One battery to rule them all?

gordonpritchard

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Had to buy a new battery for myb camera and it occurred to me that if I couldn't get a new battery, e.g. not making it any longer, my camera would become a brick.

Wouldn't it be great if there was only one or two standard battery types that all cameras could use?
 
Had to buy a new battery for myb camera and it occurred to me that if I couldn't get a new battery, e.g. not making it any longer, my camera would become a brick.

Wouldn't it be great if there was only one or two standard battery types that all cameras could use?
What is the lifespan of a new battery, parked on a shelf, until needed? Of course, that assumes one could find it when the "in use" batteries died.
 
Ideally yes. The makers and inventors of this world should be working on this.
 
If it happens, it will be because of some significant improvement in battery technology that makes it smaller and/or increases capacity. At that point a battery manufacturer or manufacturers may come out with a standard format that it will behoove camera makers to use.
 
Ideally yes. The makers and inventors of this world should be working on this.
We've had standardized batteries for a very long time. From the alkaline chemistry AA & AAA batts that have been ubiquitous as long as anyone can remember, to newer standardized cells based on lithium chemistry like 18650, 21700, etc.

But people tend to prefer the higher capacity for the same size (or smaller size for the same capacity) that is afforded by custom batt shapes designed specifically to fit into devices with shapes other than cylindrical.

Further, companies making devices don't want to use standardized batts because they would rather 1) rely on the additional revenue source of custom batts and 2) have direct control over the quality of the cells being used in their device, even if they use standard sized cells in their unique battery assemblies (which is what you see in most camera batts.) The latter should be obvious after you do a quick search on Aliexpress and look at just how cheap and junky/dangerous of a no-name cell you can buy. While the former you may be annoyed about, tough; it is the manufacturer's prerogative to maximize profits. Don't like it, don't buy the device. If enough people really had an issue with this, one or more of the camera makers would sell a body that directly accepted something like a pair of standard 14500 cells. But none of them do, because most people don't really care enough.
 
Ideally yes. The makers and inventors of this world should be working on this.
We've had standardized batteries for a very long time. From the alkaline chemistry AA & AAA batts that have been ubiquitous as long as anyone can remember, to newer standardized cells based on lithium chemistry like 18650, 21700, etc.

But people tend to prefer the higher capacity for the same size (or smaller size for the same capacity) that is afforded by custom batt shapes designed specifically to fit into devices with shapes other than cylindrical.

Further, companies making devices don't want to use standardized batts because they would rather 1) rely on the additional revenue source of custom batts and 2) have direct control over the quality of the cells being used in their device, even if they use standard sized cells in their unique battery assemblies (which is what you see in most camera batts.) The latter should be obvious after you do a quick search on Aliexpress and look at just how cheap and junky/dangerous of a no-name cell you can buy. While the former you may be annoyed about, tough; it is the manufacturer's prerogative to maximize profits. Don't like it, don't buy the device. If enough people really had an issue with this, one or more of the camera makers would sell a body that directly accepted something like a pair of standard 14500 cells. But none of them do, because most people don't really care enough.
That is what many like to believe but the reality is that they use many shapes and sizes because they need to fit in the space that the other component designers have left for the battery.
 
Ideally yes. The makers and inventors of this world should be working on this.
We've had standardized batteries for a very long time. From the alkaline chemistry AA & AAA batts that have been ubiquitous as long as anyone can remember, to newer standardized cells based on lithium chemistry like 18650, 21700, etc.

But people tend to prefer the higher capacity for the same size (or smaller size for the same capacity) that is afforded by custom batt shapes designed specifically to fit into devices with shapes other than cylindrical.

Further, companies making devices don't want to use standardized batts because they would rather 1) rely on the additional revenue source of custom batts and 2) have direct control over the quality of the cells being used in their device, even if they use standard sized cells in their unique battery assemblies (which is what you see in most camera batts.) The latter should be obvious after you do a quick search on Aliexpress and look at just how cheap and junky/dangerous of a no-name cell you can buy. While the former you may be annoyed about, tough; it is the manufacturer's prerogative to maximize profits. Don't like it, don't buy the device. If enough people really had an issue with this, one or more of the camera makers would sell a body that directly accepted something like a pair of standard 14500 cells. But none of them do, because most people don't really care enough.
That is what many like to believe but the reality is that they use many shapes and sizes because they need to fit in the space that the other component designers have left for the battery.
??... I stated as much in the paragraph above the one you highlighted.
 
It would be great to have more standardization. I have other older electronic devices that are unusable due to battery failures.

My first autofocus camera was the Nikon N70 and it used CR123 batteries. You can buy rechargeable versions of those. Current Nikons could probably use a pair of them, the Nikon ENEL15 seems about the size of a pair of CR123. Some older battery packs can be rebuilt, things such as cordless power tools. The ENEL15 might be a bit hard to cut open and rebuild with new cells. The battery in a D3300 is smaller and would be hard to replace with individual cells.
 
