens - 1.4/35 camera for $2300.
 
I think it's quite evident why there is hesitation from prospective buyers. First..the bad press about the previous two X series cameras. It appears to be a love hate relationship with X100 QUIRKS/autofocus and X10 ORBS. Second....look at the main complaints regarding the XP1. Slow autofocus and not state of the art viewfinder as in NEX7. Throw in a fairly premium price compared with the NEX7 and the OMD E M5 and there is definitely serious competition especially at this price point level. If the OMD offering had an APS C sensor I would have passed on the XP1.

IMHO Fujifilm should have and could have hit one out of the ballpark with better engineering. Imagine if the autofocus was on par with the OMD and the viewfinder was good as or better than the Sony. WOW...there would be zero stock everywhere and the XP1 would be an immediate classic. Oh...and a sealed camera would have been a major plus.

Simple solution to engineering problems...hire the best engineering talent. In the long run it will make a major difference in your profitability. Who designed the NEX7 viewfinder and the Olympus autofocus system? It should not be difficult to find and hire them. This is really not so darn complicated. Reverse engineering happens every day and great companies hire the best talent.
 
Nothing wrong with waiting to check out the em5. It's an appealing camera (on paper).

What's wrong with the OVF? I use it just fine, and it's bright enough and I've never once thought "wow, this is awful to use"? Puzzling.
The glass in the ovf have a slight tint that I personally don't like, and the ovf could've been larger and brighter. It's not faulty,it's just not exceptional.
I'd like weather sealing too. Though I've only shot in light rain and snow really. Dust has never been an issue with any camera I've used to date, including film. Gotta get everything cleaned and checked every few yrs anyway right? But it does give me (possibly false, possibly legitimate) peace of mind.
Weather sealing is not a reason to skimp on maintenance, but how much can a couple of gaskets really cost?
The 18 is great. Not sure the false controversy about it on DPR. Probably the early pre-prod model examples. I was turned off of it then as well, but it seems vastly different than back then. I have it and it's great. I'm awaiting the 60, but it's a portrait lens. It's really not supposed to be fast, is it? I guess when the stabilized tele-zoom comes out we'll have that option. Are they making a longer prime?
It's absolutely not great. It's usable and one can shoot great shots with it. But it is probably the worst performing about 18 mm lens made this millennia.
MF doesn't work? Hmm.
It's slow, evf have the refreshing rate of a medium format back and there's absolutely no feel to it. There's also no focus confirmation in the ovf. And the mf is still too slow.
What I don't like about the diopter is that the glass isn't shallow enough and attracts the oil from my eyelashes. It's worse that an LCD b/c I can't get to it easily to clean it.
I get just about every shot I attempt, so that's confusing. I bet if you asked all the current owners, you'd have much more confidence in the camera than you do now. I've shot in a moving car, at a moving car, my running dog, plants blowing in the wind, people walking. I've had most issues in low light and wide open, but that's an issue with many CDF cameras with glass this wide. I get much faster better results when it's stopped down (35mm). I've yet to have any focusing issues with the 18 (I've only had it two days, granted) that I wouldn't have with literally any lens. These are strange reiterations in a forum full of them. No one is proclaiming XP1 + lenses to be the "best", fastest AF. But at the same time, it's absurdly misrepresented, mostly by people who have shown a bias (not necessarily you) and don't own the camera. It's funny, sure, but it doesn't represent what a lot of owners are talking about. I suppose this will just continue, as it seems to motivation to (falsely and with bias) bash a company is greater than to represent it more fairly. Or at least, it's much more controversial and brings out the loudest? I can't be sure.
I have no doubt that I could easily get what I need with it. The thread was why it didn't fly of the shelves as fast as other cameras since mr Lloyd "I can test a mf system in a single day" Chambers thinks that there's a high demand. Which it isn't. Right now. Fuji likes to think of the camera as a cheap m9, but that's just silly. Its not made by Leica and that's it. So the em5 might be the strongest contender and that just isn't out yet.
I think a lot of us are waiting to see how the evf on the olympus om-d e-m5 will turn out when the first proper previews etc shows up. The olympus and panasonic mFT range is pretty tempting.

