Why buy a 1D now?

[Stefan Schott]

Hi Stefan

You pointed out the true problems about warranty.

Thank you. At least one person who gets my point ;-)

Ciao
Stefan

 

[Greg M]

If an item doesn't work right, or we just decide we don't want it, most places here in the US will take it back within anywhere from 14 days to as much as 90 days. I've even heard of places accepting items for a full refund after much longer then 90 days. Most places have a 30 day return policy. Like I said before, most problems can be found in the first 30 days.

Yes the manufacturers want you to send it in for warranty instead of returning it to the store but since the stores will exchange it then why go through that hassle? The only reason that the manufacturer wants you to send it in for warranty is because they don't want to get stuck with a product that they will have to sell as refurbished. They'd rather stick you with it.

Sorry to here that the stores around you stink at customer service. You shouldn't have to pay a premium for good customer service.

 

[Pixel Warp]

With cars, we ARE THERE -- we get from A to B, with comfort, etc.
There haven't been any real progress in car industry in last decade
or two.

That last sentence has to be one of the most outrageous statements I have heard in my entire life!!! I'm still laughing.

If you compare a 1983 ANYTHING to a 2003 equivilent, for instance take a 1983 or even a 1993 Chevy truck and a 2003 Chevy truck and map the "progress" in any area (passenger safety/comfort/fuel efficiency/build quality/performance/appearance/etc...) you'll definitely see some "real progress.

• Chris

 

[Donald Maldonado]

1D is a great camera..check out this posting:
http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1020&message=4403746
and no it's not the 1Ds he is talking about

It seems that many people are purchasing a 1D now since there has
been a significant price decrease. However, $3600 is still a lot of
money for a camera that probably will be replaced in the very near
future and become yesterday's news. With PMA just around the
corner, the logic escapes me. What am I missing? Isn't it worth
waiting a short time for a pro camera that will have twice as many
mp's and be less cost than the 1Ds?

 

[Phil Flash]

It seems that many people are purchasing a 1D now since there has
been a significant price decrease. However, $3600 is still a lot of
money for a camera that probably will be replaced in the very near
future and become yesterday's news. With PMA just around the
corner, the logic escapes me. What am I missing? Isn't it worth
waiting a short time for a pro camera that will have twice as many
mp's and be less cost than the 1Ds?

 

[Ben Horne]

A good photographer should have a decent amount of control over the subject within the viewfinder though..... for the wildlife shot, if the animal is too small in the view, you need to either a longer lens, or to get closer. If you look through any decent fine arts photo book, I imagine MOST of those photos are nearly identical to the viewfinder view. Many will actually include the film edges as an artistic effect.

If you work harder at your photography and use the proper equipment, you can get the shot right straight from the camera without having to crop. It's more difficult this way, but the payoff is so much greater. I for one love to nail a photo perfectly straight from the camera. I love the feeling when I load the photo in photoshop and I don't even need to do anything to it. It forces me to look closer at the subject and frame the shot as I take it. Through observing the subject closer, I often think of better compositional ideas for that particular scene.

I'm not bashing any particular people here, or saying that anyone in particular is a "lazy photographer" --- just that there is a tendency for people to become too crop happy in the digital darkroom when that's what they should be doing while taking the shot. To me, having to crop your shots nearly all the time is a sign of not "seeing" your subject while shooting it.

You control the subject . . . can place it where you want it.

You can postion yourself so that the background is suitable across
the frame.

You can get as close to the subject as you wish so that the frame
is filled
with the FL you have available, whatever that may be.

In wildlife photography these conditions often (usually?) are not met.

The 1D is not a "crop friendly" camera . . . the file size is too
small.

Attacking those who often find cropping a useful tool to arrive at
the images they need/want will not change this. It is a deficiency
of the camera . . . not the "lazy" photographer.

Cropping has been going on since the first negative was slapped
into an enlarger . . . there is nothing lazy or sloppy about it!

It is a photographic fact of life and will remain so. And, in this
respect, the 1D is lacking.

I hate cropping..... I always
beat myself up if I have a shot that would have been good if the
subject filled the frame properly. I will often trash a shot if it
needs any cropping at all. IMO, having to constantly crop and
adjust the exposure in the digital darkroom is a sign of lazy
shooting.

