Wanted: Alternative system with good colours and weak AA filters

Hi all,

OK, so the inevitable has happened: My E510 broke But it gave me about 50K shots, so it's not the end of the world.

At the moment, I am a bit undecided what to do.

I know the E5 looks nice, but I am also toying with the idea of moving to another system. (It's only a hobby, not a profession for me.) Could get a second E510 I guess, but am also tempted to try out a new system.

Leaving the lens selection totally aside (just to focus on the bodies at the moment): What I would want from my future camera body would be a sensor that produces nice colours, especially skin tones , that don't require much PP. And also a weak AA filter would be great, as I am also doing macro work, and the ability to crop with a weak AA filter down to 100% is great.

Any (sensible ) suggestions would be greatly appreciated!

Cheers,
Pablo

I'm more or less in the same situation. E510 body still working ("only" 25000 shutter activations) and few lens but nothing really fancy (ZD 50mm, 14-54mm MK1 and 40-150mm) and I'm wondering "what after that"?
So I'll be interested in multibrand users honest answers.

--

L'expérience est une lampe accrochée dans le dos, elle n'éclaire que le chemin parcouru. Lao Tseu

http://yinetyang.deviantart.com/

Sony cybershot P8--> Sony cybershot DSC-H2 --> Olympus E510+ 14-42mm+ OM 50mm 1.8

--
Ken

feinschmecker said:

Hi all,

OK, so the inevitable has happened: My E510 broke But it gave me about 50K shots, so it's not the end of the world.

At the moment, I am a bit undecided what to do.

I know the E5 looks nice, but I am also toying with the idea of moving to another system. (It's only a hobby, not a profession for me.) Could get a second E510 I guess, but am also tempted to try out a new system.

Leaving the lens selection totally aside (just to focus on the bodies at the moment): What I would want from my future camera body would be a sensor that produces nice colours, especially skin tones , that don't require much PP. And also a weak AA filter would be great, as I am also doing macro work, and the ability to crop with a weak AA filter down to 100% is great.

Any (sensible ) suggestions would be greatly appreciated!

Cheers,
Pablo

Click to expand...

Having been through this exercise myself recently I would definitely not recommend ignoring lenses. I would advise looking hard at what you already have and matching it elsewhere and comparing the quality and cost. I would also recommend working out what sort of ISO capability you will need. You will struggle to find an AA filter as weak as the one on the E-510, most are stronger. Having tried the Pentax K-x, which has very nice high ISO capability, I found there was no advantage for me when you factor in the lens choices, unless you like to shoot slow primes or fast expensive ones.

I also found the colour quite different and not to my taste. Blues veered towards cyan and reds towards the pink end of the spectrum. I also found that the Pentax shoots colours quite warmly. Now you may like this but I wasn't keen.
Don't expect to find anything to match the SG lenses anywhere near their price.

You will win on some things but undoubtedly lose on others. I can't speak for Canon or Nikon as I didn't go that route and others will chirp in about them.

I have no doubt there will be people diving in with lens test data who don't use either Olympus or Pentax but remember I am speaking from my personal experience.

I'm sticking with Olympus as I found, that unless I wanted to spend a serious amount of money, Pentax couldn't match what I already have in the areas that are important to me, YMMV. I'm continuing to shoot with the E-330, E-510 and E-1.
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Tony
http://the-random-photographer.blogspot.com/

Thanks for the M9 suggestion, but I can't really afford one unfortunately. Unless you have got one to give away for a very competetive price

Hi Tony,

many thanks for the response. Fair point about the lenses. I am a fairly standard prime shooter, having (had) mostly the Zuikos 25mm and 50mm on my camera, so I am not too worried that other brands won't have something similar, though obviously that would be something I'd be checking before committing to anything.

First I need to find out a nice camera body for the new lenses

Cheers,
Pablo

feinschmecker said:

Hi Tony,

many thanks for the response. Fair point about the lenses. I am a fairly standard prime shooter, having (had) mostly the Zuikos 25mm and 50mm on my camera, so I am not too worried that other brands won't have something similar, though obviously that would be something I'd be checking before committing to anything.