Had the ovf on the x pro 1 been better, had the body been weather sealed, had the mf worked, had the 18mm lens been better, had the 60mm lens been faster, had the frame lines been more accurate, had the off had diopter adjustment etc etc, x pro 1 would've been sold out :)

As it is now, the Xpro1 is higher quality than all other aps-c sensors or smaller, even compared to some of the older 35mm formats, but will you ever get the shot?

And before there's support in lightroom etc there's just no way I and many with me will even consider buying it
--
Anders

'It is nice to be important but it is more important to be nice'
--
Anders

'It is nice to be important but it is more important to be nice'
 
They should put a stop to that - $1000 non refundable deposits should do it!
:) and that is why some cameras are not for everyone ;) .

To answer your question more specifically: This is the internet and talk is cheap! I also think that many pre-order 'just in case' . It would be interesting, but time consuming, to check some weeks/months from now to see if all of the people complaning about slow distro are posting photos.

Cheers,

--
Anticipate the Light and wing it when you get it wrong
Tom
http://taja.smugmug.com/
 
Also, clearly those of you have very different - and more beneficial - consumer laws than we do in NZ. This is a quote from our consumer law page:

"Change-of-mind refunds: the basics

You don’t actually have the right to return goods for a refund if you just change your mind and decide you don’t want them."
 
I'm waiting for the NEX and X1Pro having ultrawide lens in the 10mm crop(16mm FF) lense. Then I'll ditch my 7d for travel landscape.
 
very dumb comment.
Unpopular, perhaps but you can see his point.

I would honestly rather have an X100 successor with 35mm f1.4 fixed lens, new sensor, faster processor and updated firmware.

I'd keep my X100 and add the successor for the 50mm perspective.

Cheers

Brian
In some ways the X-Pro 1 makes the x100 look like a bargain.
It actually does - with 2/18 being so so and M lenses hopelessly smeared at the edges, at least for now X-Pro is a single lens - 1.4/35 camera for $2300.
--
Join our free worldwide support network here :
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In a perfect world I would like a 23mm-46mm two position lens @1.4 ;) The X100 with the fixed focal just doesn't work for me and I tried shooting the D700, 35 f2D for a week to see if I could live with it.
--
Anticipate the Light and wing it when you get it wrong

Tom
http://taja.smugmug.com/
 
Nothing wrong with waiting to check out the em5. It's an appealing camera (on paper).

