The voting system

[OldPhoto]

I read up on how the voting works and how you don't have to vote for each image and how the algorhythm sorts it out - but subjectively the results seem a bit weird.

I used to try to enter a lot of challenges, way back before this site nearly closed down, but was away from the site for quite a while. Since I came back I put a couple of images in, but have mostly been watching, trying to discover what makes a good image that will do well in the voting. I am failing to see any coherent pattern. I see nice images doing badly, and conversely, ordinary images being rated higher in the rankings.

Is it possible something is going wrong with the mathematics behind the scenes? Interested in your comments, also, about what techiques and types of images should do well in challenges.

 

[jrtrent]

. . . Since I came back I put a couple of images in, but have mostly been watching, trying to discover what makes a good image that will do well in the voting. I am failing to see any coherent pattern. I see nice images doing badly, and conversely, ordinary images being rated higher in the rankings.

That has been my experience with the challenges, too, ever since they started, but I think it's just a matter of each voter judging the entries by his own standards. In most challenges, my favorites (those I give four or five stars to), end up all over the place in terms of final results. Pictures I like equally well will finish near first, near last, and everywhere in between.

Is it possible something is going wrong with the mathematics behind the scenes? Interested in your comments, also, about what techiques and types of images should do well in challenges.

Some people have mentioned being able to figure out what makes a good image, that is, one which will place well; hopefully one of them will post a response.

 

[Trevor Carpenter]

I think the system does work. I am never sure how but it seems to all come good. I think the problem may be us and our perception. I've posted some "very good" pictures in recent challenges with not very good results. For the latest bird challenge, I thought I'm not going to bother, let's just see how I get on with a boring Blue Tit on a branch. Well would you believe fourth is my best result for some time. IMHO there are more than few entries that are better than mine.

 

[JahnG]

I read up on how the voting works and how you don't have to vote for each image and how the algorhythm sorts it out - but subjectively the results seem a bit weird.

I used to try to enter a lot of challenges, way back before this site nearly closed down, but was away from the site for quite a while. Since I came back I put a couple of images in, but have mostly been watching, trying to discover what makes a good image that will do well in the voting. I am failing to see any coherent pattern. I see nice images doing badly, and conversely, ordinary images being rated higher in the rankings.

That is an interesting question to which I haven't either found a good answer.

One thing I have observed is that the picture has to look good in the thumbnail mode, (looking) sharp enough, not looking too dark, colorful enough, the main object big enough. A picture that doesn't look good in thumbnail mode will probably not succeed even if it is looking great in "full size". (One would think that all sharp pictures would look sharp in the small thumbnail mode, but that is not the case!)

Many times using your fantasy (publishing an "out of the box" picture) that still completely follows the rules stated by the host, will be voted low.

Jahn

Is it possible something is going wrong with the mathematics behind the scenes? Interested in your comments, also, about what techiques and types of images should do well in challenges.

 

[OldPhoto]

I read up on how the voting works and how you don't have to vote for each image and how the algorhythm sorts it out - but subjectively the results seem a bit weird.

I used to try to enter a lot of challenges, way back before this site nearly closed down, but was away from the site for quite a while. Since I came back I put a couple of images in, but have mostly been watching, trying to discover what makes a good image that will do well in the voting. I am failing to see any coherent pattern. I see nice images doing badly, and conversely, ordinary images being rated higher in the rankings.

That is an interesting question to which I haven't either found a good answer.

One thing I have observed is that the picture has to look good in the thumbnail mode, (looking) sharp enough, not looking too dark, colorful enough, the main object big enough. A picture that doesn't look good in thumbnail mode will probably not succeed even if it is looking great in "full size". (One would think that all sharp pictures would look sharp in the small thumbnail mode, but that is not the case!)

Many times using your fantasy (publishing an "out of the box" picture) that still completely follows the rules stated by the host, will be voted low.

Jahn

Is it possible something is going wrong with the mathematics behind the scenes? Interested in your comments, also, about what techiques and types of images should do well in challenges.

Needing to look good as a thumbnail, points to one big problem with the voting system. If you don't have to vote for every image, and can ignore one based on the thumbnail - that's a serious shortcoming and will skew the result badly.

Your other point about "out of the box" is very valid, and a good piece advice on what not to post.

 

[TaSad1]

(...) I see nice images doing badly, and conversely, ordinary images being rated higher in the rankings.

Is it possible something is going wrong with the mathematics behind the scenes? (...)

Usually this happens when a multi-accounts cheater votes high for his/her own photo and low for other participants' photos...or when some idiot with the intention of sabotaging a challenge "plays" with 0.5* and 5.0* votes.

 

[TaSad1]

I think the system does work. I am never sure how but it seems to all come good. I think the problem may be us and our perception. (...)

Hmm... looks like a month ago you had a different opinion :

The 0.5 voters

A bit disappointed that my entry in the latest bird challenge received three 0.5s but then I noticed that the phantom low voters were spreading 0.5s around very liberally. I feel that who ever does this is seriously unbalanced.

www.dpreview.com

 

[OldPhoto]

(...) I see nice images doing badly, and conversely, ordinary images being rated higher in the rankings.

