Waterproof Group Test

We included a whole page with samples underwater, even with a colour chart and video from each camera shot underwater. Did you check those?

iliks said:

Was surprised that there are no underwater images in the samples gallery...

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DPreview.com
Reviewer

may be because they dont want to be on second place in the final raiting?

Simon Joinson said:

Panasonic just couldn't get us one in time to be included

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Thanks for updating the review with your notes on the missing cameras.....instead of waiting for a whole new group test how about one of your "concise reviews".
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terry
http://tbanet.zenfolio.com/

Simon Joinson said:

Or, less interestingly, a group test of waterproof cameras is only possible now we've got the staff to do it and have a new group test format designed. Oh, and the it's timed to meet the vacation season - we've only been doing group tests for 6 months and this was planned last Fall, when the Canon was unknown.

Panasonic just couldn't get us one in time to be included (and of course we never give Panasonic good reviews because we love Canon - just look at all the previous group tests).
SJ

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... that you guys:

a.) can still add staff in this economic climate;

b.) do group tests and time them sensibly (it really does make sense to do this now when people will be considering pluses and minuses of beach cameras)

c.) actually don't just rank cameras based on 'brand name" as opposed to actual quality.

I do hope you someday amend this group test with the Panasonic (if the conditions are adequately replicated) but for selfish reasons. I had a SW770 (and wasn't all that happy with it but fortunately a friend coveted that camera as a burthday present) and have been debating between the Canon and Panasonic as a replacement.

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'Nice pen, bet you write good stories with it.'

Had I known DPR didn't have a TS1 available for its underwater group test I would heave loaned them mine!

TEBnewyork said:

Thanks for updating the review with your notes on the missing cameras.....instead of waiting for a whole new group test how about one of your "concise reviews".

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At least now anyone reading the article won't be totally unaware of other options. That makes a big difference.

FWIW, the most glaring problem with the FT1 is softness of the lens at telephoto. It also has some artefacts with vertical bars appearing in line with bright highlights in video and the video is generally far from free of artefacts (I haven't actually tried MJPEG mode; could be different). I'm very happy with mine, but wouldn't suggest it would be a clear winner.

The need to replace seals could count against it; I don't know if this is true of other cameras or not.

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Peter

Great group test! I've been keeping track of waterproof rugged compacts, and it's great to see such input. Thank you for all the hard work, especially the hours spent in the pool

One question that is of prime interest to skiers, climbers, and paddlers everywhere, is how easy these models are to use for "extreme" shooting - one-handed, in gloves, and in a hurry.

Here are some things that I look for:

The Olympus "tap control" feature. In the revews, it was noted as an annoyance, and was immediately shut off. I wonder, how useful it is for the "extreme" shooting?

An ability to power up and shoot quickly and with as little as possible button presses. Do the cameras in the group offer something like this? Is it useable?

The AF speed: With tiny sensors, focusing at hyperfocal distance is what's needed in 90% situations. Do the cameras in the group offer this?

Boris

I've had one since early April. I don't want the test to validate my purchase. I just keep getting asked by friends if this is the one to buy and I don't like leading people down a $300+ path with only my subjective opinion of only one model.
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terry
http://tbanet.zenfolio.com/

TEBnewyork said:

Surprised that the new Panasonic FT1/TS1 was not included in the group test. With the strong video capability and image quality this has garnered good reviews around the net.
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terry
http://tbanet.zenfolio.com/

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Also the Ricoh G600 was left out Too bad, it could certainly have given the Fuji and Olys a run.

doublepost

Yes, thank you for updating the review. I think the addition adequately addresses the issue. Thanks for listening to our feedback!

...so that it can be used with big gloves! It's actually a very useful feature and isn't meant to be kept on at all times.
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Raj Sarma
http://www.flickr.com/photos/rssarma
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Follow me on Twitter: rssarma

Olympus enthusiasts from NYC Metro, join UKPSG:
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It is unfortunate that the recently announced Pentax W80 wasn't yet available for this roundup.

