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Can't wait for the E-3 fun to begin
- Thread starter smokeyjoe
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Raist3d
Guest
Olympus is cheaper. At least in the USA, the dual kit lens e-510 is an unbeatable value. I don't know what's wrong with you. I understand in the UK it is also a great deal. You get superb lenses, superb coverage, IS, reliablity (pixel mapping, dust buster), incredible resolution, a speedy camera.
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Clint is on holiday! Soon to return! ;-)
Raist3d
Photographer & Tools/Systems/Gui Vid Games Programmer
Rriley
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carman3uk
Well-known member
The price of chips is largely due to their size. A silicon wafer of a standard size will have a fairly consisent number of defects. 1 defect = 1 dud chip. This is simple arithmetic. The larger the chip the higher the reject percentage.
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The older I get the better I used to be!
Michael Meissner
Forum Pro
Currently that is the case, though there are persistant rumors that the next Nikon pro body will have a 1.1x crop factor instead of 1.5x.
DougJGreen
Senior Member
In fact, these rumors are so persistent that they preceded the D2X introduction as well. And we saw how accurate they were at that time.
Rriley
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to be more specific
a wafer might have 40 defects, enabling many more successful small chips than larger 35mm chips. Typically they get 1 or 2, 35mm chips per wafer (10 of those were duds), in the same circumstance 32 4/3rds chips, 14 APS C chips. The wafer cost is of course the same
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Riley
real men get zippo haircuts
John Ellis
Senior Member
Are you saying the FF lenses are better at no distortion or the Oly's? I am not sure by your post. Anyway, makes no difference to me. My wife and I do mainly birds, and light equipment is a must for us old geezers. Here is a short series from Shenandoah with these two lenses, the 90-250 and 300/2.8:
http://wingsnthings07.blogspot.com/2007/06/june-2007_26.html
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John Ellis
http://wingsnthings07.blogspot.com/2007/06/june-2007_26.html
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John Ellis
Rriley
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better than this ?
this is from an 11mm wide zoom, 22mm EFL
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Riley
real men get zippo haircuts
Is there no way for you to import or perhaps take a vacation to the mainland and bring one back to the UK?
I did not hear a lot of complaints about price differences between Germany and the US, for example.Edward Rauschkolb
Senior Member
Hi J
between the 11-22, 7-14 and the upcoming E3 (EP-1?), + incredible offerings from Pan/Leica I am absolutely in heaven about dSLR's (not to mention my "obsolete" E1)
combined with the M8 + CV wides & WATE for more "serious/relaxed" photos, I have never been so satisfied with digital,
but what do I know. . .
lol
Ed R
between the 11-22, 7-14 and the upcoming E3 (EP-1?), + incredible offerings from Pan/Leica I am absolutely in heaven about dSLR's (not to mention my "obsolete" E1)
combined with the M8 + CV wides & WATE for more "serious/relaxed" photos, I have never been so satisfied with digital,
but what do I know. . .
lol
Ed R
Indeed they have this but:
Weather seal not preventing heavy rain story of the boat to Antarctica all or almost all canons died incl MarkII's.
Dust busting effectiveness 10%
No 100% viewfinder view
DR range lower than E-3
No Oly colours
Shutterlife 100.000 vs 150.000 of the E-3
Live view refreshing frame rates can be slower not sure of this.
E-3 Fastest AF don't know if this is true
Ok everyone that can look through marketing will know these things.
For long Olympus keep producing smaller SLR's with their great lenses they will continue.
It's like buying an Ipod it will be love on the first sight looking better you will show you will be better off with other brands.
That was with me otherwise i had bought 350D happy I didn't
B
Barry Fitzgerald
Guest
Of course, its not all one way. Would be damn boring for all of us if it was.
But....some areas are yet to be seen.
DR better? Fastest in world AF?
If Oly deliver on the hype, and price it at a sensible level, it could do damage..maybe.
If they dont..well, we shall see.
When is this E3 meant to be out anyway?
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Clint is on holiday! Soon to return! ;-)
gnarayan
Senior Member
Oh my god all you children at it again measuring crop factors and pixel pitches like primary school boys measuring the lengths of their... cricket bats.
Seriously, if you want to whine about high noise in smaller sensors there is plenty you can do to get it down. The chips that are going on the GIGAPIXEL camera for the PanSTARRS PS1 telescope has 7 micron pixels - very comparable to today's digital cameras. Do you want to bet it will eat anything out there today for high ISO performance (we really mean gain) and dynamic range. It costs a pretty penny more too. I've an E510 and I'm perfectly happy with its noise levels. This was the big complaint about small sensors. They seem to have addressed that well enough for now to be competitive.
So sensor technology being equal with the larger format can always have more megapixels. Whooptyf*ingdo. What do you really want to do with all that resolution - a crop of a mole on the left bum of a fruitfly or something??? Can we make glass to match the sensors - yes - at a heck of a price. That is probably going to define where the megapixel wars have to end. The people at this stage who will clamour for the larger sensors are really the ones today who claim that more megapixels are always better.
