Mediocre

xaprb

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I rented a Zf for two weeks. I was impressed by the image quality, but not more so than cameras that have comparable sensors. I was underwhelmed by the physical design, ergonomics, size, and some aspects of performance. In my view, this camera represents bandwagon-jumping ("let's offer something to customers who want visual appeal and are abandoning Nikon for Fujifilm") without really being thoughtful about the design and usability.

First, the physical and visual design, because this is obviously the major differentiator in the sea of lookalike cameras out there. Nikon wants this to feel reminiscent of the FE or FM bodies from the days of yore. I own a bunch of those, and I can put them side-by-side and compare them. The Zf fails at this; it just looks tacky next to my FE2. It totally lacks the refined, sophisticated, subtle design. It looks like a brick with leather textured plastic. It's hard to explain how and why, but despite not having much larger measurements in any specific dimension, it ends up looking and feeling much bigger. It gives the impression of being about twice the size. Some of this comes from being larger at the ends and corners; the FE2 has tapered, slender ends and the Zf is bulky and square edge-to-edge, top-to-bottom, especially in places like the LCD screen hinge. I think it's a combination of factors working together to create this impression, and it's hard to point to any one thing. Overall, it feels like Nikon had really talented designers in the 70s, and it feels like the Zf was designed by a committee or some consultants or something—someone who really lacked a deep grasp of how to make it feel right.

Ergonomically, I found a lot to dislike too. For example, most of the buttons on the back are not reachable by thumb without shifting my right-hand grip. They are placed evenly-spaced along the right side of the LCD screen instead of being placed where I can reach them. So I have to open my right hand and twist it down to get my thumb onto them—and this is on a camera that's already hard to hold because it's got slippery plastic exterior. I also agree with DPR's official review gripes—their complaints about how hard it is to access some specific oft-needed functions in the menus, for example, like the Auto ISO minimum shutter speed.

The sensor is truly great (though so are lots of other contemporary peers/competition, so this is not all that big a differentiator). It produces lovely images, clean and with great colors. Nothing to complain about here. However, I use a lot of adapted lenses, and two things stood out to me in trying to adapt lenses to the Zf. First, the IBIS performance numbers don't hold up relative to other cameras with similar CPIA stop ratings. I could not get a shake-free image at 1/500th with a 500mm lens. I have no trouble doing that on a number of other cameras; I can push my shutter speed down to 1/250th and get a percentage shake-free on my Fujifilm X-T5, which has a much smaller, much higher-resolution sensor that is far more revealing of shake. But on the Zf I was able to see at least some shake no matter what. And the IBIS was active, in case you're thinking I had accidentally disabled it; it was clearly better with it on than off, but definitely, DEFINITELY not as effective as Fuji's or Olympus's or Sony's, not even close, so don't believe the "8.5 stops" rating. These ratings are never truly comparable between brands despite being designed to be, but in this case I give it maybe 3 stops rating in reality. The second thing that was pretty poor compared to other cameras, for adapting manual-focus lenses, was the configurability for non-CPU lenses. There's no opportunity to enter a lens name to be recorded in EXIF. The only thing you can do is set the focal length for IBIS configuration, similar to how Sony cameras implement it. And also similar to Sony, you have to scroll tediously and slowly through a selection of preset choices of focal length, you can't just dial in a number of your own choosing the way you can with Fuji, Olympus, and Canon. In the Zf's case, though, it's even worse. The selection they let you choose from is just senseless. It has mostly enough choices up to 200mm, but then it just jumps to 300mm, skipping over anything between, like 250mm. Why? Lots of lenses and/or combinations of lenses and converters, including many from Nikon's back catalog, fall into this zone. But then, expecting it to also lack any settings between 300 and 400, I found 360mm was an option, also a head-scratcher—what on earth is that useful for? It's not even a sensible lens+TC combination.

Overall I found the software side of the Zf to contain a lot of head-scratching senseless decisions like that; it's just one example, but to me it exemplified a lot of other things I stumbled across, again reflecting lack of deep design thinking in bringing this thing to market.

So in conclusion, for me the Zf is a lovely high-performance sensor and processor, mounted in a bizarrely under-designed body with bizarrely under-designed ergonomics and software/firmware, and then dressed up in a costume to make people think it harkens back to an era it definitely doesn't harken back to. I think they missed the mark on this one, by a very wide margin. I'm glad I rented; I would never own one.
 
I rented a Zf for two weeks. I was impressed by the image quality, but not more so than cameras that have comparable sensors. I was underwhelmed by the physical design, ergonomics, size, and some aspects of performance. In my view, this camera represents bandwagon-jumping ("let's offer something to customers who want visual appeal and are abandoning Nikon for Fujifilm") without really being thoughtful about the design and usability.

