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Pentax review up for more than a few hours... for once!

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Cameron R Hood

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Maybe I shouldn't say anything, but rarely has a Pentax review not been preempted by one of the big guns postings within a few hours, and hits on the K20D review are through the roof. I hope this helps Pentax a lot, because now, for the first time in many years, they deserve all the praise they get. They've made an amazing comeback recently, have some incredible cameras and lenses out now, and I really do think they are offering some really unique niche products that no other company is covering. IQ over megapixels, even though they are now actually ahead in the megapixel race. Superb fixed-focal length lenses, teeny and light, good on them, man!

Now for the full-frame pro model, which would be icing on the cake, and REALLY attract some new people into the fold. A new shutter system would really help get their fps rate up, which really is pretty much the only thing holding them back now.

Go Pentax, rah-ra-ra, etc.

Thanks,
Cameron
 
Cameron R Hood said:
Maybe I shouldn't say anything, but rarely has a Pentax review not
been preempted by one of the big guns postings within a few hours,
and hits on the K20D review are through the roof. I hope this helps
Pentax a lot, because now, for the first time in many years, they
deserve all the praise they get. They've made an amazing comeback
recently, have some incredible cameras and lenses out now, and I
really do think they are offering some really unique niche products
that no other company is covering. IQ over megapixels, even though
they are now actually ahead in the megapixel race. Superb fixed-focal
length lenses, teeny and light, good on them, man!

Now for the full-frame pro model, which would be icing on the cake,
and REALLY attract some new people into the fold. A new shutter
system would really help get their fps rate up, which really is
pretty much the only thing holding them back now.
Click to expand...
====================

I actually got a huge laugh out of this whole "stats" thing, which must be causing a headache for the DPREVIEW staff about now. It points out that ANY brand's legacy owners could do the same thing, if they chose to.

GREAT that Pentax still has a following - my difference, personally, is that I want Pentax to do MORE than they've done so far - but I'm convinced it's a vain hope, as they don't have the market share or financing to compete except as a niche catering to PK owners. I have no idea how they plan to expand share in a ferociously competitive market for the move-ups from P&S, since they never had a "starter" megazoom camera of their own, as all of the others do.

As to DPREVIEW - obviously some of the Pentax adherents have figured out that you can just click and click and click on that review, and your "vote" (because that's what it's become) gets counted over and over. They would have to log clicks by user to deny duplicates, and I think anyone, member or not, can click on the K20D review (but not participate in the forums). That would require tracking cookies to deny repeated clicks.

The current click-share of course becomes the equivalent of a "rigged election".

Statistically, even though the K20D's individual share is 10.3%, the BRAND share still lags the "majors" by a huge amount - that's because they have more models, and newer models, of interest to the general buying public. At some point it will return to normal (after a lag of about 7 days after the mass-clicking stops), and Pentax (the brand) will be around 3 percent, as it always was.

I have to wonder if all this hubbub is actually creating K20D sales? Amazon has not raised its prices, and that tells me there's been no real impact, or money flowing to Pentax on account of it.

Here's the best-sellers Amazon listing for DSLR's:

http://www.amazon.com/gp/bestsellers/electronics/3017941/ref=pd_ts_e_nav

K200D is at number 13, as I'd expect - a good deal for the bucks w/lens @ $657

K20D is at number 17 at around $1080 for the body-only

It DOES point out that people still care big-time about the MOUNT, and probably the BRAND. I don't think that transfers as much to the COMPANY, which has no newer models announced, while the competition is busy getting less expensive cameras out to capture the low-end of the market, where bew people tend to buy their first DSLR.
Cameron R Hood said:
Go Pentax, rah-ra-ra, etc.

Thanks,
Cameron
Click to expand...
 
philbarton said:
Cameron R Hood said:
Maybe I shouldn't say anything, but rarely has a Pentax review not
been preempted by one of the big guns postings within a few hours,
and hits on the K20D review are through the roof. I hope this helps
Pentax a lot, because now, for the first time in many years, they
deserve all the praise they get. They've made an amazing comeback
recently, have some incredible cameras and lenses out now, and I
really do think they are offering some really unique niche products
that no other company is covering. IQ over megapixels, even though
they are now actually ahead in the megapixel race. Superb fixed-focal
length lenses, teeny and light, good on them, man!