What's wrong with the OVF? I use it just fine, and it's bright enough and I've never once thought "wow, this is awful to use"? Puzzling.
The glass in the ovf have a slight tint that I personally don't like, and the ovf could've been larger and brighter. It's not faulty,it's just not exceptional.
Right. But it's not bad? Tradeoffs and whatnot. Not everything can be 'exceptional", and it won't be to everyone, even if it is for say you or me. That was my point.
I'd like weather sealing too. Though I've only shot in light rain and snow really. Dust has never been an issue with any camera I've used to date, including film. Gotta get everything cleaned and checked every few yrs anyway right? But it does give me (possibly false, possibly legitimate) peace of mind.
Weather sealing is not a reason to skimp on maintenance, but how much can a couple of gaskets really cost?
No, but maintenance can take care of normal and even sometimes extreme environments. I don't think it's necessarily the cost of the gaskets alone, but rather, a combination of other things that would have to be considered, including changing the tolerances & fit, possibly increasing the size of the camera, having to maybe reingineer other functionalities such as the viewfinder etc etc. I'm sure its more involved to weatherproof properly - and then you have to back that up, to some extent. Again, I DO wish it were weatherproofed, if for anything my peace of mind.
It's absolutely not great. It's usable and one can shoot great shots with it. But it is probably the worst performing about 18 mm lens made this millennia.
That's absolutely an absurd statement. It's obviously more than "useable". I realize after reading this response that it's dumb to respond to the rest of your reply, but i will anyway!
MF doesn't work? Hmm.
It's slow, evf have the refreshing rate of a medium format back and there's absolutely no feel to it. There's also no focus confirmation in the ovf. And the mf is still too slow.
It's fine. The refresh rate is fine, certainly not slow enough to keep you from focusing properly and efficiently. There is feel to it - it's dampened. I don't use the OVF to focus manually, but that is a point that for those who do should be addressed. Again, it's not "slow". And for those who would like less travel to get to focus (as opposed to prefocusing), i doubt there's anything mechanically stopping Fuji from an update to make that available.
What I don't like about the diopter is that the glass isn't shallow enough and attracts the oil from my eyelashes. It's worse that an LCD b/c I can't get to it easily to clean it.
I have no doubt that I could easily get what I need with it. The thread was why it didn't fly of the shelves as fast as other cameras since mr Lloyd "I can test a mf system in a single day" Chambers thinks that there's a high demand. Which it isn't. Right now. Fuji likes to think of the camera as a cheap m9, but that's just silly. Its not made by Leica and that's it. So the em5 might be the strongest contender and that just isn't out yet.
I don't know where to start with this - but to address just a couple of points, where did Fuji proclaim this to be a cheap M9?? And are you really going to try and compare the em5 to a Leica? Seriously? It's hard for me to not read your reply without sarcasm.
I think a lot of us are waiting to see how the evf on the olympus om-d e-m5 will turn out when the first proper previews etc shows up. The olympus and panasonic mFT range is pretty tempting.

Had the ovf on the x pro 1 been better, had the body been weather sealed, had the mf worked, had the 18mm lens been better, had the 60mm lens been faster, had the frame lines been more accurate, had the off had diopter adjustment etc etc, x pro 1 would've been sold out :)

As it is now, the Xpro1 is higher quality than all other aps-c sensors or smaller, even compared to some of the older 35mm formats, but will you ever get the shot?

And before there's support in lightroom etc there's just no way I and many with me will even consider buying it
--
Anders

'It is nice to be important but it is more important to be nice'
--
Anders

'It is nice to be important but it is more important to be nice'
 
Actually, no. Sure, it may look like a bargain to some, who prefer what the X100 has to offer, and that's great! But his representation of the XP1 and lenses are nonsensical. The 18 is good, not so-so, not only on it's own merits but within it's price range. There's a false assumption here that the 18 is a bad-to-mediocre lens that just doesn't seem to be jiving with most owners of the lens. There's also a false comparison going on against the quality of the 35, which is exceptional by most accounts. None of these makes the 18 a so-so lens. The M-lenses have all and only been used with the Kipon adapter. Adapters make a difference. If and when Fuji releases there, and there are still problems, then perhaps we can make that call. Also, the super wides seem to be the issue here. I"ve some some really fantastic shots with longer FL M's. Regardless - the X100 can't even participate in that discussion can it? I'm not why M lenses were thrown in. The XP1 is a single-lens system? So the 60 doesn't exist, and the 18 is just so bad that it shouldn't exist or be used with it? Really? These aren't reasonable statements. I don't care about unpopular, as long as it's realistic or reasonable. Do you see my point?

Nothing wrong with desiring an X100 successor. I wanted the X100 and would prob have gotten it had I not decided on the XP1. It's a great camera and those who bought it and kept it did so for a reason, and it makes sense they'd want a better version of it. It also makes sense why they might not want the XP1, but that doesn't make the 18 a lemon, the 60 non-existent, and the XP1 a fixed lens. Right?
very dumb comment.
Unpopular, perhaps but you can see his point.

