NEC MultiSync LCD2490WUXi in UK

NEC MultiSync LCD2490WUXi - could anybody tell me if this nec LCD screen is available in the UK please. If so, where and how much does it cost. Nec UK site does not list it.
Thanks

Ausha

It is my understanding that this monitor is not available in Europe. Try the LCD2690WUXi. I have used both the 2490 and 2690 extensively and prefer the 2690, which I own.
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ausha said:

Bill.

Click to expand...

Thanks Bill,

Mind if I ask you how much you paid for the 2690 and where you bought it . Is there a showroom in UK where you can go and have a play.

my 2nd question is, what about the color gamut. I have red in this forum that since the 2690 has a wider color gamut (around92%) even though its good for adobe RGB when photo editing, apparently its poor at handling sRGB such as looking at the internet. It seems the 2690 over saturates the colors and blow out the reds in ordinary gamut files files. Do you have any experience/ comments in this regard??

This is the thread which discuss the issue.

http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1004&message=25042197

Thanks again

Ausha

I'm in the US. The price of the 2690 has decreased here in the US after NEC lowered their prices during the past few weeks. Prior to the reduction, it was about $1,600. After the reduction, it is about $1,200. I paid $1,200. Plus about $175 for Spectraview II.

There is an active thread on the 2690 and sRGB. If you check in the last couple of pages of that thread you will see a post that I made that describes how to use the 2690 with sRGB content. Actually, the link you posted above is the right thread ... go to the last few pages.

Good luck.
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ausha said:

Bill.

Click to expand...

NEC policy in Europe is not so nice wrt US. The basic 2690wuxi is a lower quality version while the spectraview one is the handpicked best. The basic costs more than the US version+SW and you need to (easily done) tweak it for HW calibration. Same for the SW you will have to kind of get an evaluation copy from the European version.

Problems have been reported with the monitor, which should be solved from a given series (so check the serial number). Dead/stuck pixels in the wuxi ... since the faultless panel goe to the spectraview. US gets a much better treatment then EU here.

All in all ... I gave it up and got an equivalent Eizo (which I adhore). I found the NEC a brilliant monitor but a bit too much of an hassle for a problem free and its tweaking in Europe, when for sensibly less than the spetraview I got myself a CG241w. Hassle free great quality. A bit less sideview angle, but amazingly better blacks!

Francesco

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webpage: http://www.thefoodtraveller.com/blog

fpessolano said:

NEC policy in Europe is not so nice wrt US. The basic 2690wuxi is a
lower quality version while the spectraview one is the handpicked
best. The basic costs more than the US version+SW and you need to
(easily done) tweak it for HW calibration. Same for the SW you will
have to kind of get an evaluation copy from the European version.

Click to expand...

Both the US and the EU version of Spectraview comes with a certification. The Multisync is not a "low quality version". I'm in Norway and have had two of the Mulityncs standing on my desk at some time. Both flawless. If you have ANY hard evidence that says the multisyncs are a "low quality version", I suggest present it. I've never heard of such, though I've heard many "general claims" that didn't have any root in reality. Only hearsay from forums. I hope you can prove not to be one of them.

WhateverNickname said:

Problems have been reported with the monitor, which should be solved
from a given series (so check the serial number). Dead/stuck pixels
in the wuxi ... since the faultless panel goe to the spectraview. US
gets a much better treatment then EU here.

Click to expand...

There have been one problem with an early batch of screens in EU and thats some sound issues originating from the power supply. Those issues have been fixed long ago and it only affected an early batch.

If you speak of dead/stuck pixels, that can happen to all panels. Dead pixels usually originates due to a dead transistor, which a panel have millions of. As far as I know, there are no super transistors out there and pixels can die even by transport or after you came home with it. Lots of the common errors that you get with LCD's, you get with the Eizo's too. If you want proof, go into the german version prad.de's forum. Use an online translator if you don't speak german. I've even read about Eizo CG210's with dead pixels.

Eizo have good quality, but don't paint them to be "the major company that always deliver the highest quality". Their CG221 is one of the best screens you can get for color critical tasks. I can't speak for the CG24W yet, since it pretty new, but all their other S-PVA models are seriously flawed. Left side is notisably brighter then right and this is unacceptable for anything passed as high quality. I was shocked seeing the CE240W. The early batch of 2690WUXi had a defective power supply that gave out noise, but the Eizo CE's and Flexscans have a defective panel. At least NEC fixed the issues and thats more to say about quality control then the continuening problems with the Eizo's.

