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Wanna buy a DSLR and a 50 mm lens

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lnguyenh

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Hi,
I am thinking about buying a DSLR and a 50 mm lens.

I had an old pentax P30 with a 50 mm, and it was a really nice camera. Then I got some compacts, but never really got the same feeling than with my good old pentax p30.

Me and my girfriend just got a baby, and we would like to get a system camera, to take family pictures, portraits.

So far, I ve been thinking about getting a D90 with an 18-105 zoom, or a cheaper body, and more or better quality lenses.

However after talking to a friend of mine, I am studying the possibility of buying just a body, and then a good 50 mm lens ( I am aware that a 50 mm with apsc captors will be like an "old" 75 mm)
Do you think thats a good idea?

Among the possibilities are D90, EOS 450d, EOS 500d, D5000. I am actually quite opened to lot of possibilities, though for some reason, I would like to buy Canon or Nikon.
1) I guess its an endless debate, but do you have any input about this?

2) Is there a big difference between f1.8 lenses and f1.4 in terms of depth of field one could reach (small depth for portraits).

For example would there be a big improvement going with a D90+50mm1.8, as opposed to a D90+50mm1.4 ?

3) When using this type of lenses, is there any point in having a body who deals well with high ISOs? In my previous list, the EOS 450d might be the one who deals the leat good with ISOs. Would it be a problem?

Thanks for your help !
 
lnguyenh said:
However after talking to a friend of mine, I am studying the possibility of buying just a body, and then a good 50 mm lens ( I am aware that a 50 mm with apsc captors will be like an "old" 75 mm)
Do you think thats a good idea?
Click to expand...
For general family pictures, this passion to get a small f/no 50mm lens as the only lens you have is not my idea of great. Some people chase the romantic picture with soft bokeh etc.... Family pics, most of them are just common photos, no artistry. A one lens, 75mm equiv is really constraining for me. It's so long that you can't event a birthday cake and 3 people photo in the dining room.
lnguyenh said:
2) Is there a big difference between f1.8 lenses and f1.4 in terms of depth of field one could reach (small depth for portraits).
Click to expand...
Nope. About the same. But depending on context, the f/1.4 lens could be a different design and different budget price than the f/1.8
lnguyenh said:
3) When using this type of lenses, is there any point in having a body who deals well with high ISOs? In my previous list, the EOS 450d might be the one who deals the leat good with ISOs. Would it be a problem?
Click to expand...
Yes. High ISO with low image grain is always nice and allows you to choose a variation of f/no. f/1.4 is NOT ALWAYS the f/no you MUST DRIVE AT. It is like buying a car and you always press your accelerator pedal down regardless of context.

--



Ananda
http://anandasim.mp
 
lnguyenh said:
So do you think a 35mm would be better?
Click to expand...
The obvious comeback is, "For what?"

A 35mm lens will resemble the FOV of your old 50mm lens on that 35mm film SLR.

I would suggest that you get a dSLR with the standard 18-55mm "kit" lens. You will like it and take better pix with it for the most part. Only when things get really dim will you need a faster lens.

--
Charlie Davis
Nikon 5700, Sony R1, Nikon D300
HomePage: http://www.1derful.info
'I'm from Texas. We have meat in our vegetables.'
Trenton Doyle Hancock
 
lnguyenh said:
Hi,
I am thinking about buying a DSLR and a 50 mm lens...

1) I guess its an endless debate, but do you have any input about this?
Click to expand...
We all have input, but you're ultimately going to have to decide what suits your style. You have experience with film, and it sounds like you have a good idea of the types of shots you want to get. I bought an entry level DSLR and a 50mm (80mm equiv on a 1.6x crop) lens last year, and I have been loving it to get shots of my family. I also got an 18-55mm kit lens, but I never used it until I got an external flash almost a year later. I still primarily use my 50mm, but the added flexibility of wider angle is nice when I need it.
lnguyenh said:
2) Is there a big difference between f1.8 lenses and f1.4 in terms of depth of field one could reach (small depth for portraits).
Click to expand...
I don't think there will be much practical difference in depth of field, but the number of blades that make up the aperture will affect the "quality" of the blurred background (my eye is not that discerning).
lnguyenh said:
3) When using this type of lenses, is there any point in having a body who deals well with high ISOs? In my previous list, the EOS 450d might be the one who deals the leat good with ISOs. Would it be a problem?
Click to expand...
Good high ISO capability is always nice as it provides more flexibility. I think you might be surprised at how good modern DSLRs are with high ISO. Even the "worst" high ISO cameras are still pretty good. Again, this will come down to your tolerance for noise, your ability/desire to deal with noise reduction software, and the specific conditions under which you are shooting.

If you have any qualms about focal length restriction, fix your point and shoot at a couple of different equivalent focal lengths (e.g., 35 and 50 mm) and take some snap shots of your girlfriend and baby (congratulations, by the way!).

