Considering Purchase D200 Help

I have been a Canon "man" for 2 years and am very tired of lugging around a lot of "IS" "L" lenses on vacation. A relatively small and light 18-200mm image-stabalized lens on a great body is ideal and desired but Canon doesn't have it. Close, but it doesn't. I really like image stabalization. Also, I have a bad back so extra weight is not good.

However Nikon does but you also have to buy the body with it....namely the D200 at this point. I tried out the lens yesterday on a D200 and D80 with the same settings....ISO 400, P, etc. and had a blur issue with the D80 but not the D200. However, the D80 gave a better auto white balance in the store than the D200. Also, there is a little more noise w/Nikon than Canon if all the reviews are nearly accurate.

Since I am not going to purchase a P&S I would entertain any thoughts about my potential frivolous purchase, especially if you out there are as schizophrenic as I seem.

Thanks,

Bob

PS... I am posting this same thread on the D80 forum

Hi Bob,

From my perspective, based on your intended use, going the D200/18-200 route seems very sensible. It's a fantastic camera even an amature can grow into and become a better photographer. From what I've read about that lens (don't own it myself but have considered it for my wife's D70s) is that while not considered "top level" glass, it certainly shoots more than good enough for most instances. I've seen some beautiful shots with it, and if you're more prone to "snapshot" style photography, the D200 with that lense would be a compact, tight, powerful combination your friends and family would ooh and ahh over the results for years to come.

Learn everything there is about the rig (there's a lot, but don't be intimidated by that...). I bought a DVD from BlueCraneDigital explaining everything abou the camera, and after watching it for 20 minutes, you'll have everything you NEED to know about the camera handed to you.

Go for it and don't look back.
--
Kind regards, JBC

Nikon Shooter in Colorado.
http://www.pbase.com/jbcrane/
Husband. Dad. Dog lover. COG.

jbcrane said:

Hi Bob,

From my perspective, based on your intended use, going the
D200/18-200 route seems very sensible. It's a fantastic camera even
an amature can grow into and become a better photographer. From
what I've read about that lens (don't own it myself but have
considered it for my wife's D70s) is that while not considered "top
level" glass, it certainly shoots more than good enough for most
instances. I've seen some beautiful shots with it, and if you're
more prone to "snapshot" style photography, the D200 with that
lense would be a compact, tight, powerful combination your friends
and family would ooh and ahh over the results for years to come.

Click to expand...

I do have the D200, and the 18-200mm vr, (and a few other lenses), and think that this would be a good choice for you. Once you learn the features and capabilities of the D200 you will appreciate it over the D80. The 18-200mm vr is an excellent "all around" lens (not top glass), and the VR really does work.
--
JohnE
Equipment list in profile

What has been your experience with higher ISO? This is the initial reason I chose Canon over Nikon originally...and have not really been disappointed. I would hate to invest the kind of money and not use the camera.

Thanks

I htink that the D200 does well up to ISO 800. I have not used it much above that, as that is not my need. At 1600 you may have to run some post processing NR.
--
JohnE
Equipment list in profile

Hi Bob,

You know, all I have heard is complaining about the D200's noise at high ISO.

Recently I shot an Indian festival here in Fort Collins and I was a little nervous about it. It's all dark, stage lighting, etc. I didn't want to use the flash because it would have been distracting to what was happening on stage, and it was strictly for fun, so I cranked up the ISO and shot most of it around 1250-some at 1600 with my 2.8 glass.

You can see a few of the results here:
http://www.pbase.com/jbcrane/deepanjali_2006

Personally I think too much noise has been made about this issue (sorry, just couln't resist ;-). I think the D200 handles noise beautifully and especially when I take the original images, downsample them just a bit (like 5%), the noise all but goes away. That's OK with me: I don't need that high of a resolution original file, and as you can see from the samples, at extremely lower resolutions, there is virtually no noise at all. Plus, I got the shot without distracting the performance or audience and the participants went bananas over them.

So I wouldn't buy into the noise debate/nay-sayers. While others will undoubtedly argue me on this point, my experience is as stated above. There are great settings in the camera to deal with noise, such as high ISO noise reduction, etc. This all gets into learning the tool inside and out, and using it to its potential.