Take a look at this (from the new Eizo FlexScan HD2441W):

Image taken straight view center:
http://www.toastyx.net/hd2441w/eizo-color-shifting.jpg

Image taken compared to the 2690WUXi straight view center:
http://www.toastyx.net/hd2441w/eizo-color-shifting.jpg

Posted by Toastyx@Hardforum:
http://www.hardforum.com/showpost.php?p=1031371458&postcount=58

Yes, you can get a descent calibration with a descent DeltaE, but since it also have imageshifts even at center view, you can't trust the colors. To pay money for an Eizo S-PVA is a big waste of money IMO. You get all the problems of S-PVA, but a slightly higher accuracy then the Dell 2407WFP to an extreme price premium. I agree if you argue that the image shifts and the left side vs. right is not a defect per say, but rather a "panel weakness". Still, if I had no knowledge of panel types and just bought an Eizo S-PVA for $$$$, I would have sent it back thinking I got a defect one. I've read in forums about people asking how to calibrate these issues away...

WhateverNickname said:

All in all ... I gave it up and got an equivalent Eizo (which I
adhore). I found the NEC a brilliant monitor but a bit too much of an
hassle for a problem free and its tweaking in Europe, when for
sensibly less than the spetraview I got myself a CG241w. Hassle free
great quality. A bit less sideview angle, but amazingly better blacks!

Click to expand...

Though I disagree on you above, I am still able to be happy on your behalf for getting a screen you are satisfied with. I haven't seen the CG241W yet and there is also little reports on it, so I can't argue how equivalent it is to the NEC.

But, I can say that I live in Europe, have had two 2690WUXi without any flaws, was the one who figured out how to LUT calibrate the EU units with Spectraview profiler and can safely recommend this to others. Its hazzle free, have a great quality, excelent image consistency and viewing angles, decent blacks, but not as great as the CG241W I can imaginge. Blacks are the only advantage with S-PVA's IMO, though most models with S-PVA have an annoying black crush. I've heard good about the Eizo's S-PVA in this regard though.

I've got two questions about the CG241W if you don't mind:

I've read it has "Digital Uniformity Compensation" which is kinda like the colorcomp found in the 2690WUXi. Does it compensate properly for the left side/right side problems found in the other Eizo S-PVA's?

I've also read here in this very forum that someone had eyeballed the CG241W and it also have the S-PVA image shifts, especially in dark colors. Can you confirm/deny this? The shifts is a dealbreaker for many I know and all of them would prefer a cluster of dead pixels instead. Its less intrusive then an unstable image.

"The one thing I did not like and which betrayed its PVA nature was a definite shifting of the deepest shadow tones with even a small-to-moderate shift of the head away from center. Most tones were quite stable, but, if I focused attention on the darkest visible stop, I could make detail become visible or wink out to black with only 3-4" of head movement. Since noone else has complained about this, I assume that most people are pretty good about staying in the sweet spot, at least when viewing shadow tones critically."
http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/readflat.asp?forum=1004&thread=25191185

First of all ... I think you took something too hard. I am not for Eizo, NEC or whatever. Today I took eizo, tomorrow could be anything else. Now ...

Well, Multisync is simply an 2690 which after factory calibration is hand picked to be below the target for the spectraview. It does not mean it is bad quality, but it means that people in US get better pannel (occasionally) than a multisync. Just go and check on your certificate and compare witha spectraview and you will see a difference in tollerances. So Multisync are A panels and spectraview are A+.
I see no claim from my side saying the 2690 is bad quality.

Again, I also stated problems are solved (or so they say) form a given serial number and I could not bother go picking like many have reported on the web. Despite being solved, it will take an year or so to remove the current stock of defected parts.

Regarding the Eizo. YEe, I was concerned with it being PVA. The shift on the CG241w is there, but only when I move myself a lot in one of the direction and I do not with my head but with my entire body (e.g. standing on it). It does loose some contrast but the colors stay still rather fine and the blacks are simply always amazing.
Honestly, I saw many IPS and this is only slight worse in this respect.