I would honestly rather have an X100 successor with 35mm f1.4 fixed lens, new sensor, faster processor and updated firmware.

I'd keep my X100 and add the successor for the 50mm perspective.

Cheers

Brian
In some ways the X-Pro 1 makes the x100 look like a bargain.
It actually does - with 2/18 being so so and M lenses hopelessly smeared at the edges, at least for now X-Pro is a single lens - 1.4/35 camera for $2300.
--
Join our free worldwide support network here :
http://www.ukphotosafari.org/join-the-ukpsg/
UK, Peak District Local Olympus Safari Group : http://snipurl.com/bqtd7-ukpsg
Keep up with me here : http://twitter.com/alert_bri
 
While i don't disagree that this is not a "sports camera", it's certainly more doable than the M9. I've taken shots from a moving vehicle, at a moving things, and have gotten perfectly great shots. Would I buy this camera to go shoot NFL? Probably not. But then again, there are only a few cameras I would buy to use for that. Would I use this for a soccer game, basketball, hockey, etc etc? Well maybe not to make $$ (though maybe? and with the upcoming lenses?), I would have no concerns using it to shoot this stuff generally. I would be more comfortable using it for more predictable action though, for sure. And yes, there is much faster AF out there!
I would also say that this is

a) A camera you need to handle yourself rather than buy based on reviews alone

b) Not a replacement for any kind of DSLR system: you need both. This is no more a sports camera than a Leica M9 is.

It's the most exciting camera I have bought in ages despite the irritations (and I have never owned a camera that had none of those in 30 years or so) and I really would say you need to use it to see if it works for you or not. Somehow words on the page do not really quite describe the essence of the thing.
 
There's only one camera shop near me and I hate going into a city as it's an all day and expensive job so many of my kit purchases are made on line after reading the reviews and customer feedback.

I'm really tempted to order a X Pro 1 + 35mm but I'll probably wait for the following reported possible issues to be clarified and hopefully corrected to some degree...

Slow AF focus and hunting in low light.
Lens chatter in changing light and associated possible difficulty with MF.
Long throw manual focus.

If the camera had been given a more universal clean bill of health I'd have ordered one by now, but it wasn't so until things are clarified and / or improved my existing kit will hopefully work just fine.
 
Nothing wrong with waiting to check out the em5. It's an appealing camera (on paper).

