Macro Photography in DSC F-828

Hi everyone,

I have a DSC F-828 for 8 months and I really enjoy making nice photos with it. I was interested to make macr photos for tiny objects. As you know we have a 28-134 mm lens. It is true that we can get close up to 2 cm against the object but still the object is found in a small part of the frame. Let us say that we want to make a picture for a bee. when trying all the ways to use zoon in or get close... I could not get the whole object within the frame and focused. I looked in Sony Cite I found that they have a close up lense that can be added. The lens is called (VCL-M3358 58mm Close Up Lens). I am not sure that this lens can help me really. If anyone knows this lens and can tell me about it I would be grateful.

Butros said:

As you know we have a 28-134 mm lens.

Click to expand...

I think it is 28-200.

For close up photography you might want to buy a set of 58mm CU lenses. The Sony one is good but too expensive.

Yehuda

You can focus as close as 2 cm - but only at full wide angle. At full telephoto you can focus only to 60 cm. It's a common mistake to try to zoom too much when you are too close (or get too close for your focal length, to think of it differently) - try backing off a little.

Some macro experts use a slightly different approach - set the zoom first, and start about 1m from the subject, then slowly move the camera closer until you get the largest image at the sharpest possible focus. Much depends on the subject, but you will often get better results at a moderate tele-zoom (say 150-175 mm) and moderate distance (50+cm) for several reasons; for one, it will be easier to avoid casting shadows; for another, you'll have a little more depth of field and focusing will be easier. Another thing - many of us don't want to get too close to the sharp end of the bee anyway!

Don't worry so much about filling the frame. If you have good focus with no camera shake or motion blur and can fill the frame more than 50%, your 8 MP image will let you crop quite heavily and still print very satisfactory images at reasonable size.

However, if you are really committed to sharp full-size images of really tiny objects you will definitely appreciate a close-up lens (or 2 or 3).

Butros said:

Hi everyone,
I have a DSC F-828 for 8 months and I really enjoy making nice
photos with it. I was interested to make macr photos for tiny
objects. As you know we have a 28-134 mm lens. It is true that we
can get close up to 2 cm against the object but still the object is
found in a small part of the frame. Let us say that we want to make
a picture for a bee. when trying all the ways to use zoon in or get
close... I could not get the whole object within the frame and
focused. I looked in Sony Cite I found that they have a close up
lense that can be added. The lens is called (VCL-M3358 58mm Close
Up Lens). I am not sure that this lens can help me really. If
anyone knows this lens and can tell me about it I would be grateful.

Click to expand...

I'm not the most experienced person to be answering your question, but here is what I got on my first try with macros. This was taken with my 828 and the +4 hoya close-up lense (set comes with +1,+2 and +4)



I am still trying to figure out how to get it to get more of the bug in focus... but I thought it was a good first try.

--
I'm an official Sony junkie!
Want another great sony forum? http://www.sonycams.com

As I learned from this place quite a while back, if you're into macro work, you're going to want a separate lens/filter to do the work. The macro mode on the 828 is pretty poor, not so much for the ability to get close in, but because of the large amount of distortion that shows up when you get that close. For shots of insects and the like, you're going to need a close-up filter. From that point, however, you have many choices. If you just want to experiment some then you can get a cheap close-up kit, I know Ritz Camera carries a 3 filter set for about $30 I believe. If you're really concerned about the image quality you might want to get a better filter. My whole reasoning for getting a filter in the first place was to get rid of the distortion and soft corners of the 828's macro capabilities, so I didnt' want to skimp on the filter and end up with the same problems. I ended up getting the Canon 250D. If you search the forum you'll find that a lot of people here use and swear by this filter. It's very nice, but not cheap, about $80-90 for the single +3 filter (the Ritz kit has a +1, +3, and +4 I think). Also, using a filter will not only get rid of the distortion/soft corners, but will allow you to back off the subject a bit while still getting "closer" to it in the frame. This is huge. Macro work, especially with the rather low sensitivity of the 828, needs A LOT of light, so you don't want that big lens casting a shadow on your subject.