The Pentax control layout, like other Pentax compacts, allows the settings available via green button to be customized. On my Optio A30 I have ISO and AF mode readily available instead of the image size parameters which I pretty much never change. Instead of criticizing Pentax for not having ISO adjustments readily available, the reviewer should perhaps read the manual or at least read through the camera's menus for a few minutes. The reviewers would probably already know this of course if they'd bother to review any of Pentax's other compacts--there hasn't even been a 'concise review' of a Pentax compact for over two years (March 2007, Optio A20).

I will also say that criticizing the Pentax's looks is absurd--not everyone wants their digicams in bright colors--the W60 (and W80) are handsome without looking like toys! Bright colors might be OK for poolside accessories but for many purchasers these will do double-duty at other events where turquoise and fuschia are less desirable.

BorisK1 said:

The AF speed: With tiny sensors, focusing at hyperfocal distance is what's needed in 90% situations. Do the cameras in the group offer this?

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You're right that given slowish contrast-detect AF and huge depth-of-field with tiny sensors, hyperfocal is a pretty good way to go much of the time.

I can't verify this for the W60 specifically but Pentax compacts usually have a hyperfocal focusing mode called "PF" (pan focus). If you're shopping, look out for the newer W80 as well.

The Canon D10 does start up and shoot very quickly and it does have both manual focus and autofocus lock.

I did like the test, however I note the following things - maybe just me.

1. The review itself did not have the usual 'next' button on the bottom so I amost thought the review was only one page, but that didn't seem right, so I checked at the top and sure enough a lot more pages.

2. I would have liked to see a comparison with some of the older underwater cameras which have a longer history against which to compare with. However, you do have a baseline now to go from. For the future though if it could be done, I would like to see a comparison with a full up DSLR in an underwater housing as a goal for the P&S underwater cameras to shoot for. That way I can make a full comparison if getting a P&S is worth it for the occasional underwtaer shots or if I should just keep saving for a housing. [Trivia: On a lark I picked up a Olympus WP850, images okay, lag time- way bad, but I am willing to take it into the water - not planning on taking my 1DsMkIII in the water anytime soon, but have been contemplating getting a housing for my MkII or the old 10D I still have. ]

3. I suggest using something more stable then a person to hold the charts as a test method
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Save the Model, Save the Camera, The photographer can be repaired.

Thanks! If possible add the usb connector type. Not only are the Olympus a problem with the use of XD, but it's non standard USB cable. I usually travel a lot, and having to carry an extra cable just for this camera is something that I tend to forget.

I also wished the cameras would charge the battery through the USB, so I could do away with the battery charger. When you have a Blackberry, notebook, P&S, DSLR and Ipod, having to take a battery charger and USB cable for each is really a chore and easy to forget something. I'm eliminating the iPod in favor of the BB Bold. Since I carry the notebook I only take a single USB cable to transfer data and charge the battery at the same time. That leaves only the P&S and DSLR. I might or might not travel with the D5mkII and it's lens array, depending on the amount of photography time I expect to have. But it's such a huge volume that it has it's own carry case. This leaves me having to carry an extra cable and battery just for the P&S. Using the same USB as the Blackberry for data and power would be a plus.

It is interesting that the owners' opinions about W60 includes many negative contributions, whatever they are worth:

http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/read_opinions.asp?prodkey=pentax_optiow60

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Iván József Balázs
(Hungary)

I was also very disappointed by the omission of TS1. The group review without it is like French Open without Nadal. There are reviews online comparing this group without D10, with TS1 as a winner, so what is really missing was a side to side comparison of the two. It was clear Canon D10 would be a winner of this group, so the review's whole informational value is basically that there is no big upset here. What surprised me more, though, is that dpreview makes it sound as if its Panasonic's fault that dpreview did not produce a review of it. Come on. And to say you'll produce a review next year, when a new generation of cameras (including Panny) will appear, and it will become mostly irrelevant, is just adding insult to an injury.

Make no mistake, this site is the best, but that is the reason the expectations are so big, and so is disappointment, when dpreview does not live up to its own standard for some pathetic reason. If you still can, you should add a TS1 review, bc without it, as of now, its a Wimbledon with a cancelled final.

It's a test of five cameras from 4 manufacturers.
And I couldn't find a single image taken underwater.....