What's wrong with the OVF? I use it just fine, and it's bright enough and I've never once thought "wow, this is awful to use"? Puzzling.
The glass in the ovf have a slight tint that I personally don't like, and the ovf could've been larger and brighter. It's not faulty,it's just not exceptional.
Right. But it's not bad? Tradeoffs and whatnot. Not everything can be 'exceptional", and it won't be to everyone, even if it is for say you or me. That was my point.
I'd like weather sealing too. Though I've only shot in light rain and snow really. Dust has never been an issue with any camera I've used to date, including film. Gotta get everything cleaned and checked every few yrs anyway right? But it does give me (possibly false, possibly legitimate) peace of mind.
Weather sealing is not a reason to skimp on maintenance, but how much can a couple of gaskets really cost?
No, but maintenance can take care of normal and even sometimes extreme environments. I don't think it's necessarily the cost of the gaskets alone, but rather, a combination of other things that would have to be considered, including changing the tolerances & fit, possibly increasing the size of the camera, having to maybe reingineer other functionalities such as the viewfinder etc etc. I'm sure its more involved to weatherproof properly - and then you have to back that up, to some extent. Again, I DO wish it were weatherproofed, if for anything my peace of mind.
It's absolutely not great. It's usable and one can shoot great shots with it. But it is probably the worst performing about 18 mm lens made this millennia.
That's absolutely an absurd statement. It's obviously more than "useable". I realize after reading this response that it's dumb to respond to the rest of your reply, but i will anyway!
I have used it. It's really too soft in the corners with way too much non correctable fringing. It is clearly visible in even a4 sized prints. I don't think I have ever met a photographer that would consider that any better than perhaps usable. A good image Will still be a good image. But rather despite the lens.
MF doesn't work? Hmm.
It's slow, evf have the refreshing rate of a medium format back and there's absolutely no feel to it. There's also no focus confirmation in the ovf. And the mf is still too slow.
It's fine. The refresh rate is fine, certainly not slow enough to keep you from focusing properly and efficiently. There is feel to it - it's dampened. I don't use the OVF to focus manually, but that is a point that for those who do should be addressed. Again, it's not "slow". And for those who would like less travel to get to focus (as opposed to prefocusing), i doubt there's anything mechanically stopping Fuji from an update to make that available.
As I said, I Have used the camera and all three lenses. You may have other references than I, but you'll be pretty lonely in the x pro 1 has snappy mf camp ;)
What I don't like about the diopter is that the glass isn't shallow enough and attracts the oil from my eyelashes. It's worse that an LCD b/c I can't get to it easily to clean it.
I have no doubt that I could easily get what I need with it. The thread was why it didn't fly of the shelves as fast as other cameras since mr Lloyd "I can test a mf system in a single day" Chambers thinks that there's a high demand. Which it isn't. Right now. Fuji likes to think of the camera as a cheap m9, but that's just silly. Its not made by Leica and that's it. So the em5 might be the strongest contender and that just isn't out yet.
I don't know where to start with this - but to address just a couple of points, where did Fuji proclaim this to be a cheap M9?? And are you really going to try and compare the em5 to a Leica? Seriously? It's hard for me to not read your reply without sarcasm.
The European marketing director said things that could only be understood that way on the press introduction in Scandinavia.

And I meant the e-m 5 is the main competitor to the x pro1, not to the Leica.

Only other Leica will compete with the M9. It's just a very tough crowd to win over. :)
I think a lot of us are waiting to see how the evf on the olympus om-d e-m5 will turn out when the first proper previews etc shows up. The olympus and panasonic mFT range is pretty tempting.

Had the ovf on the x pro 1 been better, had the body been weather sealed, had the mf worked, had the 18mm lens been better, had the 60mm lens been faster, had the frame lines been more accurate, had the off had diopter adjustment etc etc, x pro 1 would've been sold out :)

As it is now, the Xpro1 is higher quality than all other aps-c sensors or smaller, even compared to some of the older 35mm formats, but will you ever get the shot?

And before there's support in lightroom etc there's just no way I and many with me will even consider buying it
--
Anders

'It is nice to be important but it is more important to be nice'
--
Anders

'It is nice to be important but it is more important to be nice'
--
Anders

'It is nice to be important but it is more important to be nice'
 
I have used it. It's really too soft in the corners with way too much non correctable fringing. It is clearly visible in even a4 sized prints. I don't think I have ever met a photographer that would consider that any better than perhaps usable. A good image Will still be a good image. But rather despite the lens.
I own it. It's not "too soft" in the corners. CA/fringing is on par with every WA i've owned, and you can't possibly know if it's correctable b/c profiles in LR etc haven't been released yet. You just don't really know what you're talking about, and you seem intent on proving this with every reply.
As I said, I Have used the camera and all three lenses. You may have other references than I, but you'll be pretty lonely in the x pro 1 has snappy mf camp ;)
Ok, well I own it, and use it daily. I never said it was "snappy". Did you enter a MF speed contest with the XP1 and lose or something? I said it was fine, and sure I'd like the option to control the amount of throw. I think that's fair.
The European marketing director said things that could only be understood that way on the press introduction in Scandinavia.
what did they say?
And I meant the e-m 5 is the main competitor to the x pro1, not to the Leica.

Only other Leica will compete with the M9. It's just a very tough crowd to win over. :)
what about all the other mirrorless cams with similar form factors? Pretty sure they're all competitors, and they're invoked as such constantly throughout the forums.
 
