Tested the Zr 6K 60P RED RAW with 32bit Stereo Audio

[bing041]

Shot with the all-around Nikon Z 28-400 lens. Converted in daVinci Resolve Studio using the CST (no LUT).Fall colors and nature sounds,, including birds, leaves in the wind, water flows, and kids - who were hiking.

Very high-contrast scenes, bright sun and deep shadows.

Two differences in shooting (for me):

1. No audio meters! No need, as levels can be set in post.

2. No need to worry about WB either - can be set in post.

Otherwise the usual Nikon AF, IBIS - all familiar.

 

[curiousmike1300]

What was the mic used?

What is this crop ratio?

 

[bing041]

What was the mic used?

What is this crop ratio?

Internal mics. 2.35:1 aspect ratio. The guidelines for that AR can be, and were, shown on the lcd.

 

[zephxiiii]

Could you tell if there was lens distortion correction being applied or available while processing the R3D file?

One downside I saw when renaming my Z6 III's .nev to .r3d was that there wasn't lens distortion correction when using RED raw module like there was in Nikon RAW.

 

[jhunna]

Shot with the all-around Nikon Z 28-400 lens. Converted in daVinci Resolve Studio using the CST (no LUT).Fall colors and nature sounds,, including birds, leaves in the wind, water flows, and kids - who were hiking.

Very high-contrast scenes, bright sun and deep shadows.

Two differences in shooting (for me):

1. No audio meters! No need, as levels can be set in post.

2. No need to worry about WB either - can be set in post.

Otherwise the usual Nikon AF, IBIS - all familiar.

Interested in your take on this camera vs the Z8 for video. The main advantage is its size and 32bit audio option...

Thanks for anything you can share.

 

[bing041]

Shot with the all-around Nikon Z 28-400 lens. Converted in daVinci Resolve Studio using the CST (no LUT).Fall colors and nature sounds,, including birds, leaves in the wind, water flows, and kids - who were hiking.

Very high-contrast scenes, bright sun and deep shadows.

Two differences in shooting (for me):

1. No audio meters! No need, as levels can be set in post.

2. No need to worry about WB either - can be set in post.

Otherwise the usual Nikon AF, IBIS - all familiar.

Interested in your take on this camera vs the Z8 for video. The main advantage is its size and 32bit audio option...
Thanks for anything you can share.

Size and the audio are really important for me, I record a lot of music, and not having to worry about audio levels is really freeing. Frees up a button too - no need to dedicate one to bringing up the audio level control, which I have set on the Z8. No worry about overheating either, relative to the Z8.

So far, Zr ease of use (ergonomics, etc.) is not very different from the Z8. I do not use EVF's. If there were actually practical power zooms, the Zr would have the advantage of the rocker level on the body. I may try the PZ 14-28 power zoom (DX, though), to see if that is something valuable to have.

So the other key issue is image quality. Does the RED RAW from and the tweaked hardware of the Zr actually produce better color reproduction and dynamic range than does NRAW from the Z8? Is it worth the decline in resolution (8K->6K)? Since I do not plan on using RED cameras, I do not care if the Zr RED RAW is the same as the RED RAW from RED cameras; the issue is do we get better quality than Z8 NRAW.

I assume the IQ is no worse on the Zr than the Z8, and could be better, so maybe it is the smaller size and 32bit audio that is enough to retire the Z8. There does not seem, for video, anything is sacrificed by the smaller form factor except 6K for 8K.

Next up - nighttime test using an f2.8 lens.

 

[monte12345]

I was poking around with the 4K video on my Z50II and found out pretty quickly that will require much larger memory cards than I have at hand. Make me think that Nikon should make sure they provide a full size HDMI port on every single new camera the release capable of 4K and higher resolutions. Because these files get real big real fast.

BTW I just check B&H and Delkin has just announced a 2Tb V90 UHS-2 V90 card for "only" 1559.99. I do believe that I'm going to stick with 2K for now. I know, shooting at 2K would NOT give me the astounding quality of 6K but I have an issue with paying more for a memory card than the cost of the camera.