Now for the full-frame pro model, which would be icing on the cake,
and REALLY attract some new people into the fold. A new shutter
system would really help get their fps rate up, which really is
pretty much the only thing holding them back now.
Click to expand...
====================

I actually got a huge laugh out of this whole "stats" thing, which
must be causing a headache for the DPREVIEW staff about now. It
points out that ANY brand's legacy owners could do the same thing, if
they chose to.

GREAT that Pentax still has a following - my difference, personally,
is that I want Pentax to do MORE than they've done so far - but I'm
convinced it's a vain hope, as they don't have the market share or
financing to compete except as a niche catering to PK owners. I have
no idea how they plan to expand share in a ferociously competitive
market for the move-ups from P&S, since they never had a "starter"
megazoom camera of their own, as all of the others do.

As to DPREVIEW - obviously some of the Pentax adherents have figured
out that you can just click and click and click on that review, and
your "vote" (because that's what it's become) gets counted over and
over. They would have to log clicks by user to deny duplicates, and
I think anyone, member or not, can click on the K20D review (but not
participate in the forums). That would require tracking cookies to
deny repeated clicks.

The current click-share of course becomes the equivalent of a "rigged
election".

Statistically, even though the K20D's individual share is 10.3%, the
BRAND share still lags the "majors" by a huge amount - that's because
they have more models, and newer models, of interest to the general
buying public. At some point it will return to normal (after a lag
of about 7 days after the mass-clicking stops), and Pentax (the
brand) will be around 3 percent, as it always was.

I have to wonder if all this hubbub is actually creating K20D sales?
Amazon has not raised its prices, and that tells me there's been no
real impact, or money flowing to Pentax on account of it.

Here's the best-sellers Amazon listing for DSLR's:

http://www.amazon.com/gp/bestsellers/electronics/3017941/ref=pd_ts_e_nav

K200D is at number 13, as I'd expect - a good deal for the bucks
w/lens @ $657

K20D is at number 17 at around $1080 for the body-only

It DOES point out that people still care big-time about the MOUNT,
and probably the BRAND. I don't think that transfers as much to the
COMPANY, which has no newer models announced, while the competition
is busy getting less expensive cameras out to capture the low-end of
the market, where bew people tend to buy their first DSLR.
philbarton said:
Go Pentax, rah-ra-ra, etc.

Thanks,
Cameron
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
Another negative post from our resident troll. Surprise surprise!

Yet another $ earnt from his employer for spreading yet more FUD?

Go away philbarton, rah-ra-ra etc..
--
Richard Day - 'Carpe Diem!'
Gloucester UK
 
If you go back just two years ago to the gloom and doom here about the future of Pentax, the lack of lenses, etc. etc. and compare those times to the major achievements that Pentax has made, you would have to be pretty much brain dead to not see that Pentax is headed up, not down. The K10D was a shock to the entire industry, coming from nowhere, and from a lowly company like Pentax. Then the K20D with the Samsung CMOS sensor, who would have guessed? Has anyone noticed how Sigma and others are now making some nice glass for Pentax? Are they doing this because they think Pentax is in decline? And for those that don't realize the power of Samsung, a quick Wikipedia will clear your doubts in a heartbeat.

In conclusion, there are those here that just like to kick Pentax around, deny the truth, avoid the facts and generally attempt to paint a picture much different from reality. I have no idea what they hope to gain, maybe some self recognition as being ignorant and uninformed? They say it "takes all kinds" to make the world turn, I guess there is truth in that too.
--
'This is more serious than I thought.....but it is still fun!
http://www.pbase.com/rupertdog Take a look- It's Free!
 
Rupert60 said:
Has anyone noticed how Sigma and others are now making some
nice glass for Pentax?
Click to expand...
Not so much Sigma, who've been doing most of their glass in PK mount for quite a few years now, but the interesting thing is that Tamron have started doing PK mount for their top glass (e.g. 17-50 f/2.8) within the last year. Don't think they'd bother with R&D for another mount if they thought Pentax / Samsung wasn't getting somewhere.

