Shooting speed as well as overall AF performance seem to be the weaker points of the K20, leading many pros and advanced amateurs to experience this camera as somewhat less potent than its competitors in the same price range (the ones specified above).
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Is a pro pentax coming
- Thread starter jagge
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In the meantime, general performance and features moved ahead quite substantially amongst competitors.
Yesterday's pro camera is today's advanced amateur model and tomorrow's entry level offer. Oversimplified, I know, but this is the direction things go.
To compare a four years old pro model with a current advanced amateur model in a meaningful way, you will have to do it in the overall context of competition.
Roland Mabo
Forum Pro
The K10D, and the K20D, uses an internal construction that is similar to the *ist D (full metal chassi with an exterior of polycarbonete). This is good and strong. Now, the K10D and K20D enhances this with weather sealing, which protects the camera even more. This means that both the K10D and K20D is built to stand tougher environments than the *ist DS is.
And then what the makers calls..
You mean that if Pentax would call the K200D a pro-camera, then it would automatically be one? And if a maker releases a follow up to a semi-pro and calls it "avanced amateur" and sells the follow up to a higher price, then the camera - previous known as "semi pro" now is "advanced amateur".
And if Canon suddenly would call the Canon 1DS "entry level beginner model" then it would no longer be a pro model.
Ah, I think I get it now...
Those are silly things...
So what you actually want is not really about cameras specifications, but what Pentax actually calls the camera.
The K200D is called "popular class". Funny, last year it was called "entry level".
Market segments changes their names when the market evolves.
--
Take care
R
http://www.flickr.com/photos/raphaelmabo
And then what the makers calls..
You mean that if Pentax would call the K200D a pro-camera, then it would automatically be one? And if a maker releases a follow up to a semi-pro and calls it "avanced amateur" and sells the follow up to a higher price, then the camera - previous known as "semi pro" now is "advanced amateur".
And if Canon suddenly would call the Canon 1DS "entry level beginner model" then it would no longer be a pro model.
Ah, I think I get it now...
Those are silly things...
So what you actually want is not really about cameras specifications, but what Pentax actually calls the camera.
The K200D is called "popular class". Funny, last year it was called "entry level".
Market segments changes their names when the market evolves.
--
Take care
R
http://www.flickr.com/photos/raphaelmabo
Since Pentax for some reason were not able to offer competive primary features like speed of frames and AF, Pentax chose to offer some secondary features instead (like sealing).
I can understand why this road was taken by Pentax, what else could they do?
I understand also that many pros and advanced amateurs see through such dispositions and may turn to more potent alternatives.
Roland Mabo
Forum Pro
Nothing is wrong with the shooting speed of the K20D, it is as fast as other cameras when one pulls the trigger. But, continous shooting is 3 fps (21 fps in a burst mode).
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Take care
R
http://www.flickr.com/photos/raphaelmabo
--
Take care
R
http://www.flickr.com/photos/raphaelmabo
The two most critical factors often mentioned amongst users who considered buying into Pentax but then went elsewhere, in my experience.
Excactly. AF performance is also often mentioned as a weak spot.
Roland Mabo
Forum Pro
So in that sense, medium format is not a pro format since those bodies has such a slow continous shooting speed... And a manual focus camera can not be a pro camera.
Silly...
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Take care
R
http://www.flickr.com/photos/raphaelmabo
Silly...
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Take care
R
http://www.flickr.com/photos/raphaelmabo
Noone said or implied anything like that (at least I did not).
Distorting other posters opinions when answering them is the silly part here from you, Roland.
Roland Mabo
Forum Pro
The AF is fast and more secure than the others in good light.
In dim light when there is not enough contrast it do gets a bit slower.
Pentax has said that they has choosen not to compromise accuracy for speed.
So Pentax AF is more accurate than the competition. The Canon AF can be faster, but it also slip through more poorly focused shots. (this has been confirmed by many tests here in this forum). Pentax concentration is on image quality.
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Take care
R
http://www.flickr.com/photos/raphaelmabo
In dim light when there is not enough contrast it do gets a bit slower.
Pentax has said that they has choosen not to compromise accuracy for speed.
So Pentax AF is more accurate than the competition. The Canon AF can be faster, but it also slip through more poorly focused shots. (this has been confirmed by many tests here in this forum). Pentax concentration is on image quality.
--
Take care
R
http://www.flickr.com/photos/raphaelmabo
That's excactly the situations when pros and advanced amateurs will ask for a reliable AF system. And this might be excactly the reason why they might choose to look elsewhere than Pentax.
