Skintone link

Hey would you mind sharing some of your portriats to show us what you find is good skintones. That would be really cool.
Regards,
Larry

--
http://www.fredmiranda.com/hosting/showgallery.php?ppuser=235&cat=500
http://www.pbase.com/lmc54/root

Here I may disagree somewhat, what's said, written, and discussed here does have a certain significance. Both for the SD14 new users, as an info and help source, and for potential users, who are watching and reading the forum.

For every active poster, there are probably many, many times that number of readers ('lurkers'). The hits on our pbase galleries' photos show it; I receive email queries from people who read but don't want to engage in the visible posting. When I wrote the other day that the forum is a "stage" I meant the phrase literally. On show. With audience watching. One of the reasons I feel that 'mythiformation' needs to be corrected and responded to.
Best regards, Sandy
[email protected]
http://www.pbase.com/sandyfleischman
http://www.flickr.com/photos/sandyfleischmann (most of my SD14s)

There was a lot of 'yellow' ambiant light to : easy to see in the shadows where the flashlight did not come (arm,neck) and the flashlight was not strong enough to overcome the 'yellow' . The whites on the background and fabrics stay white because of the whitening agents in the dye (who are a kind of blue the human eye can not see).
Guido

I think Roland has a very good point.

Those who prolong these discussions are not the one who complains about not getting the SD-14 to do what they want, but all SD-X owners that in some way or another (often in anger, and often very unpolite) try to defend the SD-X. And too often resort to belitteling, name calling and such. That only provoke, and not only the OP.

If you consider Goactive, Photogeek and others for trolls, so follow the only good advise about trolls. Do not reply.

--
Kind regards
Øyvind Strøm
http://www.norwegianviking.smugmug.com
http://www.pbase.com/norwegianviking

I always thought of myself as "peachy".
--
My humble photo gallery: http://ntotrr.smugmug.com

yvind Strm said:

I think Roland has a very good point.
Those who prolong these discussions are not the one who complains
about not getting the SD-14 to do what they want, but all SD-X
owners that in some way or another (often in anger, and often very
unpolite) try to defend the SD-X. And too often resort to
belitteling, name calling and such. That only provoke, and not only
the OP.
If you consider Goactive, Photogeek and others for trolls, so
follow the only good advise about trolls. Do not reply.

Click to expand...

Øyvind,

I don't think Photogeek is a troll...he was very specific on what he purchase the SD14 for it's strenght which is good reason. As far as Goactive, since I had personal bouts with him previously under his former handling "GrandP" that's another story...only him knows for his motivation....but do you think people like this poster for example is reasonable? http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/postersprofile.asp?poster=hjixixixhvie

I think sometime people mis-intrepeting trying to help as defense...yes, I agree that we should not lower ourselves to their level but it is hard to keep that high road when encounter such irrational behavior...some of our old timers and myself included sometimes are often weary and wary of people that had been badgering us in the last few years.

It is hard to discussing any problem without those constantly budding in and fanning the flame of myth-information.

If you had witnessing what I had here the last few years you would know what I mean and you would be more impartial or at least won't too fast to jumping on and make judgement some of the old timere regulars here.
Thx,
S

yvind Strm said:

--
Kind regards
Øyvind Strøm
http://www.norwegianviking.smugmug.com
http://www.pbase.com/norwegianviking

Click to expand...

SandyF said:

...
One of the reasons I feel that
'mythiformation' needs to be corrected and responded to.

Click to expand...

It is very hard to know what the invisible lurkers are thinking and what they find good PR for the Sigma cameras or not. Only Phil has the statistics for how many they are also for this forum.

Maybe lengthy discussions upon the Yellow problem, discussions that stays on the first page for days, is more fatal than a simple message that in minutes disappear to the second page.

--
Roland

yvind Strm said:

I think Roland has a very good point.
Those who prolong these discussions are not the one who complains
about not getting the SD-14 to do what they want, but all SD-X
owners that in some way or another (often in anger, and often very
unpolite) try to defend the SD-X.

Click to expand...

