DavidP #28649
Forum Pro
Or how about a free D-60 for all? 
--The Unofficial Photographer of The Wilkinsons http://thewilkinsons.crosswinds.net
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B&H are they in big problems?
- Thread starter Peter Gregg
- Start date
S
Scotsman
Guest
I haven't either, but I have worked in retail before (for a long time) and seen the writing on the wall. The first thing that companies start cutting back on is customer service because that is one of the easiest places to save money. Repacking/getting another scanner would have cost them money and not not gotten them anything but good will. Companies in trouble start doing the minimum to get by. This looks like it is starting to show. I won't take any chances. It just isn't worth it. This is the same reason that I don't buy from stores with Brooklyn addresses.
tko
Forum Pro
When I was young, waaay before the internet, I used to order things mail order all the time to save on taxes. No big deal - my friends and I would routinely compare shipping versus sales tax to find where the break even point was.
Now, no one every complained about this tactic or proposed to tax mail order sales. Conventional mail order (catelog) sales are still big. I don't really understand all the excitement about taxing internet sales as though they are something special and new.
It's nice to talk about voting for lower taxes, but I've never seen that work in practice. Since when does a politician keep his campaign promises?
Here in California we have our city tax, our state tax, our SDI tax, our property tax, our gas tax, some some others I've probably forgotten. If you add it all up most of us are paying over half our income in taxes. However, the local agencies are alwasy poor. Our schools, libraries, police and fire departements are chronically undersfunded, and are constantly pushing for special taxes.
I don't think most voters are convinced that raising taxes would help any of these agencies. I wonder what percentage of our taxes actually makes it down to the local service level?
The internet is the only tax break a lot of us get. Don't take it away!
Now, no one every complained about this tactic or proposed to tax mail order sales. Conventional mail order (catelog) sales are still big. I don't really understand all the excitement about taxing internet sales as though they are something special and new.
It's nice to talk about voting for lower taxes, but I've never seen that work in practice. Since when does a politician keep his campaign promises?
Here in California we have our city tax, our state tax, our SDI tax, our property tax, our gas tax, some some others I've probably forgotten. If you add it all up most of us are paying over half our income in taxes. However, the local agencies are alwasy poor. Our schools, libraries, police and fire departements are chronically undersfunded, and are constantly pushing for special taxes.
I don't think most voters are convinced that raising taxes would help any of these agencies. I wonder what percentage of our taxes actually makes it down to the local service level?
The internet is the only tax break a lot of us get. Don't take it away!
C
Chip Lenkiewicz
Guest
Part of it is that times have changed. Things are costing more than in th pre dot com days. Actually mailorder has alwys been an issue; but there has not been an easy way to address that issue. Now that most mailorder firms and other have found the net it is easier to collect these over due taxes.
That is the root of the problem. We as voters do not exercise our given freedom regularly enough. I regularly try to vote the rascals out. But as long was we look at things in a 2 party way it will be difficult.
Wasn't it California that had Proposition 22 (I think that was the number)? So voters can have a voice, if they try hard.
But the issue remains what have the voters done to make the government more accountable for what they spend? Will you change things over night? No. Here in Virginia we voted in a guy for governor that said he would get rid of our car tax. Thats all the voters heard. They did not hear that it was being done during a period of a high surplus. No cuts in spending either. And now that the economy has gone south the new governor will have to make some hard choices. As always we only hear what we want to here.
The point being that for every action there is a reaction. Find a way out of taxes and either those taxes will have to be replaced, or services cut.
Henry Posner/B&H Photo-Video Inc.
Senior Member
So, based on one transaction you're abandoning a retailer who ships as many as 10,000 orders/week uneventfully? Do you like Vegas odds better?
There you go -- eliminate an entire borough, one as large as most American cities, with a sweep of the hand. Painting with a broad brush, aren't you?
--Henry PosnerB&H Photo-Video, Inc.
Mike Kuder
Well-known member
Henry Posner/B&H Photo wrote:
[snip]
Hey now! Leave good ol' Hackensack outa this! ;-)
Mike
[snip]
[snip]
Hey now! Leave good ol' Hackensack outa this! ;-)
Mike
While it's more fun to read complaints, I must report that in the past year, I have spent over $4000 on at least 10 different orders from B&H and every one was delivered in perfect condition and on time. I can't comment on customer service because I've never had the need to call. I think my experience is the rule and not the exception. I believe buyer's remorse plays a large part in all of this, you spend alot of money, get what you ordered, second guess your purchase, and then look for someone to blame. I have a hard time believing that box arrived the way it's pictured.
Just the opinion of someone who reads more than they post.
