Continuous Lighting Solutions for Still Life advice

[DCooper]

Hi guys,

Please can I get your advice with a Continuous Lighting Set-up.

For the past few months I have been creating Still Life photography in my small dining room at home, and I currently use two lamps with 30w daylight bulbs 30W Bayonet Daylight Energy Saving Light Bulb Equivalent Output 150 Watts, with some DIY diffusers, reflectors, etc

After much research, I think I have a good idea of lighting technique and I want to upgrade my lighting Set-up. I’ve been thinking about buying an Interfit Continuous lighting kit for my small, home Studio Set-up for Still Life work.

The ‘Supercool 4 55’ kit comes with 900 Watts of tungsten lighting power and uses four cool-running, daylight-balanced 55 Watt fluorescent lamps, in two switchable banks per head. It also has two Octobox softboxes and costs about £320.

However I have been watching Still Life tutorial videos on learnmyshot.com and the Photographer gets some great results from using a few Clamp lamps, clamped onto light stands, plus he uses rolls of Drafting Velum, on stands, to defuse the light. The bulbs recommended are Frosted and Clear bulbs of different wattages 40w 60w 75w 100w 150w, and also Spotlight bulbs.

Obviously the latter Set-up costs less than buying a Continuous lighting kit, however I was wondering what your thoughts are on these two Set-ups please?.

I think that I am veering toward the Clamp lamp idea, but I was wondering which Set-up would I get more professional results with or would it make no difference?

Many thanks,

D.

 

[Darrell Spreen]

I have used CFL lamps for still life (product) work including 55W lamps, one in a 14" reflector and another in a 30" or 40" umbrella. Two lights provide plenty of light and have the advantage of all continuous lighting which usually facilitates careful setup. I think 900W will be over-kill in the sense that you will probably spray a lot of light around your work area and subtle lighting effects will be harder to achieve.

Also, even with high CRI lamps (mine were rated at 92), color accuracy is not satisfactory for me. Interfit is a good brand, but I doubt if the CRI of their lights is better.

Actually, you don't need very bright lights for still life since you can work with long exposure times. Moderate size incandescent lights will likely give more light control and better color accuracy if you have the ability to match the white balance in your camera to the lighting. Incandescent lights will probably be hotter during long sessions, of course.

I finally went with inexpensive flash units and a variety of light modifiers and get my best results that way.

--
Darrell

 

[Klaus dk]

Colour rendition index (CRI) and colour temperature consistency should be your worries when using cool lights (CFL or LED). Incandescent lights have a more even spectrum, but modifiers must be heat resistant or or used with extreme care, plus they will heat the studio.

Inexpensive flash is easier in this respect, but can be quite a challenge in an advanced lighting setup, as you will have to take test shot after test shot until you get it right. Studio strobes have modeling lights, but even though modeling lights can be set to change proportionally with the power settings on the strobe, the final result will not be quite the same.

So take your pick, studio work is full of challenges - and fun!

 

[KCook]

Hi guys,

Please can I get your advice with a Continuous Lighting Set-up.

For the past few months I have been creating Still Life photography in my small dining room at home, and I currently use two lamps with 30w daylight bulbs 30W Bayonet Daylight Energy Saving Light Bulb Equivalent Output 150 Watts, with some DIY diffusers, reflectors, etc

After much research, I think I have a good idea of lighting technique and I want to upgrade my lighting Set-up. I’ve been thinking about buying an Interfit Continuous lighting kit for my small, home Studio Set-up for Still Life work.

The ‘Supercool 4 55’ kit comes with 900 Watts of tungsten lighting power and uses four cool-running, daylight-balanced 55 Watt fluorescent lamps, in two switchable banks per head. It also has two Octobox softboxes and costs about £320.

In my view two 27" ocotoboxes would be overkill for many tabletop situations. You could maybe use one such softbox, just not much need for the 2nd one.

However I have been watching Still Life tutorial videos on learnmyshot.com and the Photographer gets some great results from using a few Clamp lamps, clamped onto light stands, plus he uses rolls of Drafting Velum, on stands, to defuse the light. The bulbs recommended are Frosted and Clear bulbs of different wattages 40w 60w 75w 100w 150w, and also Spotlight bulbs.

Clamps work, I prefer stands. When I need to get a light in very close, instead of a stand I use a little tabletop tripod on the table itself.

Obviously the latter Set-up costs less than buying a Continuous lighting kit, however I was wondering what your thoughts are on these two Set-ups please?.

I think that I am veering toward the Clamp lamp idea, but I was wondering which Set-up would I get more professional results with or would it make no difference?