I'd still recommend the D200 and not look back.

--
Kind regards, JBC

Nikon Shooter in Colorado.
http://www.pbase.com/jbcrane/
Husband. Dad. Dog lover. COG.

I have the 18-200 VR and the D200. They make a great combination. I also have other Nikon lenses including the 70-200 VR, but for a light "do almost anything" combination, the 18-200 and D200 are hard to beat.

About high ISO. I've never made a direct comparison since I don't have Canon equipment, but I find the high ISO on the D200 to be more than acceptable. Yes, you can use noise reduction software if need be, but given proper exposure I don't think there's much need to do that. I've read - and whether this is true or not I don't know - that Canon automatically performs some NR internally which is why it has something of a reputation for better high ISO results. If true, you have the option to apply NR or not when using Nikon, it's "just there" with Canon.

The end results should be about the same with respect to noise and IMHO shouldn't be a determining factor regarding use/purchase of a camera.
--
--Bob

May I assume these images are on a tripod? If so, how does the camera respond handheld? Do you own VR lenses? How do they respond handheld?

Please accept my apology in advance for what may seem to be elementary questions.

Hi Bob,

Bobtheamateur said:

May I assume these images are on a tripod?

Click to expand...

Not a one. All hand-held.

BobsYourUncle said:

If so, how does the camera respond handheld?

Click to expand...

Absolutely fantastically.

BobsYourUncle said:

Do you own VR lenses? How do they respond handheld?

Click to expand...

These shots were taken with 2 lenses: the 17-35 f2.8 lens, which is not VR, and the 70-200mm F2.8, which is a VR. This lens is my favorite because it can do things like this. In my opinion it is unrivaled by antyhing Canon puts out, or anyone else for that matter.

Please forgive if you already know this, but:

The beauty of the "faster" lenses, as in anything below f4, is that you can jack up the ISO and still shoot at moderately high shutter speeds. For example on these shots, I was OK with the dark background out of focus, and needed the fastest speed of the lens combined with the lowest ISO I could get away with. I put the aperture at 2.8, set the ISO to 1250 and this gave me a shutter speed of between 1/60th and 1/120th. This was fast enough to "freeze" the slow-moving stage occupants.

BobsYourUncle said:

Please accept my apology in advance for what may seem to be elementary questions.

Click to expand...

Not at all, Bob. That's what this forum is supposed to be about. I've learned so much from reading other's posts much more experienced than myself. Please keep asking all the questions you want and I (we) will do our best.

--
Kind regards, JBC

Nikon Shooter in Colorado.
http://www.pbase.com/jbcrane/
Husband. Dad. Dog lover. COG.

Please comment on the vertical banding issue reported in the forums and the less-than-superlative review of the D200 on this website.

I know that is asking a lot but so is the $$$ for the camera and lens.

Thanks in advance.

Just get the damn think and stop worrying. It ain't a house, you know.
Jeesh!

Bobtheamateur said:

However Nikon does but you also have to buy the body with
it....namely the D200 at this point. I tried out the lens
yesterday on a D200 and D80 with the same settings....ISO 400, P,
etc. and had a blur issue with the D80 but not the D200.

Click to expand...

I have a D70 and D200, and I'm not trying to "convince" anyone not to buy a D200, it's a great camera. However, in reference to one of your initial statements, I'm not sure why the D80 alone would lead to a blur issue. At a given shutter/aperture setting and same scene, I wouldn't expect one camera over another to exhibit a blur issue. I'm guessing either your shutter speed was slower with the D80 shot, your subject was moving, or you accidentally moved the camera during the exposure.

It ain't a house but it is filled with a whole heckuvalot of toys my wife of 30 years did not desire that I get in the first place and would like to dispose of.

Thanks for all your suggestions and if I do purchase the camera and find it is not a good match for my ability/intellect who out there wants a 2nd, 3rd, or 10th camera?