Tokina, IIRC, is owned by Pentax's parent, Hoya, so their products are integrated with the Pentax line anyway - some appear to be re-badged as Pentax (or vice-versa), though the Pentax versions appear slightly better in some tests, possibly due to coatings.
 
AlexMonro said:
Tokina, IIRC, is owned by Pentax's parent, Hoya, so their products
are integrated with the Pentax line anyway - some appear to be
re-badged as Pentax (or vice-versa), though the Pentax versions
appear slightly better in some tests, possibly due to coatings.
Click to expand...
I believe that this is nothing but a myth. The Hoya/Tokina misunderstanding seem to stem from the fact that they share distributor in the US and that Tokina assemblems (some?) Hoyas filters.
 
You know, I though I posted something but could not find it.
I was starting to question my memory.

--
Best regards
Nick
 
philbarton said:
As to DPREVIEW - obviously some of the Pentax adherents have figured
out that you can just click and click and click on that review, and
your "vote" (because that's what it's become) gets counted over and
over. They would have to log clicks by user to deny duplicates, and
I think anyone, member or not, can click on the K20D review (but not
participate in the forums). That would require tracking cookies to
deny repeated clicks.

The current click-share of course becomes the equivalent of a "rigged
election".
Click to expand...
Stating as fact that denying log clicks from duplicates is something less than effortless is incorrect, and actually shows a bit too much behind your curtain.

You don't have to log clicks or do anything effortful to prevent mass clicks from a single IP address.

Ever set up a site with money earning click-throughs? . There's a reason why you can't sit at home and click away and earn thousands of hit dollars hitting your own site.

Jeez.
 
yesman12 said:
You know, I though I posted something but could not find it.
I was starting to question my memory.
Click to expand...
I think I posted something too and I can't remember what it was. Couldn't have been anything interesting, as I never post anything interesting, but still...
--
Shooting since '59 and still waiting for a keeper
 
philbarton said:
Cameron R Hood said:
Maybe I shouldn't say anything, but rarely has a Pentax review not
been preempted by one of the big guns postings within a few hours,
and hits on the K20D review are through the roof. I hope this helps
Pentax a lot, because now, for the first time in many years, they
deserve all the praise they get. They've made an amazing comeback
recently, have some incredible cameras and lenses out now, and I
really do think they are offering some really unique niche products
that no other company is covering. IQ over megapixels, even though
they are now actually ahead in the megapixel race. Superb fixed-focal
length lenses, teeny and light, good on them, man!

Now for the full-frame pro model, which would be icing on the cake,
and REALLY attract some new people into the fold. A new shutter
system would really help get their fps rate up, which really is
pretty much the only thing holding them back now.
Click to expand...
====================

I actually got a huge laugh out of this whole "stats" thing, which
must be causing a headache for the DPREVIEW staff about now. It
points out that ANY brand's legacy owners could do the same thing, > if
they chose to.
Click to expand...
The spin doctor at work again. In one sentence you manage to say that the stats are meaningless (I actually agree) and then turn around and make the implication that it's the Pentax legacy owners creating the stats. And again no evidence or proof.
philbarton said:
GREAT that Pentax still has a following - my difference, personally,
is that I want Pentax to do MORE than they've done so far - but I'm
convinced it's a vain hope, as they don't have the market share or
financing to compete except as a niche catering to PK owners. I > have
no idea how they plan to expand share in a ferociously competitive
market for the move-ups from P&S, since they never had a "starter"
megazoom camera of their own, as all of the others do.

As to DPREVIEW - obviously some of the Pentax adherents have figured
out that you can just click and click and click on that review, and
your "vote" (because that's what it's become) gets counted over and
over. They would have to log clicks by user to deny duplicates, and
I think anyone, member or not, can click on the K20D review (but not
participate in the forums). That would require tracking cookies to
deny repeated clicks.
Click to expand...
Any proof or even evidence for this accusation?

...

Yes thought not. Again baseless claims, you have done better than this Phil. Normally your FUD is a bit better disguised than this.
 
How does it feel to be widely regarded as the biggest moron on DPReview?