Dunno about the relative merits of either approach, as I don't take either very seriously. I started out with spiral CFLs, like that Interfit kit, as I couldn't resist the low prices. But the CFLs were problematic for me when it came to color tone. I am now switching my tabletop kit over to LED (video) lights. For me the LEDs are just easier to live with than the CFLs.

Many thanks,

D.

Links to more views on these topics -

Tabletop lighting and table

Can anyone share what you use or would use for taking pictures of smaller products? I need some recomendations. I use 3 fluorescent lights and a tent which I really don't like the more I learn about lighting and angles. I am experimenting with halogen work lamps from the hardware store, but I...

www.dpreview.com

http://www.dpreview.com/forums/thread/3564793

http://www.dpreview.com/forums/thread/3568854

Kelly Cook

 

[Sailor Blue]

+1 on what Darrell and Klaus said.

If you want accurate colors then use tungsten, halogen, or flash. Whatever type you settle on don't mix and match - use all lights of the same type.

The problem with hot-shoe flash units is that you don't really know what the lighting is until you test, then you move the lights, test, and repeat and repeat and repeat.

Modeling light of studio strobes are a big help in setting up the lighting. In the US you can get a good quality 150Ws studio strobe for $100 but I don't have a recommendation for what you can get in the UK.

Adorama - Flashpoint 320M, 150 Watt Second AC / DC Monolight Strobe

If you do go with studio strobes be sure to get good quality ones or you will be wasting your money, a lesson I learned the hard way. For tabletop product shots 150Ws is more than enough power so be sure that the light has at least 5 stops (1 to 1/32) of power variability.

For tabletop product shots I would consider making my own diffusers and reflectors instead of buying them. DIY gives you greater flexibility in size, and size and distance are what control light quality. Stretcher frames for paintings, embroidery hoops, etc. are all good for holding fabric diffusers. Cardboard frames work well for paper diffusers. Use your imagination and save £££.

You need a good quality WB card. Here is one I recommend. It is solid color plastic, can be washed or even sanded down if it gets dirty, and is very rugged. I'm sure you can find something similar in the UK.

Robin Myers Imaging: Digital Gray Card

I made a perfectly acceptable WB card by sanding down a 1/8"x14"x14" sheet of white acrylic plastic until it had a matte finish. I found the sheet of white acrylic for about $3 in an art supply store. Just meter on it and it comes out gray and perfect for setting a Custom WB in the camera or in post processing.

Turn on the camera's Highlight Alert and increase the exposure until the body of the white card (not the edges which are rough and have strange reflectivities) just starts to blink and with my 7D I have the perfect RAW exposure. The perfect JPG exposure is 1/3 stop less than that for RAW.

 

[chkproductions]

I have been testing some inexpensive Yongnuo 300 LED lights. If you do a manual white balance things come out pretty well. I haven't seen any bad color casts yet. The examples below were shot with the LED light behind a 4x silk approximately 2 ft. away from the subject. And obviously with inanimate objects on a tripod your exposure can be as long as you want.

















--

http://chkphotography.zenfolio.com/

 

[DCooper]

Thank you for all of your really helpful replies, suggestions on lighting, equipment, etc.

At the moment I am shooting creative Still Life Photography, rather than Product Photography. My work comprises of thematic scenes with figurines, dolls, fruit, etc.

However that’s not to say that I wouldn’t do Product work in the future..

Maybe it’s just my inexperience, but because of the type of stuff I photograph the CRI/colour, to me, hasn’t been an issue. I have been using cheap 1600 Lumen, 30 Watt, the (equivalent 150 Watt) Colour: 6500K spiral bulbs with DIY diffusers, reflectors, etc.. However after reading Darrel’s post, I did some research and it seems that I would be better of using bulbs that fall within 5400 - 5500k for photography. Am I right in thinking that colour accuracy was important for whatever Studio work I’d do?

I am aware that Incandescent lighting would give me more control with brightness levels, however I am not sure what to buy. The Photographic lighting shops all seem to sell fluorescent lighting for Studio work.

I am really interested in using Studio Strobes, but I wonder what benefits there are with the Still Life photography I am currently shooting, as opposed to the complete control WYSIWYG lighting with Continuous Lighting?

The camera I use is a Panasonic GH2 and I understand it does not have wireless strobe features, however, I can get a wireless flash transmitter which sits in the hot shoe. I was reading about this in this Thread on off-camera Flash: http://www.dpreview.com/forums/post/42045968, but I don’t know how this applies to Studio strobes? My knowledge is very limited on how I’d connect the GH2 to Studio Strobes

Thanks again.