I think this is WAY too general a statement. I remember seeing some speed-vs-accuracy tests a year or two ago, against lower-level Canikons, but has anyone done any comparisons against the D300, the 40D, or even the 30D?
I would very much like it if someone could post a link that compared the K20D accuracy to the Nikon D300, the Canon 30D, or the Canon 40D.
It was the non-improvement of the AF speed and FPS that kept me from the K20D, and keeps me on the fence even now about changing brands.
I love most things about my K10D, but I would like faster AF speed and faster FPS. In fact, a little bigger buffer would be nice, too. I tried to shoot all RAW, but I've hit too many times when I have to wait too long to be able to review pictures.
--Greg
The difinition of Pro, semi-pro etc from the manufacturers point of view are based upon how many shutter cycles the camera typically can survive, not features....
The Pentax K20D is good for 100 000 which, at least until recently, meant pro (maybe semi-pro today)
All test in my part of the world claim that the K20D is the best built in its class. The same goes for the kit lens BTW. They call it pro quality at bottom prices.
It also beats all the competition except the D300, but win overall when price is taken into consideration....
The K20D IS semi-pro built....
One example (among many):
http://www.lydogbilde.no/test-pentax-k20d.79291.87o3974o83.lbt.html
That is of course a reality for those two manufacturers with 80% of the market, but further diversification is not an option for the rest. A sub 10% marketshare player need to be more careful with its product placement.
Theres no doubt that the semi-affordable FF cameras released this fall will erode the sales potential for high-end APS cameras.
The most we can hope for from Pentax next year is a four model line-up. These models needs to be clearly seperated, at least at the upper end, best done via the sonsors....
janneman02
Forum Pro
I agree with that statement but....
Yes there is a but.
But, many, if not most of those users really hardly, if at all, need these two factors. Which ofcourse does not mean that Pentax can ignore these factors as they are necessary to attract buyers that want to have things that they really do not need, a huge market segment.
My lastest spectacle (and other things like lawnmowerraces and tractor pulling) was entirely shot with Pentax... With the low framerate and lousy AF system. Proof that there is no market for more fps and better AF??? Ofcourse not. like I said, the "gadget market"is too big to ignore (not implying that higher framerate and better AF is a gadget in itsself but for one who does not need it , to wannahave it, is gadget behaviour) ).
But it is proof that the Pentax system is much more capable than many think and indeed more than sufficient for most use, even by those who say they want more
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That is not what I'm talking about. It is not about absolute cost. It is about what such a product cost from the competition. Whats expensive for an FF camera is not same price as whats expensive for an APS camera.
An 14,6mp pro Pentax DSLR will compete with the K20D which will be cheap in comparison. I have no problem with a speeded up K20D REPLACEMNT. But coexisting with the K20D will just erode sales of both...
Not many are going to buy it. But then not many are going to buy the FF Sony either. They need a flagship model and such a model need to have a flagship effect. All the competition are doing FF for flagship. A flagship(?) APS camera from Pentax need to have some truly unique features outside the sensor to make nay impact.
The price is less than 3000EUR....
Roland Mabo
Forum Pro
It seems to me that "reliable AF system" means "a fast AF system" for you.
For me it means "an accurate AF system" and in this sense the Pentax AF system is indeed reliable, even more so than the competition.
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Take care
R
http://www.flickr.com/photos/raphaelmabo
For me it means "an accurate AF system" and in this sense the Pentax AF system is indeed reliable, even more so than the competition.
--
Take care
R
http://www.flickr.com/photos/raphaelmabo
Roland Mabo
Forum Pro
When the K10D came out fall 2006, we had many threads here and comparisions between the K10D and Canon DSLR's (including the 40D yes) for accuracy, and it was found that the Canon slips through more poorly focused shots than Pentax does. This is because the differencies in AF monitoring and calculations made by the different AF systems. Pentax has a "double check" that Canon does not do. In poor light, this double check is responsible for Pentax AF being slower. In good light, the contrast is good enough for the double check to take almost no time at all, but with poor contrast it takes more time and this slows down the autofocus. Canon does not do this double check and beacuse of this, it has faster AF but not as reliable. Same thing with Nikon. This is old story here and we had many tests and comparisions and links in fall 2006 and spring 2007 about this matter.
I don't have the links at hand right now, because it was not recently that we had this discussion here. It is old story, old news.
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Take care
R
http://www.flickr.com/photos/raphaelmabo
I don't have the links at hand right now, because it was not recently that we had this discussion here. It is old story, old news.
--
Take care
R
http://www.flickr.com/photos/raphaelmabo
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