Try some different cameras out, see which ones feel right, and make your purchase sooner rather than later. Your baby is changing every day, and it will be fun to get nice quality portraits at every stage.

Good luck!
Dave.
 
lnguyenh said:
However after talking to a friend of mine, I am studying the possibility of buying just a body, and then a good 50 mm lens ( I am aware that a 50 mm with apsc captors will be like an "old" 75 mm)
Do you think thats a good idea?
Click to expand...
This could work, and you can always get more lenses later. But while a fast 50mm is nice to have, it isn't the most versatile lens you can own. I'd suggest you start out with a cheap kit lens, a 3X zoom. These add so very little to the price of new camera that they are almost disposable.
lnguyenh said:
Among the possibilities are D90, EOS 450d, EOS 500d, D5000. I am actually quite opened to lot of possibilities, though for some reason, I would like to buy Canon or Nikon.
1) I guess its an endless debate, but do you have any input about this?
Click to expand...
Any of those cameras will work fine. If you want my personal preferece, I'd take the D90. It's the best camera on your list.
lnguyenh said:
2) Is there a big difference between f1.8 lenses and f1.4 in terms of depth of field one could reach (small depth for portraits).

For example would there be a big improvement going with a D90+50mm1.8, as opposed to a D90+50mm1.4 ?
Click to expand...
Thre would definitely be a visible improvement in DOF. Whether this is worth the extra money is up to you. Both lenses are pretty fast by current standards. Incidentally, I am not a Nikon user, so I don't know that much about Nikon lenses, but generally speaking an f/1.8 can often be a "sharper" lens than an f/1.4. It just depends on whether DOF is the most important thing for you.
lnguyenh said:
3) When using this type of lenses, is there any point in having a body who deals well with high ISOs? In my previous list, the EOS 450d might be the one who deals the leat good with ISOs. Would it be a problem?
Click to expand...
Yes, it always helps to have good high ISO ability. And IS helps too. When you combine these things (large aperture, high ISO, and IS) you can do more available light photography. Alternatively, you can always use flash, but unless you are really good at using flash you may not be happy with the results. Flash photography is an art unto itself. When done properly it is simply amazing what results you can get. When you use the built in pop up flash and cross your fingers, you often get harsh shadows.

Photography is all about lighting. You'll find out for yourself.

Good luck!

--
Marty
http://www.flickr.com/photos/marty4650/sets/72157606210120132/show/
http://www.fluidr.com/photos/marty4650/sets/72157606210120132
Olympus E-30
Zuiko 9-18mm
Zuiko 14-54mm II
Zuiko 40-150mm I
Zuiko 70-300mm
Zuiko 50mm f/2.0 macro

 
Just as an FYI, the difference in DOF between a 1.4 & 1.8 50mm lens for your needs is probably minimal. At 8', the diiference in DOF is about 2" (8" vs 10") for a 75mm lens - i.e.a 50mm with a 1.5x crop factor.

That's not to say that the background won't blur more or faster with the 1.4, but for most indoor shots, I doubt you'd notice a difference. Agree with most of the others that a standard zoom is the way to go at first.

The again, a 50mm is pretty cheap for C/N bodies, so you could grab one soon after getting the kit. Or take some shots in the camera store with one to see if you notice a huge difference between the kit lens and the prime.
Either way, capturing the moments & memories is what it's all about. Enjoy!

-Scott

Ps -I may be totally wrong about the dof, but I think I'm close... :)
 
lnguyenh said:
Me and my girfriend just got a baby, and we would like to get a system camera, to take family pictures, portraits.
Click to expand...
Congratulations!
lnguyenh said:
So far, I ve been thinking about getting a D90 with an 18-105 zoom, or a cheaper body, and more or better quality lenses.
Click to expand...
Very flexible combo. Add a sb400 flash to bounce the flash (less disturbing, better skin tones, less red eye, etc).
lnguyenh said:
However after talking to a friend of mine, I am studying the possibility of buying just a body, and then a good 50 mm lens ( I am aware that a 50 mm with apsc captors will be like an "old" 75 mm)
Do you think thats a good idea?
Click to expand...
Not as an only lens,no.
lnguyenh said:
Among the possibilities are D90, EOS 450d, EOS 500d, D5000. I am actually quite opened to lot of possibilities, though for some reason, I would like to buy Canon or Nikon.
Click to expand...
All of them will do just fine. I prefer the d90. I used to own the 500d. Both take good pictures. The d90 is better in low light (but not better than the d5000).
lnguyenh said:
2) Is there a big difference between f1.8 lenses and f1.4 in terms of depth of field one could reach (small depth for portraits).
Click to expand...
Very little difference. The f1.4 takes in more light and has shallower DOF.
Go here: http://www.dofmaster.com/dofjs.html