 

[Darrell Spreen]

Thank you for all of your really helpful replies, suggestions on lighting, equipment, etc.

At the moment I am shooting creative Still Life Photography, rather than Product Photography. My work comprises of thematic scenes with figurines, dolls, fruit, etc.

However that’s not to say that I wouldn’t do Product work in the future..

Maybe it’s just my inexperience, but because of the type of stuff I photograph the CRI/colour, to me, hasn’t been an issue. I have been using cheap 1600 Lumen, 30 Watt, the (equivalent 150 Watt) Colour: 6500K spiral bulbs with DIY diffusers, reflectors, etc.. However after reading Darrel’s post, I did some research and it seems that I would be better of using bulbs that fall within 5400 - 5500k for photography. Am I right in thinking that colour accuracy was important for whatever Studio work I’d do?

I am aware that Incandescent lighting would give me more control with brightness levels, however I am not sure what to buy. The Photographic lighting shops all seem to sell fluorescent lighting for Studio work.

I am really interested in using Studio Strobes, but I wonder what benefits there are with the Still Life photography I am currently shooting, as opposed to the complete control WYSIWYG lighting with Continuous Lighting?

The camera I use is a Panasonic GH2 and I understand it does not have wireless strobe features, however, I can get a wireless flash transmitter which sits in the hot shoe. I was reading about this in this Thread on off-camera Flash: http://www.dpreview.com/forums/post/42045968, but I don’t know how this applies to Studio strobes? My knowledge is very limited on how I’d connect the GH2 to Studio Strobes

Thanks again.

I think you may be confusing color temperature with CRI. 5500K lamps will have a warmer overall color temperature than 6500K lamps, but the Color Rendering Index is a number that describes the accuracy of the color spectrum. Fluorescent and LED lamps have a discontinuous spectrum, so they have difficulty reproducing the natural light they're designed to match. Higher CRIs mean that the lamp has been engineered to come closer to a true continuous spectrum. Hot lamps don't have this problem and flash tubes have a better spectral response too.

Don't worry about avoiding spiral fluorescents if you're getting them at photographic lighting shops -- they probably have a good CRI. And you can work with either 6500K or 5500K color temperatures if you set the white balance correctly in your camera. These are "daylight" color balanced and can usually be used in conjunction with window light if you desire (for that purpose, 6500K may be better).

About using inexpensive flashguns. Initially, you may find that using flash units without modeling lights requires multiple shots to get what you want -- however, especially with still life work, you soon learn how your lights and modifiers behave and setups will become very intuitive. At least, that's what I have found.

You should be able to use your GH2 with a simple hot-shoe to pc-sync cable adapter. They cost about £15. This will mean that one of your flash units is connected by cable (any others can be sync'd in optical slave mode). One nice thing about still-life photography and many other types of studio work is that a cable connection and optical slaves are cheap and work very well.

--

Darrell

 

[KCook]

Thank you for all of your really helpful replies, suggestions on lighting, equipment, etc.

At the moment I am shooting creative Still Life Photography, rather than Product Photography. My work comprises of thematic scenes with figurines, dolls, fruit, etc.

However that’s not to say that I wouldn’t do Product work in the future..

Maybe it’s just my inexperience, but because of the type of stuff I photograph the CRI/colour, to me, hasn’t been an issue. I have been using cheap 1600 Lumen, 30 Watt, the (equivalent 150 Watt) Colour: 6500K spiral bulbs with DIY diffusers, reflectors, etc.. However after reading Darrel’s post, I did some research and it seems that I would be better of using bulbs that fall within 5400 - 5500k for photography. Am I right in thinking that colour accuracy was important for whatever Studio work I’d do?

As Darrell posted, CRI is about color quality, not temperature. The CFLs that I have been using are from a photographic supplier, with a CRI label of 90, and I still have color correction issues. Worse than with my video LED light. Maybe I just suck at color correction, whatever, I'm pretty well done with CFLs. Color temperature by itself is very easy to correct in post, so long as all the lights have the same temperature.

I am aware that Incandescent lighting would give me more control with brightness levels, however I am not sure what to buy. The Photographic lighting shops all seem to sell fluorescent lighting for Studio work.