These large sensor cameras are going to be larger physically and if you ask marketing they scream at engineers to make things smaller and sleeker cause that is what people are buying.
All this back and forth about sensor sizes is tiring. One of the things I did when I was considering which camera to buy was just look at the damned images each one produced and it struck me that the people using larger sensors 1Ds were all doing the same old boring wedding portraits - which they'd then photoshop to make exceedingly smooth and dreamy wasting all said advantage of the higher resolution. When you tossed those out all I found was that people on the different forums basically all took the same kinds of pictures anyways. if there was such a larger difference in sensor technology between the smaller and the larger ones it wasn't showing up.
So I went for what I thought felt best (admittedly leaning towards the Oly for LiveView which I tried some astrophotography with that it worked nicely for).
I will happily agree with you about price points - it was apparently competitive enough for me to buy an E510 over a D40x or an A100 or a 30D. Competition is a great thing if it saves me $$.
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Reality must take precedence over public relations, for nature cannot be fooled.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/gnarayan
Seriously, if you want to whine about high noise in smaller sensors there is plenty you can do to get it down. The chips that are going on the GIGAPIXEL camera for the PanSTARRS PS1 telescope has 7 micron pixels - very comparable to today's digital cameras. Do you want to bet it will eat anything out there today for high ISO performance (we really mean gain) and dynamic range. It costs a pretty penny more too. I've an E510 and I'm perfectly happy with its noise levels. This was the big complaint about small sensors. They seem to have addressed that well enough for now to be competitive.
So sensor technology being equal with the larger format can always have more megapixels. Whooptyf*ingdo. What do you really want to do with all that resolution - a crop of a mole on the left bum of a fruitfly or something??? Can we make glass to match the sensors - yes - at a heck of a price. That is probably going to define where the megapixel wars have to end. The people at this stage who will clamour for the larger sensors are really the ones today who claim that more megapixels are always better.
These large sensor cameras are going to be larger physically and if you ask marketing they scream at engineers to make things smaller and sleeker cause that is what people are buying.
All this back and forth about sensor sizes is tiring. One of the things I did when I was considering which camera to buy was just look at the damned images each one produced and it struck me that the people using larger sensors 1Ds were all doing the same old boring wedding portraits - which they'd then photoshop to make exceedingly smooth and dreamy wasting all said advantage of the higher resolution. When you tossed those out all I found was that people on the different forums basically all took the same kinds of pictures anyways. if there was such a larger difference in sensor technology between the smaller and the larger ones it wasn't showing up.
So I went for what I thought felt best (admittedly leaning towards the Oly for LiveView which I tried some astrophotography with that it worked nicely for).
I will happily agree with you about price points - it was apparently competitive enough for me to buy an E510 over a D40x or an A100 or a 30D. Competition is a great thing if it saves me $$.
--
Reality must take precedence over public relations, for nature cannot be fooled.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/gnarayan
jeffb89061
Forum Enthusiast
Funniest thing I've ever seen posted!!!!!!Maybe the new cameras won't take good pictures from underneath troll
bridges. Nah, that's probably why Canon puts so much energy into low
light behavior to satify some of their users
Perhaps we could have an under-the-bridge photo theme competition?
PDXguy
Senior Member
That you didn't argue his comment about prying your ass off a bar stool in ages.
Jim Attfield
Senior Member
Well, not really. How simplistic can you get? The 'weather seals' are just a couple of seals on two compartments. That is way below what even the E-1 can boast.
Live view - laugh! Attempting to emulate Oly but not doing a proper job and articulating it so IT IS ACTUALLY USEFUL and it doesn't even have any extra pixels. Yes, I know about the E-510 non-articulation.
Dustbusting - we all know that Oly is the only system which works. Everyone elses (including Canon's) is a pitiful attempt to pay lip service to the concept. Maybe the 40D will be better. Maybe.
No they didn't. They got a couple of extra MP (big deal), nearly a couple more FPS, two (yes, two!) seals, a few more grams of weight and more dust which still won't be removed so it will still have to be done digitally. If Oly had produced such a pathetic 'upgrade' there would be howls of derision all over this forum. If Canon had included the 'kitchen sink' it would have had only one tap, no plug, an unstoppable leak and would have perhaps a couple of pints of extra capacity.
You're pretty certain about a camera of which only 'leaked' specs are around and performance parameters do not yet exist.
Now you are just becoming tiresome. If you feel this way just sell up, buy a 40D and let us all breathe a sigh of relief at your departure.
Don't hurry back
Jono Slack
Forum Pro
about digital cameras and lenses
are that Canon wide angle lenses are less than might be desired
your photograph looks fine - but it would be astonishing if it didn't at that size!
best wishes
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Jono Slack
http://www.slack.co.uk
are that Canon wide angle lenses are less than might be desired
your photograph looks fine - but it would be astonishing if it didn't at that size!
best wishes
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Jono Slack
http://www.slack.co.uk
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