First I need to find out a nice camera body for the new lenses

Cheers,
Pablo

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No problem Pablo, Pentax do produce some nice primes and the 35mm 2.4 is pretty cheap and a decent performer (50mm equiv). They also produce some longer macro lenses that are meant to be decent so they might be a good fit for you. I would recommend checking the colours to see if you like them. I found the K-x to be a very nice camera but you will have to stop down on a lot of the lenses to get the best out of them. This is the main difference between Olympus and the other brands. I like the fact that I can shoot all my 4/3's lenses wide open and get decent results. When you are used to shooting Zuiko lenses, performance across the frame becomes noticeable when using lenses which generally need stopping down.

The higher ISO capability will also be lost if you need to stop down. There are exceptions of course but I also found that lens performance seemed to vary quite widely for different versions of the same lens. Consistency of performance is a strength of the Zuiko's IMHO.

It came down to one thing for me, could I match the lenses I already own without spending a fortune elsewhere, I came to the conclusion I couldn't and I am not prepared to compromise on that. If you don't have many lenses then moving to another brand might make sense for you and I wouldn't discount Pentax, especially the K-x or K-r, they are very good value and the AA filter is not too strong for my taste.

--
Tony
http://the-random-photographer.blogspot.com/

Hi Pablo,

I know it might be somewhat sacrilegious ,but have you considered mFT. For example the EPL2 image quality is very good { similar to E-5 }combine it with the VF2 and an adaptor you can use your 50mm macro I find AF slow on this lens using the GH2/GF1 though AF is not such a big deal with macro work as manual is often used. Though the native lens choice is not anywhere near developed enough there are hopefully a few faster lenses on the horizon. I have been quite pleased with the 20mm and 14-45. For a lot of shooting they deliver great results in a smaller and lighter package.

Jim

pentax K5. but be prepared to spend $$ to get decent lenses for it

Fuji always was best. Minolta was good ( perhaps now Sony ). And there is m4/3.
That was the answer to the skin color question.

OK, now all I need to do is to convince Fuji to produce another DSLR!!

I don't know why you got the M9 recommendation. That is not a system for macro at all. I have a lot of friends and know a few professionals including my teacher that use Nikon. It's a great system, but they all pretty much agree you have to use Capture NX to get the right colors out of their cameras. I'm sure you can mess around with custom settings if you want. The prices on their new lenses are just daft unless you are getting paid.

As an alternative to Olympus I like Pentax a lot. They have a lot of primes. Not cheap, but affordable. They have some nice 2.8 zooms too. Not quite up to the best Canon or Nikon quality, but also a lot cheaper and lighter. Professionals still use them and it's more reasonable if it's just a hobby. The K5 doesn't have a weak AA filter though. It's had a few teething problems, but looks like those are getting worked out. It's probably more expensive than Oly with the HG lenses.

I don't think there is anything wrong staying with Olympus if the E5 is in your budget. I'm not sure we'll see much in the way of cheaper bodies, but from Oly's statements I think it's pretty safe to assume that 4/3s it going to continue for a while in some form.

I don't know Canon well enough to comment on it much. They have a few lenses options that are more reasonable in cost/weight than Nikon which make them appealing.

feinschmecker said:

Hi all,

OK, so the inevitable has happened: My E510 broke But it gave me about 50K shots, so it's not the end of the world.

Click to expand...

Sorry to hear that. How many ZD lenses do you have and which ones? You might consider an E-620 body as they are still available.

feinschmecker said:

I know the E5 looks nice, but I am also toying with the idea of moving to another system. (It's only a hobby, not a profession for me.) Could get a second E510 I guess, but am also tempted to try out a new system.

Click to expand...

I know the feeling and I am considering a Canon 60D because I have a couple of EF lenses from the film days. Also, Tamron and Sigma have some good lenses at reasonable prices. The 60D has many of the E-30 features and size. Don't need a metal body and weather sealing. Reasonably priced.

feinschmecker said:

Leaving the lens selection totally aside (just to focus on the bodies at the moment): What I would want from my future camera body would be a sensor that produces nice colours, especially skin tones , that don't require much PP. And also a weak AA filter would be great, as I am also doing macro work, and the ability to crop with a weak AA filter down to 100% is great.

Click to expand...

Weak AA filter not as important with the slightly larger sensors. 4/3 needed a weaker AA filter to enhance sharpness because of the smaller format.

feinschmecker said:

Any (sensible ) suggestions would be greatly appreciated!