Indeed they all do peddle the fluorescents. Low prices are easy to sell, plus CFL types can use a sexy softbox (LEDs generally cannot), and multi-blub CFLs and flourescent light banks put out more light than LED which is important for portraits (especially full length). However still life photography and tabletop in particular is a very, very different game from portrait photography. At that point many stores will try to peddle you a light tent plus CFLs or tungsten lights (still slightly cheaper than LED). Tungsten light will also work, if the heat is not an issue with your particular setup. And tungstens do not have the CRI issue. I sometimes use tungsten as well.

I am really interested in using Studio Strobes, but I wonder what benefits there are with the Still Life photography I am currently shooting, as opposed to the complete control WYSIWYG lighting with Continuous Lighting?

I do sometimes use my strobes for tabletop stuff. That is when I want to use a beauty dish or snoot or some other special light modifier. LEDs lights are panel style, generally do not work with all those cool modifiers. On the other hand, such modifiers are not always needed. Panel style lights mean a different approach, but they can work. Tungsten lights can use most modifiers, with the usual caveat about the heat issue. Both LED and tungsten lights usually incorporate dimmers, where CFLs are either On of Off.

The camera I use is a Panasonic GH2 and I understand it does not have wireless strobe features, however, I can get a wireless flash transmitter which sits in the hot shoe. I was reading about this in this Thread on off-camera Flash: http://www.dpreview.com/forums/post/42045968, but I don’t know how this applies to Studio strobes? My knowledge is very limited on how I’d connect the GH2 to Studio Strobes

So long as we are talking about manual flash control, not TTL, RF trigger sets are affordable and dead easy to use. Linky to a video on this -

There are other ways of controlling off camera flash, but RF triggers are the most practical solution.

Thanks again.

Kelly

 

[DCooper]

Many thanks for your informative replies again Darrell and Kelly,

From your posts, to me it seems like it can be either or, with regards to Continuous vs Strobes for Still Life work.

I'm quite technically minded and I'm sure if I bought some Studio Strobes, I'd really enjoy working with them, for freezing motion, etc, but I also love the control that Continuous lighting currently gives me.

I think I might buy continuous lamps on light stands for now and create some DIY modifiers. I'm interested in seeing the differences between tungsten, LED and CFL, for my work.

LEDS aside, please can you tell me if lamp heads can take either Tungsten or CFL bulbs, with the correct adaptor, so that I can have the best of both worlds? Or do I need to buy dedicated tungsten/CFL kits? Also, will an LED head fit onto any light Stand?

Thanks again.

 

[KCook]

Low budget CFL heads use ordinary household bulb sockets, like this one -

http://www.cowboystudio.com/product_p/double%20ac.htm

So it possible to also use a common tungsten bulb with that, within the head's wattage limit. High wattage tungsten bulbs need high temperature heads. The more powerful CFLs and tungstens use other socket designs, which are not usually interchangeable.

My little LED is intended for on-camera video use, so it comes with a hotshoe fitting (which is obviously really a coldshoe) for the camera. This same fitting also has a 1/4-20 hole, to fit on a tripod. Many light stands come with a 1/4-20 screw on top. Even it they don't the 1/4-20 adapter is easy to get for stands. Bigger LED lights likely have a common 5/8" fitting for stands.

The various adapters are cheap, should be the least of your problems.

Kelly

 

[DCooper]

Low budget CFL heads use ordinary household bulb sockets, like this one -

http://www.cowboystudio.com/product_p/double ac.htm

So it possible to also use a common tungsten bulb with that, within the head's wattage limit. High wattage tungsten bulbs need high temperature heads. The more powerful CFLs and tungstens use other socket designs, which are not usually interchangeable.

My little LED is intended for on-camera video use, so it comes with a hotshoe fitting (which is obviously really a coldshoe) for the camera. This same fitting also has a 1/4-20 hole, to fit on a tripod. Many light stands come with a 1/4-20 screw on top. Even it they don't the 1/4-20 adapter is easy to get for stands. Bigger LED lights likely have a common 5/8" fitting for stands.

The various adapters are cheap, should be the least of your problems.

Kelly

Thanks.

Thank to you guys I can safely say that I now know what I want with regards to CFL and LED, Diffusers and Modifiers.

However when using Tungsten light bulbs is it important to get 3200k bulbs for photo Studio work?

At the varying bulb watts suggested in this equipment tutorial web page, it seems impossible to get Tungsten bulbs that are 3200k (in the UK anyway):

http://learnmyshot.com/lighting-and-grip-equipment-for-clamp-lamp-studio/

Thank you.

D

 

[KCook]

It's important to get tungsten bulbs that are all the same temperature, regardless of the exact value. You will be correcting the temperature in post anyways, whatever that value is. There are some very simple cameras that do not let you set the K degree WB, in that case, along with no possibility of post, then you would need to get the same K bulb as that camera happens to be set for Tungsten WB. But that is a pretty weird combination of circumstances.