BTW, great clip and amazing quality. I just have to wonder if that covered bridge actually has the overhead clearance for a Stagecoach and what people using the bridge would do if they saw/heard a Stagecoach coming.

 

[jhunna]

Size and the audio are really important for me, I record a lot of music, and not having to worry about audio levels is really freeing. Frees up a button too - no need to dedicate one to bringing up the audio level control, which I have set on the Z8. No worry about overheating either, relative to the Z8.

So far, Zr ease of use (ergonomics, etc.) is not very different from the Z8. I do not use EVF's. If there were actually practical power zooms, the Zr would have the advantage of the rocker level on the body. I may try the PZ 14-28 power zoom (DX, though), to see if that is something valuable to have.

So the other key issue is image quality. Does the RED RAW from and the tweaked hardware of the Zr actually produce better color reproduction and dynamic range than does NRAW from the Z8? Is it worth the decline in resolution (8K->6K)? Since I do not plan on using RED cameras, I do not care if the Zr RED RAW is the same as the RED RAW from RED cameras; the issue is do we get better quality than Z8 NRAW.

I assume the IQ is no worse on the Zr than the Z8, and could be better, so maybe it is the smaller size and 32bit audio that is enough to retire the Z8. There does not seem, for video, anything is sacrificed by the smaller form factor except 6K for 8K.

Next up - nighttime test using an f2.8 lens.

Can't wait to see this. On a side note, can you do some flash photography testing? I am interested in how much the 1/30 shutter sync is limiting the photo output.

Can't lie, I just got the z8 but if this had a corner evf I would get rid of everything to simplify to this one body.

 

[bing041]

Size and the audio are really important for me, I record a lot of music, and not having to worry about audio levels is really freeing. Frees up a button too - no need to dedicate one to bringing up the audio level control, which I have set on the Z8. No worry about overheating either, relative to the Z8.

So far, Zr ease of use (ergonomics, etc.) is not very different from the Z8. I do not use EVF's. If there were actually practical power zooms, the Zr would have the advantage of the rocker level on the body. I may try the PZ 14-28 power zoom (DX, though), to see if that is something valuable to have.

So the other key issue is image quality. Does the RED RAW from and the tweaked hardware of the Zr actually produce better color reproduction and dynamic range than does NRAW from the Z8? Is it worth the decline in resolution (8K->6K)? Since I do not plan on using RED cameras, I do not care if the Zr RED RAW is the same as the RED RAW from RED cameras; the issue is do we get better quality than Z8 NRAW.

I assume the IQ is no worse on the Zr than the Z8, and could be better, so maybe it is the smaller size and 32bit audio that is enough to retire the Z8. There does not seem, for video, anything is sacrificed by the smaller form factor except 6K for 8K.

Next up - nighttime test using an f2.8 lens.

Can't wait to see this. On a side note, can you do some flash photography testing? I am interested in how much the 1/30 shutter sync is limiting the photo output.
Can't lie, I just got the z8 but if this had a corner evf I would get rid of everything to simplify to this one body.

Sorry, I do not have any flash equipment.

 

[bing041]

I was poking around with the 4K video on my Z50II and found out pretty quickly that will require much larger memory cards than I have at hand. Make me think that Nikon should make sure they provide a full size HDMI port on every single new camera the release capable of 4K and higher resolutions. Because these files get real big real fast.

BTW I just check B&H and Delkin has just announced a 2Tb V90 UHS-2 V90 card for "only" 1559.99. I do believe that I'm going to stick with 2K for now. I know, shooting at 2K would NOT give me the astounding quality of 6K but I have an issue with paying more for a memory card than the cost of the camera.

BTW, great clip and amazing quality. I just have to wonder if that covered bridge actually has the overhead clearance for a Stagecoach and what people using the bridge would do if they saw/heard a Stagecoach coming.

Thank you for the comments.

The bitrate for the 6K 60P RAW files including the uncompressed audio is 3717 Mb/s (megabits/second = 465 megabytes per second = 28 GBs per minute).

A 2TB Delkin Black CFexpress card is $749; 1TB (which is what I use) is $399. These are faster than v90 UHS-II cards, which the Zr cannot use anyway.

