Are UV filters necessary?

Flares can be minimized by the petal shaped lens hood. Most flares happens due to the light hitting the side of the lens and bouncing off other lenses to the sensor. Multicoated filters can minimize flares but not completely.
Absolutely, there are things you can do to minimize the problems caused by filters. If you are in a situation where a filter provides a tremendous benefit (for instance a polarizing filter to reduce glare) you should use the filter and take steps to minimize degradation.

For most people shooting digital, there is no need to reduce UV with a filter.

If the filter isn't providing any benefit, you can maximize quality by removing the filter entirely.

To be fair, many people produce wonderful images when using filters.

As with anything, good tools don't guarantee a good result, and a great photographer can produce spectacular results, even when his tools are working against him.
 
The biggest issue with filters is that they are flat and parallel to the very shiny sensor. This is conducive to light bouncing back an forth between the sensor and the filter.
Only light through the center, perpendicular to the sensor will behave that way for sure because, after all, the whole purpose of a lens is to focus rays. On the other hand, light through the center would bounce even off a curved filter, including any lens element.

The main problem is reflections between the front element and the filter. In that case, a flat filter is actually good if the front element is curved. With telephoto lenses, you can get the effect that you describe but not from the sensor.
 
Don't good lenses already have anti-UV coating?
Yes. And the glass low-pass filter that covers virtually all DSLR sensors has UV and IR blocking coatings.

The front element and coatings of most lenses are not so fragile as to need full-time protection. The hood provides better protection anyway, and actually helpls prevent flare issues, rather than contribute to them as does a flat glass filter. If the extent the lens is exposed to blowing sand or salty sea spray, then use a good multicoated clear protection filter.

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Unapologetic Canon Apologist ;)
 
The biggest issue with filters is that they are flat and parallel to the very shiny sensor. This is conducive to light bouncing back an forth between the sensor and the filter.
Only light through the center, perpendicular to the sensor will behave that way for sure because, after all, the whole purpose of a lens is to focus rays. On the other hand, light through the center would bounce even off a curved filter, including any lens element.

The main problem is reflections between the front element and the filter. In that case, a flat filter is actually good if the front element is curved. With telephoto lenses, you can get the effect that you describe but not from the sensor.
Your position seems to disagree with Canon's stated position. They specifically state that a flat front protective element contributes to flaring and ghosting with digital sensors.

Here's a quote from Canon's Lens Work book:
Reflective characteristics of image sensors

The reflective characteristics of the image sensors in a digital camera differ from those of film in that they possess a higher reflectivity as well as a characteristic known as regular or “mirror” reflection, which has the effect of creating flaring and ghosting inside the lens when light from a bright source enters the lens and reflects back to the image sensor. In order to resolve this problem particular to digital cameras, a new approach to optical design has already been adopted, with the goal of bringing the outstanding imaging performance of EF lenses to digital photography. This is, after all, the mission of EF lenses in the digital age, because they occupy the core of the EOS system, whether film or digital.

Use of meniscus lenses

Players in a stadium or racecars whizzing round the circuit. All are lit up by the bright lighting in the stands, or the headlights on the cars, creating numerous bright light sources. Ordinary super-telephoto lenses have protective glass in front of the first lens unit. If this glass is flat, any light entering the lens from a bright light source will be reflected off the image sensor and back onto the inside of the protective element, causing spot-shaped ghosting. To prevent this, meniscus lenses are used as the protective glass on all of Canon’s large- aperture IS super-telephoto lenses. Meniscus lenses are spherical lenses which have the same curvature on both sides of the lens. By using these lenses as the protective glass, the light reflected off the image sensor forms an image in front of the image sensor and then disperse. Since almost all the light which is dispersed does not hit the reflective elements, this prevents ghosting while at the same time achieving high contrast for the resulting image.
 
Your position seems to disagree with Canon's stated position. They specifically state that a flat front protective element contributes to flaring and ghosting with digital sensors.
Entirely correct. It's the reason Canon has been using (hugely expensive) Meniscus Glass for the front element in many of their newer lenses.

R2

--
Good judgment comes from experience.
Experience comes from bad judgment.

http://www.pbase.com/jekyll_and_hyde/galleries
 
The biggest issue with filters is that they are flat and parallel to the very shiny sensor. This is conducive to light bouncing back an forth between the sensor and the filter.
Only light through the center, perpendicular to the sensor will behave that way for sure because, after all, the whole purpose of a lens is to focus rays. On the other hand, light through the center would bounce even off a curved filter, including any lens element.