Mixing bulbs with different K values complicates post a lot, so just don't do that.

Kelly

 

[DCooper]

Hi Kelly, Darrell, and others on this forum,

After reflecting on this thread, I purchased an LED panel because of the ability to dim the lights, some come with Barn doors, which are useful to me and also there are separate coloured diffuser gels in the box which are also useful.

I got the Yongnou 160 LED, which is inexpensive, £34.95, at Amazon.co.uk. So far I have been happy with the unit and I was considering buying 2 more for Still Life Lighting set-ups. I have noticed that the Colour temp is 5500k, the CRI is 87.5. (I understand that I would have to buy expensive units to get a higher CRI in LED Panels).

I was just wondering what your opinions are on these Yongnou LED panels, please, before I buy a couple more?

Thanks,

D.

 

[Klaus dk]

Since you already have the panel, why don't you form your own opinion?

You could take some pictures with it and look at colour rendition (skin tones, highly saturated colours, pastels, shades of grey) and general quality of light both at full power and at dimmed settings. That would be a much better indication of its usefulness for you than other's opinions of it.

 

[DCooper]

Thank you Klaus, you make a good point.

 

[KCook]

Since you already have the panel, why don't you form your own opinion?

You could take some pictures with it and look at colour rendition (skin tones, highly saturated colours, pastels, shades of grey) and general quality of light both at full power and at dimmed settings. That would be a much better indication of its usefulness for you than other's opinions of it.

+1

With LED lights you are faced with 2 questions -

Is it bright enough?

Is the panel type light appropriate for your setup? If you need to use snoots, umbrellas, etc, then you will need to look into other lights.

Either way, Klaus is right. You can answer these questions better for yourself than we can.

Kelly

 

[DCooper]

Hi guys,

I do apologise for my continual research, on this thread. I have a few questions in regards to my tests that I have done with my LED Panel and recommendation for a Studio Strobe.

I've done a number of tests using White Balance card, and different shades/colours and I like the colour of light that I get from the LED panel, (it seems to be very white, without any blue tint).

However I have been reading in forums, that if I dim the light it will affect the colour temperature. On another forum a guy reviewed the YN-60 panel and did a test saying the dimming affected the colour temperature by 5400k - 5700k. If I have a two light Set-up and one panel is dimmer than the other, will I have issues with the colour temperature consistency in my photos, even if the difference is approximately 300k?

It seems that the YN-300 model has a dial for the colour temperature, separately from the dimmer, but I presume dimming will affect the colour temperature anyway?

For the first time, I did some Still Life flash photography the other day for a project, and I was very pleased with my results. I have been looking into buying a studio strobe set, and I was wondering whether the Elinchrom D-Lite- RX One would suit my needs. Considering that all of my work is Still Life art photography, mainly Low Key, is 100w enough power/or too much, for what I want to do?

The power can also be reduced by 5 f/stops to 6W/s and also uses a modelling lamp which has four settings. Unlike the LED panels, I can purchase a range of accessories, rather than spending hours building DIY modifiers I have made for the continuous lights, so it would seem to be ideal.

Thanks in advance,

D.

 

[KCook]

I'm just a hobbyist, not a pro. 300K difference would not bother me at all.

100Ws is still more than a speedlight, so this would be plenty of light for still life work. My cheap Flashpoint is 150Ws, I hardly ever use it at full power. But with the caveat that I set up in my home, pretty small spaces.

I'm in the USA, where Elinchrom prices are not competitive with other bargain brands. Of course this price ranking can be very different in other parts of the world. At least the Elinchrom brand is popular enough that it is feasible to find less expensive 3rd party accessories for a Elinchrom head. Regarding the particular model you linked to, I am not a fan of flush face switches, but that is just me. Different strokes for different folks. Linky to more views on the Elinchrom route -

http://www.dpreview.com/forums/thread/3236507

Kelly

 

[DCooper]

Thank you Kelly for your reply.

I've been reading that some people generally buy more power than they need for their home Studio purposes, particularly when it comes to creative Still Life work.

I haven't been able to see this in any videos or judge it anywhere and I don't now if you are able to answer this question, but if I were to use the RX One on the lowest power setting, would this still be too much for low key photo shoots? Especially when I consider that in my last photo project, I reduced the output of pop-up flash on my GH2 by 2 stops to get the kind of atmosphere that I wanted.

Regards,

D.