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Camera Shake

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Loren:

In my reply to Ann, I noted that this DLS repaired camera is not my original. And it seems to me that my original with DLS was sharper. Like these ones:
http://www.imagestation.com/album/?id=4291993821&p=4259528968&idx=6
http://www.imagestation.com/album/?id=4291993821&p=4259528906&idx=8

Conversely, the posted photo of the group on the outcrop was taken on a very bright day with very dull bright rocks in the background, so I'm at a loss for the cause. Is it user error or camera error. I now have my original camera back, DLS fixed, and I will be testing it.

As a side note, I took many photos this past weekend with scene mode on landscape and the images appear sharper - but still not as sharp as I expected. Are my expectations to high? Shay's view is that I'm at the limit that the CCD can resolve, and I can live with that. I just want to make sure I don't start out with less sharpness than I should. Thanks for your input. I'll post a few more photo tonight.
Regards
...Wes
Loren Charif said:
I don't see how it could be camera shake unless your shutter is
staying open longer than the stated speed; theoretically, assuming
your camera's shutter is accurate, if you use 1/250 (as an
example), you should be able to move the camera at 1/251 and not
have it show up in the shot.

Loren
Ann McRae said:
Mine has just been id'ed as having DLS. I do not think I am going
to fix it. Did you get yours fixed in Calgary or have to ship it?

And do you think that your camera issues now are maybe due to the fix?

Ann
--
Canadian Ann
http://www.pbase.com/canadian_ann
http://www.stfchallenge.com
http://www.cs.duke.edu/~parr/photography/faq.html
Click to expand...
--
http://www.pbase.com/lorenbc/
Click to expand...
 
Thank you for this information. I will have to investigate the warranty and what service is available in Edmonton. Nice to hear that Sony Canada is good to deal with. Unfortunately, I've owned mine for 5 months so think I am outside the warranty period.

Ann
Wes said:
Ann:
I had both cameras repaired for DLS by a Sony Service tech in
northeast Calgary. I drive over on my lunch breaks and talk
directly with the Sony tech. I'll try to keep this short. My
original camera had DLS and I sent it for repair. When lens block
assembly was found to be on back order, they simply gave me a new
camera. The replacement camera had severe DLS. I got my original
camera back and the replacement waited for the new lens block.
When it was fixed, I got the replacement for testing. I found the
nightshot/nightframing no longer worked, so back for fixing. It is
with the fixed replacement camera that I seem to have a lack of
sharpness. Now, my original has been repaired for DLS and they
swapped me back so I can test it. I will keep the one that I am
happy with, so that's why I'm seeking all this input from STFers.
I will be testing my fixed original over the week and need to make
a decision by then. I would like to point out that Sony Canada has
been outstanding in their service and when all is said and done,
they should be experts on replacing the lens block. I was amazed
at all the calibration and internal settings that they have control
over that don't show up in the menus that you and I are allowed to
see. For example, on the fixed replacement the LCD and EVF were
quite "washed out" compared to my original. It seems that when
they plug the 707 into their computers, they have total control
over contrast and brightness - essentially, they define "normal".
Regards
...Wes
PS. I would like to point out that I have stopped taking sky
photos though!! DLS is completely eliminated, don't even have any
vignetting!
Click to expand...
--
Canadian Ann
http://www.pbase.com/canadian_ann
http://www.stfchallenge.com
http://www.cs.duke.edu/~parr/photography/faq.html
 
Shay:

May I clarify - do you thing that this photo could have been in better focus? Your earlier reply, left me thinking it was as good as I might expect.
Regards
...Wes
Shay Stephens said:
The rocks will be sharp. The aperture was F4 and the photo was
taken from a distance so the DOF would be big enough to capture the
rocks as well as the people in focus.

I very rarely get a badly focused shot so cannot really give you
any suggestions on what the problem may be. Generic advice would
be to half press with the subject in the brackets and then
reviewing the shot after it has been taken, zoomed all the way in,
to verify focus.

--
Shay

My Sony F707 Gallery: http://www.shaystephens.com/portfolio.asp
Click to expand...
 