The main problem is reflections between the front element and the filter. In that case, a flat filter is actually good if the front element is curved. With telephoto lenses, you can get the effect that you describe but not from the sensor.
Your position seems to disagree with Canon's stated position. They specifically state that a flat front protective element contributes to flaring and ghosting with digital sensors.
... with super telephoto lenses (500-600mm), where the rays are almost parallel.
 
The biggest issue with filters is that they are flat and parallel to the very shiny sensor. This is conducive to light bouncing back an forth between the sensor and the filter.
Only light through the center, perpendicular to the sensor will behave that way for sure because, after all, the whole purpose of a lens is to focus rays. On the other hand, light through the center would bounce even off a curved filter, including any lens element.

The main problem is reflections between the front element and the filter. In that case, a flat filter is actually good if the front element is curved. With telephoto lenses, you can get the effect that you describe but not from the sensor.
Your position seems to disagree with Canon's stated position. They specifically state that a flat front protective element contributes to flaring and ghosting with digital sensors.
... with super telephoto lenses (500-600mm), where the rays are almost parallel.
With any lens. Here are a batch of shots using a 50mm lens which were ruined by a flat, protective filter:

http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1002&message=38376360

Notice how the reflections are all diagonally opposite the light source? A classic example of reflections between the sensor and the inside of the filter as already outlined in this thread. Reflections between the front element and filter don't exhibit this behavior.
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Steve H

 
Nonetheless, that tiny scratch cost me $100. I end up selling an almost brand new 28-135mm IS for $180 due to that scratch on the front element. Hum....buying a $5 UV on ebay to save a $100 seem like a good idea after my experienced.
good filters costs more than $100 and if need one for each lens it really ends up in much
money.

I rather take the cost if I scratch a lens....
but who told you to buy a $100 filter in the first place? i think you can get very high quality filters for 40~50USD. my B+W F-Pro on my 70-200 F4 IS was less than $40USD,the other B+W MRC on 17-55 was 45 USD. the expensive high end stuff are completely unnecessary, it is called diminishing of returns.

besides you dont sell the filter as you sell the lens, so you can keep it for your next lens.

I think if you are talking about 18-55 or 50 F1.8 then there is no need for filter protection, but mid-class lenses probably can definitely justify this sort of investment.
 
Nonetheless, that tiny scratch cost me $100. I end up selling an almost brand new 28-135mm IS for $180 due to that scratch on the front element. Hum....buying a $5 UV on ebay to save a $100 seem like a good idea after my experienced.
good filters costs more than $100 and if need one for each lens it really ends up in much
money.

I rather take the cost if I scratch a lens....
but who told you to buy a $100 filter in the first place? i think you can get very high quality filters for 40~50USD. my B+W F-Pro on my 70-200 F4 IS was less than $40USD,the other B+W MRC on 17-55 was 45 USD. the expensive high end stuff are completely unnecessary, it is called diminishing of returns.

besides you dont sell the filter as you sell the lens, so you can keep it for your next lens.

I think if you are talking about 18-55 or 50 F1.8 then there is no need for filter protection, but mid-class lenses probably can definitely justify this sort of investment.
It seems that prices in Norway are a bit higher than you talk about. Prices goes from about 100$ and up here....
 
Wow! I never had problems with a UV filter in low lights.
 
Nonetheless, that tiny scratch cost me $100. I end up selling an almost brand new 28-135mm IS for $180 due to that scratch on the front element. Hum....buying a $5 UV on ebay to save a $100 seem like a good idea after my experienced.
good filters costs more than $100 and if need one for each lens it really ends up in much
money.

I rather take the cost if I scratch a lens....
but who told you to buy a $100 filter in the first place? i think you can get very high quality filters for 40~50USD. my B+W F-Pro on my 70-200 F4 IS was less than $40USD,the other B+W MRC on 17-55 was 45 USD. the expensive high end stuff are completely unnecessary, it is called diminishing of returns.

besides you dont sell the filter as you sell the lens, so you can keep it for your next lens.