First, the physical and visual design, because this is obviously the major differentiator in the sea of lookalike cameras out there. Nikon wants this to feel reminiscent of the FE or FM bodies from the days of yore. I own a bunch of those, and I can put them side-by-side and compare them. The Zf fails at this; it just looks tacky next to my FE2. It totally lacks the refined, sophisticated, subtle design. It looks like a brick with leather textured plastic. It's hard to explain how and why, but despite not having much larger measurements in any specific dimension, it ends up looking and feeling much bigger. It gives the impression of being about twice the size. Some of this comes from being larger at the ends and corners; the FE2 has tapered, slender ends and the Zf is bulky and square edge-to-edge, top-to-bottom, especially in places like the LCD screen hinge. I think it's a combination of factors working together to create this impression, and it's hard to point to any one thing. Overall, it feels like Nikon had really talented designers in the 70s, and it feels like the Zf was designed by a committee or some consultants or something—someone who really lacked a deep grasp of how to make it feel right.

Ergonomically, I found a lot to dislike too. For example, most of the buttons on the back are not reachable by thumb without shifting my right-hand grip. They are placed evenly-spaced along the right side of the LCD screen instead of being placed where I can reach them. So I have to open my right hand and twist it down to get my thumb onto them—and this is on a camera that's already hard to hold because it's got slippery plastic exterior. I also agree with DPR's official review gripes—their complaints about how hard it is to access some specific oft-needed functions in the menus, for example, like the Auto ISO minimum shutter speed

......

So in conclusion, for me the Zf is a lovely high-performance sensor and processor, mounted in a bizarrely under-designed body with bizarrely under-designed ergonomics and software/firmware, and then dressed up in a costume to make people think it harkens back to an era it definitely doesn't harken back to. I think they missed the mark on this one, by a very wide margin. I'm glad I rented; I would never own one.
Very much my own sentiments regarding the Zfc. Which is actually much closer in size to an FM/FE/2, yet as you say, very plasticky and nothing like the film cameras in feel.
Style over substance imo. And does the Zf actually have an ISO button? Or do you need do delve into menus to change between auto and manual ISO control? Because that, for me, was a major bugbear with the Zfc. Really slowed down operation when that feature was most needed. Found myself frustrated with the camera on several occasions. Which is why I sold it and replaced it with a Z50ii, which is superior in every way, not least ergonomics.

'Retro' style cameras are gimmicky and faddish, imo.

There; I've said it.
 
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I believe that a fair number of Zf sales went to people who wanted Expeed7 in a camera that cost less than a Z8, even if this meant they needed to deal with less-than-ideal ergonomics. There is some evidence for that in threads from that period. Now that the Z6III and Z50II are out (the former on sale with steep discounts), this route may look less attractive than it used to, and the “warts” of the Zf will look more bothersome.
 
The Zf is one of the least pleasant cameras I have ever held. I have no idea what they were thinking making it so massive.
 
The review seems harsh, but I'm also someone who tried it out, needed Expeed7 more than form, would have enjoyed storing it out on my bookshelf for quick access and visual appeal, and SENT IT BACK. A miss, but still more than mediocre.

Maybe IF it was more intended for use as a rangefinder. The retro cameras, with fewer buttons and dials, didn't solve any problems we had with the regular Z's, and actually created more. My very first impression was that I didn't like anything about the shutter button. Otherwise, I felt the quality was much nicer than the Zfc. It was bulky for no reason.

I still kind of want a "retro" mirrorless D750, with pop-up flash, but with CFE-B (and micro sd-II,) and a joystick. The Z50II is now filling this void.

Nikon would sure sucker me in for an FX metal build that was the size of the Zfc. Put in a better EVF and I could skip the monitor/LCD altogether. Make it a film-oriented camera. Just load up the 1080p video features so you don't have to worry about cooling and still enjoy medium video quality.

Not to mention the missing split-circle (prism) focusing emulation. A bluetooth spot-meter (which was also a remote) would also have useful and fun. Maybe even a firmware release for schools to disable any automatic features. When I learned film I was the only one that hat a camera without a battery. I struggled a lot more at first, but then I learned more.

Will they try again?! I hope so, but I'll probably pass.

--
SkyRunR
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
Moderation is a fatal thing. Nothing succeeds like excess. Oscar Wilde
 
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Re IBIS, were you using a native Z 500mm lens or adapted?
 
Horses for courses, I’ve found my Zf with Voigtlander 40/1.2 to be a wonderful combination. Choice is good!
 
