D90 release speed....

Now canon has been through 2 cycles in the eos line, and Nikon is still on the D80. First the 40d and now even a 50D, which does seem to mark quite a substantial upgrade.

In praxis this propably means that the hopefully upcoming upgrade to the D80 is flored even before it arrived.

It will very likely be more than matched on resolution, at least matched and possibly surpased in the high iso field. Matched on display quality, surpassed on house quality and floored on speed.

Its interesting that even though Nikon refuses to compete on speed, Canon does absolutely want to compete on resolution, so Canon beats the Nikon in both.

Besides the very blurry "Nikon ergonomics" and flash control, what should make a non Nikon fanatic choose the D80 sucessor instead of the 50D ? While extremely competetive in the full blown pro segment, Nikons to me has lost focus completely in the serious amateur segment, and yes I consider the D300 to be a pro cam.

In short my point is this. In being extremely show to release a cam in that segment, Nikon has shoot themselves in the foot, because Canon is in the speeding lane and the 50D will make the proposed D90 look dull.

Would like to hear your serious takes on that issue. Just take a deep breath and take the discussion seriously. Could be interesting :0)

Best wishes

Jakob

I agree when it comes to choosing a body and the budget is not strictly limited.
But which Canon lens would you choose to go with the 50D?
Nikon has more adequate lenses in the up to 500EUR class. IMHO.

Tom

Thomas Richter said:

I agree when it comes to choosing a body and the budget is not
strictly limited.
But which Canon lens would you choose to go with the 50D?
Nikon has more adequate lenses in the up to 500EUR class. IMHO.

Click to expand...

Well I wouldt limit myself to the brand lenses anyway. They both have great 50 mm 1.8 and 1.4 no difference there. For the standard lense i would propably go for a 17-50 mm f2.8 tamron or sigma, which is much better than the standard kit zooms anyway.

So for me I dont see any difference there. Remember we dont know if the 18-105VR is ok yet, AND canon has just put forward a 18-200 IS so both are offering the same I think.

Best wishes

Jakob

The 50D is to compete with nikon's D300, as officially stated by Canon themselves. D90 is in a different price range, so I don't see why there should be a comparison.

--
http://www.flickr.com/photos/thierrymarysael

yep D90 positioned to compete against the 450d and 40d, both the Canon 18-200 IS and Rumoured 18-105 (another 18-nn lens) are unknown quantites at this time and so is the IQ ,ISO and pictue quality from both Cameras.

Only variable we do know is that the AF on both 50d and D90 (strong hints that D90 is 11 Point Af Cam1000) are just the same from 40d and D80 nothing earth shattering on both Nikon and Canon part with the Canon still offering an AF and body that really has not changed since the 20d.

Also be careful to not get suck into Sales Blurb/Pitches that being banded by Canon today; the High Iso quality may not be patch on 40d; may have high NR with detailing loss and the camera certainly is not really a radical upgrade; just a 15mp with a new Processing chip in same outdated 20d body and features,

Good points on 50d: hdmi, live view AF, Lens Adjustments, 920k LCD, Sraw and Gapless Micro lenses which may mean a good cleaner image at high iso (but I reserve my view of this until the camera is reviewed and used by people on street compared to Canon Management Pitch).

Hopefully we will see a 5d Mk 2 soon that is probably the most needed Camera in Canon line needing a refresh and I expect that we will see a good High Iso sensor probably 16mp but with 40d specs and same 20d'ish dated body.

--



My Pictures & Web Site: http://www.dltp.co.uk

jagge said:

Well I wouldt limit myself to the brand lenses anyway. They both have
great 50 mm 1.8 and 1.4 no difference there. For the standard lense i
would propably go for a 17-50 mm f2.8 tamron or sigma, which is much
better than the standard kit zooms anyway.

Click to expand...

My 5c re the Tamron:

• Loud, annoying focusing noise
• Externally moving focusing ring
• Extreme field curvature-> blurred edges
• Too short

jagge said:

So for me I dont see any difference there. Remember we dont know if
the 18-105VR is ok yet, AND canon has just put forward a 18-200 IS so
both are offering the same I think.

Click to expand...

Correct.
But I assume it will be a shortened 18-135, so it should be OK.
Less distortion maybe.
We'll see.
I was thinking about the 16-85. Canon has nothing like that!

Tom

jagge said:

In short my point is this. In being extremely show to release a cam
in that segment, Nikon has shoot themselves in the foot, because
Canon is in the speeding lane and the 50D will make the proposed D90
look dull.

Click to expand...

I would think that a price expected to be 50% lower should attract a few buyers?

Besides, video should also be a big plus for all the folks looking at upgrading from a compact digital to something better...