I think if you are talking about 18-55 or 50 F1.8 then there is no need for filter protection, but mid-class lenses probably can definitely justify this sort of investment.
It seems that prices in Norway are a bit higher than you talk about. Prices goes from about 100$ and up here....
you can always buy from a place like maxsaver.net

--
Life is short, time to zoom in ©
 
Wow! I never had problems with a UV filter in low lights.
Any piece of glass, no matter how well coated, will eventually give rise to a reflection if the original light source is strong enough. 0.2% reflection of a surface is 9 f stops from the original intensity.

--
Life is short, time to zoom in ©
 
but who told you to buy a $100 filter in the first place? i think you can get very high quality filters for 40~50USD. my B+W F-Pro on my 70-200 F4 IS was less than $40USD,the other B+W MRC on 17-55 was 45 USD. the expensive high end stuff are completely unnecessary, it is called diminishing of returns.

besides you dont sell the filter as you sell the lens, so you can keep it for your next lens.

I think if you are talking about 18-55 or 50 F1.8 then there is no need for filter protection, but mid-class lenses probably can definitely justify this sort of investment.
I am having trouble understanding your position.

It seems you believe that a $45 filter is more durable than the front element of a $1,200 "pro" level lens?

Your plan is to take that filter, along with years of accumulated wear and tear and plop it front of whatever expensive lens you buy next?

Why?

If your goal is to maximize quality, you should remove the filter and use the "Pro" lens.

If your goal is to get the best image quality for your dollar, buy a consumer lens, and don't use a filter.

If your goal is make money by buying and selling lenses, then leave the lens in the original factory box.

If your goal is to protect your lens, than get a lens hood. Filters may actually increase the likelihood that an impact will damage your lens (the filter glass is thinner and weaker than the front element of your lens. Filters will break from impacts that wouldn't hurt your front element. The shards of glass from a broken filter can scratch your front element. Most impact damage is actually internal damage from the shock of impact. Filters don't reduce impact shock)

What is the actual benefit you believe you get from a filter?
 
Nonetheless, that tiny scratch cost me $100. I end up selling an almost brand new 28-135mm IS for $180 due to that scratch on the front element. Hum....buying a $5 UV on ebay to save a $100 seem like a good idea after my experienced.
good filters costs more than $100 and if need one for each lens it really ends up in much
money.

I rather take the cost if I scratch a lens....
but who told you to buy a $100 filter in the first place? i think you can get very high quality filters for 40~50USD. my B+W F-Pro on my 70-200 F4 IS was less than $40USD,the other B+W MRC on 17-55 was 45 USD. the expensive high end stuff are completely unnecessary, it is called diminishing of returns.
That filter costs about 75 dollars and if you add tax and postage then it is over 100 dollars for it ...
 
...

That filter costs about 75 dollars and if you add tax and postage then it is over 100 dollars for it ...
Cost isn't the issue.

There is no need to block UV on a modern digital camera.

Filters reduce contrast and increase flare. Best case is that the degradation isn't noticeable, worst case is that the filter ruins an otherwise great image.

Even if the filter was free, why use something that doesn't help, and might hurt?
 
With any lens. Here are a batch of shots using a 50mm lens which were ruined by a flat, protective filter:

http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1002&message=38376360

Notice how the reflections are all diagonally opposite the light source? A classic example of reflections between the sensor and the inside of the filter as already outlined in this thread. Reflections between the front element and filter don't exhibit this behavior.
Maybe not this but another one. We were nor discussing a specific behavior, and Canon clearly talks about super-telephoto lenses. A good filter may still produce such spots but much weaker ones, but any element of the lens reflects light, as well. That still affects the image as lost contrast, spots, etc., and this artifacts are harder to clean. Some lenses are much worse than others in that respect.

Below is a shot taken with the 17-55 and an B+W multicoated filter. I have dozens of those, with direct light sources. BTW, what filter were you using?

The fear of reflections with most lenses and a filter is overblown. Here are a few more examples, with the 17-55, that is supposed to flare a lot, according to those forums. I did not bother to remove the filter. Can you imagine the horror of combining a lens "with flare problems" and a flat filter? A few more examples here:

http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1029&message=35821172

 
...

Maybe not this but another one. We were nor discussing a specific behavior, and Canon clearly talks about super-telephoto lenses. A good filter may still produce such spots but much weaker ones, but any element of the lens reflects light, as well. That still affects the image as lost contrast, spots, etc., and this artifacts are harder to clean. Some lenses are much worse than others in that respect.