If you do get a filter, here's some tips to get as close as possible (most, if not all, gotten from members of this forum)

• Set the zoom to 200mm
• Switch to manual focus, and set it to focus as close as possible
• Instead of using the focus ring, simply move the camera back and forth to get it into focus on the subject, you'll be about 20cm from the subject I think
• If possible (it will require bright, direct sunlight, or a flash), set the camera to f/8. You'll find with macro work that the depth of field can sometimes be only a millimeter thick, so you may not even be able to get the entire insect in focus. Always (well, almost always, depending on what you're going for) try to get the insects eyes in focus.

Hmm, so that's not a whole lot of special tips, but those are the only technical aspects that I can think of. Otherwise it's just a lot of patience and trial and error!

Let us know how it goes!

Mark

--
http://www.photobird.com/prinz/

At least you got that much in focus

I took some shots of a praying mantis, real close up (basically just the head) and couldnt' even get it to have both eyes in focus! I'd get the eye closer to me in focus, but the other eye would already be out of the DOF range!

--
http://www.photobird.com/prinz/

Well I thank all of you for the qiute pretty explanation. As I can see the 828 is not recommended for macro photography and any further adapted accessoris might be problematic especially in the field depth issue. I can learn from you that there are two ways to solve this problem of 828: a) try to use a tele-photomacro lens and try to make the shoot from at least 50cm away from the object. b)try to adapt a set of Close up lenses of vaious degrees/numbers until I get the object alone in the frame. By the way I have to check these options in a photography equipment store before I order anything since the prices are not cheap!!!

Also as for our 828 it got a 28-134mm lens which is equivalent to 200mm. This means that you can get 200mm only when using the digital zoom while the optical zoom for the lens is 28-134mm. I prefer to stay away from the digital zoom because it reduces the picture quality.

Also I would like to get some recommendations from you about places/stores on the net where I can find the recommended filters/lenses in a good price.
All the best.
Butros

When you use macro setting, thru your evf, you have a scale from 1 to -7.1 (in manual) don't go over the 2 mark -

or use some "close-up lens" (as hoya) to be able to stand further and let the light coming on your subject

I have a few galleries where I have used the f828 for close-up and I think the result was satisfactory (at least for me!) )

lebororo
http://www.pbase.com/lebororo (birds, plats, flowers etc.)

The 828 is a simply outstanding macro camera (your lens specs are also wrong).
http://www.steves-digicams.com/2003_reviews/f828.html

Get a Raynox DCR-250 +8 diopter close up lens (best bang for the buck). Illuminate with flash (preferrably diffused).

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/B0002YBXBY/qid=1126441108/sr=8-1/ref=sr_8_xs_ap_i1_xgl23/002-6188012-2041635?v=glance&s=electronics&n=507846

R2

--
Good judgment comes from experience.
Experience comes from bad judgment.

http://www.pbase.com/jekyll_and_hyde/galleries

Here is a link of some of my Macro Bee shots :

http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1009&message=14914066

--
Jaxom
http://pulcine.smugmug.com/

Hi Butros, here is a previous post from me and some samples, taken with my F828, hope it can help you.
I almost always use F8 and spot focus for my macros.

Homemade Achromatic close-up for F828:
http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1009&message=10716951

This tree wasp (Harmless) is taken with a normal non acromatic +4
closeup lens.



This grass leech with the homemade lens.



For Butterflys I mostly use +2 or +1



Jesper

Hi Jesper Hjelme,

Thank you very much for the nice pics. Actually I need to reach to this performance as you show with your 5$ lens. It is fantastic and I like it. I will try to do the same but I am not sure that I will find the basic matter easily

Jesper Hjelme said:

Hi Butros, here is a previous post from me and some samples, taken
with my F828, hope it can help you.
I almost always use F8 and spot focus for my macros.

Homemade Achromatic close-up for F828:
http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1009&message=10716951

This tree wasp (Harmless) is taken with a normal non acromatic +4
closeup lens.



This grass leech with the homemade lens.