Cameras already use them, pro ILC bodies have batteries inside which you'il find two or four standard cells linked and glued to the inside of the plastic shell.

Replacement of dead cells in obsolete batteries is possible and also, most DSLRs will accept a grip with AA adapter.
 
Had to buy a new battery for myb camera and it occurred to me that if I couldn't get a new battery, e.g. not making it any longer, my camera would become a brick.

Wouldn't it be great if there was only one or two standard battery types that all cameras could use?
I don’t necessarily disagree with this, but I find for the most part the battery to be increasingly irrelevant. This is due to…
  1. Good overall battery life of both my main cameras
  2. The ubiquity of USB-C and how I primarily charge in-camera now - at home, in the car, from a power bank while out and about, etc
I like the fact that both cameras share the same battery and that I have spares in case one of them fails, but I can also see why someone would be okay with a camera that didn’t have a swappable battery. They’re much less relevant now than they were say, 20 years ago.
 
Had to buy a new battery for myb camera and it occurred to me that if I couldn't get a new battery, e.g. not making it any longer, my camera would become a brick.

Wouldn't it be great if there was only one or two standard battery types that all cameras could use?
Sounds a reasonable idea at first but consider this. I use the Nikon D5 which uses an EN-EL18 battery. This is very similar to the Canon LP-E4N except that Canon attaches the door as part of the battery, Nikon sells the door separately.

I also have a Nikon 1J5 camera which is slightly smaller than the D6, Below is a picture of a Nikon EN-EL18 battery beside the 1J5.

dd27b9bd508b45e191658d54d1b12070.jpg


Yes, the EN-EL18 really is almost the same size as the 1J5 body. The battery at the top is an EN-EL24 for the 1J5 they are all sitting on a 16" M1 MacBook Pro for comparison. Clearly the EN-EL18 is absolutely no use for the 1J5. How many EN-EL24s would be required to power a D5? Obviously it can't be done directly as the -24 is two cells and 7.6Wh and the -18 is 3. cells and 27Wh.

It's rather more complicated than just having one battery to power everything. The battery in the MacBook is the same voltage as the EN-EL18 but nearly four times the capacity. At some point you realise that batteries, particularly bigh performance ones, need to be designed for the application. AA cells might be great for a flash gun or a portable radio but they aren't going to do much for a DSLR, even if Nikon provides a battery holder for some of it's grips to use them.
 
Had to buy a new battery for myb camera and it occurred to me that if I couldn't get a new battery, e.g. not making it any longer, my camera would become a brick.

Wouldn't it be great if there was only one or two standard battery types that all cameras could use?
I don’t necessarily disagree with this, but I find for the most part the battery to be increasingly irrelevant. This is due to…
  1. Good overall battery life of both my main cameras
  2. The ubiquity of USB-C and how I primarily charge in-camera now - at home, in the car, from a power bank while out and about, etc
I like the fact that both cameras share the same battery and that I have spares in case one of them fails, but I can also see why someone would be okay with a camera that didn’t have a swappable battery. They’re much less relevant now than they were say, 20 years ago.
Hmm. There are photographers who get through several batteries during a shoot, they probably don't want a cable getting in the way so they will swap batteries. If it weren't possible to remove the battery these people would buy a different camera.
 
Had to buy a new battery for myb camera and it occurred to me that if I couldn't get a new battery, e.g. not making it any longer, my camera would become a brick.

Wouldn't it be great if there was only one or two standard battery types that all cameras could use?
I don’t necessarily disagree with this, but I find for the most part the battery to be increasingly irrelevant. This is due to…
  1. Good overall battery life of both my main cameras
  2. The ubiquity of USB-C and how I primarily charge in-camera now - at home, in the car, from a power bank while out and about, etc
I like the fact that both cameras share the same battery and that I have spares in case one of them fails, but I can also see why someone would be okay with a camera that didn’t have a swappable battery. They’re much less relevant now than they were say, 20 years ago.
Hmm. There are photographers who get through several batteries during a shoot, they probably don't want a cable getting in the way so they will swap batteries. If it weren't possible to remove the battery these people would buy a different camera.
And if I’m covering longer events, I’m one of those people. But most of the events I cover (concerts with two bands) I can get through with one battery easily. However, I’m sure there’s tons of pros out there who rely on swappable batteries.

But for my casual photography? I didn’t swap my battery once on my last vacation since the battery is pretty big and I was charging it up while driving, back at our lodging taking a nap, etc. So, I’m just saying the specifics of the battery aren’t really on my mind since my current setup “just works”. As usual, YMMV.
 
Wouldn't it be great if there was only one or two standard battery types that all cameras could use?
No one's posted it yet, so I get to be the one to reference the XKCD "standards" comic.