Below is a shot taken with the 17-55 and an B+W multicoated filter. I have dozens of those, with direct light sources. BTW, what filter were you using?

The fear of reflections with most lenses and a filter is overblown. Here are a few more examples, with the 17-55, that is supposed to flare a lot, according to those forums. I did not bother to remove the filter. Can you imagine the horror of combining a lens "with flare problems" and a flat filter? A few more examples here:

No one denies that it is possible to take excellent photos with a filter.

The point is that UV filters don't provide any benefit for digital cameras, and may noticeably degrade the image.

Why use a product that at best does no harm?
 
The point is that UV filters don't provide any benefit for digital cameras,
Actually, this thread quickly degenerated, as usual. UV filters do offer additional UV filtering. It would be interesting to see if in high altitude conditions, for example, this is noticeable.
and may noticeably degrade the image.
Why use a product that at best does no harm?
I am not a big fan of UV filters. I own 5 lenses currently and two of them have filters. Why use them?
  • may keep dust away with my 17-55 (no dust so far). This increases resale value, and may actually improve IQ if it indeed, keeps dust way.
  • I tend to bump my 70-200 too often; the filter on front has several marks on the ring already. It makes me feel better knowing that there is a filter there.
  • B+W filters can be cleaned much easier than any lens I own, especially for fingerprints, smudges, etc. This may increase IQ.
 
The point is that UV filters don't provide any benefit for digital cameras,
Actually, this thread quickly degenerated, as usual. UV filters do offer additional UV filtering. It would be interesting to see if in high altitude conditions, for example, this is noticeable.
The original question was whether or not UV filters are necessary. I think discussing the pros and cons of UV filters is on topic, and not "degeneration"
and may noticeably degrade the image.
Why use a product that at best does no harm?
I am not a big fan of UV filters. I own 5 lenses currently and two of them have filters. Why use them?
  • may keep dust away with my 17-55 (no dust so far). This increases resale value, and may actually improve IQ if it indeed, keeps dust way.
Thanks for posting your reasons for using filters. I think it is more educational to have actual examples to discuss.

I assume you are referring to internal dust, as exterior dust can be easily wiped off.

Most lenses are not weather sealed, and dust can enter through many avenues. Obviously, dust does not pass though the front element of the lens. I suspect you are worried about dust passing around the edges of the front element. My suspicion is that dust entering through various openings in the barrel are far more of an issue. Many lenses change their length (and internal volume) as they focus and/or zoom. As the volume changes, air must pass in or out of the barrel. This is the easiest way for dust to enter a lens. A filter doesn't stop this.

If you could stop the air exchange, then the lens would not be able to focus. Your best bet to stop this sort of dust intrusion is to place a protective barrier around the lens. A baggie will work (with an opening cut out for the front element), or some sort of filter material that allows air to pass, and not dust.

Thus I don't think the filter is giving you the sort of dust protection you desire.

Even if we assume that a filter does give you dust protection, then the question is which affects image quality more - a little bit of dust inside the lens, or a filter?
  • I tend to bump my 70-200 too often; the filter on front has several marks on the ring already. It makes me feel better knowing that there is a filter there.
Again, there is something to this claim. For some people it is worth trading a little image quality to preserve the cosmetic finish on the front of the lens and/or your piece of mind.

Personally, I think you would be far better off with a lens hood. The lens hood provides much better protection to the lens barrel and never reduces image quality.

To me it seems that lens hood is a much better choice than a filter.

On the other hand, some people won't remember to put on the hood, they leave the filter on all the time and forget about it.

Again, it's a personal decision whether or not the convenience of the filter justifies the cost in IQ. (depending on your shooting circumstance, the IQ cost might be very low).
  • B+W filters can be cleaned much easier than any lens I own, especially for fingerprints, smudges, etc. This may increase IQ.
Now we are getting to some tricky questions. If you are much better at cleaning a filter than a lens, then perhaps the filter is the right choice for you. Keep in mind that a filter is further forward and tends to get dirtier faster than the lens alone.

On the other hand, the coatings on your lens are probably higher quality than the coatings on your filter. The lens might stand up to repeated cleanings much better than the filter.

So yes, there are advantages to filters. Depending on your circumstances, the filter may be the right choice for you.

We all have different workflows.

I think it's important to understand the benefits and costs or filters so you can make a decision that right for your situation.
 

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