Colors are simply whow and the blacks superior to any IPS I have seen so far. The gradient is impressive ... sometimes I feel (when watching a movie or phtos) that it is coming out of the screen. PErsistance for movies and games is quite nice. Looking forward to upgrade to a xbox360 ...

Backlight extremely good. (both measured and perceived).

Again, I believe that the cg241w and the 2690 are BOTH great monitors. In US I would have taken the NEC, but in Europe ... well, I did not feel like paying for the spectraview for the handpicked panel or risking to get an old defected multysync.

BTW HW calibration works pretty well.

--
Francesco

PS: BTW I guess you are the same tamlin on hardforum and your posts also contributed to my choice

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webpage: http://www.thefoodtraveller.com/blog

WhateverNickname said:

I see no claim from my side saying the 2690 is bad quality.

Click to expand...

Your argumentation about the "hazzle", "lower quality", "Dead/stuck pixels in the wuxi..." vs. " Hassle free great quality. A bit less sideview angle, but amazingly better blacks!" for the CG241W seemed to me like it was a quality issue and you wished to present the CG241W as a screen where you cannot face quality issues. If I'm mistaken by this, then you have my apology.

My point was that every manufacturer have manufacturing faults and quality issues. For all we know, there might be a long thread of reports on sound issues on the CG241W @ prad.de after it have been in the marked a little longer. It is fairly new and there are little reports about it yet, good or bad. This is also why I am a bit more humble about commenting on the CG241W, since I know too little about it besides the specs. Therefore I also wanted to exclude it from the rest of the Eizo S-PVA's.

Personally, I think that the Spectraview models are selected from all the models before shipment. Not preselected and certified after production. I can't see from the two 2690WUXi's I had on my desk could be improved by getting a Spectraview version either.

I have no loyalty to NEC (besides the screen I only have a NEC dvd burner) and my post about how to enable Spectraview on EU screens should prove that. But, I have tested the 2690WUXi extensively and know what it can do, so I can easily recommend it. Just as you feel with the CG241W.

Though I went out hard on the S-PVA panels here, I was stating an inherit flaw. Just as TN's, they have their image consistency problems. The CG241W might be improved in that matter or so I hope. You ask me if I took something hard, but I don't. I have a passion for technology, so I'm not totally cold, but its only machinery. For what its worth, if S-PVA surpasses IPS technology, I'd probably get one myself and if I can't afford it at that moment, I'd be first in line to recommend it at least.

WhateverNickname said:

PS: BTW I guess you are the same tamlin on hardforum and your posts
also contributed to my choice

Click to expand...

That I am. Tamlin is my internet nick, though I sometimes use Tamlin_WSGF as a habit since I'm obviously not the only one who uses Tamlin. Since you're happy with your purchase, I'm glad I had some contributions to it.

I don't care what screen a person ends up with (I'm not going to be the one using it anyway), but I like it to be an educated choice he made first, so there's no suprises. At least not any bad suprises.

Problems are everywhere.

Technology is my work and I am the first to say that it is all about trade offs. IPS is better in certain things (e.g. viewing angle) and MPA in others (e.g. black levels). TN for games. But differences in the first two are blurring as samsung starts rolling out the new PVA panels.

I feel NEC policy in europe is rather poor as puts off potential buyers like me towards others.

Not that Eizo is perfect, the S and CE lines have defects in their back lighting which some people (like me) feel disturbing. Luckily the CG not.

Again, it is about luck. I own a mac and I am the first to say ... gosh it is surely not perfect (while most will say the opposite). I wish things would be different, but again ... from an insider, it cannot be :-(

Francesco

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webpage: http://www.thefoodtraveller.com/blog

In Norway, consumer protection is rather strong, so its not a problem regardless of display. In any case you can send the screen back, no questions asked, before the first 14 days. If they don't include a return form for people who might regret, its expanded to a year (they didn't include one for me btw.). NEC have a 2 working days exchange policy on the place, so if faults warrant a replacement, they send you one and you send the defective back. Repairs are within 7 days. http://www.nec-display-solutions.no/coremedia/generator/index,realm=Service__Guarantee__Details,spec=x__no__no,solutionId=,docId=291658

This is for 3 years "only" in Norway, but the warranty includes backlight fully.