As someone who started on “classic” film cameras, I can still remember getting my Minolta 700si and experiencing finger and thumb wheel ergonomics for the first time. That’s a useful memory because it had prevented me from buying a Df, Zf or Zfc over the years despite loving the way they look.

The fact that the Df has become a classic and is holding its price incredibly well has scuppered my plan to buy one for loose change for the shelf once it was obsolete. :-)
 
Love mine, and "mediocre" seems unfair, but each to his own. I think early reviews got it right when they said not everyone will like it. Suits the way I shoot. Own the Z7, Z6 and ZF, plus an FM2n. What made the Zf usable for me, so I can carry with one hand, is the Neewer grip, which fortunately is cheap and looks good.

Can't speak to your telephoto ibis results, but it's definitely a big step or two up from the Z6 and 7, with my collection of wide to portrait Z and adapted lenses (and the 24-120 f4Z).

I sold all of my Fuji gear. Not because it wasn't good as well, purely because I was not picking it up enough.

If I could design my own Z camera, it would have Expeed 7, the 45 mp sensor, the size and grip of the Z6/7, the iso dial of the ZF, the better ibis of the Zf and Z6III, the viewfinder of the Z6 III, and a Sony style tilt/flippy lcd.

The main complaint I have with the Zf is weight. Camera companies need to start trimming the fat, and make fewer grams a goal with both lenses and bodies. Nikon is moving in the wrong direction there.

--
https://www.flickr.com/photos/jkrumm/
https://juneauphotographs.org/
 
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Adapted Reflex-Nikkor N f/8.
Which 500mm lenses have you used on other systems where you found the IBIS to be more effective?
 
Adapted Reflex-Nikkor N f/8.
I believe you only get 3 axis IBIS in this case.
Not to mention that in body VR (IBIS) is mostly useless for super telephoto lenses that are longer than 200mm or so. Most super telephotos have built in VR that works in conjunction with IBIS. Then the newer Z bodies have synchro VR that work with the lens VR to improve performance. I can’t see myself criticizing a camera for not stabilizing a fully manual 500mm lens.
 
I rented a Zf for two weeks. I was impressed by the image quality, but not more so than cameras that have comparable sensors. I was underwhelmed by the physical design, ergonomics, size, and some aspects of performance. In my view, this camera represents bandwagon-jumping ("let's offer something to customers who want visual appeal and are abandoning Nikon for Fujifilm") without really being thoughtful about the design and usability.

First, the physical and visual design, because this is obviously the major differentiator in the sea of lookalike cameras out there. Nikon wants this to feel reminiscent of the FE or FM bodies from the days of yore. I own a bunch of those, and I can put them side-by-side and compare them. The Zf fails at this; it just looks tacky next to my FE2. It totally lacks the refined, sophisticated, subtle design. It looks like a brick with leather textured plastic. It's hard to explain how and why, but despite not having much larger measurements in any specific dimension, it ends up looking and feeling much bigger. It gives the impression of being about twice the size. Some of this comes from being larger at the ends and corners; the FE2 has tapered, slender ends and the Zf is bulky and square edge-to-edge, top-to-bottom, especially in places like the LCD screen hinge. I think it's a combination of factors working together to create this impression, and it's hard to point to any one thing. Overall, it feels like Nikon had really talented designers in the 70s, and it feels like the Zf was designed by a committee or some consultants or something—someone who really lacked a deep grasp of how to make it feel right.

Ergonomically, I found a lot to dislike too. For example, most of the buttons on the back are not reachable by thumb without shifting my right-hand grip. They are placed evenly-spaced along the right side of the LCD screen instead of being placed where I can reach them. So I have to open my right hand and twist it down to get my thumb onto them—and this is on a camera that's already hard to hold because it's got slippery plastic exterior. I also agree with DPR's official review gripes—their complaints about how hard it is to access some specific oft-needed functions in the menus, for example, like the Auto ISO minimum shutter speed.