to calculate it for yourself. Just remember there is no rule saying you can't use the f1.4 at f1.8. On 50mm lenses, I prefer (in order)Sigma 50mm f1.4, Nikon 50mm 1.8d, Nikon f1.4d and Nikon f1.4g
lnguyenh said:
For example would there be a big improvement going with a D90+50mm1.8, as opposed to a D90+50mm1.4 ?
Click to expand...
no real difference from the f-stop. The Sigma is sharper, the f1.8 is the lowest distortion and the best bargain.
lnguyenh said:
3) When using this type of lenses, is there any point in having a body who deals well with high ISOs? In my previous list, the EOS 450d might be the one who deals the leat good with ISOs. Would it be a problem?
Click to expand...
Sure, the higher the ISO the less light you need. I had a Canon 500d, it was noiser at 1600iso than the Nikon d90 is at 3200iso. This is roughly a 1.5 stop advantage. The d5000 has the same sensor, but simplified controls (more menus) designed "new to DSLR" folks. But it is all there. The d90 has better ergonomics, better controls, better AF, better viewfinder and is a bit quicker.

Have you tried these cameras to see what feels good?

Instead of a prime, I would suggest you start with a standard zoom. Assuming Nikon, either the 18-105vr, 16-85vr (better), or the Tamron 17-50 f2.8 vc. The Tamron is also available in a Canon mount if you prefer how they feel in your hands. VC = stabilized.

Later add a 35mm f1.8 lens and a 70-300 vr lens. 1 for low light, 1 for "at a distance". Shooting from a little further away is generally better because the camera and you do not impact the behavior / scene you are trying to capture. The ability to do this a little bit from the get go is a strong recommendation for the 18-105 or 16-85. But, then you will need a flash.
 
lnguyenh said:
Among the possibilities are D90, EOS 450d, EOS 500d, D5000. I am actually quite opened to lot of possibilities, though for some reason, I would like to buy Canon or Nikon.
1) I guess its an endless debate, but do you have any input about this?
Click to expand...
Be careful on the D5000. I'm usually the last one to bring this up as an actual problem, but if you do want to use a 50mm lens the lack of a body motor may be an issue for you. The cheap 50mm f1.8 is NOT an AF-S lens and WILL NOT auto-focus on the D5000. You would still have the options of the AFS 35mm 1.8 or the AFS 50mm 1.4 but as you can see you will either have to sacrifice your desired focal length, or some cash money.
lnguyenh said:
2) Is there a big difference between f1.8 lenses and f1.4 in terms of depth of field one could reach (small depth for portraits).

For example would there be a big improvement going with a D90+50mm1.8, as opposed to a D90+50mm1.4 ?
Click to expand...
You're only talking 1/2 to 2/3 of a stop. Yes, there will be a difference but if that difference is worth the cost for you is something only you can answer.
lnguyenh said:
3) When using this type of lenses, is there any point in having a body who deals well with high ISOs? In my previous list, the EOS 450d might be the one who deals the leat good with ISOs. Would it be a problem?
Click to expand...
Photography is about choices. There may be time where you dont want the thin DOF you get with a lens at f1.4 but stopping down to f4 would give you a 2" exposure. High ISO ability would be very valuable here.
 
lnguyenh said:
Hi,
I am thinking about buying a DSLR and a 50 mm lens.

I had an old pentax P30 with a 50 mm, and it was a really nice camera. Then I got some compacts, but never really got the same feeling than with my good old pentax p30.

Me and my girfriend just got a baby, and we would like to get a system camera, to take family pictures, portraits.

So far, I ve been thinking about getting a D90 with an 18-105 zoom, or a cheaper body, and more or better quality lenses.

However after talking to a friend of mine, I am studying the possibility of buying just a body, and then a good 50 mm lens ( I am aware that a 50 mm with apsc captors will be like an "old" 75 mm)
Do you think thats a good idea?

Among the possibilities are D90, EOS 450d, EOS 500d, D5000. I am actually quite opened to lot of possibilities, though for some reason, I would like to buy Canon or Nikon.
1) I guess its an endless debate, but do you have any input about this?

2) Is there a big difference between f1.8 lenses and f1.4 in terms of depth of field one could reach (small depth for portraits).

For example would there be a big improvement going with a D90+50mm1.8, as opposed to a D90+50mm1.4 ?

3) When using this type of lenses, is there any point in having a body who deals well with high ISOs? In my previous list, the EOS 450d might be the one who deals the leat good with ISOs. Would it be a problem?

Thanks for your help !
Click to expand...
until your learn more about DSLR lens just get a DSLR with the 18-55IS kit lens.

the 50mm is good for portraits and narrow "depth of field" but you will be surprised at the quality of the kit lens for many situations.