Ann:

Actually we Canadians have an advantage there...we have a one year warranty, not 90 days. Don't ask me why, it's just goofy.
Regards
...Wes
Ann McRae said:
Ann
Wes said:
Ann:
I had both cameras repaired for DLS by a Sony Service tech in
northeast Calgary. I drive over on my lunch breaks and talk
directly with the Sony tech. I'll try to keep this short. My
original camera had DLS and I sent it for repair. When lens block
assembly was found to be on back order, they simply gave me a new
camera. The replacement camera had severe DLS. I got my original
camera back and the replacement waited for the new lens block.
When it was fixed, I got the replacement for testing. I found the
nightshot/nightframing no longer worked, so back for fixing. It is
with the fixed replacement camera that I seem to have a lack of
sharpness. Now, my original has been repaired for DLS and they
swapped me back so I can test it. I will keep the one that I am
happy with, so that's why I'm seeking all this input from STFers.
I will be testing my fixed original over the week and need to make
a decision by then. I would like to point out that Sony Canada has
been outstanding in their service and when all is said and done,
they should be experts on replacing the lens block. I was amazed
at all the calibration and internal settings that they have control
over that don't show up in the menus that you and I are allowed to
see. For example, on the fixed replacement the LCD and EVF were
quite "washed out" compared to my original. It seems that when
they plug the 707 into their computers, they have total control
over contrast and brightness - essentially, they define "normal".
Regards
...Wes
PS. I would like to point out that I have stopped taking sky
photos though!! DLS is completely eliminated, don't even have any
vignetting!
Click to expand...
--
Canadian Ann
http://www.pbase.com/canadian_ann
http://www.stfchallenge.com
http://www.cs.duke.edu/~parr/photography/faq.html
Click to expand...
 
Shay Stephens said:
The rocks will be sharp. The aperture was F4 and the photo was
taken from a distance so the DOF would be big enough to capture the
rocks as well as the people in focus.
Click to expand...
OK, your right. He was far away enough to have to group also in focus.
Shay Stephens said:
I very rarely get a badly focused shot so cannot really give you
any suggestions on what the problem may be. Generic advice would
be to half press with the subject in the brackets and then
reviewing the shot after it has been taken, zoomed all the way in,
to verify focus.
Click to expand...
The point to me is not that the camera have problems to focus some times. I have also the say, that happens mostly on macro shots. I had the same with my Canon SLR. But there I just switch to manual focus and that's it. On the DA (on every digital except DSLR) there is no way to really focus manual in my eyes. The DA seams to extend to the whole image to focus. Some sort of Sony-AI. :) But sometime it is really bad where I have the stem sharp and the bloom blur altrough I focused on the bloom.

OK, never mind. I used to use this behavier on the DA. :) Just remember my good old Canon SLR. ;)

Detlef
 
OOps, that would be:
Do you think (not do you thing)...
Wes said:
Shay Stephens said:
The rocks will be sharp. The aperture was F4 and the photo was
taken from a distance so the DOF would be big enough to capture the
rocks as well as the people in focus.

I very rarely get a badly focused shot so cannot really give you
any suggestions on what the problem may be. Generic advice would
be to half press with the subject in the brackets and then
reviewing the shot after it has been taken, zoomed all the way in,
to verify focus.

--
Shay

My Sony F707 Gallery: http://www.shaystephens.com/portfolio.asp
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
 
Have you considered using a focus target when doing macros? It helps me. Basically it is a business card sized piece of paper with black vertical lines about 1 mm apart. Place the card where you want the focus, half press and remove the card (you can also switch to manual foces if you will be taking more than one shot) and take the picture.



--
Shay

My Sony F707 Gallery: http://www.shaystephens.com/portfolio.asp
 
You may have been able to get marginally better focus on the people, but not much better. Based on their distance from the lens the subjects are aproaching infinity focus. A closer analysis of the photo shows the focus point may be behind the subjects. What is the intended output of the photo? Will it be printed or viewed on a monitor? The reason I ask is that viewing a photo at 100% is far less satisfying than viewing a printed version or resized version for viewing on a monitor.

Not until the Foveon comes out will we get better 100% viewing size satisfaction with image sharpness.

--
Shay

My Sony F707 Gallery: http://www.shaystephens.com/portfolio.asp
 
Actually ,I'm amazed at the clarity. It appears that each and every face is easily recognizable considering the distance you shot from. The framing would certainly allow for many many more people to be included and recocognized. I added a touch of USM and thought it was marginally better but I still would be very very happy with your results. IMO you would have to spend lots more bucks for a big DSLR to get anything better than that. I think it's a great group image.
John
Shay Stephens said:
You may have been able to get marginally better focus on the
people, but not much better. Based on their distance from the lens
the subjects are aproaching infinity focus. A closer analysis of
the photo shows the focus point may be behind the subjects. What
is the intended output of the photo? Will it be printed or viewed
on a monitor? The reason I ask is that viewing a photo at 100% is
far less satisfying than viewing a printed version or resized
version for viewing on a monitor.

Not until the Foveon comes out will we get better 100% viewing size
satisfaction with image sharpness.