--
Terry Danks
Nature & Wildlife (Hummingbirds!) Photography
http://www3.ns.sympatico.ca/n1dcmc78/home.htm

 

[MAC]

$3350 or $3625 from reputable folks.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2913608252

http://www.pricegrabber.com/search_getprod.php/masterid=533990/ut=41198b345dc3bab6

and I have over a month to go to win the bet that it reaches $3K by end of March.

http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1019&message=4297484

Who's dreaming hanging on to the past now?



MAC

It seems that many people are purchasing a 1D now since there has
been a significant price decrease. However, $3600 is still a lot of
money for a camera that probably will be replaced in the very near
future and become yesterday's news. With PMA just around the
corner, the logic escapes me. What am I missing? Isn't it worth
waiting a short time for a pro camera that will have twice as many
mp's and be less cost than the 1Ds?

--
MAC
http://www.digi-pictures.com

 

[Shabok]

A good photographer should have a decent amount of control over the
subject within the viewfinder though.....

and

If you work harder at your photography and use the proper
equipment, you can get the shot right straight from the camera
without having to crop.

Hi Ben,

I also love having a "perfect" shot straight from the camera ; unfortunately, when shooting some sports where subject movement is erratic, action fast and versatility limited (due to constraints like the use of primes because of low light), the ability to crop a little bit and still maintien sufficient resolution for a magazine publication is essential. In that situation, the 1D could have a slighty higher resolution.

The D30 shot below isn't cropped but I consider myself rather lucky...



--
Shabok
http://www.nobrakes.ch - mountain biking shots

 

[Mishkin]

No, I'm at college

With cars, we ARE THERE -- we get from A to B, with comfort, etc.
There haven't been any real progress in car industry in last decade
or two.

That last sentence has to be one of the most outrageous statements
I have heard in my entire life!!! I'm still laughing.

If you compare a 1983 ANYTHING to a 2003 equivilent, for instance
take a 1983 or even a 1993 Chevy truck and a 2003 Chevy truck and
map the "progress" in any area (passenger safety/comfort/fuel
efficiency/build quality/performance/appearance/etc...) you'll
definitely see some "real progress.

• Chris

 

[Shabok]

You can find on B&H website the following statement :

"A "USA" warrantied item is a manufacture's warranty that would be repaired in any manufacturer's authorized service facility worldwide if the item required in-warranty service. The "direct import" item would have to be returned to B&H Photo-Video Corp. in New York City if it required in-warranty attention. A resident of the USA may wish to make the buying decision based on price, since the cost of shipping to an American service center or to us should be about equal. A non-USA resident may want to consider the cost of returning the "direct import" item to us for warranty service, compared to the expense of buying the "USA warrantied" item and having warranty service available locally. "

I'm still skeptical about it... I will maybe buy a 1D in the near future, but I want to make sure that if I buy it at B&H I'll get a worldwide warranty...

--
Shabok
http://www.nobrakes.ch - mountain biking shots

 

[Buchan-Grant]

where your mouth is Mike? If your so happy for everyone else to lose their cash, why don't you risk some yourself?

I'll bet you £50 against the value of the drop in the official price of a 1D within the 4 weeks following PMA!

It seems that if you don't have anything important to shoot over the next 4 weeks, it makes sense to wait and save some cash!

Bottom line is that the 1D is one fine instrument. If you buy it
now, you will use and enjoy it now. If you don't - you won't.
That simple. Your logic eludes me, frankly.

Mike

It seems that many people are purchasing a 1D now since there has
been a significant price decrease. However, $3600 is still a lot of
money for a camera that probably will be replaced in the very near
future and become yesterday's news. With PMA just around the
corner, the logic escapes me. What am I missing? Isn't it worth
waiting a short time for a pro camera that will have twice as many
mp's and be less cost than the 1Ds?

--
Mike Flaherty
http://imageevent.com/mflaherty/mikesgallery

--
Neil
http://buchangrant.ezhoster.com/bgp/

 

[Stefan Schott]

...calling your national Canon headquarters will provide you with an answer.

I believe it is Canon's policy to honor US warranty in Europe, but I'm not sure. It it is, it's merely a courtesy and may change in the future.

Also, consider that the manual will probably not include a German section. But for a dpreview-member that shouldn't be a problem, right?
;-)

Servus
Stefan

 

[aevoegels]

It seems that many people are purchasing a 1D now since there has
been a significant price decrease. However, $3600 is still a lot of
money for a camera that probably will be replaced in the very near
future and become yesterday's news. With PMA just around the
corner, the logic escapes me. What am I missing? Isn't it worth
waiting a short time for a pro camera that will have twice as many
mp's and be less cost than the 1Ds?