Just the opinion of someone who reads more than they post.
C
Chip Lenkiewicz
Guest
I was going to warn you about "wording" things wrong for Henry; but looks like I am too late.
Tim Brom
Active member
B&H is probably one of the best photo shops in the country; find another photo shop that has as high a percentage of correct, undamaged deliveries. Can't find one can you? Be gald there is a decent one we can deal with that is located on the east coast.
Tim Brom
Tim Brom
S
Scotsman
Guest
Norman Camera
L
Lee Rothman
Guest
I got a brand spanking new (so they said at Norman Camera) wide angle lens over a year ago that they swore before shipping had not yet been touched, with a big ole' McDonalds french fry thumb print right smack dab in the middle of the lens when I opened it. Guess what? Norman has been OFF my buy list ever since.......
S
Scotsman
Guest
I guess that just goes to show that it is best to walk in the store and see what you are getting. But you know, if you do that, unless you take a box from the back you aren't sure it hasn't been opened either. There are no guarantee's in retail. You just have to use your credit card and yell to the bank if you get screwed.
DavidP #28649
Forum Pro
Everybody's got their problems, even Delta.
I don't know the percentages of botched orders, etc. But I'd be willing to bet that Canoga, BestPriceAudioVideo, B&H, Norman, Roberts, Delta, and several others I've left off all have pretty good track records.
I'm willing to bet that every one of those stores has at one time let out a piece of merchandise that never should've left the store to be sold "as new".
I don't know the percentages of botched orders, etc. But I'd be willing to bet that Canoga, BestPriceAudioVideo, B&H, Norman, Roberts, Delta, and several others I've left off all have pretty good track records.
I'm willing to bet that every one of those stores has at one time let out a piece of merchandise that never should've left the store to be sold "as new".
--The Unofficial Photographer of The Wilkinsons http://thewilkinsons.crosswinds.net
Tom Conte
Leading Member
Jeff Gourley
Well-known member
L
Lee Rothman
Guest
I just figured it was McDonalds and NOT Burger King as they have one across the street from their store. LOL....sure doesn't do much for the lens coating though.
Bill Hansen82652
Well-known member
In all fairness...
After seeing the picture of the box I wanted to share a couple things.
I'm a FedEx courier that handles quite a few B & H shipments every week. Contrary to some of the threads, in my experience I have noticed B&H boxes come through the system remarkably unscathed. Unusually clean and almost always void of damage (and I'm outside Chicago, not in New York so there's a fair amount of handling in transit). Reading that the damage is to the product box inside the B&H shipping materials probably means it's damaged by either the distributor, the carrier that delivered the shipment to B&H from the distributor or someone in receiving at B&H gets a little sloppy unloading their shipments.
The product box picture looks like someone picked up the box with only one of the handles/holes. The box is designed to be lifted with two hands and will tear if it's been lifted nonchalantly with one. From there additional handling causes further deterioration (am I sounding like Cliffy on 'Cheers).
Just remember, the corrugated boxes (like the one the scanner shipped in) are designed for the abuse incurred with shipping at the orgin so one can't expect a repack at B&H. They don't have replacement boxes. Torn cardboard isn't need for much concern although a little retape would be a good idea. Boxes with a crushed corner are an indication of being dropped, and more cause for scrutiny.
After seeing the picture of the box I wanted to share a couple things.
I'm a FedEx courier that handles quite a few B & H shipments every week. Contrary to some of the threads, in my experience I have noticed B&H boxes come through the system remarkably unscathed. Unusually clean and almost always void of damage (and I'm outside Chicago, not in New York so there's a fair amount of handling in transit). Reading that the damage is to the product box inside the B&H shipping materials probably means it's damaged by either the distributor, the carrier that delivered the shipment to B&H from the distributor or someone in receiving at B&H gets a little sloppy unloading their shipments.
The product box picture looks like someone picked up the box with only one of the handles/holes. The box is designed to be lifted with two hands and will tear if it's been lifted nonchalantly with one. From there additional handling causes further deterioration (am I sounding like Cliffy on 'Cheers).
Just remember, the corrugated boxes (like the one the scanner shipped in) are designed for the abuse incurred with shipping at the orgin so one can't expect a repack at B&H. They don't have replacement boxes. Torn cardboard isn't need for much concern although a little retape would be a good idea. Boxes with a crushed corner are an indication of being dropped, and more cause for scrutiny.
Scott Bourne
Active member
Peter: You need toi understand that the majority of B&H bashing comes from just a few posters. We all know who they are and most of us believe they are shills for a company called Delta International.
Use common sense....