Is it possible something is going wrong with the mathematics behind the scenes? (...)

Usually this happens when a multi-accounts cheater votes high for his/her own photo and low for other participants' photos...or when some idiot with the intention of sabotaging a challenge "plays" with 0.5* and 5.0* votes.

After I posted my question - I read about these problems that are besetting the challenges. It's a pity, and I hope we don't lose them as a result, but's very frustrating.

 

[Trevor Carpenter]

I think the system does work. I am never sure how but it seems to all come good. I think the problem may be us and our perception. (...)

Hmm... looks like a month ago you had a different opinion :

https://www.dpreview.com/forums/thread/4787611#forum-post-68058352

The voting system does work surprisingly well most of the time but it is open to sabotage as mentioned above by the malicious use of 0.5s and 5s but that is not an issue with the voting system.

 

[Bill Thoo]

I think the system does work. I am never sure how but it seems to all come good. I think the problem may be us and our perception. (...)

Hmm... looks like a month ago you had a different opinion :

https://www.dpreview.com/forums/thread/4787611#forum-post-68058352

The voting system does work surprisingly well most of the time but it is open to sabotage as mentioned above by the malicious use of 0.5s and 5s but that is not an issue with the voting system.

Sandbagging (and not giving the tools to the hosts to more easily address it) is definitely a weakness in the voting system. Not all of us have the time or skill of Tasad to investigate. But if we are able to put that aside, I also agree that the results mostly turn out the way I had expected.

 

[jrtrent]

I think the system does work. I am never sure how but it seems to all come good. I think the problem may be us and our perception. (...)

Hmm... looks like a month ago you had a different opinion :

https://www.dpreview.com/forums/thread/4787611#forum-post-68058352

The voting system does work surprisingly well most of the time but it is open to sabotage as mentioned above by the malicious use of 0.5s and 5s but that is not an issue with the voting system.

Sandbagging (and not giving the tools to the hosts to more easily address it) is definitely a weakness in the voting system. Not all of us have the time or skill of Tasad to investigate. But if we are able to put that aside, I also agree that the results mostly turn out the way I had expected.

Things turn out the way I expect them to, too, but my expectation is that there is no rhyme or reason to where my favorites in a challenge end up. For example, Trevor mentioned his "boring Blue Tit on a branch" photo finishing 4th, and that was one of my favorites in that challenge, but I had pictures I really liked scattered everywhere from 2nd to well down in the 40's.

 

[OldPhoto]

I think the system does work. I am never sure how but it seems to all come good. I think the problem may be us and our perception. (...)

Hmm... looks like a month ago you had a different opinion :

https://www.dpreview.com/forums/thread/4787611#forum-post-68058352

The voting system does work surprisingly well most of the time but it is open to sabotage as mentioned above by the malicious use of 0.5s and 5s but that is not an issue with the voting system.

Sandbagging (and not giving the tools to the hosts to more easily address it) is definitely a weakness in the voting system. Not all of us have the time or skill of Tasad to investigate. But if we are able to put that aside, I also agree that the results mostly turn out the way I had expected.

Things turn out the way I expect them to, too, but my expectation is that there is no rhyme or reason to where my favorites in a challenge end up. For example, Trevor mentioned his "boring Blue Tit on a branch" photo finishing 4th, and that was one of my favorites in that challenge, but I had pictures I really liked scattered everywhere from 2nd to well down in the 40's.

That's how I feel as well. I am getting the impression the results have little correlation to what a good picture really is (as maybe judged in a formal comp with accredited judges). There is a certain randomness that is hard to pin down.

 

[Bill Thoo]

I think the system does work. I am never sure how but it seems to all come good. I think the problem may be us and our perception. (...)

Hmm... looks like a month ago you had a different opinion :

https://www.dpreview.com/forums/thread/4787611#forum-post-68058352

The voting system does work surprisingly well most of the time but it is open to sabotage as mentioned above by the malicious use of 0.5s and 5s but that is not an issue with the voting system.

Sandbagging (and not giving the tools to the hosts to more easily address it) is definitely a weakness in the voting system. Not all of us have the time or skill of Tasad to investigate. But if we are able to put that aside, I also agree that the results mostly turn out the way I had expected.

Things turn out the way I expect them to, too, but my expectation is that there is no rhyme or reason to where my favorites in a challenge end up. For example, Trevor mentioned his "boring Blue Tit on a branch" photo finishing 4th, and that was one of my favorites in that challenge, but I had pictures I really liked scattered everywhere from 2nd to well down in the 40's.

That's how I feel as well. I am getting the impression the results have little correlation to what a good picture really is (as maybe judged in a formal comp with accredited judges). There is a certain randomness that is hard to pin down.

It's a popular vote (that's hard to police), so I admit I never try not to analyse the results too much.