--
http://www.pbase.com/shickox/favorites

 

[Jay B]

David:

A line pair is actually a single boundary between two pixels. Line pair resolution is detecting the boundaries, not the lines. Think of a pcket fence. If the fence has 10 upright boards, (pickets), the number of spaces between the boards is 10-1=9. Each space is created by two boards, but adjacent spaces share a center board. Now consider detecting a DOT. A dot has two horizontal transitions, not one, ... dot resolution is actually a more challenging number.

On film scanners... most film resolution become grain-limited over 4000 dpi. Grain=noise beyond a point. But... there are a very few that can resolve much more - at considerable sacrifice (color, sensitivity, cost). High-end professional scanners (usually $10,000+ drum scanners), where performance is at a premium, are designed to work with even these films

So...lets take a real world example...the D60. The Canon D60 has 3072 (virtual) pixels horizontally, and by your measure should resolve 3072/2=1536 line pairs. Normalizing this to 35 MM terms yields (approximately) 1536/35=44 lp/mm maximum resolution, ignoring lens imperfections and averaging caused by pixel averaging in the sensor. But the D60 has been measured by several sources as having between 50 and 54 35 mm equivalent lp/mm. Oooops! Much better than the N/2 theory would suggest.

Brian C.

I count 2000 line pairs. 2000 x 2 = 4000.

And if you're right, why do we have 10,000 dpi scanners for 35mm
negative film, which would be roughly 200 lp/mm (or 400 lp/mm,
using your method).

PS -- you stated "For any conventional digital imager, apparent
resolution (without aliasing) will not exceed N-1 and should never
be less than N/2 (a rule of thumb with no basis except observation)
with a conventional sensor"

The N/2 part of that quote correlates quite nicely with my
calculations.

On your line-pair resolution arithmetic... there are actually N-1
line pairs across an imager frame, where N is the number of pixels.
Since a line pair is two samples, Nyquist is satisfied. So, for
instance, an imager with 4000 real pixels across the frame would
have a maximum Nyquist-limited resolution of 4000-1, or 3999 line
pairs horizontally. Note that each line pair marks a transition in
frequency/amplitude and each transition shares one pixel with the
previous transition. But... except for the Foveon sensor, actual
resolution is degraded by frequency/amplitude averaging (low-pass
filtering) due to the mosaic color mask over each pixel...i.e each
pixel imaged is actually the average of at least three pixels in
the imager. Also, resolution is different in each direction due to
different pixel radius, spacing and averaging at each angle.
Unlike film, which has uncorrelated, random grain, (hence iniform
resolution at all angles) digital sensor resolution must be
averaged across all angles to determineaverage resolution.

What to conclude? For any conventional digital imager, apparent
resolution (without aliasing) will not exceed N-1 and should never
be less than N/2 (a rule of thumb with no basis except observation)
with a conventional sensor. Aliasing will be in the form of a
rainbow-like color or intensity burst in areas of fine detail.
Camera software or physical low-pass filters in front of the imager
usually prevent this.

--
The Unofficial Photographer of The Wilkinsons
http://thewilkinsons.crosswinds.net
Photography -- just another word for compromise

 

[Mishkin]

Err... did you mean 1536lp/22.7mm=68lp/mm?

So...lets take a real world example...the D60. The Canon D60 has
3072 (virtual) pixels horizontally, and by your measure should
resolve 3072/2=1536 line pairs. Normalizing this to 35 MM terms
yields (approximately) 1536/35=44 lp/mm maximum resolution,
ignoring lens imperfections and averaging caused by pixel averaging
in the sensor. But the D60 has been measured by several sources as
having between 50 and 54 35 mm equivalent lp/mm. Oooops! Much
better than the N/2 theory would suggest.

 

[snooter]

I think you missed the point in what he was saying. I believe Mike's point was simply that there will always be something new around the corner, and if you forever sit on the fence and say "Just wait until the next PMA", you will never take any pictures. I don't think he was saying don't wait until next week to buy one. Rather he was saying, this is a great camera right now, and while many people will sit on the fence endemically waiting for the "next best thing around the corner", those who buy it now (not to be read as "don't wait until next week") will be out snapping great photos and enjoying their 1D.

Correct me if I am wrong in my intepretation, Mike

I'll bet you £50 against the value of the drop in the official
price of a 1D within the 4 weeks following PMA!

It seems that if you don't have anything important to shoot over
the next 4 weeks, it makes sense to wait and save some cash!