Click to expand...

Colors can be tweaked with most cameras. Even the E-510 allowed color adjustment. Canon has the ability to accept some legacy lenses, notably Olympus OM, Nikon and M42 via adapters.

--
Trevor

I would try strong brands if I were you (Nikon or Canon), that have good support, lots to chose from, and big user base so you can buy and sell the lenses easily. I particularly like Canon 5DII, as they are not terribly expensive these days and system has some awesome primes. If you like to shoot primes that is (wide open). Canon 7D if you like occasional macro or do not mind somewhat longer reach for the birds. Same goes for the Nikon Dx bodies. I would not care about default JPGs or default colors (as what you will be told on this forum), those are use controlled and can be set to anything.

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- sergey

Quite a few users find the M9 to have terrible OOC color.

Leica M also would be far from my first choice for macro work... no TTL view, lenses that only focus down to 0.7 meters, no TTL view, parallax distortion between the viewfinder and actual photo. Did I mention no TTL view?.

You're right about one thing though, the M9 does have no AA filter.
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http://www.photoklarno.com

You'll be able to use your existing lenses on micro4/3 with the addition of the necessary adapter (which runs $110 if you buy the Panasonic one, $140 if you buy the Olympus). I find that as long as you're not interested in the fastest possible action, AF speed even with older 4/3 lenses on m4/3 cameras is sufficient (I've tried the Sigma 18-50 and Olympus 11-22 on the E-P1 in very poor light with pretty low contrast focal points and I was happy with what I got).

All of the Olympus micro 4/3 cameras have a weak AA filter, and the E-PL2 will have IQ most similar to the E-5.

Which lenses do you already have? That might help guide your decision. If you don't have too much invested, it would certainly be easier to buy into another system entirely. I assume from your challenge submissions that you already have the 50mm f/2.0. For that lens alone I might try to keep a 4/3 or m4/3 camera around.
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http://www.photoklarno.com

Klarno said:

Quite a few users find the M9 to have terrible OOC color.

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M9 are CCD and have a different gamut to CMOS people are more used to. Most M9 users rely more on C1 and the like

Klarno said:

Leica M also would be far from my first choice for macro work... no TTL view, lenses that only focus down to 0.7 meters, no TTL view, parallax distortion between the viewfinder and actual photo. Did I mention no TTL view?.

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yeah absolute last place for macro or even long lenses, although that said there are M mount macro accessories

Klarno said:

You're right about one thing though, the M9 does have no AA filter.

Click to expand...

properly process M9 files are stunningly clear and sharp, shallow DoF with a myriad of fast lenses is its forte. But its that sort of camera that attracts very good photographers well on top of their game, making M9 file browsing a contemplative absorbing process

Klarno said:

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http://www.photoklarno.com

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--
Riley

any similarity to persons living or dead is coincidental and unintended

Rriley said:

properly process M9 files are stunningly clear and sharp, shallow DoF with a myriad of fast lenses is its forte. But its that sort of camera that attracts very good photographers well on top of their game, making M9 file browsing a contemplative absorbing process

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I looked at it in the store the other day, and for the life of me I could not even imagine how one can do shallow without actually seeing it through the viewfinder. Their imagery of course (thanks to the lenses) is very interesting indeed,

http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1038&message=32714149

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- sergey

Klarno said:

Quite a few users find the M9 to have terrible OOC color.

Leica M also would be far from my first choice for macro work... no TTL view, lenses that only focus down to 0.7 meters, no TTL view, parallax distortion between the viewfinder and actual photo. Did I mention no TTL view?.

You're right about one thing though, the M9 does have no AA filter.
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http://www.photoklarno.com

Click to expand...

"You're right about one thing though" (I'm right with having a personal viewpoint!).

Your right it is a bit silly from price point alone... but, he did prioritize with underlining skin tone colors and no AA filter . Macro is not an a viable option with the M9.
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Ken

color is my continual frustration with my 5dmkii. I can get it to sing and it's been much better behaved since I'm using passport with LR.

But it so much easier to nail the colors with Olympus. (comparing raw with both systems as I don't shoot jpeg)
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John Mason - Lafayette, IN

http://www.fototime.com/inv/407B931C53A9D9D