The sensor is truly great (though so are lots of other contemporary peers/competition, so this is not all that big a differentiator). It produces lovely images, clean and with great colors. Nothing to complain about here. However, I use a lot of adapted lenses, and two things stood out to me in trying to adapt lenses to the Zf. First, the IBIS performance numbers don't hold up relative to other cameras with similar CPIA stop ratings. I could not get a shake-free image at 1/500th with a 500mm lens. I have no trouble doing that on a number of other cameras; I can push my shutter speed down to 1/250th and get a percentage shake-free on my Fujifilm X-T5, which has a much smaller, much higher-resolution sensor that is far more revealing of shake. But on the Zf I was able to see at least some shake no matter what. And the IBIS was active, in case you're thinking I had accidentally disabled it; it was clearly better with it on than off, but definitely, DEFINITELY not as effective as Fuji's or Olympus's or Sony's, not even close, so don't believe the "8.5 stops" rating. These ratings are never truly comparable between brands despite being designed to be, but in this case I give it maybe 3 stops rating in reality. The second thing that was pretty poor compared to other cameras, for adapting manual-focus lenses, was the configurability for non-CPU lenses. There's no opportunity to enter a lens name to be recorded in EXIF. The only thing you can do is set the focal length for IBIS configuration, similar to how Sony cameras implement it. And also similar to Sony, you have to scroll tediously and slowly through a selection of preset choices of focal length, you can't just dial in a number of your own choosing the way you can with Fuji, Olympus, and Canon. In the Zf's case, though, it's even worse. The selection they let you choose from is just senseless. It has mostly enough choices up to 200mm, but then it just jumps to 300mm, skipping over anything between, like 250mm. Why? Lots of lenses and/or combinations of lenses and converters, including many from Nikon's back catalog, fall into this zone. But then, expecting it to also lack any settings between 300 and 400, I found 360mm was an option, also a head-scratcher—what on earth is that useful for? It's not even a sensible lens+TC combination.

Overall I found the software side of the Zf to contain a lot of head-scratching senseless decisions like that; it's just one example, but to me it exemplified a lot of other things I stumbled across, again reflecting lack of deep design thinking in bringing this thing to market.

So in conclusion, for me the Zf is a lovely high-performance sensor and processor, mounted in a bizarrely under-designed body with bizarrely under-designed ergonomics and software/firmware, and then dressed up in a costume to make people think it harkens back to an era it definitely doesn't harken back to. I think they missed the mark on this one, by a very wide margin. I'm glad I rented; I would never own one.
HI,

I would not buy a Zf or Zfc either.........

But OTH IMO it is a very smart move from nikon to provide this possibility because some people/nikon users love such retro design camera and otherwise would buy a fuji retro style camera ( dx format sensor ) and now nikon gives people the choice to buy a nikon dx/ff retro style camera (Zfc/Zf) instead of loosing customers and income.

--
Greetings,
Marc
 
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Adapted Reflex-Nikkor N f/8.
Well, it's a mediocre lens.

But in addition, you are aware that IBIS is less effective the longer the focal length, right?

It also can only make up so much for the movement of the camera body, if you're moving the lens end no mount of IBIS will keep the image super stable, so I'm willing to bet this one isn't a camera problem but an expectation/understanding issue.
 
I believe that a fair number of Zf sales went to people who wanted Expeed7 in a camera that cost less than a Z8, even if this meant they needed to deal with less-than-ideal ergonomics. There is some evidence for that in threads from that period. Now that the Z6III and Z50II are out (the former on sale with steep discounts), this route may look less attractive than it used to, and the “warts” of the Zf will look more bothersome.
Right. I wish Nikon had introduced the Z6iii (June 2024) before the Zf (September 2023), and the Z6iii would have sold like hot cakes @ $2500 while the Zf would be the niche camera it is. However, a lot of pend-up demand for a EXPEED 7 based 24MP with good AF went to the Zf instead, and by the time the Z6iii came alone, the demand has been low and Nikon has already discounted it twice. Of course with the Z6iii and Z50ii around nowadays, further demand for the Zf will be pretty low.
 
The Zf is one of the least pleasant cameras I have ever held. I have no idea what they were thinking making it so massive.
It is interesting to read Thom Hogan's Zf review Nikon Zf Camera Review | Thom Hogan and his advice :

QUOTE

My advice? If you think the Zf might be for you, you need to go to your local camera store and have a protracted session trying it out. Try it with the dials, try it without the dials. Make sure it fits your hand and you can expose the controls you need at your fingertips to the minimal set of buttons. If the Zf passes this test, you'll be happy. On the other hand, if you just order a Zf from online without testing it first, you may not be happy when it arrives and you try to use it. More so than any other camera in Nikon's lineup, you really need to test drive a Zf before plopping your credit card down on the counter.

Recommended (2023 to present) but make sure you're comfortable with the UI

UNQUOTE
 
Adapted Reflex-Nikkor N f/8.
I believe you only get 3 axis IBIS in this case.
Plus the stated specs are for IBIS + in-lens VR for fully supported lenses. And IBIS is not very effective for long lenses (beyond 150-200 mm or so). Therefore, it is not a surprise that this result was not even close to expectations. I wonder whether the OP's comparison with other systems used the same VR-less lens or a better, fully supported lens.
 

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