For Butterflys I mostly use +2 or +1



Jesper

Click to expand...

Your lens specification is wrong.
The lens is usually given in 35mm equivalent.
And it is 28-200 (I've had two F828s)

As for closeup, I'd start with a Canon 250d closeup lens. It is less than $100 at http://www.bhphotovideo.com .

It will let you get quite close.

It works well with the F828, I've used it many times for Macros.

And yes, almost any camera with a zoom lens can do macro, tele-macro and closeup, three different approaches to close-in photography:

1) Macro. Set the lens to full wide-angle. Click the Macro button. Shoot very close to your subject.

2) Use a closeup lens (like the Canon). You'll be back about 9-12" from your subject. The closeup lens gives you a greater variety of focal lengths (zoom) than the built-in macro does.

3) Tele-Macro Zoom all the way out (200mm) move back until you can autofocus. Shoot closeup.

Three things to consider:

1) The normal built-in macro, being at full wide-angle will not give a nice blurred background to your image.

2) The Canon 250d will give a beautiful "bokeh", soft blurred background.

3) You can use the 1.7X tele extender (try the HD1758, made for the H1. It works great with the F828 and costs less than $100 at http://digitallyunique.com ) to get an even better tele-macro. You'll have to stand back about 9 feet from your subject, but you'll get beautiful closeups, larger (closer) than you get from the native telephoto.

Hope this helps...
--
AAK - http://www.aakatz.com

Your welcome, you can also stack the home made lens with another one or a +2 +4 lense and get pictures like this.



Forgot to say, that I use these at the tele end of the zoom, and I almost never use the "build in" macro function, you have no use for it when using close up lenses. At least you know now that i'ts possible with the F828, some patience/practice and the right gear.

Jesper

As "Safari" explained, you have all you need in your camera to begin with.

Here is one example taken with my 717 without any accessory (click on New Window):
http://img330.imageshack.us/my.php?image=loveisintheair0uc.jpg
About 3 cm from the friendly insects...

hi Jesper,

I really like your creativity and I have to say that yesterday I spent some good hours in playing with different types of lenses...

I have to ask you something about your homemade lens... What is its focal length and how much far you stay from the obect to get a focus like in the case of the fly's eye? Is it a one double convex lens or did you try to combine other lenses?

I hope to hear from you.
Butros

Hi again Butros, I can't remember how close I was with the Fly, but it was pretty close, the more magnification the closer you get, as far as I remember with the fly pic Is was a combination of the homemade lens and a +4 single element close up lens, and it was a small fly.

The homemade lens from the binoculars is achromatic (2 elements) like the Canon 250D.

I also made another one from som cheap new binoculars. here in Denmark there are a lot of these (7x50) at around 300 dkk, aprox. 50$, some of these have a yellow coating, but this is no problem if you set the white balance in the camera.
I just did a quick test for you with the homemade lens.
at 200 the focus distance to the subject is aprox. 15cm

at 70 the focus distance to the subject is aprox. 13cm, and if I now switch on the macro function, it seems that the focus distance at 70 goes down to 9.5cm, the macro function has no effect at full tele.

This cropped hornet pic is taken with the homemade one alone,
but it is also much bigger the the fly,



Exposure time 1/5 s
F-number 8
Exposure program Aperture priority
ISO speed ratings 64
Max. aperture value 2.0625
Metering mode Center Weighted Average
Light source Unknown
Focal length 41.5 mm

Jesper

HI Jesper,

Do you know what is the type of the 2 lenses you are talking about. Is it a combination between double-convex and double-concave lenses? or something else? My question for the focal length was related to the focal length of the lenses themselves... If you can give me any information about that or even show me a site were I can learn more about the optics of the macro lens I would be grateful.
Butros

Butros, Hi. I shoot lot's of product and use the close up lens on the 828. Here's an example of what it can do.



--
Rgds, Dave.
Have fun - take lotsa pix.
http://www.pixplanet.biz

Hi everybody!
Have a look at

http://www.raynox.co.jp/english/digital/f828/index.htm

and let me know what you think
Butros