--
Shay

My Sony F707 Gallery: http://www.shaystephens.com/portfolio.asp
Click to expand...
--
Seabee MCPO (ret)
 
Shay Stephens said:
Have you considered using a focus target when doing macros? It
helps me. Basically it is a business card sized piece of paper
with black vertical lines about 1 mm apart. Place the card where
you want the focus, half press and remove the card (you can also
switch to manual foces if you will be taking more than one shot)
and take the picture.
Click to expand...
Thats sounds good. I'll give it a try.

Thanks,
Detlef
 
Hi Wes,

there isn't something like 'camera shake' it's your hands,

Well just buy a fully automatic one, you can send outdoors to get some decent pics, without your interfering.

;-)

jacques

Don't like the saturated colrs go and buy a F505V, well you will not be disapointed, as it is a great tool.
 




Wes,

Rest assured: Your camera has no focusing problem, nor your camera didn't shake. The only problem is you technique of reducing the photo size. Please compare.

Regards, Yehuda
 
Shay Stephens said:
Have you considered using a focus target when doing macros? It
helps me. Basically it is a business card sized piece of paper
with black vertical lines about 1 mm apart. Place the card where
you want the focus, half press and remove the card (you can also
switch to manual foces if you will be taking more than one shot)
and take the picture.



--
Shay

My Sony F707 Gallery: http://www.shaystephens.com/portfolio.asp
Click to expand...
I checked on both the Edmund Scientifics and Edmund Optics websites and couldn't find this card (yes I searched the product numbers). It sure seems like it would be handy to have.
--
Jared

DSC-F707
 
johnD1 said:
Shay Stephens said:
You may have been able to get marginally better focus on the
people, but not much better. Based on their distance from the lens
the subjects are aproaching infinity focus. A closer analysis of
the photo shows the focus point may be behind the subjects. What
is the intended output of the photo? Will it be printed or viewed
on a monitor? The reason I ask is that viewing a photo at 100% is
far less satisfying than viewing a printed version or resized
version for viewing on a monitor.

Not until the Foveon comes out will we get better 100% viewing size
satisfaction with image sharpness.

--
Shay

My Sony F707 Gallery: http://www.shaystephens.com/portfolio.asp
Click to expand...
--
Seabee MCPO (ret)
Click to expand...
I went to a big parade this weekend and was amazed at the clarity and sharpness of the faces in the crowds far outside and away from the target I was shooting. I'm very happy with the 707.
--
Oly C-2100, Sony F-707
http://www.pbase.com/chopper
 
Haven't read the whole thread, Wes, so this has probably been covered. I have some of the same problems. They come from 1. Not waiting for the camera to get its focus 2. Jerking the camera by pressing the shutter too hard. 3. Actual tremor, espcially if I've just done weights or other exercise within an hour or two of shooting. Two out of three are my own darn fault.

Patience, patience, patience.
Wes said:
Hello all.
How much of an issue is camera shake for you folks. I have a lot
of outdoor shots recently that appear to have camera shake. I'm
seriously wondering if I simply move to soon after the shutter
releases - before the image capture is complete. My previous
camera was a fully manual SLR, so I not quite used to shutterlag or
autofocus lag. I assume that once the shutter noise is finished,
the image is captured? I assume that the "recording" banner is
just recording lag and doesn't have anything to do with the image
capture. Any one else dealt with these issues?
Regards
...Wes
Click to expand...
--
Eric
F707
http://www.pbase.com/erichocinc
 
Wow:

Thanks everyone for the great input! I loaded a few more photos with my fixed replacement and they seem pretty darn good for sharpness.
http://www.pbase.com/fenwick/kananaskis

Please bear in mind that I have not post-processed the photos, so there is lots of room for improvement. These photos are simply for examples of clarity. I can do a wack of editing later... Bottom line, I could be happy with this camera. I'll try out my fixed original, and make my choice on the weekend.

Regards
...Wes
 
Thanks Shay. I posted a few more to look at. See thread below.
Regards
...Wes
Shay Stephens said:
You may have been able to get marginally better focus on the
people, but not much better. Based on their distance from the lens
the subjects are aproaching infinity focus. A closer analysis of
the photo shows the focus point may be behind the subjects. What
is the intended output of the photo? Will it be printed or viewed
on a monitor? The reason I ask is that viewing a photo at 100% is
far less satisfying than viewing a printed version or resized
version for viewing on a monitor.

Not until the Foveon comes out will we get better 100% viewing size
satisfaction with image sharpness.

--
Shay

My Sony F707 Gallery: http://www.shaystephens.com/portfolio.asp
Click to expand...
 
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