Again, Thanks

Bob

A couple of exaples from amateur photographer of ISO 800

no PP done, first is a 100% crop. Both taken with D200 and 18-200 VR lens. I love the D200 and lens.
Robert
P.S. The animal is a Gerbill

Hi Bob,

Bobtheamateur said:

Please comment on the vertical banding issue reported in the forums
and the less-than-superlative review of the D200 on this website.

Click to expand...

I have no issues whatsoever with banding and never have. I bought mine around June of this year, I believe right as they were coming out (?). So no issues from the git-go, and after one firmware update, no issues whatsoever.

BobsYourUncle said:

I know that is asking a lot but so is the $$$ for the camera and lens.

Click to expand...

Like everything else in life, you get what pay for. This is not an inexpensive camera, but its price/performance ratio is unrivaled, according to me, and according to many critical reviewers I respect. So I'd feel good about your decision, dig in and learn everything you care to/have time to about the camera, and know you own a rig that is capable of making you into a better photographer and probably has way more resolution than you actually need for many years to come.

Honestly, you can not go wrong with either the D50, D70S, D80 or D200. They are all very different cameras, of course, but all very, very good. You're going to find an opinion to support whatever decision you end up making. Don't worry about what others say. Do your due-dilligence as you are, make a decision based on features and budget, then just enjoy the camera.
--
Kind regards, JBC

Nikon Shooter in Colorado.
http://www.pbase.com/jbcrane/
Husband. Dad. Dog lover. COG.

When I'm travelling with my D200 I take two lenses. The Nikkor 18-200 VR and my Tokina 12-24. That's it, And that covers a lot of range. Mu

--
'Last night the moon came dropping it's clothes in the street.
I took it as a sign to start singing.' Rumi

Banding is a nonissue as far as I'm concerned. There seems to have been a problem with very early production and Nikon took steps to deal with that. There's an occasional person who still reports banding problems, but usually (IMHO) they're shooting in unrealistic conditions. Most people using D200 cameras do not see any banding problems. I've taken thousands of shots with my D200 and I've not had any problems with banding. Sort, long, across one direction or another.

As far as "less than stellar reviews" are concerned, I honestly don't know what you're talking about. I haven't looked at Phil's review in a long time, but don't recall it being negative.

There will always be some people who are not happy with a given product. Maybe they got a lemon or maybe they can't be pleased. From the general comments here and from my personal usage the D200 seems to be an excellent product. Is it trouble free for all users in all circumstances? No, but neither is any automobile or any other product of any complexity. I've never had a car that hasn't needed at least routine maintenance. My cameras generally have not. My Nikon DSLRs have - so far - been trouble free.

If you're concerned about a D200 giving you problems, by all means get something else. If you find another camera that is completely trouble free and has no unhappy users, please let us know!
--
--Bob

Hello All,

I decided to take the plunge and immerse myself into total schizophrenia (after all, I am and have been a Canon-guy) and purchase the D200 with the 18-200 VR lens. It is ordered and expected to arrive tomorrow. I know this is not the optimum piece of glass but it is, as some of you have pointed out, a good start.

I would appreciate, however, some caveats of the camera's idiosyncrasies so I don't have to fight with it, get frustrated, then ask stupid questions on this forum. I know it is a complex piece of great technology and I will read the manual but a few tips would be appreciated.
Thanks in advance.

Bob

Bob,

Feel good about your decision. It's a great camera. And if you decide you don't like it and want to sell it, give me a call. I'm sure we can come to some arrangement. Happy shooting!

--
Kind regards, JBC

Nikon Shooter in Colorado.
http://www.pbase.com/jbcrane/
Husband. Dad. Dog lover. COG.

Bob,

It's a great combination but expect a bit of a learning curve. The camera has many settings in its menus and switches and it'll take you a little while to get up to speed on the way you want to set it up to your taste. Order Thom Hogan's ebook at his site, bythom.com. Search here for the spreadsheet (I think it's at Nikonians) that a lot of people use for a beginning on the camera's setup.

Read both the camera manual and the lens manual and don't expect to absorb everything right away. Do a lot of experimental shooting to see how things interact.

And above all, have fun!!
--
--Bob