.....

again, I think you're painting these discussions with too broad a brush. Most of the experienced SD14 users have been very helpful in my opinion, in trying to assist new SD14 users. I do a lot of 'trouble shooting' about what's wrong, what's not working, in my (non-photography related) job.

It helps enormously if someone says "I have problems with xyz" and shows an example; here, a photo. Then we can get somewhere in finding the cause of the problem and then usually solution or suggestions for how-to. Maybe some new forum readers aren't accustomed to do anything but complain with !!! points, "my flash is broken!!!" or whatever. (I'm not referring to anyone specifically.) What's unusual here in the Sigma forum I think is that there ARE folks who have been using the cameras for many months who are ready and able to respond to legitimate queries. And there is the larger cadre of experienced SD9 and SD10 users.

By the way, I really appreciate your pointers on composition.
Best regards, Sandy
[email protected]
http://www.pbase.com/sandyfleischman
http://www.flickr.com/photos/sandyfleischmann

spm said:

...
between that I had tea, take more yellow weeds pictures...having
eating yellow safron flavor icecream (yum yum yum) ...how about you?
...

Click to expand...

I had safron fish today and safron cake the last weekend. Unfortunately the fish was bland, but the cake was delicious. And tea ... yes I have a cup beside my keayboard. It is cold now ... better make a new one. Maybe japanese green this time.

--
Roland

But each day brings queries from new readers with similar questions, often with new cameras. Discussions turn into learing experiences too, white balance, flash settings. Very helpful to those of us actually using the Sigma cameras on a daily basis, in changing light, circumstances, and scenes.

Ref my post above, SPECIFIC details and photos are very useful for analysis. I hope new SD9/10/14 users with queries will include photo and gallery links.
Best regards, Sandy
[email protected]
http://www.pbase.com/sandyfleischman
http://www.flickr.com/photos/sandyfleischmann

"peachy" -- that's funny. I consider myself 'blotchy' not helped after picking up sunburn in Death Valley. I'm still peeling; very sensitive blond skin (made more sensitive after an adult bout of severe chickenpox). Yes, the Sigma cameras show 'flush' in skintones when someone's sick by the way. I've seen it in photos of me --
Best regards, Sandy

LMC54 said:

Hey would you mind sharing some of your portriats to show us what
you find is good skintones. That would be really cool.

Click to expand...

I am not a portrait photographer really and I must admit I find skintones being difficult. Unfortunately many people are not satisfied with the truth And besides that - caucasian skin is not all that flattering in many cases.

Some brown and yellow variants are much more photogenic really.

--
Roland

SandyF said:

But each day brings queries from new readers with similar
questions, often with new cameras. Discussions turn into learing
experiences too, white balance, flash settings. Very helpful to
those of us actually using the Sigma cameras on a daily basis, in
changing light, circumstances, and scenes.

Click to expand...

Yes of course. But it is very seldom a helpful and informative thread hits the 150 mark. If there is anything helpful in a 150 thread - then it will drown in argumentation.

BTW - this thread started by a helpful link plus a reference to whiners.

Would it not have been better with just the helpful link?

Now anything helpful in this thread will be almost impossible to find among the whiner discussion and among those agreeing with the whiner comment.

--
Roland

I hope my flash samples are helpful to someone too. I'll remember the thread ;-) from discussion on settings for non-yellow flash and different white balances too. First step of searching, finding something, is recalling a keyword or specific post in a thread.
Best regards, Sandy
[email protected]
http://www.pbase.com/sandyfleischman
http://www.flickr.com/photos/sandyfleischmann

Gunter B said:

See for yourself:
http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1027&message=22891947

Click to expand...

By the smugmug criteria, most of the original skintones in your collage had too much cyan. Some were already on the pink side (e.g. M > Y). The proposed changes made them much worse. Reducing the Cyan and magenta a bit brings most of them in line with the recommendations.

Now if you really want to see some really warm skintones:



http://www.pbase.com/maderik/image/46466740

Their skins were very tan and it was late afternoon. Making the skintones neutral would've ruined the image.