That's kind of the point I was making.

There are so many people out there who seem to evaluate every camera they pick up against an unrealistic requirement that it should be able to replace every other camera for every other kind of photography.

This is patently nonsense. Yes, I COULD (and would) shoot sports with an XP1 if that was the only camera I had in the bag. I would not expect it to compensate for any lack of skill or technique on my part, though. OTOH, I would expect a D4 to compensate by for example taking over the focusing tasks for me, so that if my focusing/panning/anticipation sucked it would hide that a lot.

If you can have only one camera, then any and all cameras will be a compromise. If you can have more than one, then the XP1 may well fit a niche for you. It does for me.
While i don't disagree that this is not a "sports camera", it's certainly more doable than the M9. I've taken shots from a moving vehicle, at a moving things, and have gotten perfectly great shots. Would I buy this camera to go shoot NFL? Probably not. But then again, there are only a few cameras I would buy to use for that. Would I use this for a soccer game, basketball, hockey, etc etc? Well maybe not to make $$ (though maybe? and with the upcoming lenses?), I would have no concerns using it to shoot this stuff generally. I would be more comfortable using it for more predictable action though, for sure. And yes, there is much faster AF out there!
I would also say that this is

a) A camera you need to handle yourself rather than buy based on reviews alone

b) Not a replacement for any kind of DSLR system: you need both. This is no more a sports camera than a Leica M9 is.

It's the most exciting camera I have bought in ages despite the irritations (and I have never owned a camera that had none of those in 30 years or so) and I really would say you need to use it to see if it works for you or not. Somehow words on the page do not really quite describe the essence of the thing.
 
And is also built by Fuji. On the other hand, any camera with which you are not familiar, is idiosyncratic.
Expensive for a camera with some idiosyncrasies. Also the legacy of the X100 and X10. Maybe next year :)

The cameras and lenses seem to be in stock everywhere in the UK and there were some posts about dealers(and even Fuji) offering some discounts(bundles). My wife will be in the UK for a month so I guess she will have to call around to get more info.
larry!
http://www.larry-bolch.com/
 
The X100 was attractive because it provides enthusiasts/pros with a really good quality compact. I don't think the XPro-1 will be particularly attractive for most photographers who already have an enthusiast/pro grade system unless they're desperate to shed some weight (and spend some money).
Exactly why I bought. Working out of a vehicle when traveling, or shooting in a fixed location, the D700 really delivers. As a carry-everywhere people camera, the X100 is superb. However, strolling a city with the D700 and a few lenses in the case, my knees start howling more quickly each year that passes. My XP1 does not replace either, but gives me more versatility than the X100, and less weight than the D700 by a bunch. With all three lenses, it only weighs a total of 967g. The D700 without a lens weighs 995g, and together with the usual kit weighs nearly four kilograms.

As a superb quality, urban walkin'-'round, shootin'-stuff camera that can handle the range of light the D700 can, the XP1 appears to be ideal.

--
larry!
http://www.larry-bolch.com/
 
Perhaps a simple analogy (I know its risky here) would help. Just taking the MF implementation as an example of what Fuji did wrong and could have done right. Virtually every modern fighter aircraft is fly by wire as are many commercial planes. Now imagine that they had Fuji engineers creating their fly-by-wire controls. Would you want to fly that plane? Would you want to be a passenger on that plane?

Conversation between pilot and co-pilot:
Pilot to co-pilot: Turn left 90...I said turn left 90...TURN LEFT 90!!!

Co-pilot to Pilot: I am turning left...I am turning you idiot...the f@#$!ng thing is spinning!!!
Pilot to CO-Pilot: Now turn right 50...WTF...I said turn right 50...

Co-pilot to Pilot: I am turning right but it keeps turning left. Darn thing can't make up its mind...

--
John
Visit my web gallery at:
http://www.barjohn.com/My Photographs/index.html
Comments and critiques welcome.
 

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