Hope someone is paying you enough to prostitute your personal integrity - or are you just cheap?
philbarton said:
I actually got a huge laugh out of this whole "stats" thing, which
must be causing a headache for the DPREVIEW staff about now. It
points out that ANY brand's legacy owners could do the same thing, if
they chose to.

GREAT that Pentax still has a following - my difference, personally,
is that I want Pentax to do MORE than they've done so far - but I'm
convinced it's a vain hope, as they don't have the market share or
financing to compete except as a niche catering to PK owners. I have
no idea how they plan to expand share in a ferociously competitive
market for the move-ups from P&S, since they never had a "starter"
megazoom camera of their own, as all of the others do.

As to DPREVIEW - obviously some of the Pentax adherents have figured
out that you can just click and click and click on that review, and
your "vote" (because that's what it's become) gets counted over and
over. They would have to log clicks by user to deny duplicates, and
I think anyone, member or not, can click on the K20D review (but not
participate in the forums). That would require tracking cookies to
deny repeated clicks.

The current click-share of course becomes the equivalent of a "rigged
election".

Statistically, even though the K20D's individual share is 10.3%, the
BRAND share still lags the "majors" by a huge amount - that's because
they have more models, and newer models, of interest to the general
buying public. At some point it will return to normal (after a lag
of about 7 days after the mass-clicking stops), and Pentax (the
brand) will be around 3 percent, as it always was.

I have to wonder if all this hubbub is actually creating K20D sales?
Amazon has not raised its prices, and that tells me there's been no
real impact, or money flowing to Pentax on account of it.

Here's the best-sellers Amazon listing for DSLR's:

http://www.amazon.com/gp/bestsellers/electronics/3017941/ref=pd_ts_e_nav

K200D is at number 13, as I'd expect - a good deal for the bucks
w/lens @ $657

K20D is at number 17 at around $1080 for the body-only

It DOES point out that people still care big-time about the MOUNT,
and probably the BRAND. I don't think that transfers as much to the
COMPANY, which has no newer models announced, while the competition
is busy getting less expensive cameras out to capture the low-end of
the market, where bew people tend to buy their first DSLR.
Click to expand...
--
Steve
When I can master technique I'll be a photographer.
When I can realise a vision I'll be an artist.
When I get paid I'll be a professional.
 
My prevous response challanging phill's lack of logic was deleted into Orwellian space.

I am amazed at how consistenly vehement he is with really specious arguments.

If in fact the site counts each click from the same user as unique, and assuming that Pentax fan boys are loading the votes, the Canon fan club, which is probably 5-10x size of the Pentax "fan boys" will be also be loading the site by an order of magnitude greater than Pentax.
--
Best regards
Nick
 
We will see how long it takes my thread to get deleted/me to gat banned.

Franklly I dont care any more. If cretins like PhilBarton can post with impunity and the rest of us are censored then I for one will take my interest elsewhere. It people like him who make the internet worthless for anyone looking for real information.

The only people who suffer in the end are people who rely on review sites. Pretty soon the internet will be a waste of time because it is rapidly becoming a vehicle for viral negative publicity which is pernicious and extremely effective, and which is being sponsored by major companies.

If DPReview is not alert to this threat, it will become a joke like most forums on the internet.
yesman12 said:
My prevous response challanging phill's lack of logic was deleted
into Orwellian space.

I am amazed at how consistenly vehement he is with really specious
arguments.

If in fact the site counts each click from the same user as unique,
and assuming that Pentax fan boys are loading the votes, the Canon
fan club, which is probably 5-10x size of the Pentax "fan boys" will
be also be loading the site by an order of magnitude greater than
Pentax.
--
Best regards
Nick
Click to expand...
--
Steve
When I can master technique I'll be a photographer.
When I can realise a vision I'll be an artist.
When I get paid I'll be a professional.
 
Pentax and Tokina do work together on some lenses, and there is a possiblity that Hoya sells Tokina glass but that's it....
--
360 minutes from the prime meridian. (-5375min, 3.55sec) 1093' above sea level.

'The exposure meter is calibrated to some clearly defined standards and the user needs to adjust his working method and his subject matter to these values. It does not help to suppose all kinds of assumptions that do not exist.'
Erwin Puts
 
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