Cheers,
Bernard

IMO Nikon is doing the exact right thing.. Canon is constantly alienating its customers with pseudo-choices that are in reality just minor improvements over previous cameras. Ask yourself, what does the 50D really offer over the 40D? Do you make better pictures with it? Do you have more possibilities? NO! The #1 complaint I immediately read about the 50D in the respective forums is that it still has the same AF engine that users are not happy with. Canon does improve marketing features and make them cheaper and tempting, but they don't build the solid and well-rounded long-to-live products like Nikon does. Nikon hands out bigger improvements after we've really enjoyed and exploited their products (at least for the non-entry level product range). The D300 was a major step after the D200 which was a major step after the D100. The D3 was a total awesomeness over the D2h offering an incredible ISO range unpreceeded by any other camera and Nikon has since introduced another very well-received FX camera that immediately finds its way into the hearts of photographers world-wide. Canon meanwhile has produced small improvements and built a reputation of buggy AF implementations. 5D users are desperately longing for their update while 40D users could be happy for another year easily. What do you think Canon is doing right?

I'm a happy D80 owners for 2 years and somehow I feel comfortable and pleased that my camera is still without successor as it is a well performing and well built DSLR. As soon as there is a successor and better camera it's a natural thing to feel weaker about what you have. Most people are tempted to always have the latest, most featured and best camera in their segment and I disregard companies that play lightly with this temptation.

--
http://donandre.ipernity.com

Thomas Richter said:

My 5c re the Tamron:

• Loud, annoying focusing noise
• Externally moving focusing ring
• Extreme field curvature-> blurred edges
• Too short

Click to expand...

OK ok a lot of shooters rate it as exellent. But there is also the sigma.

Thomas Richter said:

I was thinking about the 16-85. Canon has nothing like that!

Click to expand...

Ok its always possible to find that one lense the other one doesnt carry. They both have plenty though. And canon do have that one, they actually was first with the 17-85 is, but i agree it apparently isnt that great.

Jakob

Bernard Languillier said:

I would think that a price expected to be 50% lower should attract a
few buyers?

Click to expand...

That's exactly my point.
I'm looking for a camera/lens combo with well balanced performance.

To get that with the 50D, I'd also have to get the 17-55/2.8 lens, which adds another 1100EUR to the bill.

So we are at 2500EUR compared to the assumed list price of 1300EUR for the 90D kit.

That's enough differentiation between the two, both in price and performance, let alone size and weight.

Tom

That would be a deciding factor for me except that I have too much nikon stuff to go with the Nikon offering.

Can you really not spell or use correct grammar? Is this sort of a "NakidTrute" put-on?
Sorry, maybe you just need some help.

P.S.- . . . read what you wrote above . . . no kidding.

If you really are this horrible of a writer, maybe some remedial English(2nd grade, i place it) would be of help to you.
--
David~



. . . shoot like there's no film in the thing!

I've seen worse spelling and grammar on this forum - and yes it does grate
--
*********************
Amanda
http://www.flickr.com/photos/minhay/
*********************

Hi David, I assume you're attacking Don Andre's use of the English Language ( a bit rich from an Americam) Don appears to be from Austria making his first language German, How's your German David?

geoffrb said:

Hi David, I assume you're attacking Don Andre's use of the English
Language(a bit rich from an American). Don appears to be from
Austria making his first language German, How's your German David?

Click to expand...

Hi Geoff, first-off i'm not attacking anything, just making an observation, second-off who's "Don Andre"? -I was commenting "Jakob", the OP, who shows us his location as the U.S.(an English-speaking country) and third-off, my German is excellent though my French is better, but this is not a German Forum . . . we use English here.
Thanks for your concern, though.

P.S.- . . . thanks, Amanda, i thought it might be only me! ;-)
--
David~

. . . shoot like there's no film in the thing!

Sorry David, it was English humour (or humor?), not attacking you. Don Andre was a poster in the thread.

Geoff

Thanks Geoff! -no harm felt.
--
David~

. . . shoot like there's no film in the thing!

Oriinal post removed.

your comments on Nikon being beat by Canon make sense on paper reading spec sheets, but don't agree with the sales numbers. Perhaps Canon HAD to put out the 50D because the 40D wasn't competing sucessfully. It seems like Canon is reacting to Nikon's moves, so Nikon must be doing something right.

I'm pleased to see Canon adopting Nikon changes so that will force Nikon to adopt the few things I like about Canon or else innovate new things.

I think it's clear that Canon is the choice for you now. Nothing wrong with that. Personally, I'm glad to have the Nikon choices that I do as they are meeting my needs / desires well as I plan my next upgrade for a year or so from now after I see what the D400 has in store for us.

Supr X said:

Can you really not spell or use correct grammar? Is this sort of a
"NakidTrute" put-on?
Sorry, maybe you just need some help.

Click to expand...

what and arrogant pric. you just proved to be. Sorry but I dont care. English isnt my native tongue. This is not grammar school but a forum. I could spell check the whole thing but i dont care to.

Please enlighten me to how many languages you can debate in and how many you speak absolutely fluent ? That would be interesting.

Personaly I am completely fluent in 3 quite different langages in spoken word, and if I spell check I can do proper written as well. Besides that I can understand a few more, which i dont master in spoken word.

I have a suspect you are one of those spoiled gimps coming from a english native country that forgot there is a whole world out there. That goes perfect in line with the current conseption your country in the rest of the world.

Jakob