Bottom line is that the 1D is one fine instrument. If you buy it
now, you will use and enjoy it now. If you don't - you won't.
That simple. Your logic eludes me, frankly.

Mike

It seems that many people are purchasing a 1D now since there has
been a significant price decrease. However, $3600 is still a lot of
money for a camera that probably will be replaced in the very near
future and become yesterday's news. With PMA just around the
corner, the logic escapes me. What am I missing? Isn't it worth
waiting a short time for a pro camera that will have twice as many
mp's and be less cost than the 1Ds?

--
Mike Flaherty
http://imageevent.com/mflaherty/mikesgallery

--
Neil
http://buchangrant.ezhoster.com/bgp/

--
--Mike Ezell

 

[Mike Flaherty]

Risk? Hardly. Fact is that I got my 1D a number of months ago. Paid 5 grand. Zero regrets. Bought my D30 when then were first introduced. Paid $2700. Zero Regrets. If I wanted another 1D, I'd buy it right now - again with zero regrets. Time is life, my friend.

Mike

I'll bet you £50 against the value of the drop in the official
price of a 1D within the 4 weeks following PMA!

It seems that if you don't have anything important to shoot over
the next 4 weeks, it makes sense to wait and save some cash!

Bottom line is that the 1D is one fine instrument. If you buy it
now, you will use and enjoy it now. If you don't - you won't.
That simple. Your logic eludes me, frankly.

Mike

It seems that many people are purchasing a 1D now since there has
been a significant price decrease. However, $3600 is still a lot of
money for a camera that probably will be replaced in the very near
future and become yesterday's news. With PMA just around the
corner, the logic escapes me. What am I missing? Isn't it worth
waiting a short time for a pro camera that will have twice as many
mp's and be less cost than the 1Ds?

--
Mike Flaherty
http://imageevent.com/mflaherty/mikesgallery

--
Neil
http://buchangrant.ezhoster.com/bgp/

--
Mike Flaherty
http://imageevent.com/mflaherty/mikesgallery

 

[Mike Flaherty]

Hi, Mike. Yes. Your interpretation is right on, although Buchan-Grant should be able to simply read my words and figure out my meaning himself/herself. Whatever. Take care...

Mike

Correct me if I am wrong in my intepretation, Mike

I'll bet you £50 against the value of the drop in the official
price of a 1D within the 4 weeks following PMA!

It seems that if you don't have anything important to shoot over
the next 4 weeks, it makes sense to wait and save some cash!

Bottom line is that the 1D is one fine instrument. If you buy it
now, you will use and enjoy it now. If you don't - you won't.
That simple. Your logic eludes me, frankly.

Mike

It seems that many people are purchasing a 1D now since there has
been a significant price decrease. However, $3600 is still a lot of
money for a camera that probably will be replaced in the very near
future and become yesterday's news. With PMA just around the
corner, the logic escapes me. What am I missing? Isn't it worth
waiting a short time for a pro camera that will have twice as many
mp's and be less cost than the 1Ds?

--
Mike Flaherty
http://imageevent.com/mflaherty/mikesgallery

--
Neil
http://buchangrant.ezhoster.com/bgp/

--
--Mike Ezell

--
Mike Flaherty
http://imageevent.com/mflaherty/mikesgallery

 

[Denise]

Risk? Hardly. Fact is that I got my 1D a number of months ago.
Paid 5 grand. Zero regrets. Bought my D30 when then were first
introduced. Paid $2700. Zero Regrets. If I wanted another 1D,
I'd buy it right now - again with zero regrets. Time is life, my
friend.

Mike

Mike, your last sentence just about sums up my feelings on the subject too.

I think some people spend too much time worrying about issues in the original post.

As DavidP stated, the 1D is now at an excellent price and refurbished ones are snapped up like gold dust. More people are able to afford this camera now than ever before.

There are no guarantees that Canon will produce anything even similar this year anyway, so why wait?

Best regards,

Denise

 

[hyslopc]

Why would he import a camera from the US if he lived in the US? He lives in Germany, where AFAIK there is no such thing as a return period. In fact the US is about the only country in the world where a majority of stores have no-questions-asked 30-day return periods. Yes, believe it or not, the other countries are not just "America with funny languages" - they differ in many respects, including retail laws, culture and traditions. Another example is that in Germany I believe it's still illegal to have a store open on Sunday - unbelievable to most Americans (and to us Swedes), but that's how it is (unless it's changed recently).

Not very clever calling someone a fool when you've made several invalid assumptions about their situation.