For this video, including all the clips I did not use, I used up 650 GBs. No heating warnings, 1/4 battery left. About 2.5 hours in the field.

 

[jhunna]

I was poking around with the 4K video on my Z50II and found out pretty quickly that will require much larger memory cards than I have at hand. Make me think that Nikon should make sure they provide a full size HDMI port on every single new camera the release capable of 4K and higher resolutions. Because these files get real big real fast.

BTW I just check B&H and Delkin has just announced a 2Tb V90 UHS-2 V90 card for "only" 1559.99. I do believe that I'm going to stick with 2K for now. I know, shooting at 2K would NOT give me the astounding quality of 6K but I have an issue with paying more for a memory card than the cost of the camera.

BTW, great clip and amazing quality. I just have to wonder if that covered bridge actually has the overhead clearance for a Stagecoach and what people using the bridge would do if they saw/heard a Stagecoach coming.

Thank you for the comments.

The bitrate for the 6K 60P RAW files including the uncompressed audio is 3717 Mb/s (megabits/second = 465 megabytes per second = 28 GBs per minute).

A 2TB Delkin Black CFexpress card is $749; 1TB (which is what I use) is $399. These are faster than v90 UHS-II cards, which the Zr cannot use anyway.

For this video, including all the clips I did not use, I used up 650 GBs. No heating warnings, 1/4 battery left. About 2.5 hours in the field.

This is good info! Thanks for sharing!

 

[Andre Yew]

I was poking around with the 4K video on my Z50II and found out pretty quickly that will require much larger memory cards than I have at hand. Make me think that Nikon should make sure they provide a full size HDMI port on every single new camera the release capable of 4K and higher resolutions. Because these files get real big real fast.

You don't really need a V90 card for the Z50II: the highest bitrate it outputs is 340Mb(its)ps or 42.5MB(ytes)ps in V90 units (which means the card can sustain 90MBps write speeds). A recommended card from Nikon is the 1TB Sandisk UHS-II Extreme Pro which is about $220, and will give you almost 7 hours of video at the Z50's highest bit rate. The 256GB version of that card is $70, and will let you record 1.7 hours of video.

That's for h.265 10-bit 4k60, which will probably cause the camera to overheat before you run out of card space. The 4k30 and 24 modes have even more modest bitrates and probably won't overheat the camera. An advantage of shooting in 4k is that the downsampling to 2k in your post workflow will produce higher quality 2k video than the camera's own 2k recording, which is surprisingly not very good.

https://www.dpreview.com/reviews/im...0&x=0.09964717702166377&y=0.10803640173088658

 

[BudgetTraveller]

Have you done overheating test on the ZR @ 25c room temperature

@4K/60P H.265 10bit? How long will it last before overheating? My Z8 couldn't go past 41min

@6K RED RAW @ 25c room temperature?

Totally appreciate what you are sharing here right now. Gives me some idea of how I can move forward adding a field camera.

 

[BudgetTraveller]

Size and the audio are really important for me, I record a lot of music, and not having to worry about audio levels is really freeing. Frees up a button too - no need to dedicate one to bringing up the audio level control, which I have set on the Z8. No worry about overheating either, relative to the Z8.

So far, Zr ease of use (ergonomics, etc.) is not very different from the Z8. I do not use EVF's. If there were actually practical power zooms, the Zr would have the advantage of the rocker level on the body. I may try the PZ 14-28 power zoom (DX, though), to see if that is something valuable to have.

So the other key issue is image quality. Does the RED RAW from and the tweaked hardware of the Zr actually produce better color reproduction and dynamic range than does NRAW from the Z8? Is it worth the decline in resolution (8K->6K)? Since I do not plan on using RED cameras, I do not care if the Zr RED RAW is the same as the RED RAW from RED cameras; the issue is do we get better quality than Z8 NRAW.

I assume the IQ is no worse on the Zr than the Z8, and could be better, so maybe it is the smaller size and 32bit audio that is enough to retire the Z8. There does not seem, for video, anything is sacrificed by the smaller form factor except 6K for 8K.

Next up - nighttime test using an f2.8 lens.