--
Erik

Yes, skintones are hard. Most tones are fabricated in what one thinks skintones should be. Kinda like painting apples pure red .

I don't quite understand what you mean by "the truth". I haven't been following very closely.

Regards,
Larry

Roland Karlsson said:

LMC54 said:

Hey would you mind sharing some of your portriats to show us what
you find is good skintones. That would be really cool.

Click to expand...

I am not a portrait photographer really and I must admit I find
skintones being difficult. Unfortunately many people are not
satisfied with the truth And besides that - caucasian skin is
not all that flattering in many cases.

Some brown and yellow variants are much more photogenic really.

--
Roland

Click to expand...

--
http://www.fredmiranda.com/hosting/showgallery.php?ppuser=235&cat=500
http://www.pbase.com/lmc54/root

Roland Karlsson said:

LMC54 said:

Hey would you mind sharing some of your portriats to show us what
you find is good skintones. That would be really cool.

Click to expand...

I am not a portrait photographer really and I must admit I find
skintones being difficult. Unfortunately many people are not
satisfied with the truth And besides that - caucasian skin is
not all that flattering in many cases.

Some brown and yellow variants are much more photogenic really.

--
Roland

Click to expand...

Roland is just totally, and perhaps intentionally, missing the point of the original post, along with Erik. Schnauzer is hopeless, as is expected. It is entirely possible that Sigma is presenting the "truth" of the skin tone reality, although that is really not significant either. The point of the original post is that skin tone can be corrected to be apparently accurate and certainly pleasing by the application of a few easy to follow rules. Therefore the variation in color by Sigma, even if true, is both trivial and irrelevant.

If this issue is taken away from the yellow whiners what will they focus on next?

The issue of accuracy compared to pleasing is also significant: People want to look good, and the reality is not necessarily that good. So pleasing is more important than accurate, for some and possibly most purposes. Even models in magazines have a certain look to them, as Sandy pointed out, which is probably not the "truth." I keep using quotes around truth because truth is a slippery issue in itself. (see: http://books.guardian.co.uk/review/story/0,12084,1487956,00.html Or you can read the entire book, as I did.) This issue of pleasing compared to accurate is even more apparent and difficult when we have mixed lighting and low light, and then consider the ability of the human eye to compensate for those factors.

Richard

. . ., and apparently "truth" for you, are in the eye of the beholder. If Sigma/Foveon images requires correction with an expensive, industrial-strength third-party software program, and the images of other cameras do not, that may not be trivial and irrelevant. A potential Sigma purchaser deserves to know that.

No it does not require it, nor the OP mention that you need it.

you're just smearing things.

Schnauzer said:

. . ., and apparently "truth" for you, are in the eye of the
beholder. If Sigma/Foveon images requires correction with an
expensive, industrial-strength third-party software program, and
the images of other cameras do not, that may not be trivial and
irrelevant. A potential Sigma purchaser deserves to know that.

Click to expand...

--
C.

http://www.pbase.com/chunsum
http://www.pbase.com/sigmadslr/chunsum_choi

Really Schnauzer,

Schnauzer said:

. . ., and apparently "truth" for you, are in the eye of the
beholder. If Sigma/Foveon images requires correction with an
expensive, industrial-strength third-party software program, and
the images of other cameras do not, that may not be trivial and
irrelevant. A potential Sigma purchaser deserves to know that.

Click to expand...

Now just think about it...in your own words "requires correction with an

Schnauzer said:

expensive, industrial-strength third-party software program" if it is so true then the company that make the software like Adobe, who likely would have as many employees as SDxx users, and it would had been in bankrupt already for lack of sales...with Sigma SDxx sales amounting to less than 1% of current total sales of all dSLR...so who did you think that purchasing and supporting this expensive program? Nikon, Canon users mostly...

Click to expand...

Take PS program from the main stream dSLR users, and let's see how Adobe would still be in business.

Another example is college's colors management course...guess the 99.99% of the students are using?....surprise surprise, they are not Sigma Users...I can go on and on...
So your cruisade is a bit hallow of personal bias and revenge, no more!
S