In all seriousness, I do like the idea of there only being one type of battery, especially as a camera reviewer. But I think there are probably just too many different sizes, shapes, and classes of cameras for that to ever really happen. Also, as time moved on, they'd probably make updates to the standard and leave the old one behind... though it'd still probably be easier to find the old standard battery than one that existed for just a few cameras.

Also, you're correct that if no one is producing your battery (or at least a dummy unit) for your camera it would be a brick. But electronics also have a limited lifespan – in 20 years it won't matter if nobody makes a specific battery if all the cameras that use it have leaky caps.
 
Had to buy a new battery for myb camera and it occurred to me that if I couldn't get a new battery, e.g. not making it any longer, my camera would become a brick.

Wouldn't it be great if there was only one or two standard battery types that all cameras could use?
I don’t necessarily disagree with this, but I find for the most part the battery to be increasingly irrelevant. This is due to…
  1. Good overall battery life of both my main cameras
  2. The ubiquity of USB-C and how I primarily charge in-camera now - at home, in the car, from a power bank while out and about, etc
I like the fact that both cameras share the same battery and that I have spares in case one of them fails, but I can also see why someone would be okay with a camera that didn’t have a swappable battery. They’re much less relevant now than they were say, 20 years ago.
Hmm. There are photographers who get through several batteries during a shoot, they probably don't want a cable getting in the way so they will swap batteries. If it weren't possible to remove the battery these people would buy a different camera.
What are you arguing about...? Nobody is saying you can't have spare batts, or be forced to just use one batt in all your cameras. Of course there's still going to be cameras with swappable batteries. The dude you're arguing against even said he uses spares. All he said was that he could see why some people would be ok without swappable batts in a camera.

Why does this place ALWAYS take each discussion to the completely illogical extreme?
 
I'm not sure I can visualize a single battery being suitable for all cameras. For example, in Nikon's line you have the little Z30 APS-C camera. Small, light, and with the right lens, pocketable. At the other end, you have the Z9, the pro powerhouse. A Z9 battery would force the Z30 to be larger. You would probably want the Z9 to use at least 2 of the Z30's batteries. Would anyone be happy?
 
Had to buy a new battery for myb camera and it occurred to me that if I couldn't get a new battery, e.g. not making it any longer, my camera would become a brick.

Wouldn't it be great if there was only one or two standard battery types that all cameras could use?
I don’t necessarily disagree with this, but I find for the most part the battery to be increasingly irrelevant. This is due to…
  1. Good overall battery life of both my main cameras
  2. The ubiquity of USB-C and how I primarily charge in-camera now - at home, in the car, from a power bank while out and about, etc
I like the fact that both cameras share the same battery and that I have spares in case one of them fails, but I can also see why someone would be okay with a camera that didn’t have a swappable battery. They’re much less relevant now than they were say, 20 years ago.
Hmm. There are photographers who get through several batteries during a shoot, they probably don't want a cable getting in the way so they will swap batteries. If it weren't possible to remove the battery these people would buy a different camera.
What are you arguing about...? Nobody is saying you can't have spare batts, or be forced to just use one batt in all your cameras. Of course there's still going to be cameras with swappable batteries. The dude you're arguing against even said he uses spares. All he said was that he could see why some people would be ok without swappable batts in a camera.

Why does this place ALWAYS take each discussion to the completely illogical extreme?
I think you miss the point. I was merely pointing out that if a camera manufacturer decided to make a camera with a non-removable battery, which Sam Bennett suggests wouldn't be a problem, others might not buy it for that reason. I would be one of those, having a policy of avoiding non-removable batteries where ever possible.

As to power banks, many years ago I used Olympus cameras with motordrives, one option to power these was by means of a remote battery pack and a power cable. Said arrangement was very inconvenient to use, the cable getting in the way almost constantly.

I am sure there are plenty of people who would be happy with a non-removable battery. Pointing out that others wouldn't buy such a camera is hardly illogical.
 
I'm not sure I can visualize a single battery being suitable for all cameras. For example, in Nikon's line you have the little Z30 APS-C camera. Small, light, and with the right lens, pocketable. At the other end, you have the Z9, the pro powerhouse. A Z9 battery would force the Z30 to be larger. You would probably want the Z9 to use at least 2 of the Z30's batteries. Would anyone be happy?
The photograph in my post, above, illustrates this.
 
I'm not sure I can visualize a single battery being suitable for all cameras. For example, in Nikon's line you have the little Z30 APS-C camera. Small, light, and with the right lens, pocketable. At the other end, you have the Z9, the pro powerhouse. A Z9 battery would force the Z30 to be larger. You would probably want the Z9 to use at least 2 of the Z30's batteries. Would anyone be happy?
The photograph in my post, above, illustrates this.
Even 3 or 4 battery sizes would not work because, as I have already pointed out, no one designs a camera with a battery size in mind, they design the camera body to what they like it to be and then the challenge is to make all the bits needed to fit inside it. The battery size is one of the very few , if not the only , bits that can change in size.



2898984ba691457ab0d63b7f4d756467.jpg
 

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