B&H is one of the largest and oldest professional camera stores in the world. If they were one tenth as bad as certain people want you to believe, then they'd be out of business.
Like all companies, they make mistakes. It is how they handle the mistakes that counts. Henry Posner from B&H regularly makes appearances here on this board to answer these problems. Unfortunately, we have never heard from the phantom owners and managers of some other camera stores like Delta so we don't have any way to hold them accountable.
While I am sure that companies like Delta and others are fine places to buy cameras, they typically do not offer the OVERALL service, product quality and availability as well as pricing and warranty of B&H.
As a professional who makes his living using these tools, I can assure you that I would not buy from B&H if I thought it meant that I would find trouble at the end of the deal.
And I live in laid back Seattle where New York attitude is anything but the norm!
Scott Bourne
http://www.scottbourne.com
Use common sense....
B&H is one of the largest and oldest professional camera stores in the world. If they were one tenth as bad as certain people want you to believe, then they'd be out of business.
Like all companies, they make mistakes. It is how they handle the mistakes that counts. Henry Posner from B&H regularly makes appearances here on this board to answer these problems. Unfortunately, we have never heard from the phantom owners and managers of some other camera stores like Delta so we don't have any way to hold them accountable.
While I am sure that companies like Delta and others are fine places to buy cameras, they typically do not offer the OVERALL service, product quality and availability as well as pricing and warranty of B&H.
As a professional who makes his living using these tools, I can assure you that I would not buy from B&H if I thought it meant that I would find trouble at the end of the deal.
And I live in laid back Seattle where New York attitude is anything but the norm!
Scott Bourne
http://www.scottbourne.com
peripheralfocus
Veteran Member
Yes, in California you are legally required to pay the sales tax on items purchased from out of state retailers but which were shipped to California. It's called a "use tax", and it's exactly the same as the state sales tax. (7.5% or so last time I checked.) Nobody ever pays the use tax, and the state tax authorities almost never enforce the law, but it does exist.
I'll leave aside the whole issue of whether avoiding taxes is a good or bad idea, and also the issue of whether we get the politicians we deserve.
But I don't think anyone would disagree that the government shouldn't have policies or practices that favor certain businesses over others. (This, of course, happens all the time, but that doesn't make it a good idea.) It's simply unfair that Chip's store is forced to charge and collect sales tax and B&H is not. It's a terrible competitive burden for Chip, and it means Chip has a harder time making a living, paying his employees, and creating jobs in his local community. (Note that I mean no criticism of B&H in the above example. Obviously, B&H didn't create this situation, and they're just doing business aggressively in the environment they find themselves in. Nothing wrong with that.)
I used the term "government" in a slippery way in the previous paragraph. I did so on purpose because it gets to the root of the problem. State governments want to collect taxes on mail order and Internet sales, and they do have the authority to require their citizens to pay the tax. But they don't have the authority to make out-of-state retailers collect the tax and send it to them. Therein lies the rub. So they pass completely toothless "use tax" laws, then don't enforce them, and local in-state retailers (who can be and are forced to collect sales taxes) end up with an unfair competitive burden. The federal government wants no part of trying to collect or enforce sales taxes for 50 different states (and the Constitution might not allow it anyway), so nobody addresses the problem.
This is why the moratorium on Internet sales taxes is a fundamentally unfair and stupid policy. It favors certain retailers over others based on the mechanism by which they sell their products. It's totally discriminatory towards locally owned and operated businesses, and, because those businesses provide the vast majority of jobs and economic activity in this country, it's a stupid economic policy. All the blather from Internet retailers about how collecting sales tax would be too much of a burden on a fledgling industry is self-serving nonsense designed to camouflage the oldest scam in business: getting special treatment from the government, so you don't have to actually compete in a free and fair marketplace. And how in the world does a behemoth like Amazon.com cast itself as the underdog in a fragile and fledgling industry whose very existence is threatened if it had to collect state sales taxes like the corner bookstore owned by your neighbors who are trying to sell enough books every month to pay for their kids' braces.
Okay, I'm done ranting now.
Larry H. Smith
Veteran Member
Scott,
I certainly recognize your right to have-and-post any opinion.
But, ...I think you should reconsider speaking for "most of us", which I submit, you can't/have not been elected/asked to do, especially when it comes to accusing fellow-members of having ulterior motives for THEIR posting.
Before you jump to the conclusion that I am a friend of Lee's, (and say that "most of us " think so, in an attempt to add weight to your argument),... understand that I don't know Lee, and I have no prboblem with B&H.
I have a problem with someone else speaking FOR me, and bet "most of us" feel the same way.
If any of us want to call others "names" please let us do it ourselves.
Larry
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