Can't wait to see this. On a side note, can you do some flash photography testing? I am interested in how much the 1/30 shutter sync is limiting the photo output.
Can't lie, I just got the z8 but if this had a corner evf I would get rid of everything to simplify to this one body.

I believe the ZR's flash sync speed is 1/60sec and not it doesn't limit the photo output as someone in Asia had tested with a Godox V1 flash driven with a Godox wireless transmitter. But that's ZR's max flash sync speed as it doesn't have a mechanical shutter.

 

[bing041]

Have you done overheating test on the ZR @ 25c room temperature

@4K/60P H.265 10bit? How long will it last before overheating? My Z8 couldn't go past 41min

@6K RED RAW @ 25c room temperature?

Totally appreciate what you are sharing here right now. Gives me some idea of how I can move forward adding a field camera.

There are plenty of tests that have been done. You can search for them. I do not shoot video clips that extend beyond 5 minutes. I have encountered overheating issues with the Z8 in hot sun shooting a lot of shorter clips. In my first shoot I did not even get a warning, but it was 60's F. The bottom line from the tests I have seen, running the camera continuously, is that the Zr does not have overheating issues.

Here a link to one test, shooting 6K RED Raw in direct sunlight, 92 F:



One hour straight with not even a warning. He stopped after that.

 

[BudgetTraveller]

Have you done overheating test on the ZR @ 25c room temperature

@4K/60P H.265 10bit? How long will it last before overheating? My Z8 couldn't go past 41min

@6K RED RAW @ 25c room temperature?

Totally appreciate what you are sharing here right now. Gives me some idea of how I can move forward adding a field camera.

There are plenty of tests that have been done. You can search for them. I do not shoot video clips that extend beyond 5 minutes. I have encountered overheating issues with the Z8 in hot sun shooting a lot of shorter clips. In my first shoot I did not even get a warning, but it was 60's F. The bottom line from the tests I have seen, running the camera continuously, is that the Zr does not have overheating issues.

Here a link to one test, shooting 6K RED Raw in direct sunlight, 92 F:
One hour straight with not even a warning. He stopped after that.

Totally appreciate it. Thank you.

 

[Andre Yew]

Here a link to one test, shooting 6K RED Raw in direct sunlight, 92 F:
One hour straight with not even a warning. He stopped after that.

It turns out that recording raw is not the most strenuous thing Z cameras can do: the Z6III similarly also does not overheat when recording 6k60 raw for a long time. However, it does overheat in low 70s indoors when recording 5k60 10-bit h.265 in under an hour. I don't think anyone's done that test on the ZR yet, but given how bad the ZR's h.265 is, I'm not expecting this to be very important to its first users.

 

[BudgetTraveller]

Here a link to one test, shooting 6K RED Raw in direct sunlight, 92 F:
One hour straight with not even a warning. He stopped after that.

It turns out that recording raw is not the most strenuous thing Z cameras can do: the Z6III similarly also does not overheat when recording 6k60 raw for a long time. However, it does overheat in low 70s indoors when recording 5k60 10-bit h.265 in under an hour. I don't think anyone's done that test on the ZR yet, but given how bad the ZR's h.265 is, I'm not expecting this to be very important to its first users.

Right. I'm hoping that the production unit improves the h.265 IQ. I don't understand why the Z6III's h.265 is so much better than the ZR having the same architecture?

Sometimes shooting in h.265 is more efficient for quick post production delivery.

 

[patrol_taking_9j]

Could you tell if there was lens distortion correction being applied or available while processing the R3D file?

One downside I saw when renaming my Z6 III's .nev to .r3d was that there wasn't lens distortion correction when using RED raw module like there was in Nikon RAW.

Just want to bump this. One downside with RED RAW workflow from Z6III is no lens distortion corrections - Is this the same behavior with the ZR?

 

[sunnycal]

Could you tell if there was lens distortion correction being applied or available while processing the R3D file?

One downside I saw when renaming my Z6 III's .nev to .r3d was that there wasn't lens distortion correction when using RED raw module like there was in Nikon RAW.

Just want to bump this. One downside with RED RAW workflow from Z6III is no lens distortion corrections - Is this the same behavior with the ZR?

Yes.