I have a question for you regarding Eizo warranty. I'm a bit puzzled here.

In Norway, the Eizo's have a "5 years warranty". But this warranty is only valid if the display has been used for less then 30 000 hours. After that warranty is void. The same goes with backlight, but here you only have 10 000 hours and after that, warranty is void. Displays count hours as long as it is on, so if not to count hours, you need to turn it completely off. Suspend doesn't help usually (this I've seen from all the service menu's I've encountered, so I assume its so with the Eizo's as well). The same policy goes for Eizo in US:

"1The usage time is limited to 30,000 hours or less, and the warranty period of the LCD panel and backlight is limited to three years from the date of purchase. The warranty period of the backlight is warranted only if the monitor is used within the recommended brightness of up to and including 120 cd/m2 with a color temperature between 5,000 K – 6,500 K and limited to three years from the date of purchase subject to the usage time being less than or equal to 10,000 hours."
http://www.eizo.com/products/graphics/cg241w/spec.asp

So, if backlight is failing after 10 000 hours, you are without warranty. You only have that warranty to begin with if you have used the display with a brightness @ 120 cd/m2 or below and a color temperature @ 6500K or below. If you have used higher temperature or brightness, you have no warranty (though you can probably lie about it if the screen doesn't log your OSD selections. It does log your hour use).

Is this the warranty you got presented as well?

Those are the terms. Not sure about the stand-by and I am enquiring Eizo about it ... in the worst case I will switch it off instead of standby. Not a big issue anyway.

I believe that 10000 is 1.5 years always on, which when stand-by is not included (or I turn it off otherwise) would mean more than 3 years for my kind of usage. This was what I calculated.

Anyway, knowing EU laws it would be easy to force Eizo into considering stand-by time.

Thanks for the stand-by tip ... it seems every manufacturer likes to play with these things.

Francesco

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webpage: http://www.thefoodtraveller.com/blog

I edited this post for simplicity. Good, it seems some countries do not want to bother with the fact that not loggin stad-by will incur into loosing against a warranty complain in EU. So I guess Eizo Norway would have to do the same if pushed.
From the benelux site of Eizo:

"The warranty applies to all equipment supplied in the Benelux. It covers failure of the backlight and extends to either five years or 30,000 operating hours, whichever is sooner. (At a normal office, however, a total of 30,000 operating hours will not be reached within a period of five years. Assuming that the equipment is used eight hours a day, five days a week, and 52 weeks a year, that would take more than 14 years.)"

Francesco

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webpage: http://www.thefoodtraveller.com/blog

I took a search over the different Eizo's in Europe and it seems that they have different standards. Sweden, which is also an EU country, states this for the CG241W:

"5-års garanti
CG241W har Eizo:s unika fem (5) års garanti.

LCD panelen garanteras i tre år eller 10,000 timmar, vilket kommer först, från inköpsdatum (vid en maximal ljusstyrka av 100cd/m² med 5000 - 6500K)"

translated:

5-years warranty
CG241W have Eizo:s unique five (5) years warranty.

The LCD panel have a warranty of three years or 10,000 hours, whatever comes first, from the date of purchase (with a maximum brightness of 100!!! cd/m2 with 5000-6500K)
http://www.eizo.se/eizo/smpage.fwx?smlanguage=SWE&page=189&PRODUCT=1637

Here they have defined what limits you can operate the screen within for warranty to be valid. They can refuse any warranty claim if you operate the screen outside those borders by law (though they might not in practical terms unless you meet a cranky person at customer support). In theory, you can turn the brightness up to 120 cd/m2 and should you be unlucky enough for backlight to fail at that moment, your warranty is void.