The Canon 500D (T1i), 450D (XSi) and Pentax K-x are the best "bang for the buck" -
 
A lot of good info here. I cannot comment about other lenses except Canon. I had a 50mm 1.8 and found the auto-focus is very slow, so I replaced it with the 50mm f/1.4 which is a much better lens. Additionally, I have a 24-105mm f/4L and IMHO the 50mm f/1.4 produces better photos. Here are a couple of 50mm f/1.4 shots; 1st on my FF and 2nd my wife's 1.6 crop. Personally, with 6 different lenses, 4 of which are L-glass, the 50mm is one of my favorites.





--



http://www.pbase.com/sullyc5er
 
Thanks for all info

Something I am worried about with kit lenses is to not be able to get good "bokeh" and I really want to experiment with that.

Also, for indoor shooting (without flash), I fear the kit lenses, and especially the 18-105 for nikon to be too slow. But thats where the ISO capabilities might help right?

(Am I right saying that for ISOs
3200 iso : d90 500d
1600 iso : 450d
And if we have to classify them d5000 > d90 > 500d > 450d )

Are my fears for bokeh and indoor shooting justified?

Lâm
 
Good thinking on spending your money on better glass. As you improve and get more serious about photography, you can upgrade your body and still enjoy the lenses from body to body.

As for Canon or Nikon, it's pretty much a horse race. Nikon has a slight edge because of it's ongoing legacy lens support.
 
In the same way of thinking than buying 50mm lenses (better quality than kit lens), what do you think of a

450d + Tamron 17-50?

500d + Tamron 17-50? It would be like 130$ more expensive (1000 sek in Sweden), is it worth it? I guess the main point of going to 500d is higher ISO possibilities, as I dont really care for video and better LCD.

Two things I am looking for:
  • good indoor shooting without flash
  • good portrait lens, ability to play around with bokeh
To sum up my thoughts now:
  • d90 + 18-105
  • 450d + 18-55
  • 450d + 18-55 + 50mm 1.8
  • 450d + Tamron 17-50
  • 500d + 18-55
  • 500d + 18-55 + 50mm 1.8
  • 500d + Tamron 17-50
 
lnguyenh said:
Thanks for all info

Something I am worried about with kit lenses is to not be able to get good "bokeh" and I really want to experiment with that.

Also, for indoor shooting (without flash), I fear the kit lenses, and especially the 18-105 for nikon to be too slow. But thats where the ISO capabilities might help right?

(Am I right saying that for ISOs
3200 iso : d90 500d
Click to expand...
No, the 500d is very noisy above ISO 800. I would say that the 500d has a parctical limit of 1600 ISO. I suspect the 450d is actually slightly better in this one area, but not as good as the d5000. Check dxomark.com to get the facts straight.
lnguyenh said:
1600 iso : 450d
And if we have to classify them d5000 > d90 > 500d > 450d )
Click to expand...
For ISO:
d90 > d5000 > 450d > 500d
The d90 & d5000 are very close, the 450d and 500d are very close.
lnguyenh said:
Are my fears for bokeh and indoor shooting justified?
Click to expand...
yes, the kit lenses are all too slow to generate much out of focus area and of course no bokeh.
 
lnguyenh said:
In the same way of thinking than buying 50mm lenses (better quality than kit lens), what do you think of a

450d + Tamron 17-50?

500d + Tamron 17-50? It would be like 130$ more expensive (1000 sek in Sweden), is it worth it? I guess the main point of going to 500d is higher ISO possibilities, as I dont really care for video and better LCD.
Click to expand...
The 500d has worse high ISO, not better. Check dxomark.com
500d
Sensor mark 62.5
Color depth 21.7
dynamic range 11.5
High ISO 663

450d
Sensor mark 60.6
Color depth 21.9
dynamic range 10.8
High ISO 692

d5000
Sensor mark 72
color depth 22.7
Dynamic Range 12.5
High ISO 868

d90
Sensor mark 72.6
color depth 22.7
Dynamic Range 12.5
High ISO 977

This is just a sensor rating. It does not take in to account ergonomics, price, controls, layout, preferred lenses, etc. it is more important that the camera feel good in your hands than that it is the ISO king. You should go hold a few.
lnguyenh said:
Two things I am looking for:
  • good indoor shooting without flash
  • good portrait lens, ability to play around with bokeh
To sum up my thoughts now:
  • d90 + 18-105
Click to expand...
also consider:
d90 + Tamron 17-50
d5000 + Tamron 17-50
d5000 + 18-55 + 50mm f1.4
lnguyenh said:
  • 450d + 18-55
  • 450d + 18-55 + 50mm 1.8
  • 450d + Tamron 17-50
  • 500d + 18-55
  • 500d + 18-55 + 50mm 1.8
  • 500d + Tamron 17-50
Click to expand...
 
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