I'm not sure which warranty that is valid for UK. I got redirected to Eizo.com. If the OP is evaluating this screen and descides to contact Eizo UK about warranty, I'd appriciate if he could post Eizo's response here!

for me is 30000 hours or 5 years for every component. Confirmed by Eizo Benelux.
--
Francesco

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webpage: http://www.thefoodtraveller.com/blog

Thanks! It seems like Eizo Benelux have their own warranty. Did they mention anything about the operation limits? It seems like most of the other countries have a limitation of brightness and colortemp that the screen needs to be operated within for the warranty to be valid. Here's Eizo France, which also have the same limitation as Sweden (except Sweden have a max luminance of 100 cd/m2 before warranty is void):

"1Le temps d'utilisation est limité à 30.000 heures ou moins et la période de garantie de la dalle LCD et du rétro-éclairage est limitée à 3 ans à partir de la date d'achat. La période de garantie du backlight est garanti seulement si le moniteur est utilisé à la luminosité de 120 cd/m² inclus et une température de couleur qui oscille entre 5,000 K et 6,500 K et limité à trois ans à partir de la date d'achat sujet au temps d'utilisation inférieur ou égal à 10,000 hours."
http://www.eizo.fr/products/graphics/cg241w/spec.asp

Babelfish translated:

"The time of use is limited to 30.000 hours or less and the period of guarantee of flagstone LCD and retro-lighting is limited to 3 years starting from the date of purchase. The period of guarantee of the backlight is guaranteed only if the monitor is used with the luminosity of 120 cd/m² included and a temperature of color which oscillates between 5,000 K and 6,500 K and is limited to three years starting from the date of purchase prone to the time of use lower or equal to 10,000 hours"

Tamlin_WSGF said:

Image taken compared to the 2690WUXi straight view center:
http://www.toastyx.net/hd2441w/eizo-color-shifting.jpg

Click to expand...

Tamlin,

I've been agonizing about the choice between the two for quite a while and this side-by-side comparison cuts it for me (I'm going with the Nec). I read also most of your 2690 writeups (and the SV discovery) - they helped in my decision process too.
Many thanks!

Now fingers crossed so that I get a good instance

Cheers,
Richard

The rest is the same, but again I have at at 90 ... before was at 100 and it was too bright.

Also 6500 is the max (most people tend to go lower down to 5000 for pre-press) to be used for professional color calibration which the Eizo is targeting so in a way it is saying that above 6500/120 the monitor is also being used kind of out of specs for the intended use.

Francesco

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webpage: http://www.thefoodtraveller.com/blog

Good choice.

They are both good monitors and honestly I did not see the color shift being so bad on mine. But again I have a CG with a different back lighting which probably helps a lot.

Francesco

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webpage: http://www.thefoodtraveller.com/blog

rixo said:

rixo said:

Image taken compared to the 2690WUXi straight view center:
http://www.toastyx.net/hd2441w/eizo-color-shifting.jpg

Click to expand...

Tamlin,

I've been agonizing about the choice between the two for quite a
while and this side-by-side comparison cuts it for me (I'm going with
the Nec). I read also most of your 2690 writeups (and the SV
discovery) - they helped in my decision process too.
Many thanks!

Now fingers crossed so that I get a good instance

Cheers,
Richard

Click to expand...

You're welcome! The 2690 is easy to recommend. Here's a good indepth review of it as well:

http://www.prad.de/en/monitore/review/2007/review-nec-lcd2690wuxi.html#Introduction

As with all screens, and in spirit of all the warranty talk here, always make sure you get good return options regardless of what screen you buy. You are never safe, so you need to make sure you have good consumer rights!

The picture you looked at from toastyx,I posted the same twice by mistake, but I assume you ment this one:
http://www.toastyx.net/hd2441w/eizo-nec-center.jpg

This illustrates very good the Eizo S-PVA's compared to IPS based screens. But, I don't know if this is a good illustration for the CG241W, since its the first Eizo S-PVA with "Digital Uniformity Compensation" and Francesco states its not so extreme.

The CG uses a different panel form the HD, CE and S series. I checked.
Based on Eizo history, I would guess CG had Eizo specified panels.

In the end the 2690 is supposed to be on par with the CG ... so it makes sense to compare these two (instead of the HD or S series). The CE240 is obsolete (CE241 already out in japan) so cannot be used for comparison as well.

Specific to the pic from toasty ... I tried myself and I see no appreciable shift. From the photos it seems related to the problem of the HD/S/CE which seem to have left side back lighting unbalanced (with CE having even gamma shift due to the old panel)

Anyway, to me a faultless 2690 or a faultless 241w are comparable. The others are not.

And check how to unlock the HW calibration!!!

Francesco

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webpage: http://www.thefoodtraveller.com/blog